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Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

Catholic Dogma? I don't remember quoting any Catholics...I just use the BibleThe "or the Spirit" footnote is in reference to the very beginning of verse 10 as to whether it reads "...house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem (a spirit) or (the Spirit) of Grace and supplication. " It doesn't speak to who is piercedWell let's see: "they will look at ME whom they pierced." Or "they will look on ME whom they pierced." Or "they will look to ME whom they pierced." Either way the one being pierced is the LORD God...and the qu  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #28)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

This response is interesting in that it reminds me of how different JW's at my house have responded to different points. One guy, after looking at Romans 11:36 slammed his book shut and said "the devil is in you, boy" and stormed out the door. A CO, that was brought over, would only stare at the table after I pointed out Genesis 18...he wouldn't respond to the passage...he was done. Recently a couple of JW's came over, one of them was a lady who was very warm, very friendly, smiling and pleasant. She pointed out that Jesus was the wisdom of God, and then she showed me the Proverbs 8 passage. My come back was that this passage was merely Solomon personifying wisdom...she happily disagreed, so I asked her if God was ever without his wisdom...if not then Jesus is not a created being...which was the debate in the first place. She grew very cold, very sullen, she seemed rather angry, and left without responding to any more of my points. What an odd way to respond But to be fair, I bet there are some who have dedicated their lives to the LORD who also respond in a rather odd manner.  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #27)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

Not really shattered The one God is made up of three persons, the idea you speak about is for those who believe in the "oneness " doctrine...where Jesus himself is the Father  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #23)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

Well not really shattered No, a being who was fully man (Philippians 2:7) died on the cross. If you recall from Philippians 2 that Jesus took on the nature of a servant...he "took on the nature" indicates that his nature before that was not the nature of a servant, which would not be the case if he was a created being. If I understand the JW's teaching Jesus was created and used as a tool to create every other thing...this means he was created already a servant. Interesting Colossians teaches us that all things were created by Jesus, and all things were created for Jesus, and all created things are held together by Jesus. No wonder we are called to worship him  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #22)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

The Bible tells us that since before the creation of the World Jesus was going to come to earth as a man. What's interesting is that in Zachariah 12:10 the LORD God himself tells us: "Then I will pour out a spirit of grace and prayer on the house of David and the residents of Jerusalem, and they will look at Me whom they pierced." When would the residents of Jerusalem have looked at God pierced? Do you find it interesting that Thomas call Jesus "The Lord of me and the God of me"? Mad would you ever confess Jesus to be the Lord of you and the God of you?  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #21)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

Not really shattered There is not one of Two Gods, there is not one of Three Gods, the Trinity doctrine speaks of one God made up of three persons.  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #19)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

I'm not certain of what you're getting at here...have you heard someone say that Jesus was an Apostle?  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #18)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

here should be hear...sorry  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #17)

Jehovah's Witness

The Triune Travesty shatters when touched.....

Well, not really shattered...the formula for the Trinity is the same as that of the Bride of Christ. There is one WHAT made up of three Who...so it goes one God made up of three persons, Father, Son, Holy Spirit. The bride of Christ there is one WHAT (bride) made up of a multiple of Who (saved people) By the way, I always here that this Doctrine is a pagan doctrine...what pagan religion has this formula?  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #16)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

man, I'd like to have you take a look at my post and discuss and discuss the scriptures with me  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #85)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

Sorry Nomi, I'm not sure what you mean.  (Jul 10, 2012 | post #84)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

So the Jews tried to stone him because he was claiming to be really old?  (Jul 9, 2012 | post #45)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

Jah Fan, What do you make of John 1:1-3 which tells us that Jesus is the uncreated Creator of all that has been created? Or Colossians 1:16-17 which tells us that everything (not every other thing) was created by Jesus, and was created for Jesus, and everything that was created is held together by Jesus? What do you make of John 20:28 where Thomas calls Jesus "the Lord of me and the God of me" without being corrected, but instead was praised? What do you make of all the worship Jesus gets in Revelation 5:8-14 where Jesus is praised and worshiped by every creature in heaven and earth? There is also Zechariah 12:10 where the LORD God predicts that the residents of Jerusalem will: "look at Me whom they pierced." The question for this verse is When was the LORD God pierced by the inhabitants of Jerusalem? Just a few questions for you  (Jul 9, 2012 | post #44)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

This is another verse that needs the context. Look what happens when all of 9:5 and 6 are included: "For the living know that they will die, but the dead don't know anything. There is no longer a reward for them because the memory of them is forgotten. (v6) Their love, their hate, and their envy have already disappeared, and there is no longer a portion for them in all that is done under the sun." SAM what does that phrase "under the sun" mean to youLook at all of Psalm 115, it's speaking from the point of view of those on earth...where the dead do not rise and Praise the LORD. Just as Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are dead and in the ground to us...but in reality God knows them as they really are...livingThose exact words in that order? I don't know, but Jesus, in John 11:25-26 says: "I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in Me, even if he dies, will live. Everyone who lives and believes in Me lill never die...ever." SAM will a true believer in Christ ever dieSAM, a slogan doesn't equal truth  (Jul 9, 2012 | post #43)

Jehovah's Witness

Can A Trinitarian Be Saved?

With this I'll skip down a bit and add thisYou mentioned that I had better read the scriptures, but then you post that the dead are only alive in God's memory...yet Jesus calls the Father the God of the living, not of the dead...He didn't say that they are the remembered. Now it may be that you have a scripture to back this up...I'll wait and seeInteresting when this is read in context with the rest of the passage. Here The LORD is telling the reader that no longer will it be true in Israel that: "The fathers eat sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge." Which seems to me to be saying that the son will not be punished because the Father sinned. The word soul does not mean spirit...it means personThe key phrase that you left out of verse 20 is "...A son won't suffer punishment the father's iniquity, and a father won't suffer punishment for the son's iniquity." The point of this, and the above passage, is not that the dead are not conscious but that the person who sins will be punished  (Jul 9, 2012 | post #42)