Stein tackles issues in `Expelled'

There was a time when documentaries were considered BORING. Usually they were news specials that pre-empted TV shows, or were films shown in history or science classes that put students to sleep. via Pasadena Star-News

[Wiggy]

I would like to get other theories concerning reproduction back into classrooms too. "Sex Theory" is an immoral dogma supported by "big science" but many people believe that children are delivered to their loving parents by storks. Anyone who brings up this totally legitimate idea called "the stork theory of reproduction" in academia though, is quickly EXPELLED!

[Dave]

I saw "Expelled" and enjoyed it. I'm an engineer, religious in the traditional sense but not affiliated. So I've got a foot in both camps, and I see no need for a war between scientists and religionists. I was glad to see that "Expelled" was not simplistic and monolithic; it covered a lot of turf and expressed a number of viewpoints. Stein directly addressed some tough questions (such as, were the cases of academic bullying systematic and representative, or where they isolated and anecdotal?; is I.D. simply creationism?; is discussing I.D. as inane and silly as discussing a flat Earth theory?) I think Stein's goal here was not to end a discussion, but to begin one. And I agree it's a discussion worth having.

[Nephilim]

I thought it would be kind of boring but I enjoyed the movie. Every time I wondered "where in the heck is he going with this" I ended up with "oh I see."

I believe the truth is somewhere in the middle and discussion without the hesterics would be great.

In the movie and in subsequent chats and videos I am taken aback back I.D. critics who seem to have the need to resort to insults and name calling. I thought these were our brightest minds?

[The Dude]

www.expelledexposed.com

It's a shame that with ID being around for 20 years, they've never come up with any scientific evidence. That's why ID is kept out of the classrooms.

Science and religion do not have to disagree; there are many religious people who accept modern science. But religion is religion and science is science. Unless one can come up with a way to scientifically test the supernatural, that's the way it will stay.

>>>"In the movie and in subsequent chats and videos I am taken aback back I.D. critics who seem to have the need to resort to insults and name calling. I thought these were our brightest minds?"

But comparing the scientific community with the Nazi's? Claiming that evolution is responsible for the Holocaust? That's okay? Unfortunately, Ben Stein and his buddies at the DI are propogating the idea that science and religion are at odds with each other. And they jump right into Godwin's law from the get go. If the DI are as honest as they claim, then maybe they could explain why they've done no scientific research on ID? And why they came up with the Wedge Document? And if they agree with the warped views of Christian Reconstructionist Howie Ahmanson from which the DI gets much of its funding? And if not, why do they take his money anyway?

ID is nothing more than repackaged Creationism, which has already been found in court not only to be unscientific, but unConstitutional to teach in public schools. And Creationism has been in court many times. And lost every one. They already know they don't have any scientific evidence to present. So they write lots of books. Spend all their "research" money on PR. And now they make movies.

[chipfle]

Dave wrote:

I saw "Expelled" and enjoyed it. I'm an engineer, religious in the traditional sense but not affiliated. So I've got a foot in both camps, and I see no need for a war between scientists and religionists. I was glad to see that "Expelled" was not simplistic and monolithic; it covered a lot of turf and expressed a number of viewpoints. Stein directly addressed some tough questions (such as, were the cases of academic bullying systematic and representative, or where they isolated and anecdotal?; is I.D. simply creationism?; is discussing I.D. as inane and silly as discussing a flat Earth theory?) I think Stein's goal here was not to end a discussion, but to begin one. And I agree it's a discussion worth having.

Engineer != scientist, despite the silly pretentions of plug&crankers. When the creIDiots actrually present anything remotely approaching actual research or evidence, we can talk. CreIDism is simply an exercize in flock-fleecing and political power. Should we also have a discussion about astrology, phrenology, pyramid power? They have at least as much validity as creIDism.

[chipfle]

Nephilim wrote:

I thought it would be kind of boring but I enjoyed the movie. Every time I wondered "where in the heck is he going with this" I ended up with "oh I see."
I believe the truth is somewhere in the middle and discussion without the hesterics would be great.
In the movie and in subsequent chats and videos I am taken aback back I.D. critics who seem to have the need to resort to insults and name calling. I thought these were our brightest minds?

They (we) are, and we have much better things to do than argue with pinheadologists (People who study how many angels can gance on the head of a pin) and flat earthers (who actually have more science than creIDiot flock fleecers)

[Darron S]

"an atheist and evolution believer..."

And therein lies the problem. Creationists have tainted the public understanding of the science of evolution to the point where it's something that the layman thinks you can "choose" not to believe in. Unfortunately, evolution isn't something you can choose to believe in, in the same way gravity isn't something you can "choose" to believe in.

It's a fact: we can observe macro-evolution in existing, short-lived species. It's repeatable, observable and testable. We have forced speciation in the lab and we've observed it in nature.
And it's a theory: The Theory of Evolution via Natural Selection explains HOW things change over time based on selection pressures

Same thing for gravity:

It's a fact: we can observe the effect it has on planets going around the sun or apples falling from trees. It's repeatable observable and testable.
And it's a theory: Gravitational Theory, from our good friend Einstein, explains how objects of mass curve space-time and cause the effect we call gravity.

It makes me very sad that religious fundamentalism is keeping so many people in the bronze age with respect to their understanding of the scientific method, especially given how completely reliant our society is on science.

[CDavidParsons]

Stein's Expelled is opening doors for The Quest for Right.

A PARAGON OF SCIENTIFIC ACHIEVEMENT!

The Quest for Right, a series of 7 textbooks created for the public schools, represents the ultimate marriage between an in-depth knowledge of biblical phenomena and natural and physical sciences. The several volumes have accomplished that which, heretofore, was deemed impossible: to level the playing field between those who desire a return to physical science in the classroom and those who embrace the theory of evolution. The Quest for Right turns the tide by providing an authoritative and enlightening scientific explanation of natural phenomena which will ultimately dethrone the unprofitable Darwinian view.
Read a review:

"I am amazed at the breadth of the investigation - scientific history, biblical studies, geology, biology, geography, astronomy, chemistry, paleontology, and so forth - and find the style of writing to be quite lucid and aimed clearly at a general, lay audience." ― Mark Roberts, former Editor of Biblical Reference Books, Thomas Nelson Publishers.

Visit the official website for additional information: http://questforright.com

[The Dude]

But Intelligent Design is about SCIENCE, not about religion! Nope! Nosiree-bob! It's just them lying atheist Darwinists who say it is!

Is uh, that right, CDavidParsons?

(giggle)

[Nephilim]

chipfle wrote:

<quoted text>They (we) are, and we have much better things to do than argue with pinheadologists (People who study how many angels can gance on the head of a pin) and flat earthers (who actually have more science than creIDiot flock fleecers)

Why so angry? What are you afraid of?

[Jason]

"Disappointingly, Stein does not challenge Dawkins further by asking: How did that alien life come to exist?"

That's kind of the point of what Dawkins was saying. ID believers know that they must be able to say that the designer isn't necessarily a god or they will never be accepted by the public school system. It is they who initially pushed the idea that perhaps it was an intelligent extraterrestrial race that seeded life here. Dawkins brought up the concept simply because saying aliens may have designed life on earth only pushes the question back a level. Did the alien life begin naturally, was it designed by a supernatural creator, or was their life seeded by an even more advanced alien race? Using the alien hypothesis can extend backward indefinitely (or at least as far back as the Big Bang), so it ultimately comes down to a question of god vs natural processes, which is why ID is so often labeled as creationism in disguise. It may not be strict biblical creationism, but does imply supernatural creation nonetheless.

[Franklin Ratliff]

Dave wrote:

I saw "Expelled" and enjoyed it. I'm an engineer, religious in the traditional sense but not affiliated. So I've got a foot in both camps, and I see no need for a war between scientists and religionists. I was glad to see that "Expelled" was not simplistic and monolithic; it covered a lot of turf and expressed a number of viewpoints. Stein directly addressed some tough questions (such as, were the cases of academic bullying systematic and representative, or where they isolated and anecdotal?; is I.D. simply creationism?; is discussing I.D. as inane and silly as discussing a flat Earth theory?) I think Stein's goal here was not to end a discussion, but to begin one. And I agree it's a discussion worth having.

The Vatican accepts the theory of evolution as science. That's why oxymoronic "intelligent design" ISN'T taught in Catholic school science classes.

[Boris]

whoever wrote this review would do well to indulge in a little research. Sternberg was never an employee, he did not lose his job because he never had a job. He had AND STILL HAS a volunteer position at the Smithsonian. His website even shows that and so does the Smithsonian's website.

I remember the good old days when writers actually dug into subjects and did not parrot everything they were told. Stein's movie is one big lie. Check it out yourself.

[sweets2360]

Nephilim wrote:

I thought it would be kind of boring but I enjoyed the movie. Every time I wondered "where in the heck is he going with this" I ended up with "oh I see."
I believe the truth is somewhere in the middle and discussion without the hesterics would be great.
In the movie and in subsequent chats and videos I am taken aback back I.D. critics who seem to have the need to resort to insults and name calling. I thought these were our brightest minds?

Go over to the "should evolution be taught in high school" and see who is slinging the insults and name calling. There are people over there that have discussed every aspect of evolution down to the formulas for thermo, and they are called stupid, nazis, baby killers, Hitler. Just go read.

[sweets2360]

The Dude wrote:

But Intelligent Design is about SCIENCE, not about religion! Nope! Nosiree-bob! It's just them lying atheist Darwinists who say it is!
Is uh, that right, CDavidParsons?
(giggle)

Wouldnt you just love to go visit their labs and see what new discoveries they are coming up with?

wink wink

[The Dude]

"We can only conclude that GODIDIT! AMEN!"

[Gracie]

"Why so angry? What are you afraid of?"

I'm afraid of a nation of ignorant boobs. And angry that people apparenly LIKE being ignorant and try to encourage others to be ignorant too.

But that's just me.

Also, Ben went on Craig Ferguson's talk show and said this movie should be watched after hitting the bong. Look for it on YouTube. Hopefully you can laugh at yourself.

[Bud]

CDavidParsons wrote:

Stein's Expelled is opening doors for The Quest for Right.
A PARAGON OF SCIENTIFIC ACHIEVEMENT!
The Quest for Right, a series of 7 textbooks created for the public schools, represents the ultimate marriage between an in-depth knowledge of biblical phenomena and natural and physical sciences. The several volumes have accomplished that which, heretofore, was deemed impossible: to level the playing field between those who desire a return to physical science in the classroom and those who embrace the theory of evolution. The Quest for Right turns the tide by providing an authoritative and enlightening scientific explanation of natural phenomena which will ultimately dethrone the unprofitable Darwinian view.
Read a review:
"I am amazed at the breadth of the investigation - scientific history, biblical studies, geology, biology, geography, astronomy, chemistry, paleontology, and so forth - and find the style of writing to be quite lucid and aimed clearly at a general, lay audience." ― Mark Roberts, former Editor of Biblical Reference Books, Thomas Nelson Publishers.
Visit the official website for additional information: http://questforright.com

SPAMMER.

Why doesn't this shameless spammer get banned for trashing every thread here with his advertisements?

[MAB]

What a pathetic review of a completely dishonest movie. How about doing a bit of independent investigation to see what the real merits of this movie are?

[Al Kafir]

Since we're discussing a movie, suppose you walked into a theater and demanded to see the movie without paying for a ticket. How far would you get?

Now suppose you demand that your pet belief be called a scientific theory but refuse to produce any evidence for it. How far should you get?

ID operates a dishonest shell game by loudly proclaiming that there is evidence of design, without ever actually showing it to anyone. Believe thee me, anyone who comes up with solid positive scientific evidence for intelligent design of any living organism is on the fast track for a Nobel. But, so far....