Gun Laws Debate - Jacksonville, FL

Discuss the national Gun Laws debate in Jacksonville, FL.

Does the US need to reform its gun laws?

Jacksonville thinks US gun laws are fine.
Not at all
 
22
Yes
 
2
Undecided
 
2

Vote now in Jacksonville:

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brenda

Jacksonville, FL

#1 Aug 29, 2012
we need to protect ourselves from government
Toaster

Pomona Park, FL

#2 Aug 29, 2012
Guns don't commit crimes, people do.
Eliminate the criminals permanently, and the problem goes away.
Why should law abiding,tax paying citizens lose a freedom.

“Just Add Obama ”

Since: Mar 08

Jacksonville Florida

#3 Aug 29, 2012
Only if reform makes it easier for law abiding citizens to carry and protect themselves from the POS who will not obey ANY law.
Army if one

Hollywood, FL

#4 Sep 9, 2012
I don't like someone leaving a loaded .45 w/hollow points in an unlocked truck. It's stolen and then what?

Being able to carry is a privilege like driving your car.

Shouldn't there be something in place to keep people from supply criminals with weapons?

I don't have an answer, just think people need to be more responsible.

I'm all for armed responsible citizens, but I would prefer a higher level of training, and the Training refreshed at least once every year (range time counting towards that).

I've seen some folks that are carrying according to the law, but they make me pretty nervous because of lack of judgement or just plain absent minded. In the heat of the moment I don't knie who will get shot.
Viker

Montgomery, AL

#5 Sep 10, 2012
The laws doesn't need to be any more restrictive than they are now. I'm just glad I can legally carry here in Florida.
Mackie

Herndon, VA

#6 Oct 30, 2012
Only if reform makes it easier for law abiding citizens to carry and protect themselves from the POS who will not obe...agree w/ Mr Logic in Jax
Besara

Des Moines, IA

#7 Oct 31, 2012
Army if one wrote:
I don't like someone leaving a loaded .45 w/hollow points in an unlocked truck. It's stolen and then what?
Being able to carry is a privilege like driving your car.
Shouldn't there be something in place to keep people from supply criminals with weapons?
I don't have an answer, just think people need to be more responsible.
I'm all for armed responsible citizens, but I would prefer a higher level of training, and the Training refreshed at least once every year (range time counting towards that).
I've seen some folks that are carrying according to the law, but they make me pretty nervous because of lack of judgement or just plain absent minded. In the heat of the moment I don't knie who will get shot.
What other rights and liberties would YOU mandate require higher levels of training or refreshing? Seems you're a bit of a gun bigot.
Gun Owning Democrat

AOL

#8 Nov 4, 2012
The only time I had trouble in Obama's four years was getting bullets. Because there was a rush on ammunition caused by the Chicken Littles who keep screaming the world was ending. My God we have gotten more rights in four years, to own assault weapons, and sell them in parking lots or flea markets. More rights to carry guns into restaurants, bars,parks, churches than ever before. At the same time we've had more tragic gut ripping accidents with guns than ever before. Kids finding their parents guns killing each other or their parents by accident or sometimes on purpose.

I would like to see life long training, maybe safety and shooting recertification for gun owners. I'd love for most people to take shooting courses on when NOT to whip out a weapon in public or when NOT fire especially in crowds. If shots are fired in a crowd and everyone pulls out their guns, the cops won't be able to tell the good guys from bad. It's getting crazy what armchair cowboys think they can do in real life.

I know people are scared but it terrifies me to go to the movies and some 70 year old guy's loaded and cocked gun falls out of his jacket pocket in front of my nephews kids. There's time to protect yourselves and then there's paranoia. I see more paranoia these days than real threats.
Law

Papillion, NE

#9 Nov 4, 2012
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
The only time I had trouble in Obama's four years was getting bullets. Because there was a rush on ammunition caused by the Chicken Littles who keep screaming the world was ending. My God we have gotten more rights in four years, to own assault weapons, and sell them in parking lots or flea markets. More rights to carry guns into restaurants, bars,parks, churches than ever before.
All as a result of state legislation. Nothing done federally.
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
At the same time we've had more tragic gut ripping accidents with guns than ever before.
Got proof?
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
Kids finding their parents guns killing each other or their parents by accident or sometimes on purpose.
I would like to see life long training, maybe safety and shooting recertification for gun owners. I'd love for most people to take shooting courses on when NOT to whip out a weapon in public or when NOT fire especially in crowds.
The majority of concealed carry courses cover this.
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
If shots are fired in a crowd and everyone pulls out their guns, the cops won't be able to tell the good guys from bad.
Speaking of Chicken Little.
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
It's getting crazy what armchair cowboys think they can do in real life.
And now you're projecting.
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
I know people are scared but it terrifies me to go to the movies and some 70 year old guy's loaded and cocked gun falls out of his jacket pocket in front of my nephews kids. There's time to protect yourselves and then there's paranoia. I see more paranoia these days than real threats.
So that shootign n the theater in Colorado was just a figment of the public's imagination?
You say the 70 year old is paranoid yet had he been able to carry in that theater, he could have made the difference in how many lives were lost.
Bet you're a big fan of "Gun Free Zones".
Reason Over Fanaticism

AOL

#10 Nov 4, 2012
I'm a gun owner but I'm a firm believer in banning guns from STUPID PEOPLE. Here are few links that will prove my point that some people shouldn't have guns regardless of their rights and even Cops mess up big time. Emotional state of mind changes due to drug use or illness, aging affects visual acuity, reflexes, cognition, coordination. To hand out gun permits Willy nilly is careless and puts people's lives in more danger from being robbed and killed with their own weapons.

ACCIDENTAL SHOOTINGS: An 11 year old boy accidentally shoots his mother in the head in Tennessee. http://timesnews.net/article/9051300/

MORE KIDS WITH GUNS: http://kidshootings.blogspot.com/search/label...

Another idiot adult who thought he could carry his gun, cocked, in the front of his waist band.
http://www.examiner.com/article/michigan-man-...

A 53-year-old man who died after accidentally shooting himself in the head, was a U.S. military veteran who was believed to be a master weapons instructor, police said. He assumed the gun was unloaded.
http://www.journal-news.net/page/content.deta...

HUNTING ACCIDENTS: http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2011-12-17/s...

http://thegazette.com/2011/12/07/at-least-fiv...

INTENTIONAL SHOOTINGS: Man shoots and kills door to door salesman. http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/07/26/florida...

Man kills family then self.(This was the guy who was afraid Obama would get re-elected. Paranoia is a mental illness.)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/her...

WHEN THINGS GO HORRIBLY WRONG: Sometimes, Tasers are more appropriate use of force than deadly force. For instance this 83 year old lady was sacred, confused and didn't know who to trust.She thought she was being robbed. Of course she will carry a kitchen knife as she is running out the back door. There was no reason for cops to shoot and kill her when she had called 911 for help. Maybe she couldn't hear well, either way she's dead because of some cowboys itchy trigger fingers.
http://www.examiner.com/article/83-year-old-g...

Even when officers are trained on when to shoot and who NOT to shoot, people running in panic WILL be caught in the crossfire.*New York Police Department officials have confirmed that all nine bystanders shot during the Empire State Building tragedy last Friday were struck by bullets fired by two police officers – Officer Craig Matthews who shot seven times and Officer Robert Sinishtaj who fired nine times. It was reported that neither officer had fired his weapon in the line of duty prior to the incident.

http://samuel-warde.com/2012/08/nypd-confirms...
Law

Papillion, NE

#11 Nov 4, 2012
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
I'm a gun owner but I'm a firm believer in banning guns from STUPID PEOPLE. Here are few links that will prove my point that some people shouldn't have guns regardless of their rights and even Cops mess up big time.
Regarldess of their rights? You sound like a frustrated contorol freak no matter what name you use.
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
Emotional state of mind changes due to drug use or illness, aging affects visual acuity, reflexes, cognition, coordination. To hand out gun permits Willy nilly is careless and puts people's lives in more danger from being robbed and killed with their own weapons.
Who is handing out permits willy-nilly? Got names? Got proof?
And where are your stats to back up your last asserion?
Gun Owning Democrat wrote:
ACCIDENTAL SHOOTINGS: An 11 year old boy accidentally shoots his mother in the head in Tennessee. http://timesnews.net/article/9051300/
MORE KIDS WITH GUNS: http://kidshootings.blogspot.com/search/label...
Another idiot adult who thought he could carry his gun, cocked, in the front of his waist band.
http://www.examiner.com/article/michigan-man-...
A 53-year-old man who died after accidentally shooting himself in the head, was a U.S. military veteran who was believed to be a master weapons instructor, police said. He assumed the gun was unloaded.
http://www.journal-news.net/page/content.deta...
HUNTING ACCIDENTS: http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2011-12-17/s...
http://thegazette.com/2011/12/07/at-least-fiv...
INTENTIONAL SHOOTINGS: Man shoots and kills door to door salesman. http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/07/26/florida...
Man kills family then self.(This was the guy who was afraid Obama would get re-elected. Paranoia is a mental illness.)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/her...
WHEN THINGS GO HORRIBLY WRONG: Sometimes, Tasers are more appropriate use of force than deadly force. For instance this 83 year old lady was sacred, confused and didn't know who to trust.She thought she was being robbed. Of course she will carry a kitchen knife as she is running out the back door. There was no reason for cops to shoot and kill her when she had called 911 for help. Maybe she couldn't hear well, either way she's dead because of some cowboys itchy trigger fingers.
http://www.examiner.com/article/83-year-old-g...
Even when officers are trained on when to shoot and who NOT to shoot, people running in panic WILL be caught in the crossfire.*New York Police Department officials have confirmed that all nine bystanders shot during the Empire State Building tragedy last Friday were struck by bullets fired by two police officers – Officer Craig Matthews who shot seven times and Officer Robert Sinishtaj who fired nine times. It was reported that neither officer had fired his weapon in the line of duty prior to the incident.
http://samuel-warde.com/2012/08/nypd-confirms...
So? In that same perod of time, how many crimes were thwarted or lives saved with the mere presences of a firearm?

"There are approximately two million defensive gun uses (DGU's) per year by law abiding citizens. That was one of the findings in a national survey conducted by Gary Kleck, a Florida State University criminologist in 1993. Prior to Dr. Kleck's survey, thirteen other surveys indicated a range of between 800,000 to 2.5 million DGU's annually."

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdguse.ht...
Law

Papillion, NE

#12 Nov 4, 2012
Bank President Pulls Gun on Bank Robber

http://www.guns.com/bank-president-apprehends...

You always hear stories of people pulling guns on bank tellers, but what about the other way around? When was the last time that you heard of a bank manager holding a bank robber at gun point? Peoples Bank & Trust President David W. Thompson of St. Louis, Missouri, turned the tables on a gun-toting thief with a weapon of his own.

The St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported that it started the same way that most robberies start: a masked-man walked into a bank, held up the place, and then walked out with a bag full of loot. He should have known better – in order to get in, he had to pass a sign explaining that the bank was a concealed carry-approved establishment. The official policy of the bank explains,“Management recognizes the Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution as an unalienable right of all citizens.”

The robbery went off without a hitch, but Thompson wasn’t about to let 58-year-old Donald Ray Lee, who wore the Chucky mask from the film "Child's Play", just waltz out of his bank with a bag full of other peoples’ cash. He grabbed his Colt .380 handgun and went out into the parking lot to confront Lee, locking the door behind him. Once he was certain that there would be no collateral damage, he pointed his gun at Lee and said,“Sir, get out of the truck. You’re not going anywhere.”

The man put his hand in his pocket as if he had a gun, but Thompson warned,“You don’t want to go there. This will end badly.” He sounds cool as a cucumber, which Thompson explained was a product of the adrenaline:“I didn’t have time to get scared. I was excited. Your adrenaline pumps. He robbed a bank, he menaced my employees, and I don’t allow that.”

It turns out that it was all a bluff. The robber did not have a weapon of his own, so it was a piece of cake holding him until the cops showed up. They charged Lee with first-degree robbery in a bank heist and set his bail at a cool $50k.

----------

Home invasion suspect shot by female victim

http://www.wafb.com/story/19950763/home-invas...

BIRMINGHAM, AL (WBRC)-
A burglar got more than he bargained for when he targeted the wrong house in Jefferson County.

The woman he was trying to steal from fought back and shot him.

"I was awakened with a gun in my face hollering 'give me all yo money and give me all yo jewelry' and I screamed 'I don't have any money and I don't have any jewelry,'" the victim, who does not want to be identified, said. "That didn't satisfy [him]. Then he asked me about everyone in my house during this time I'm fumbling to get my gun. He pushed me down. I got up fought back."

Deputy Chief Randy Christian from the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office says the suspect had an air rifle, similar to a BB gun.

"She didn't know that at the time, she thought it was loaded. He knew it though. Sometime during the struggle, he put that down took out a keyhole saw. He cut her a few times superficially with that," Christian said.

The victim was cut on her stomach and on her arm.

"Kept on fighting and another person in the house got up to see what the dogs were barking at and that distracted him. When that distracted him I finally got to my pistol and fired a round," the victim said.

The suspect was found at UAB Medical West hospital. Deputies found him by calling the hospital and asking if they had a patient with a gunshot wound. When they arrived and interviewed the suspect, they say he had an interesting explanation for his injury.

"Tried to make up a story that he was at a party and shot himself on a dare," Christian said.

"He felt like it was going to be easy especially when he saw me on oxygen and a woman. I can take her down, sorry," the victim said.

The suspects name has not been released because charges are still pending.
Law

Papillion, NE

#13 Nov 4, 2012
MI Homeowner Fires at, Scares Off Burglar

A Ferndale homeowner shot at a man who was trying to break into his home Friday, and now the suspect’s in custody, according to the Ferndale Police Department.

During the Friday incident, the homeowner responded to a would-be burglar who was trying to break in through a bedroom window at his house on Edgewood Place.

The homeowner fired two shots from a handgun at the man — who has been identified as 32-year-old Jeffrey Paul Reiher — who managed to escape and flee in a silver pick-up truck, police said
Law

Papillion, NE

#14 Nov 4, 2012
Homeowner shoots home invader, protecting wife and child.

http://gunssavelives.net/self-defense/homeown...

Two men are at large and third was hospitalized Tuesday after a homeowner fired a handgun at home invaders, police said.

The incident took place about 3:20 p.m. at 2303 S. Green St., Salt Lake City police detective Dennis McGowan said.

According to witnesses, a man, woman and child were inside the home when the man opened the door for an acquaintance. When he did, three adult men rushed inside the home, one of them armed with a gun, McGowan said.

More info at the video below and the link below that.
----------

Owner of Pizzeria Shoots and Kills Armed Robber

An armed robber got more than he bargained for after trying to rob a pizzeria in Indiana.

The owner at the shop drew his own weapon and shot the would be robber.

The suspect then fled the store and collapsed on the sidewalk outside.

When authorities arrived the wounded suspect was transported to an area hospital, where he died.

Please follow the link below to read the full source article:
http://www.local12.com/news/state/story/Pizza... -...

Is the link above broken? You can view an archived copy of the source article here: http://www.webcitation.org/6Bc0Y0oFC
----------
Law

Papillion, NE

#15 Nov 4, 2012
Defensive Gun Use of the Day: Tough Old Bird Edition

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/10/dani...

If you’re ever so hard up that you figure your only option is to break into someone’s home and steal their stuff, just remember — you don’t want to mess with Jill Stucker. The 64-year-old from Lake City, Florida knows how to handle a hairy situation, not to mention her gun.“Police said Jill Stucker was watching TV about 9:20 p.m. at her home in the 800 block of Northeast Lake Drive when 26-year-old Milton Barber Jr. broke in through the bedroom window.” Is it ageist/sexist to say most 64-year-old women wouldn’t have had a clue what to do in the same situation? Yes, yes it is. But Ms. Stucker handled herself like a real operator ...


First, she got her gun. Second, as news4jax.com reports, she made for the back door, probably figuring the home invader would take what he wanted and skedaddle. But he skedidn’t.


As she tried to flee her home, Barber began chasing her out of the house, police said. They said Stucker began screaming for help as heard by her neighbors, and as she began running toward the road, she stopped, saw the intruder still chasing her and fired one shot at him, striking him once in the chest, police said.

One shot, in the dark with adrenaline flowing like champagne in the Giants’ locker room last night. And she plugs him center mass. Not bad. Not bad at all.

The hole in his thorax made Barber change his trajectory.


Barber fled out the backyard over a wooden fence, dropping blood on the fence and fled down the sidewalk, leaving a blood trail, police said. They said Barber collapsed on the doorstep of the home of a man who was applying pressure to the gunshot wound when officers arrived.

But why would he take off after the homeowner when he could have had anything in her house? Here’s a clue:


Barber is a convicted felon and a registered sexual offender. He was also placed on probation by the state of Florida on July 11 for previous charges of burglary, battery and sexual assault until July 2019.

We don’t know Ms. Stucker, but we’d like to shake her hand.
Law

Papillion, NE

#16 Nov 4, 2012
Reasons why you shouldn't try stealing a gun owner's car.

http://www.guns.com/man-catches-truck-thieve-...

Getting your car stolen sucks the big one. The worst part about is that most car owners don’t get a chance to stop it. Your car is there when you go to sleep, and then when you wake up it’s gone. Some men, like Pulp Fiction’s Vincent Vega, would give anything to catch a car thief in action.

One enviable car owner managed to catch a pair of car thieves in action in Morgan County, Missouri. And unfortunately for the car thieves, that car owner also just so happened to be a gun owner.

According to Lake News Online, the gun owner confronted 45-year-old Robert Eaton, and his partner in crime, 50-year-old Mark Meggs, as the two were trying to break into a truck. Meggs immediately fled the scene, leaving his partner to stare down the barrel of a gun as they waited for the police to arrive.

The cops took Eaton into custody and went on a manhunt through the woods for Meggs. Meanwhile, Meggs had approached another neighbor with a story about how he was having car trouble (technically, that’s kind of true) and that he needed to call somebody for a ride. Another neighbor was aware of the full situation, though, so he phoned the police and warned them that one of the suspect might be hiding out at a neighbor’s place.
So, the cops swung by and picked up Meggs, too. They slapped ‘em with tampering and burglary charges and their bonds have been set at a hefty $50,000.
Upon further investigation, it seems that these two small-time crooks were on something of a spree. The police believe that the two men had broken into another residence a few days earlier and had stolen valuables. Many of those valuables have since been recovered.
The world is an ever-so-slightly better place thanks to that ballsy gun owner. It’s not like these two men are mass murderers or anything, but there’s just something viscerally satisfying about a gun owner stumbling upon a pair of men who are trying to swipe his car – it's instantaneous karma kicking in.

What would you do if you were in the gun owner’s shoes? Shooting a guy who breaks into your home in the middle of the night is one thing – that guy’s inherently threatening you and your family. Shooting a guy who’s stealing your car is another matter – that guy’s just being a toolbag and isn’t really threatening anybody. It’s great if you can get the thieves to kiss the dirt and wait for the cops to show up, but if they turn tail and run there’s not much you can do stop them without putting a bullet in their backs. What would you have done differently to take control of the situation?
Law

Papillion, NE

#17 Nov 4, 2012
Elyria homeowner sleeps with gun after burglary, shoots intruder when he comes back for seconds.

http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/8598

The Lorain Morning-Journal is reporting that an Elyria resident fatally shot a burglar who confronted him at home in the early Friday darkness, then hours later he was confronted by the dead man's upset relatives.

Police said Jeffrey Carson, 29, of Elyria, broke into a house at 112 Water St. about 2:44 a.m. after getting a friend to boost him up to get in through an unlocked window.

The home’s residents, Jack and Linda Dillon, were awakened by Carson, who was in their living room, believed to be stealing electronics, police said. Jack Dillon called out and Carson lunged at him. Dillon had a handgun and shot Carson, police said.

In a frantic call to 911, Linda Dillon said, "Oh my God, we just had a break-in and we shot him." She continued, "My husband shot him. Oh Jesus. He's on my couch. I think this guy is dead."

Then she thanked God her granddaughter wasn't there.

Linda Dillon also made reference to a burglary Thursday morning in which their $1,700 52-inch Sharp flat-screen television was stolen, according to a police report of the incident. "We knew he was coming back. He unlocked my window," she said. Police have not yet linked Carson to that earlier burglary.

LifeCare ambulance Vice President Herb de la Porte said the Carson was critical at the scene and paramedics took him to EMH Elyria Medical Center, where he died.

The article goes on to report that the deceased burglar's two siblings, Bobbie Kniceley and her brother Johnny Minor Jr., went to the Water Street home a few hours after the shooting and confronted the homeowners, who were just returning home.


"The people just blew his brains out," Kniceley said. "They could have done something else."
The couple got out of their car, approached Kniceley and Minor and retorted, "You don't just go breaking into people's houses."

"Like you really had to shoot someone with a shotgun," Kniceley replied.

As the yelling continued, Jessica Dillon, who lives next door, called the police at 9:37 a.m. to report that the burglary suspect's family members were outside 112 Water St. causing trouble, according to an Elyria police log.

The couple yelled at Carson's family to get off their property. Carson’s family members slowly backed away yelling that the Dillons didn't have to kill their brother.

Minutes later police showed up and de-escalated the situation and sent everyone on their way.

The couple declined to comment.

Kniceley admitted Carson had a criminal record for assault, theft and domestic violence. However, she said, "They should have taken different precautions."

Kniceley was notified of the shooting about 4:30 a.m. Another brother, Matt Green, said the family wasn't getting consistent information from authorities.

"We wanted closure; now the family is stuck. We are all confused and upset," he said.

Green last saw Carson Thursday around 6:30 p.m. Carson didn't say anything about planning to break into a house, Green said.

"I'm not saying he was perfect, but he didn't deserve it," Green said.

Carson worked at Green Circle Growers in Oberlin, was laid off and had since gotten another job. Green said he knows his brother had a criminal past, liked to fight and had been behind bars on and off since he was 17 years old. Despite Carson’s past, Green said the situation could have been resolved differently.

According to the article, police are not releasing details about the gun used to shoot Carson or how many times he was shot or where. When asked if the shooting was justified or would be considered self defense, Elyria police Lt. Andy Eichenlaub said, "I'm not going to speculate. The investigation is ongoing."

“Haven't been free since 1776”

Since: Nov 12

International Falls, MN

#18 Nov 12, 2012
Right to bear arms!
Robert

Jacksonville, FL

#19 Nov 23, 2012
Do criminals honor the "law"?
Suzy

Jacksonville, FL

#20 Nov 23, 2012
No we need protection. Then only the thugs will be armed.

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