Gun Control Debate - Midlothian, VA

Discuss the national Gun Control debate in Midlothian, VA.

Would you support a ban on handguns?

Midlothian opposes
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2

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“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#1
Sep 24, 2010
 
I'm from England which has a total ban on handguns which translates to almost no deaths due to this type of firearm!
Get Real

Johnson City, TN

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#2
Sep 24, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
I'm from England which has a total ban on handguns which translates to almost no deaths due to this type of firearm!
This hasn't been an English colony in hundreds of years! It seems like the British didn't have much respect for our individual freedoms then, either.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#3
Sep 24, 2010
 
Get Real wrote:
<quoted text>
This hasn't been an English colony in hundreds of years! It seems like the British didn't have much respect for our individual freedoms then, either.
Funny that you should say that! Because if I read American history right, you American Colonials didn't have much respect for each other's individual freedom either.
Remember the Plymouth Pilgrims, aka Puritans? Supposedly left England to get away from religious persecution, and once they arrived in America started persecuting the Quakers that followed and the Anglicans that followed them.
Your individuals freedoms were the freedoms to beat the crap out of anyone who didn't agree with you, and it would seem that you still maintain this freedom.
Maybe now, since the US is a subsidiary of China, your freedoms will be curtailed as China holds a foreclosure notice on your treasury bonds.

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#4
Sep 25, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
I'm from England which has a total ban on handguns which translates to almost no deaths due to this type of firearm!
Maybe, but why has your violent crime rate quadrupled since then? Oh yeah...because these criminals realize they will not be met with any deadly response.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#5
Sep 25, 2010
 
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
Maybe, but why has your violent crime rate quadrupled since then? Oh yeah...because these criminals realize they will not be met with any deadly response.
This maybe true, but I've never heard of innocent bystanders being killed by bladed weapons or metal pipes.
Professional criminals over here do not carry firearms since everybody knows that if caught, even for a first offense, it's an automatic five year incarceration.
We do not have your mentality over here that the perpetrators of every crime that is considered violent, whether it be a drunken brawl, a gang fight, robbery, or even domestic violence must be shot dead, this is why we have courts of Law.

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#6
Sep 25, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>
This maybe true, but I've never heard of innocent bystanders being killed by bladed weapons or metal pipes.
It is true that an innocent bystander does get hit on occasion. But that is extremely rare. What is even sadder is how your country prosecutes victims for defending themselves.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crim...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/no...
(and these were just the two I could find when searching for about 30 seconds)
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>
Professional criminals over here do not carry firearms since everybody knows that if caught, even for a first offense, it's an automatic five year incarceration.
If that is indeed true, why have your police officers gone back to carrying firearms for their own protection after years of being unarmed? After all, if the criminals don't have them, why do the cops need to? Criminals don't care about laws. That's why they are criminals.
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>We do not have your mentality over here that the perpetrators of every crime that is considered violent, whether it be a drunken brawl, a gang fight, robbery, or even domestic violence must be shot dead, this is why we have courts of Law.
Well one thing for certain. If criminal is shot dead while committing a violent crime, that is a pretty good guarantee that he won't be committing another violent crime, now isn't it?

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#7
Sep 25, 2010
 
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
It is true that an innocent bystander does get hit on occasion. But that is extremely rare. What is even sadder is how your country prosecutes victims for defending themselves.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crim...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/no...
(and these were just the two I could find when searching for about 30 seconds)
<quoted text>
If that is indeed true, why have your police officers gone back to carrying firearms for their own protection after years of being unarmed? After all, if the criminals don't have them, why do the cops need to? Criminals don't care about laws. That's why they are criminals.
<quoted text>
Well one thing for certain. If criminal is shot dead while committing a violent crime, that is a pretty good guarantee that he won't be committing another violent crime, now isn't it?
If that is indeed true, why have your police officers gone back to carrying firearms for their own protection after years of being unarmed? After all, if the criminals don't have them, why do the cops need to? Criminals don't care about laws. That's why they are criminals.
In the United Kingdom, the majority of police officers do not carry firearms, except in special circumstances.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police_use_of_fi...
It is true that an innocent bystander does get hit on occasion. But that is extremely rare.


A gun in the home is 22 times more likely to be used in an unintentional shooting, than to be used to injure or kill in self-defense.
A gun in the home is 22 times more likely to be used in an unintentional shooting, a criminal assault or homicide, or an attempted or completed suicide than to be used to injure or kill in self-defense.
(Journal of Trauma, 1998)
Criminals don't care about laws. That's why they are criminals.
Correctly stated! So why not replace liberal judges who seem to favour the rehabilitation of incorrigible criminals, and sex offenders, some of your States had the right idea with the three strikes and your off the streets forever program.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#8
Sep 25, 2010
 
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
It is true that an innocent bystander does get hit on occasion. But that is extremely rare. What is even sadder is how your country prosecutes victims for defending themselves.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crim...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/no...
(and these were just the two I could find when searching for about 30 seconds)
<quoted text>
If that is indeed true, why have your police officers gone back to carrying firearms for their own protection after years of being unarmed? After all, if the criminals don't have them, why do the cops need to? Criminals don't care about laws. That's why they are criminals.
<quoted text>
Well one thing for certain. If criminal is shot dead while committing a violent crime, that is a pretty good guarantee that he won't be committing another violent crime, now isn't it?
What is even sadder is how your country prosecutes victims for defending themselves.
Our law in this regard is exactly the same as US law, a person is allowed the use of force in defense of oneself, but only the necessary force to overcome your assailant, anything more is considered extra-judicial.

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#9
Sep 25, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Our law in this regard is exactly the same as US law, a person is allowed the use of force in defense of oneself, but only the necessary force to overcome your assailant, anything more is considered extra-judicial.
You need to look up "Castle Doctrine". Your law is NOT the same.

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#10
Sep 25, 2010
 
This quote from one of the linked articles pretty much sums up your courts:

"The parole board, however, has continually refused him early release - saying he has shown no remorse and would continue to pose a danger to any other burglars."

A danger to any other BURGLARS!! Does anyone else see the irony here?
lol

Harrisonburg, VA

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#11
Sep 25, 2010
 
blamimg a gun for killing someone is like blamimg a spoon for rosie odonnel being fat,
it aint the hammer, its the retard swinging it
Realist

Midlothian, VA

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#12
Sep 27, 2010
 
Gun control is about GOVERNMENTAL CONTROL of a fundamental right. Those with a tyrannical bent want their SUBJECTS disarmed. Also, making something illegal does not prevent prevent people who want to use something in a criminal manner from doing so! It's like putting "no robberies" on the door of a 711 store. You think someone is going to read the sign and say, "Oh, we better go rob the Sheetz up the road because they don't have that sign." By banning handguns, you simply harm law-abiding citizens. Oh, and not to mention, we have a Constitutional RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.

REZA. In England you are not even allowed to defend your own home against intrusion with a kitchen knife! And, if you didn't know, gun-free London has a VERY high crime rate! England is fully pussies who don't know how to stand up for their rights.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#13
Sep 27, 2010
 
Realist wrote:
Gun control is about GOVERNMENTAL CONTROL of a fundamental right. Those with a tyrannical bent want their SUBJECTS disarmed. Also, making something illegal does not prevent prevent people who want to use something in a criminal manner from doing so! It's like putting "no robberies" on the door of a 711 store. You think someone is going to read the sign and say, "Oh, we better go rob the Sheetz up the road because they don't have that sign." By banning handguns, you simply harm law-abiding citizens. Oh, and not to mention, we have a Constitutional RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.
REZA. In England you are not even allowed to defend your own home against intrusion with a kitchen knife! And, if you didn't know, gun-free London has a VERY high crime rate! England is fully pussies who don't know how to stand up for their rights.
As the law stands, if you hurt someone while defending yourself, or while stopping a crime, you wonít be prosecuted even if you kill, so long as what you did was reasonable in the circumstances. Youíll only be prosecuted if you have acted unreasonably. And reasonableness isnít judged by the standards of behaviour at a vicarís tea party, itís judged by what someone in desperate circumstances would do.
Worried

Chesterfield, MO

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#14
Sep 27, 2010
 
The Second Amendment was written and made a part of the Constitution not to protect us from foreign powers but from our own government when it goes out of control. A government that does not have some fear of those it governs will dominate them.

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#15
Sep 28, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>
As the law stands, if you hurt someone while defending yourself, or while stopping a crime, you wonít be prosecuted even if you kill, so long as what you did was reasonable in the circumstances. Youíll only be prosecuted if you have acted unreasonably. And reasonableness isnít judged by the standards of behaviour at a vicarís tea party, itís judged by what someone in desperate circumstances would do.
Reasonable according to whom? The government??

If some one comes after me with a knife, bat, or pipe (all deadly weapons) and I pull out a gun and kill them, I would be locked up for life in the UK for using excessive force.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#16
Sep 28, 2010
 
Worried wrote:
The Second Amendment was written and made a part of the Constitution not to protect us from foreign powers but from our own government when it goes out of control. A government that does not have some fear of those it governs will dominate them.
This is true, but what good would a citizen's militia be against today's modern trained army. I could see a confrontation with a citizen militia - even if they were allowed assault weapons - similar to the Tiananmen Square fiasco.
It might have had some chance 220 years ago when everybody, that could afford them, had similar weapons and training, but your 2nd Amendment could not envision the world of today.

“Pardon my nosiness ”

Since: May 07

London, England

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#17
Sep 28, 2010
 
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
Reasonable according to whom? The government??
If some one comes after me with a knife, bat, or pipe (all deadly weapons) and I pull out a gun and kill them, I would be locked up for life in the UK for using excessive force.
I think this may help define excessive force according to UK law!

http://www.laugarkungfu.co.uk/use%20of%20forc...
Trust Reason

Houston, TX

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#18
Sep 28, 2010
 
No one argues any other amendments in the bill of rights. Can you imagine the oproar if this kind of infringement were exercised over the first or fourth amendment?

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

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#19
Sep 28, 2010
 
reza june wrote:
<quoted text>
I think this may help define excessive force according to UK law!
http://www.laugarkungfu.co.uk/use%20of%20forc...
Here is where your laws are completely screwed up (from your link):

Offensive Weapons:-
Anything designed, adapted, intended or modified to cause injury to another.(AV: complete B.S. anything can be modified to use as a weapon. Even a rolled up magazine can be used as a baton, a screwdriver makes a good shank...so does an ink pen.)

It is an offence to have an offensive weapon away from your abode with no lawful excuse.(AV: Offensive or defensive is in the mind of the user. Weapons have no intent. they are merely tools. Intent is strictly in the mind of the user. I carry a sidearm routinely. Is it an offensive weapon? No. It is strictly for my defense and the defense of those around me.)

The onus lies on you to prove your innocence.(AV: COMPLETE NONSENSE!!!! You are innocent until proven guilty.)

An armed individual is a citizen. An idividual disarmed by his govt is a subject.
I carry

Phoenix, AZ

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#20
Sep 28, 2010
 
The Second Amendment was written and made a part of the Constitution not to protect us from foreign powers but from our own government when it goes out of control. A government that does not have some fear of those it governs will dominate them.
I could not have said it better.

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