Full Faith and Credit: Past Due

Article IV, Section 1, of the U.S. Constitution, more commonly known as the Full Faith and Credit clause, consists of just two sentences: ...

[1noteasilyfooled]

Excellent editorial.. very smart writer!

[Jozef]

Contrary to the wishes of its citizens, Massachusetts has allowed a few homosexuals to mock marriage in a political charade that has no real basis in homosexual life.

No other state has an obligation to provide such relationshits with any recognition at all. EVERY other state rejects the contrived nonsesne of homosexual "marriage," as does the federal goverment.

The DOMA received overwhelming support in Congress and specifically prevents the undemocratic imposition of the contrived philosophy of homosexual "marriage" on other states.

[frank___nrw]

Jozef wrote:

Contrary to the wishes of its citizens, Massachusetts has allowed a few homosexuals to mock marriage in a political charade that has no real basis in homosexual life.
No other state has an obligation to provide such relationshits with any recognition at all. EVERY other state rejects the contrived nonsesne of homosexual "marriage," as does the federal goverment.
The DOMA received overwhelming support in Congress and specifically prevents the undemocratic imposition of the contrived philosophy of homosexual "marriage" on other states.

Your kind has been through these earth-moving changes before, and they eventually had to accept them, only to find out that the world did not come to an end.
Your great-grandparents fought to keep their slaves in their pens, your grandfathers to keep their wives in the kitchen, your parents to keep the negroes out of your schools and women (interracial marriage was illegal, you know?), and now it's your turn, and since race is no longer an issue, your people has chosen a new target, and it's your duty to carry the sacred KKK torch onto the 21st Century with a new flame: keep gays in the closet. So I can't really blame you personally for your hatred: you are nothing but a product of your parents and their world.

Your posting reminds me of a poem written by Joseph de Jarnette in 1938:

Oh, why do we allow these people
To breed back to the monkey's nest,
To increase our country's burdens
When we should only breed the best?

Oh, you wise men take up the burden,
And make this your loudest creed,
Sterilize the misfits promptly—
All are not fit to breed!

Then our race will be strengthened and bettered,
And our men and our women be blest,
Not apish, repulsive and foolish,
For the best will breed the best.

[Ralph]

frank___nrw wrote:

<quoted text>
Your kind has been through these earth-moving changes before, and they eventually had to accept them, only to find out that the world did not come to an end.
Your great-grandparents fought to keep their slaves in their pens, your grandfathers to keep their wives in the kitchen, your parents to keep the negroes out of your schools and women (interracial marriage was illegal, you know?), and now it's your turn, and since race is no longer an issue, your people has chosen a new target, and it's your duty to carry the sacred KKK torch onto the 21st Century with a new flame: keep gays in the closet. So I can't really blame you personally for your hatred: you are nothing but a product of your parents and their world.
Your posting reminds me of a poem written by Joseph de Jarnette in 1938:
Oh, why do we allow these people
To breed back to the monkey's nest,
To increase our country's burdens
When we should only breed the best?
Oh, you wise men take up the burden,
And make this your loudest creed,
Sterilize the misfits promptly—
All are not fit to breed!
Then our race will be strengthened and bettered,
And our men and our women be blest,
Not apish, repulsive and foolish,
For the best will breed the best.

Thanks. I haven't seen or read that poem since I was in high-school in the 60's. Funny how everything old is new again.

[Rick in Kansas]

Jozef wrote:

Contrary to the wishes of its citizens, Massachusetts has allowed a few homosexuals to mock marriage in a political charade that has no real basis in homosexual life.
No other state has an obligation to provide such relationshits with any recognition at all. EVERY other state rejects the contrived nonsesne of homosexual "marriage," as does the federal goverment.
The DOMA received overwhelming support in Congress and specifically prevents the undemocratic imposition of the contrived philosophy of homosexual "marriage" on other states.

When you begin your post with a false premise, your logic tends to go downhill from there. Apparently the decision was in accordance with the wishes of the citizens of the state of Massachusetts as they had a couple of opportunities to elect legislators to carry out your sort of bigoted ideals, but they didn't and so no anti-gay amendement was never offered up for a vote. If what you say was what they wanted, why didn't they elect representatives who would carry that out? Could it be that you're just wrong? Would that even be a surprise to anyone if that were the case?
If you had actaully bothered to read the article you would have seen that this nation has been through just this kind of turmoil before when the issue was that of inter-racial marriage. What happened then was a decision by the state supreme court of California granting the right brought the issue to a head in many states forcing them to re-examine the issue and overturn laws prohibiting it culminating with the landmark USSC decision in the loving case that put the last nail in the coffin of such bigoted laws. If the court in California makes the right decision today and extends the right of marriage to lesbians and gays hopefully the same parallel will occur on this issue as well, DOMA law or not. A decision by the most influential state court in the country is going to be difficult to ignore.
By the way, you'd better hope for a reversal of fortune by the Republican party between now and the general elections as both Democratic contenders have advocated repeal of all or most of the DOMA provisions making that law one out that will no longer exsist...

[1noteasilyfooled]

DOMA WILL FALL......... it's a matter of time and a matter of LAW.

sorry wil.. your days are numbered.. Iran has invited you to be a citizen.. bye! have a nice trip!

[Ziggy on High]

I'm surprised DOMA has not been stricken yet. It is blatantly unconstitutional. Basic federal laws or acts do NOT trump the constitution. Yet, Bush has packed the supreme court with so many of his biased fundie chronies that they just let slide. They should be recused from their benches.

[frank___nrw]

Ziggy on High wrote:

I'm surprised DOMA has not been stricken yet. It is blatantly unconstitutional. Basic federal laws or acts do NOT trump the constitution. Yet, Bush has packed the supreme court with so many of his biased fundie chronies that they just let slide. They should be recused from their benches.

There have been many laws in American history against your Constitution, and just to name a few: slavery, segregation, interracial marriage ban, and all the laws that treated women as second-class citizens. And those laws prevailed for decades.

When were they changed? When the political will was bigger than the status quo.

Until then, DOMA will remain a law of the land. Sorry :(

[Ziggy on High]

frank___nrw wrote:

<quoted text>
There have been many laws in American history against your Constitution, and just to name a few: slavery, segregation, interracial marriage ban, and all the laws that treated women as second-class citizens. And those laws prevailed for decades.
When were they changed? When the political will was bigger than the status quo.
Until then, DOMA will remain a law of the land. Sorry :(

Yeah, you're right. Pretty damn sad. We have some of the worst and most biased judges and lawmakers around. Sometimes my own country shames me. But, I hear Denmark's nice, and I've heard Germany is fabulous. I might just have to give one of them a try.

Cheers

[frank___nrw]

Ziggy on High wrote:

<quoted text>
Yeah, you're right. Pretty damn sad. We have some of the worst and most biased judges and lawmakers around. Sometimes my own country shames me. But, I hear Denmark's nice, and I've heard Germany is fabulous. I might just have to give one of them a try.
Cheers

Germany will open you with open arms, but...

our history is even worse than yours. We only came to exist as a country in 1871, and our Constitution made it a crime to be gay. The Nazis expanded the law and multiply the persecutions, sending us to death camps. After the war, East Germany (the communist one) removed the Nazi additions, but West Germany kept them (yes, the West Germany sponsored by the USA, UK and France). Only in 1968 East Germany decriminalized same-sex sex, and West Germany followed in 1969. Only forty years ago. In that time we have come along a lone way. There is a national law against discrimination that includes sexual orientation and gender identity, and we do have a domestic partnership law.

However, just as you have your evangelical nuts, here we have our Catholic nuts in the South, which support the Christian parties, and our South is just like your South... and our federal system made it impossible to get marriage equality approved because of their opposition. The watered-down version is better than nothing, yes, but it's not equality. Most people in urban centers are very accepting of us, and there is no problem for them seeing two men kissing on the street. Only immigrants from Muslim and Russian Orthodox countries have a problem with that, but they know better than to do anything. In rural areas, though, the rejection is as common as in the USA. And it's true as well for blue collar neighborhoods (yes, we have out share of white trash).

The churches are not as vocal against us as in the USA. The Lutherans (here they call themselves Evangelicals, but they have nothing to do with yours) are very open and welcoming, and Catholics are not, of course. But as religious as rural areas might be, most Germans are not affiliated to any religion, so this secular climate has brought some perspective and information to our society. And that makes it very hard to the new generations to grasp the idea of how a country so powerful and developed like yours could've fallen into the hands of such uneducated and hateful fundamentalists.

As I said, come over and join the first world. The food sucks but you will be able to kiss your boyfriend during a meal in a restaurant.

[frank___nrw]

sorry, the first line was supposed to read: will welcome you... not open you.... although, that it's up to you :)