Butlinski: Butlin's goes to Eastern Europe for staff while...

Mar 2, 2013 Full story: Mirror.co.uk 39

Butlin's is hiring hundreds of foreign workers in recruitment drives throughout A Eastern Europe while turning away unemployed Brits.

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meteor burger

Bedminster, NJ

#21 Mar 4, 2013
Let Russian man have his chunk of meteor to eat.

Since: Feb 13

Sweden

#22 Mar 4, 2013
plus I don't think it's just Butlins.....probably other companies in the UK are also hiring cheap labour from abroad......just to save themselves pennies rather than hiring someone local during this time of recession
Mikey

UK

#23 Mar 4, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
...and that's because they are advertising in Eastern Europe. From the sound of what you say that's because they can't find Brits who are committed to working there for a long enough period becaues "they don't like it".
As a British company do they have a responsibility to their local workforce? If so does the local workforce have an equal responsibility to commit to the job?
i have been working for Butlins for 5 years and I personally know that they have done 4 Recruitment drives in britan but they do 4-5 in eastern Europe a year. They Definitely have more rights then British people working.
Annie

London, UK

#24 Mar 4, 2013
Mikey wrote:
<quoted text>i have been working for Butlins for 5 years and I personally know that they have done 4 Recruitment drives in britan but they do 4-5 in eastern Europe a year. They Definitely have more rights then British people working.
I'm sure they do in this situation but it's not their fault, but the fault of the company and from what you say the local population who mostly don't really want these jobs. Employment law gives more protection to British workers and that will be another reason companies source from more vulnerable foreigners. The government's suggestion of giving us less employments rights is definitely not the answer. Media campaigns like this one have more impact.

Since: May 11

Milan, Italy

#25 Mar 4, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course they do when the minimum wage here is a maximum wage there
Thank you for showing how much you know NOTHING about Romania. You would like to get the maximum wage in Romania, I assure you. But you won't and this is another topic. I'm sure this would let you live much better than you currently live there, otherwise you would not be so obfuscated on a few Eastern Europeans, doing a poor job.
Put it well into your head: the ones coming there, either they come because they have no jobs and they are happy with whatever, either they come as specialists/managers... and they get jobs which you would never get, because, as you're showing here, you are lacking the education/knowledge/experience to get them.
Annie wrote:
<quoted text> and employers here are marketing directly to unemployed people there or those with high skills but in poorly paid jobs.
I've never seen a job posting saying:'UK_somewhere, Program Manager position. We will pay you nothing. It is a voluntary job.'. Maybe you've seen one, I missed them all...
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>Not sure how the tonnes of money fits in. Most people come here with next to nothing.
Leave the poor life cursed people and concentrate on others. Or the others do not raise your interest? Do you have a passion for scat or what? Is our society gone that crazy?
Annie wrote:
<quoted text> What they should do is say that people can work around the EU as long as they can prove they have a min value of savings. That's the case for Brits who want to work in Australia or New Zealand for a year.
Can you provide a source of this information? I never heard about it. Have you any level of understanding of the concept:'freedom of movement'. Does it tell you something? Do you know what 'democracy' means?
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>But of course if they did that they would lose a tonne of cheap and enthusiastic labour. The state doesn't want to stop people coming here because industry would grind to a halt.
Oh, so now you are contradicting yourself. Just a few posts above, you were so negative a few people are there and were so obfuscated by their presence. Now, you are saying without them, your industry would 'grind to a halt'. So, it is good or it is bad? Please decide yourself...
Annie wrote:
<quoted text> It's can be compared to the cigarette debate - sale of cigarettes increases costs of healthcare but also increases tax revenue.
So... Then I am missing your point. What is it you complain about: the fate of some people cursed by life, the fate of some richer people who came to take specialist positions, your own fate?

You see, guys... You are all small 'Nigel Farage'-s. You start debates without having a real clue what you really want to say. Just throw lots of words, making some sense, but overall, if considered more, making not really that much sense.
Annie

London, UK

#26 Mar 5, 2013
Petru wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for showing how much you know NOTHING about Romania. You would like to get the maximum wage in Romania, I assure you. But you won't and this is another topic. I'm sure this would let you live much better than you currently live there, otherwise you would not be so obfuscated on a few Eastern Europeans, doing a poor job.
Put it well into your head: the ones coming there, either they come because they have no jobs and they are happy with whatever, either they come as specialists/managers... and they get jobs which you would never get, because, as you're showing here, you are lacking the education/knowledge/experience to get them.
<quoted text>
I've never seen a job posting saying:'UK_somewhere, Program Manager position. We will pay you nothing. It is a voluntary job.'. Maybe you've seen one, I missed them all...
<quoted text>
Leave the poor life cursed people and concentrate on others. Or the others do not raise your interest? Do you have a passion for scat or what? Is our society gone that crazy?
<quoted text>
Can you provide a source of this information? I never heard about it. Have you any level of understanding of the concept:'freedom of movement'. Does it tell you something? Do you know what 'democracy' means?
<quoted text>
Oh, so now you are contradicting yourself. Just a few posts above, you were so negative a few people are there and were so obfuscated by their presence. Now, you are saying without them, your industry would 'grind to a halt'. So, it is good or it is bad? Please decide yourself...
<quoted text>
So... Then I am missing your point. What is it you complain about: the fate of some people cursed by life, the fate of some richer people who came to take specialist positions, your own fate?
You see, guys... You are all small 'Nigel Farage'-s. You start debates without having a real clue what you really want to say. Just throw lots of words, making some sense, but overall, if considered more, making not really that much sense.
Petru you haven't followed the debate and we are not talking just about Romanians. Your points are from your own self-centric point of view and you clearly don't know what is happening in the UK or who is coming here from Eastern Europe. A lot of people have been exploited here in the last few years and some by their fellow natinals, but many by businessess who hire from third party agencies without asking questions.
East Asian Cars

Podgorica, Montenegro

#27 Mar 5, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
Petru you haven't followed the debate and we are not talking just about Romanians. Your points are from your own self-centric point of view and you clearly don't know what is happening in the UK or who is coming here from Eastern Europe. A lot of people have been exploited here in the last few years and some by their fellow natinals, but many by businessess who hire from third party agencies without asking questions.
Hey Annie,you are Polish right?
How is there in UK..is it hard?

Since: May 11

Milan, Italy

#28 Mar 5, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
Petru you haven't followed the debate and we are not talking just about Romanians. Your points are from your own self-centric point of view and you clearly don't know what is happening in the UK or who is coming here from Eastern Europe. A lot of people have been exploited here in the last few years and some by their fellow natinals, but many by businessess who hire from third party agencies without asking questions.
Sorry, Annie, you refuse to understand my point.
I am trying to ask you what is the problem? I can only guess it must be one (or more) of these:
- you complain on the fate of a number of people, who were tricked by other individuals or let to believe they are being offered interesting positions there
- you complain on the fact there are too many Eastern Europeans there
- you say the UK's economy is based on these people

Please clarify your position, because, following the thread, I cannot see it.

Since: May 11

Milan, Italy

#30 Mar 5, 2013
Just some funny things, related to the topic here: http://www.feeder.ro/2013/01/31/we-may-not-li...

And this one: http://www.prosport.ro/sport-life/special/ins... (just click on the arrow, following the image number).
Annie

London, UK

#32 Mar 5, 2013
Petru wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, Annie, you refuse to understand my point.
I am trying to ask you what is the problem? I can only guess it must be one (or more) of these:
- you complain on the fate of a number of people, who were tricked by other individuals or let to believe they are being offered interesting positions there
- you complain on the fact there are too many Eastern Europeans there
- you say the UK's economy is based on these people
Please clarify your position, because, following the thread, I cannot see it.
I would counter that by saying that you refuse to understand mine.

What I have consistently said is that this article proves that it is corporations that are to blame for the vast numbers of East European workers coming to the UK. Over here up until now the media has placed the blame squarely on the shoulders of the people coming over and treated it as an invasion. You will see some posters here parroting these media-fed views.

The problem itself is complex. As another poster stated we don't want to commit to the jobs that are taken by East Europeans. The economy is made more efficient by these foreign workers who accept lower wages for a longer term (see my point about commitment). If they all left the prices of locally produced goods and services would shoot up. So these people are being exploited. But for them the wage is indeed high enough compared to what they may earn back home (which given the rate of unemployment in many East Euro countries would equal very low benefits if anything).

My comments don't apply to Romanians who do not have unrestricted access to our jobs market (yet). Yes you have people from Romania who come here and have set up businesses. However, there are also Romanian people who work on the black market here and are exploited as is the case with Ukrainians and Russians. There is a terrible exploitation market particularly for those who do not have work permits. You have to admit yourself that not everyone in Romania is an educated professional and you have large pockets of deprivation.

The expat Romanian community here is still comparatively small. Some are ridiculously wealthy and most are educated and very cultured. The press gives Romania a poor image because of the number of Roma who have come here with Romanian nationality and in the past begged on the streets.(they were not all from Romania but the majority reported in the press were). Most came here as refugees before EU ascension and receive benefits. But then the press here generally knocks Eastern Europe at every opportunity.

As long as corporations continue to draw people here the social problems that people here have with East European workers will grow. There is a refusal however to accept that locals do not want these jobs. Maybe the poster who worked at Butlins here wants the work, but he has admitted that his collegues are not committed to the organisation and don't like the work. As the pay here is so close to the pay received on benefits it's understandable that people aren't motivated. There is a consumer culture here and people don't want to remain in low paid jobs. Plus companies don't value low paid staff enough. Compounding this is the need for shareholders to see companies are making profits so it is not a simple discussion with yes or no answers. There are many factors causing the current tension and none of them have simple solutions, because if these people did not work here companies would fold.

Is that clear now?
Annie

London, UK

#33 Mar 5, 2013
Petru wrote:
Just some funny things, related to the topic here: http://www.feeder.ro/2013/01/31/we-may-not-li...
And this one: http://www.prosport.ro/sport-life/special/ins... (just click on the arrow, following the image number).
The first was widely cited in the press.

This thread is not limited to the Romanian forum (on which I assume you are posting), but I'm assuming it is shared across a number of national forums.
Croatia Ustasha Pavelic

Podgorica, Montenegro

#34 Mar 5, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
The first was widely cited in the press.
This thread is not limited to the Romanian forum (on which I assume you are posting), but I'm assuming it is shared across a number of national forums.
Annie,how old are you?
And what nationality are you?
AbeUG

Dunellen, NJ

#35 Mar 5, 2013
East Asian Cars wrote:
<quoted text>Hey Annie,you are Polish right?
How is there in UK..is it hard?
I think Annie is doing fine in the UK.

Some say she looks like this girl in Britain
http://www.google.com/imgres...

Intelligent and pretty girls do well, where ever they go.
Petru

Rome, Italy

#36 Mar 6, 2013
Annie wrote:
<quoted text>
I would counter that by saying that you refuse to understand mine.
...
Annie, excellent post, I must admit!

Ok, now it is very much more clear than before.

You are raising a very good point: using others to reach someone's or some corporation goals, then use them as scape goats, when needed, by the politicians.

I guess everything resumes somewhat to our inequity throughout Europe/EU. And reading you, one may think there is no interest in changing that, as it brings what is needed by the decident powers of the day, especially in more advantaged countries of the EU.
As long as this does not change, as there is no interest coming from such decidents of our society and as long as the large public is ignorant to what other EU countries real realities (if you allow me to express myself this way) are, there will be no change whatsoever.

I am not sure it is only the corporations themselves. It is the whole system, which leads to such a conclusion: corporations, the ones leading/owning the corporations, the investment funds, the politicians. None has a real interest to change poverty on one side and ignorance on the other side, as it brings benefits.

I think we are quite powerless here, unless there is a change in the system, which is required by many today, see the different anti-system movements getting many votes throughout Europe today, but they unfortunately do not come with an alternative...

P.S. I think the Croatian/Slovenian/Montenegrin /Serb/Bosnian (whatever area of ex-Yugoslavia is he from) has a crash on you.:)
Petru

Rome, Italy

#37 Mar 6, 2013
On the other hand, let us consider another perspective.

Let us start again from the inequities. Sure, they are there. Let us not forget, at least the very recent period: 1947-1989, when throughout Eastern Europe, communism reigned. Let us not forget Western Europe beneficiated of a Marshall plan after WW II, years when in Eastern Europe, communism was installed mostly by force. So, in Eastern Europe nothing was built until at least the early 1960s. From then on, the communism also brought in modernisation, but quickly ran out of money, because, the world was still moving following the notion of "capital".

Now, let us get back to our days. We are in A.D. 2013, we said in 2004 and 2007 that we want to correct some errors of the past, when Europe was separated and we want to unify it. Given that, we need, at the level of the planet to become a matching economical power for existing ones: US, Japan, but also for the ascending ones: China, India, Brazil now... But we unified an Europe, where inequity reigns among East and West.

And what the "decidents of the day" noticed, was the high costs in equalising it. Given that those money seem lacking (Europe seemingly cannot afford at high level, what Western Germany could afford when unifying to Eastern Germany, probably due also to inequities among Western European countries themselves, too), then some alternate solution was built and I think this is what we see today and we complain about, from one perspective, or the other (seen from the East, or from the West).

And now the economical crisis is on and we feel/notice it even harder, given all the reasons you wrote about. Naturally and logically, in this situation, there will be new tendencies of saying: "it was not worthwhile to unite Europe in 2004 and 2007".

But, do we actually have a chance un-united, if I may say so? Given that we moved all production to India and China, that militarily, each country in Europe is not necessarily a great power, that economically, the same... then we should better get used to the situation, yes, we are overall poorer than the 1980s-1990s, we see and hear more often foreign languages on the streets, we see more often the poverty, but we cannot live separated anymore.

Or... we need to invent a new economic-social model.
Petru

Rome, Italy

#38 Mar 6, 2013
The world is a very different place now, than what your 'before' was. You cannot turn back time, just because you want so.
Irish2 wrote:
...
Funny UK was doing fine without them before.
...
Petru

Rome, Italy

#39 Mar 6, 2013
And in Eastern Europe, I know that it sounds rough, we probably need to get used to being a second degree neighbourhood. This is the concept which was implemented in the USA, this is what they want/have-no-other-financial-c hoice-than to implement in Europe now. Unfortunately, it will not be neighbourhoods around towns, but whole countries.

Moreover, as you see now, the rich ones will even try to make some sort of "reservations for poor", as they do now with Romania and Bulgaria.

Yes, we cannot accept this in the East, but we have to do more than vocally not accepting it. And we should not expect someone would help us in realizing it, on the contrary.
Good person

Romania

#40 Mar 8, 2013
This is great news, may it continue.
mary miah

London, UK

#41 Sep 11, 2013
well if you all went back we would find out.the fact that every ones want to work here uk says some thing about our country dont you think.my son would like to wwork at butlins but isnt given the oppertunity. i wonder why.were only good for spending our hard earned money.so get off your high horse.my polish pal.s even say they rercuruit direct from europe. whats that all about.

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