Gay Marriage Debate - Denver, CO

Discuss the national Gay Marriage debate in Denver, CO.

Do you support gay marriage?

Denver opposes
Oppose
 
373
Support
 
335

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“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#553 Jan 2, 2013
emilyut1207 wrote:
Love is love. Doesn't matter what sex you are.
There's no law against same sex marriage in any state. Polygamy and incest are against the law in most states; love isn't the answer.
TheWhydah

United States

#554 Jan 2, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
We don't license blind people to drive cars or fly airplanes and we don't license same sex couples to marry. Life isn't fair.
Government gets a benefit from marriage; the next generation of taxpayers. Same sex couples can't provide that benefit and the blind can't see.
Gay people do reproduce, stupid.
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#555 Jan 2, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
We don't license blind people to drive cars or fly airplanes and we don't license same sex couples to marry. Life isn't fair.
Government gets a benefit from marriage; the next generation of taxpayers. Same sex couples can't provide that benefit and the blind can't see.
We don't license blind people to drive cars or fly airplanes and we don't license same sex couples to marry. Life isn't fair.

Thats is because harm could come from blind people pilotingcars and airplanes.... What harm,,,, REAL harm, not speculated would come from ssm?

Government gets a benefit from marriage; the next generation of taxpayers.

You keep saying this yet ignore that there is no "benifit" to the government to allow people who cannot have children (your issue w ssm) to marry.... So how is that different?

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#556 Jan 3, 2013
TheWhydah wrote:
Gay people do reproduce, stupid.
I don't insult other posters and I've never claimed gay people don't reproduce. I've often cited examples of homosexuals marrying and having children under the same laws as everyone else.

Homosexual couples don't reproduce, that's a fact of life. Whenever gay people reproduce, they do it by mimicking straight people.
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#557 Jan 3, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>I don't insult other posters and I've never claimed gay people don't reproduce. I've often cited examples of homosexuals marrying and having children under the same laws as everyone else.
Homosexual couples don't reproduce, that's a fact of life. Whenever gay people reproduce, they do it by mimicking straight people.
Infertile people dont reproduce... that is a fact.... People who are "fixed" dont reproduce that is a fact, post menopausal women dont reproduce that is a fact... yet all those are allowed the priviledge that a ssc who do not reproduce do not get.... why?

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#558 Jan 3, 2013
None of those ([i]Infertile people,[p]eople who are "fixed" and post menopausal women) are allowed to marry someone of the same gender.

Government has no practical way to determine fertility without invading the individual's private reproductive choice.

Just as homosexuals have a right to their private intimate behavior; we have a right to protect the ancient public institution of marriage.
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#559 Jan 3, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
None of those ([i]Infertile people,[p]eople who are "fixed" and post menopausal women) are allowed to marry someone of the same gender.
Government has no practical way to determine fertility without invading the individual's private reproductive choice.
Just as homosexuals have a right to their private intimate behavior; we have a right to protect the ancient public institution of marriage.
None of those ([i]Infertile people,[p]eople who are "fixed" and post menopausal women) are allowed to marry someone of the same gender.

Does not matter... they meet the same criteria you use to disallow leagally recognized ssm

"Government has no practical way to determine fertility without invading the individual's private reproductive choice."

Practical... easy... under penalty of perjury can you to your knowledge conceive children.... easy question to ask. If the woman is over 51 she is considered post menopausal... since average age of last menstrual cycle is below 51. Now will that question weed out all... no... but it is a start.
But again... if you are going to have the rule... you can not produce children biologically as a couple... you can not have it for just one class of people. Called the 14th.

Just as homosexuals have a right to their private intimate behavior; we have a right to protect the ancient public institution of marriage.

And the homosexual has the right (276 years so maybe not "ancient") to have equal rights guaranteed by the constitution. Now before you cut and paste your constitution gender equality fallacious argument, it is about the right to enter into a legally binding contract. The state for no reason are breaking the equal protection clause of the 14th. They are denying the ssc to enter into the legally binding contract, one which allows them to receive state and federal monitary and legal benifits, for no overwhelming reason. Now dont past your next generation falacious arguement as you have shown that since people who can not give the state the "next generation of taxpayers" are allowed to enter into the contract... that is not an overwhelming reason.
TheWhydah

Wheat Ridge, CO

#560 Jan 3, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>I don't insult other posters and. I've never claimed gay people don't reproduce. I've often cited examples of homosexuals marrying and having children under the same laws as everyone else.
Homosexual couples don't reproduce, that's a fact of life. Whenever gay people reproduce, they do it by mimicking straight people.
Your presence is insulting. Your ignorance is an insult. So stop insulting the other posters, Brian G.

Homosexuals still reproduce, even in their committed relationships. So what if they mimic the behavior of straight folks. The results of their labors still yield the same result-- a child.

Dont be daft.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#561 Jan 4, 2013
Marriage is more than a contract. Civil unions and domestic partnerships; I support them as a perfect compromise for same sex couples.
No big O

Bolingbrook, IL

#562 Jan 4, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
Marriage is more than a contract. Civil unions and domestic partnerships; I support them as a perfect compromise for same sex couples.
Back with the silly "more than a contract" cut and paste response. That is like saying a Ferrari is more than a car... but it is still a car. Likewise marriage may be, according to ONE scotus judge's opinion, more than a contract... it is still a contract.

"Civil unions and domestic partnerships; I support them as a perfect compromise for same sex couples."

Then would you be willing to get one?....
Would you be willing to give up any and all federal government benefits i.e. tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits....
Would you be willing to stay in one State, because you know your c.u. is not worth the paper it was printed on in another state?
Would you be willing to accept many many other inequities between a c.u. and marriage?
If not why should they.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#563 Jan 4, 2013
No big O wrote:
[]....Would you be willing to give up any and all federal government benefits i.e. tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits....[]
Same sex marriage would increase wasteful government spending on "tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits" for same sex couples. It would force taxpayers to provide benefits to same sex dependent beneficiaries.

Our economy is in world record debt; increasing government spending is the worst thing we can do.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#564 Jan 4, 2013
It's all about the money (and destroying the fundamental institution of marriage).
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#565 Jan 4, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Same sex marriage would increase wasteful government spending on "tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits" for same sex couples. It would force taxpayers to provide benefits to same sex dependent beneficiaries.
Our economy is in world record debt; increasing government spending is the worst thing we can do.
Answer my question... would you be willing to only have a civil union, why or why not.

"Same sex marriage would increase wasteful government spending on "tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits" for same sex couples"

Since ssc pay taxes and into ss they should be allowed to get the same benifits...

It would force taxpayers to provide benefits to same sex dependent beneficiaries.
Ummm the ssc ARE taxpayers... why should they not get what their taxes pay for?

Our economy is in world record debt; increasing government spending is the worst thing we can do

So what you are saying here... civil rights comes with a cost.. one which, since you are on the have side,,, you dont care to pay.

Again answer the question... would you be willing to accept a civil union with all the inequities there of....
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#566 Jan 4, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
It's all about the money (and destroying the fundamental institution of marriage).
Nope not all about money... all about equality. Examples of money less equality issues... the ability not to testify against your spouse. Since a c.u. is not recognized that "privilege' is not given a couple with c.u.. Another the ability to have your c.u. transferred state to state....

These are two example where there is NO state federal or local money involved... yet the people with a c.u. are treated unequally

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#567 Jan 4, 2013
come on now wrote:
Answer my question... would you be willing to only have a civil union, why or why not.
Yes, if I had a same sex couple a civil union would be appropriate. I wouldn't ask the government to change the definition of marriage for everyone out of common dencency.

.
come on now wrote:
"Same sex marriage would increase wasteful government spending on "tax breaks, s.s. survivor benefits" for same sex couples" Since ssc pay taxes and into ss they should be allowed to get the same benifits...
They don't provide the same benefits to society.

.
come on now wrote:
It would force taxpayers to provide benefits to same sex dependent beneficiaries. Ummm the ssc ARE taxpayers... why should they not get what their taxes pay for?
Their taxes pay for survivors benefits of spouses, not partners.

.
come on now wrote:
Our economy is in world record debt; increasing government spending is the worst thing we can do
So what you are saying here... civil rights comes with a cost.. one which, since you are on the have side,,, you dont care to pay.
Cost is one aspect of how same sex marriage harms our society.

.
come on now wrote:
Again answer the question... would you be willing to accept a civil union with all the inequities there of....
I've answered all your questions. Now answer mine:

Since marriage has always been defined in law as male/female before the 21st Century; were all legal, philosophic, religious, scientific, education and medical leaders homophobes before the 20th Century?
TheWhydah

Aurora, CO

#569 Jan 4, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, if I had a same sex couple a civil union would be appropriate. I wouldn't ask the government to change the definition of marriage for everyone out of common dencency.
.
<quoted text>They don't provide the same benefits to society.
.
<quoted text>Their taxes pay for survivors benefits of spouses, not partners.
.
<quoted text>Cost is one aspect of how same sex marriage harms our society.
.
<quoted text>I've answered all your questions. Now answer mine:
Since marriage has always been defined in law as male/female before the 21st Century; were all legal, philosophic, religious, scientific, education and medical leaders homophobes before the 20th Century?
I'd say in post roman western society there has been a lot of homophobes.

How about we look at gay marriages throughout many cultures through many centuries?

And what do you mean by "gay couples don't provide the same benefits to society?"

Are you being insulting again?
come on now

Bolingbrook, IL

#570 Jan 4, 2013
Brian_G wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, if I had a same sex couple a civil union would be appropriate. I wouldn't ask the government to change the definition of marriage for everyone out of common dencency.
.
<quoted text>They don't provide the same benefits to society.
.
<quoted text>Their taxes pay for survivors benefits of spouses, not partners.
.
<quoted text>Cost is one aspect of how same sex marriage harms our society.
.
<quoted text>I've answered all your questions. Now answer mine:
Since marriage has always been defined in law as male/female before the 21st Century; were all legal, philosophic, religious, scientific, education and medical leaders homophobes before the 20th Century?
"Yes, if I had a same sex couple a civil union would be appropriate. I wouldn't ask the government to change the definition of marriage for everyone out of common dencency."

No swerve denied. The question was not if you were a ssc... the question was would you accept a c.u. Meaning you and your spouse, desolve your marriage and get a c.u...... would you settle for that... the same inequities you ask a ssc to settle for .... would you and your spouse?

'They don't provide the same benefits to society."
They dont pay taxes... they are not part of the community.. they do not raise children be it adopted or via alternative means... what part of the society do they not benefit . If you say having children.... you you must say that anyone not able to have children do not benefit society... no way around that....

"I've answered all your questions. Now answer mine:
Since marriage has always been defined in law as male/female before the 21st Century; were all legal, philosophic, religious, scientific, education and medical leaders homophobes before the 20th Century?"

Considering that the term homosexual was not around prior to 1870's.. then by prior 1870's standards ... no... by todays standards yes..
curmudgeon1

Denver, CO

#571 Mar 8, 2013
Who you marry is nobody's business except yours, and your partner's.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#572 Mar 9, 2013
TheWhydah wrote:
Gay people do reproduce, stupid.
True, and they imitate heterosexuals to do it. Same sex couples don't reproduce, only opposite sex couples can procreate. I don't insult my political opponents; this is where we differ.

“I Luv Carbon Dioxide”

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#573 Mar 9, 2013
TheWhydah wrote:
I'd say in post roman western society there has been a lot of homophobes.
Like, China and the East are havens for same sex marriage? Not!

Keeping marriage one man and one woman isn't homophobia; our political opponents prefer internet quackery to rational argument. Ad hominem arguments are fallacious.

.
TheWhydah wrote:
How about we look at gay marriages throughout many cultures through many centuries?
OK, cite any pre21st century law for same sex marriage or any pre 20th century argument for same sex marriage. Every culture defines marriage as male/female, as does every religion. Same sex marriage is taboo.

.
TheWhydah wrote:
And what do you mean by "gay couples don't provide the same benefits to society?"
They don't procreate like opposite sex couples, to bring the next generation of taxpayers. I say, marriage is the best way to bring up children, so we defend male/female marriage.

.
TheWhydah wrote:
Are you being insulting again?
I've never insulted gays, I always write there is nothing wrong with homosexuals or homosexuality. That's no reason to rewrite marriage laws for everyone.

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