Health Care Debate - Horseshoe Bend, AR

[pup]

I would rather have my freedom than have food.

[Raven]

I absolutely support Obama's health INSURANCE reform. You may value your freedom, but right now the insurance companies are running the show. If you don't have insurance, the doctor's are allowed to save your life, but they can't do anything more. For example, if you have a heart attack, the hospital will get you stabilized and put you out on the streets. If you die later, too bad. If everyone has insurance this problem will be resolved. It's not socialized medicine, but even if it were, so what? I have friends in Canada, France and the UK. No one has anything bad to say about their health care. It works well for them and they're grateful for it. The proposal will save money in the long run, as well. The way things are now, if a person has no insurance they go to the ER. The cost is 3 to 5 times higher than a visit to the doctor's office. Unlike Noneedtoknow on another post, I think basic health care should be a right, not a privilege. As Obama said in his speech, this issue defines the character of our country! Id rather be one of the good guys.

[whoknew]

Fix our health care, thats fine with me. Im not talking about Health Care, Im talking about what comes along with health care. I care about my freedom. The more you take from the government, the more they are allowed to take from you. Are you ready to be pushed towards ideals that you dont agree with? Or will you be as happy as a pig in slop with what the government gives you.
Are you ready for your electricity bills to rise? Your water bills?
Ive known a family from Canada, they fled here. The son is not here legally. The parents are. The son told me about health care (he wasnt happy) he also told me about the censorship there. Could it be that Canada dosent know what they are missing? I also talked to a pregnant woman in the UK. She was 7 months pregnant, she had been (fit in) to the Dr. three times for her pregnancy. She had to go the the (clinic) in the area that she lived. She saw three diffrent Drs., had no idea who would deliver her baby. One Dr. read her glucose test one way and weeks later the other Dr. read it another way. Dosent that sound great? Is that the health care you want?

[whoknew]

$11,746,389,394,969.
This number is our national debt.
Watch it growing here.
http://zfacts.com/p/461.html

[Bluesteel]

We do not need the gubmet taking care of us by taxing our health care. This is a capitalistic nation. We should be free to buy health insurance from what ever insurance company we choose. If health care is passed the only people to benefit from the cost and added taxes are the fat cat RINO's and Marxest Democrats. Long story short gubmet run health care is unconstitutional, just read a copy of the bill of right and the congressional enumerated powers act. Guess what? You won't find health care mentioned once!

[Raven]

Bluesteel wrote:

We do not need the gubmet taking care of us by taxing our health care. This is a capitalistic nation. We should be free to buy health insurance from what ever insurance company we choose. If health care is passed the only people to benefit from the cost and added taxes are the fat cat RINO's and Marxest Democrats. Long story short gubmet run health care is unconstitutional, just read a copy of the bill of right and the congressional enumerated powers act. Guess what? You won't find health care mentioned once!

If the bill passes, it won't be government run health care. We will hopefully have the public OPTION for those of us that can't afford health insurance from the fat cat insurance companies. People like you will still be able to buy your insurance from whomever you wish. I'm glad you can afford it. Most of us can't.

[tired of the main problem]

pup wrote:

I would rather have my freedom than have food.

I agree with you. I strongly oppose government run health care. That freak obama needs to keep his hands to himself and just finish out his term. Before you know it, we will be a socialist country and frankly that scares the hell out of me.

[Liberty]

tired of the main problem wrote:

<quoted text>
I agree with you. I strongly oppose government run health care. That freak obama needs to keep his hands to himself and just finish out his term. Before you know it, we will be a socialist country and frankly that scares the hell out of me.

The U.S. is now on the path of financial destruction. The Constitution has been shredded and individual human rights are being trampled. In less than 8 months, Obama has used a recession to take over the two largest industries in the U.S. He will debase the Dollar and is on the road to creating an incredible energy shortage that will allow him and Congress to take over the energy industry. Keep sleeping American and when you wake up the country will be gone.

[Raven]

Liberty wrote:

<quoted text>
The U.S. is now on the path of financial destruction. The Constitution has been shredded and individual human rights are being trampled. In less than 8 months, Obama has used a recession to take over the two largest industries in the U.S. He will debase the Dollar and is on the road to creating an incredible energy shortage that will allow him and Congress to take over the energy industry. Keep sleeping American and when you wake up the country will be gone.

The sleeping happened during the Bush administration. The real problems started in the 90's and we closed our eyes when there was still time to fix it. It's probably too late now, but at least Obama's trying. Try to hold your blame until he's done something to deserve it.

[wow]

whoknew wrote:

$11,746,389,394,969.
This number is our national debt.
Watch it growing here.
http://zfacts.com/p/461.html

dats scarry

[Liberty]

Raven wrote:

<quoted text>
The sleeping happened during the Bush administration. The real problems started in the 90's and we closed our eyes when there was still time to fix it. It's probably too late now, but at least Obama's trying. Try to hold your blame until he's done something to deserve it.

I believe common sense health care reforms should embrace the following principles:

1) CHOICE: the ability to choose my own plan, doctors, facilities and treatments.

2) ACCESS: the ability to get the treatment I need, when I need it, without delay or denial of service.

3) COST REDUCTIONS: meaningful reductions in the cost of my insurance and medical care.

4) FAIRNESS: individuals who purchase their own insurance should receive the same tax savings as those who obtain insurance through their employers.

5) DEFICIT NEUTRAL: there should be no increase in our national debt.

6) PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY: individuals must take responsibility for managing their health and those who make unhealthy lifestyle decisions should pay more.

7) LIMITED GOVERNMENT: government intrusion is a major contributor to runaway health care costs and therefore reform should seek to reduce, not expand, the role of government in the health care industry.

8) PORTABILITY: I should be able to take my insurance with me when I change jobs.

9) PRIVACY: government should not have access to my private medical information.

Some examples of common sense health care reforms that should be enacted include:

1) EXPAND COMPETITION by repealing government restrictions which prevent insurance companies from offering plans across state lines.

2) EQUALIZE TAX LAWS so employer-provided and individually-owned health insurance have the same tax benefits.

3) ELIMINATE GOVERNMENT MANDATES that drive-up the cost of insurance for all people.

4) ENACT TORT REFORM to end frivolous lawsuits that force doctors to practice defensive medicine and pay astronomical insurance rates.

5) EXPAND HEALTH SAVINGS ACCOUNTS coupled with high-deductible health plans to increase price transparency and create true competition by putting consumers' in-charge of spending their own health care dollars.

6)IMPROVE PURCHASING POWER for individuals and small employers by allowing them to form purchasing pools across state lines.

7) INCREASE PRICE TRANSPARENCY so consumers can understand the true costs of their health care and shop for the best price.

8) REFORM MEDICARE to eliminate the projected $38 trillion in unfunded government obligations.

9) USE SUBSIDIZED PRIVATE INSURANCE to provide coverage for the poor instead of implementing massive government-directed bureaucracies.

10) OFFER INCENTIVES TO ENCOURANCE HEALTHLY LIFESTYLES so that individuals will take more responsibility for managing their own health.

11) REQUIRE PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP for all individuals that receive taxpayer-subsidized coverage.

12) REQUIRE MEMBERS OF CONGRESS TO ADOPT THE SAME PLAN that they impose on the American people.

[True American]

Raven wrote:

<quoted text>
The sleeping happened during the Bush administration. The real problems started in the 90's and we closed our eyes when there was still time to fix it. It's probably too late now, but at least Obama's trying. Try to hold your blame until he's done something to deserve it.

OK typical Obama supporter blame everything on someone else. No matter what or when someone was sleeping I don’t think we should flush our freedoms and give up to the new American Gestapo. I can truly say that Obama and gang has done more damage than all the administrations combined in the past 200 years. He has spent more money, made radical changes without regard to the American people, is working hard at destroying our standing in the international community, destroying the American dollar, etc. Wake up raven and think what is best for America as a whole not more free handouts to assistance dependent individuals. Taxing the working class anymore will drag us further down a hole I’m afraid we will never see light again. However, those dependent on some form of assistance will most naturally think this is a good thing. Another thing for free bring it on ----Take care and watch diligently to what he and gang are up to. If you don’t see or hear anything then you are sleeping.

[Raven]

True American wrote:

<quoted text>
OK typical Obama supporter blame everything on someone else. No matter what or when someone was sleeping I don’t think we should flush our freedoms and give up to the new American Gestapo. I can truly say that Obama and gang has done more damage than all the administrations combined in the past 200 years. He has spent more money, made radical changes without regard to the American people, is working hard at destroying our standing in the international community, destroying the American dollar, etc. Wake up raven and think what is best for America as a whole not more free handouts to assistance dependent individuals. Taxing the working class anymore will drag us further down a hole I’m afraid we will never see light again. However, those dependent on some form of assistance will most naturally think this is a good thing. Another thing for free bring it on ----Take care and watch diligently to what he and gang are up to. If you don’t see or hear anything then you are sleeping.

I see and hear plenty. I guess I just see things differently than you do. I see Obama trying to fix the mess we were in when he took office. Yes, tons of money is being spent. What did you think would happen if he sttod by and let the banks fail? This was a global problem and it was the fault of greed in the US. Not only would the whole world have been in a depression, they would have been extremely pissed at us. I disagree with most of what you've said, but most especially that he's destroyed our standing in the international community. Where have you been? Maybe you should watch something besides FOX and get a little balance in your perspective. I do, however, agree with your views on free handouts. It only drags us down. But since it's been going on for 3 generations, who's to blame for that? What would happen if it got cut off with no warning? I hope the welfare and food stamp programs will be phased out over time so people can regain their self respect.

[Raven]

Liberty wrote:

<quoted text>
I believe common sense health care reforms should embrace the following principles:
1) CHOICE: the ability to choose my own plan, doctors, facilities and treatments.
2) ACCESS: the ability to get the treatment I need, when I need it, without delay or denial of service.
3) COST REDUCTIONS: meaningful reductions in the cost of my insurance and medical care.
4) FAIRNESS: individuals who purchase their own insurance should receive the same tax savings as those who obtain insurance through their employers.
5) DEFICIT NEUTRAL: there should be no increase in our national debt.
6) PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY: individuals must take responsibility for managing their health and those who make unhealthy lifestyle decisions should pay more.
7) LIMITED GOVERNMENT: government intrusion is a major contributor to runaway health care costs and therefore reform should seek to reduce, not expand, the role of government in the health care industry.
8) PORTABILITY: I should be able to take my insurance with me when I change jobs.
9) PRIVACY: government should not have access to my private medical information.
Some examples of common sense health care reforms that should be enacted include:
1) EXPAND COMPETITION by repealing government restrictions which prevent insurance companies from offering plans across state lines.
2) EQUALIZE TAX LAWS so employer-provided and individually-owned health insurance have the same tax benefits.
3) ELIMINATE GOVERNMENT MANDATES that drive-up the cost of insurance for all people.
4) ENACT TORT REFORM to end frivolous lawsuits that force doctors to practice defensive medicine and pay astronomical insurance rates.
5) EXPAND HEALTH SAVINGS ACCOUNTS coupled with high-deductible health plans to increase price transparency and create true competition by putting consumers' in-charge of spending their own health care dollars.
6)IMPROVE PURCHASING POWER for individuals and small employers by allowing them to form purchasing pools across state lines.
7) INCREASE PRICE TRANSPARENCY so consumers can understand the true costs of their health care and shop for the best price.
8) REFORM MEDICARE to eliminate the projected $38 trillion in unfunded government obligations.
9) USE SUBSIDIZED PRIVATE INSURANCE to provide coverage for the poor instead of implementing massive government-directed bureaucracies.
10) OFFER INCENTIVES TO ENCOURANCE HEALTHLY LIFESTYLES so that individuals will take more responsibility for managing their own health.
11) REQUIRE PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP for all individuals that receive taxpayer-subsidized coverage.
12) REQUIRE MEMBERS OF CONGRESS TO ADOPT THE SAME PLAN that they impose on the American people.

Agreed.#7 is the biggest issue. There's a fine line between too much government and not enough. It would be nice if everyone could be trusted to do what's best for all.

[Liberty]

By: Phil Kerpen
If you thought Washington-which already took over banking and autos, and is fast-tracking attempts to take over health care and energy-would leave the Internet alone, you were dead wrong. The Internet (perhaps our greatest free market success story in recent years) is squarely in the cross-hairs of the administration and it's not waiting for Congress to act. The charge is being led by an eager, ideologically committed White House staffer named Susan Crawford. Officially, she is the Special Assistant for Science, Technology, and Innovation Policy. Wired Magazine calls her, "the most powerful geek close to the president." In recent weeks, bloggers and online activists have begun calling Crawford the "Internet Czar." The shoe fits.
For the next couple days, we need to make our case against FCC even taking that first step down the road to a Washington takeover of the Internet. The FCC created a website at www.OpenInternet.gov where you can comment on government regulating the Internet under so-called net neutrality rules. The left has been flooding it with comments. Please take a moment to head over to www.OpenInternet.gov and click on "Join the Discussion" to make your voice heard for keeping the Internet in private hands.

[Raven]

Liberty wrote:

By: Phil Kerpen
If you thought Washington-which already took over banking and autos, and is fast-tracking attempts to take over health care and energy-would leave the Internet alone, you were dead wrong. The Internet (perhaps our greatest free market success story in recent years) is squarely in the cross-hairs of the administration and it's not waiting for Congress to act. The charge is being led by an eager, ideologically committed White House staffer named Susan Crawford. Officially, she is the Special Assistant for Science, Technology, and Innovation Policy. Wired Magazine calls her, "the most powerful geek close to the president." In recent weeks, bloggers and online activists have begun calling Crawford the "Internet Czar." The shoe fits.
For the next couple days, we need to make our case against FCC even taking that first step down the road to a Washington takeover of the Internet. The FCC created a website at www.OpenInternet.gov where you can comment on government regulating the Internet under so-called net neutrality rules. The left has been flooding it with comments. Please take a moment to head over to www.OpenInternet.gov and click on "Join the Discussion" to make your voice heard for keeping the Internet in private hands.

From what I've read, they're just trying to make sure everyone has access to the internet and there's fair competition among internet providers. Of course, I read more than Phil Kerpen's article.

[Rebecca C]

Raven wrote:

<quoted text>
From what I've read, they're just trying to make sure everyone has access to the internet and there's fair competition among internet providers. Of course, I read more than Phil Kerpen's article.

Are you really this naive?'trying to make sure everyone has access?' When did having access to the Internet become a government issue or a Constitutional right? It is a back door, sneak attempt at controlling the Internet and the access we have to open public opinions. Is nobody else seeing the government attempt to take away every right and piece of privacy that we have? It absolutely astonishes me that nobody has revolted against the atrocities that are going on right in front of our eyes. If we don't wake up soon, we will have every one of our American rights taken away in less than one Presidential term. I have the feeling, Raven, that if you would honestly read and take heed to other information out there than just what is on Obama's reading list, then you would possibly be better informed and see the devious slope that our 'Rock Star' president has us on. However, you might also be one of the people on the list that thinks government handouts and 'free' healthcare are worth the price of our God given American rights.

[justice]

Raven wrote:

<quoted text>
From what I've read, they're just trying to make sure everyone has access to the internet and there's fair competition among internet providers. Of course, I read more than Phil Kerpen's article.

"fair competition" who the h*ll ever said there had to be fair competition? You know what that sounds like to me....people that weren't smart enough to make it or don't want to work for it and still want a piece of the pie. Having the Internet is a luxury, not a must, so you are not entitled to 'fair competition.' That is the lamest bullsh*t i've ever heard. Any provider can charge what they want for the service they provide. As a consumer, you will either pay the price , find another provider with a different rate, or do without. That is what keeps 'fair market value' in check is consumers that price shop. Next thing you know is that the government has to buy everyone a d*mn computer to access the 'free' Internet they have provided. If the government would just stick to the issues that they honestly had a right to govern such as roads, homeland defense, national parks, etc. then we would be much better off. They wouldn't be spending billions and billions of our tax money on issues that they have no business jumping into.

[1103]

The government should stay out of anything and everything except for homeland defense, national parks, and roads across America. The Government is taking away our rights and privacy little by little until one day we wake up and have nothing left.

[Raven]

Rebecca C wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you really this naive?'trying to make sure everyone has access?' When did having access to the Internet become a government issue or a Constitutional right? It is a back door, sneak attempt at controlling the Internet and the access we have to open public opinions. Is nobody else seeing the government attempt to take away every right and piece of privacy that we have? It absolutely astonishes me that nobody has revolted against the atrocities that are going on right in front of our eyes. If we don't wake up soon, we will have every one of our American rights taken away in less than one Presidential term. I have the feeling, Raven, that if you would honestly read and take heed to other information out there than just what is on Obama's reading list, then you would possibly be better informed and see the devious slope that our 'Rock Star' president has us on. However, you might also be one of the people on the list that thinks government handouts and 'free' healthcare are worth the price of our God given American rights.

I have no idea what's on Obama's reading list, and no, I'm not on his e-mail list. I read many websites to get my information. There are still many rural areas that don't yet have access to the internet. Students in those areas are falling behind the rest of the country in their education. And just so you know, I've stated more than once that I don't agee with government handouts. It steals a person's self-respect. As for your question about my naivete, our "Rock Star" president hasn't had time in his 9 months in office to create these problems. You need to look a little farther back to our very own Wild Bill. He had the best of intentions, but you know what people say about those! Now we're screwed.