created by: Triple C | Jul 27, 2011

Syria

1,275 votes

Will the uprising in Syria erupt into full blown Civil War?

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  • Yes
  • No
  • Only if outside powers intervene.

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Since: Jul 11

Gera, Germany

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#1093
Aug 24, 2012
 
kiwi wrote:
And this is supposed to be proof that Fisk was in the citadel? I'd have thought a competent journalist will have far more serious equipment than a mobile phone for filming if he's going to risk the dangers of a front line. And the clip has also been taken with the camera held in the wrong position. This is not the work of a journalist and therefore no proof of Fisk having been in the citadel.

Since: Jul 11

Gera, Germany

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#1094
Aug 24, 2012
 
kiwi wrote:
http://www.informationclearing house.info/article32251.htm
I wonder who is working for who. Is it Saudis, paying for American export of democracy or Americans supplying weapons and troops to Saudis and their war for Muslim unification, fighting, mostly Shia, heretics?
Syrian war gets more and more religious/sectarian/minorities shape. After Christians, Druses and Caucasians, now Armenias are being threatened by international "freedom fighters".
http://www.tert.am/en/news/2012/08/24/almajli...
LOL! Just some more links to some BS sites run by crap spreading self important nonentities using false names. Kiwi has such an instilled hatred for anything Western and especially US that he's desperately ready to support the most blood drenched scumbag Tyrants, spread the most absurd conspiracy theories, believe the crappiest "evidence" and agree with the biggest nut cases, at the same time forfeiting his last shred of credibility just to make a point. It's always a laugh to read his comments very often with a link to some video clip or "news outlet" that’s supposed to serve as “proof” but is never ever anything of the sort. With Kiwi the entertainment value of any thread gets better.

Since: Jul 11

Gera, Germany

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#1095
Aug 24, 2012
 
kiwi wrote:
There is an interesting article of Stratfor in here: http://www.stratfor.com/weekly/considering-su...
Personally I don´t agree with its conclusions but still worth to read and think about future of might-to-be Sunni Syria.
Thanx for the link. The conclusions or simple, it's all about beating back Iranian influence. And if Assad falls Iran is next on the list.

Since: Jul 11

Gera, Germany

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#1096
Aug 24, 2012
 
Not "The conclusions OR simple." I meant "The conclusions ARE simple."
Triple C

East Alton, IL

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#1097
Aug 24, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
And this is supposed to be proof that Fisk was in the citadel? I'd have thought a competent journalist will have far more serious equipment than a mobile phone for filming if he's going to risk the dangers of a front line. And the clip has also been taken with the camera held in the wrong position. This is not the work of a journalist and therefore no proof of Fisk having been in the citadel.
Like I stated previously I don't think he was there, the amount of fighting taking place in and near the citadel is very heavy, the Christian neighborhoods to the northwest not to mention the constant fighting taking place in the Souq neighborhood adjacent to the Citadel. Also if the FSA was so demoralized and pretty much a defeated mob as his articles allude to why hasn't the pro Assad forces retaken Aleppo. The obvious answer is Fisk is reporting pro Assad propaganda and not the truth.
arthur

Australia

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#1098
Aug 24, 2012
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
Like I stated previously I don't think he was there, the amount of fighting taking place in and near the citadel is very heavy, the Christian neighborhoods to the northwest not to mention the constant fighting taking place in the Souq neighborhood adjacent to the Citadel. Also if the FSA was so demoralized and pretty much a defeated mob as his articles allude to why hasn't the pro Assad forces retaken Aleppo. The obvious answer is Fisk is reporting pro Assad propaganda and not the truth.
The tank pictured in his article looks very similar to the tank prowling around on the Nat geo clip.The old man standing guard is apparently famous for walking between cities for peace.I found it odd that this particular guy just happened to be there.lol.I still think Fisk was there though.Another thing I noticed was he mentioned that 3 generals he had previously met had been wounded.Do Syrian generals serve up on the front with their troops?
kiwi

Kosice, Slovakia

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#1099
Aug 24, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL! Just some more links to some BS sites run by crap spreading self important nonentities using false names. Kiwi has such an instilled hatred for anything Western and especially US that he's desperately ready to support the most blood drenched scumbag Tyrants, spread the most absurd conspiracy theories, believe the crappiest "evidence" and agree with the biggest nut cases, at the same time forfeiting his last shred of credibility just to make a point. It's always a laugh to read his comments very often with a link to some video clip or "news outlet" that’s supposed to serve as “proof” but is never ever anything of the sort. With Kiwi the entertainment value of any thread gets better.
Only to have things clear. So, the Sunnis (eg. Saudis) are good guys and Shias (eg. Iraniens) are bad guys for you?
George

Red Deer, Canada

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#1100
Aug 24, 2012
 
kiwi wrote:
<quoted text>
Only to have things clear. So, the Sunnis (eg. Saudis) are good guys and Shias (eg. Iraniens) are bad guys for you?
You are too quick to generalize. Read more clearly as the posting by Ditto was a lot more detailed than a good guy bad guy approach.

Please read again.
Triple C

East Alton, IL

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#1101
Aug 24, 2012
 
kiwi wrote:
<quoted text>
Only to have things clear. So, the Sunnis (eg. Saudis) are good guys and Shias (eg. Iraniens) are bad guys for you?
Just to get things clear the Alawite proxies of Russia/Iran/China are good guy's to you and the Sunni/Kurd forces are the bad guy's even though your own country supports them?

In the current geo political climate yes NATO views the Sunni/Kurdish forces as good and the Russian/Iranian backed pro Assad forces as bad. Why else do you think NATO supports the FSA and Russia and Iran support Assad. Believe me its not out of goodwill it's to serve each alliances political ambitions.
kiwi

Kosice, Slovakia

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#1102
Aug 24, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL! Just some more links to some BS sites run by crap spreading self important nonentities using false names. Kiwi has such an instilled hatred for anything Western and especially US that he's desperately ready to support the most blood drenched scumbag Tyrants, spread the most absurd conspiracy theories, believe the crappiest "evidence" and agree with the biggest nut cases, at the same time forfeiting his last shred of credibility just to make a point. It's always a laugh to read his comments very often with a link to some video clip or "news outlet" that’s supposed to serve as “proof” but is never ever anything of the sort. With Kiwi the entertainment value of any thread gets better.
What about Mother Agnes Mariam (Qara-Homs)? http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Another dodgy source of mine?
Triple C

East Alton, IL

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#1103
Aug 24, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanx for the link. The conclusions or simple, it's all about beating back Iranian influence. And if Assad falls Iran is next on the list.
Exactly then it's on to wrest control of Central Asia from their former Soviet masters and stop China from filling the void and finally Pakistan if the civilian govt. succumbs to their version of the religious far right.

After that if Russia is still in the anti west camp I can envision the US supporting anti Kremlin forces in the North Caucasus while helping pro democracy activist mobilize and wrenching Belarus out of the Russian sphere of influence while expanding NATO with the addition of Ukraine and Georgia as well as helping the Ukraine expel the Russian navy from Sevastopol and helping Georgia reclaim her renegade provenience's from the pro Russian proxy forces.

Then it's all about China but it is hard to predict what action will be taken because the true strength of China is unknown but apparently weaker then the image the CCP has shown the world.
kiwi

Kosice, Slovakia

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#1104
Aug 24, 2012
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly then it's on to wrest control of Central Asia from their former Soviet masters and stop China from filling the void and finally Pakistan if the civilian govt. succumbs to their version of the religious far right.
After that if Russia is still in the anti west camp I can envision the US supporting anti Kremlin forces in the North Caucasus while helping pro democracy activist mobilize and wrenching Belarus out of the Russian sphere of influence while expanding NATO with the addition of Ukraine and Georgia as well as helping the Ukraine expel the Russian navy from Sevastopol and helping Georgia reclaim her renegade provenience's from the pro Russian proxy forces.
Then it's all about China but it is hard to predict what action will be taken because the true strength of China is unknown but apparently weaker then the image the CCP has shown the world.
Got you. Impressive picture of our future world. Especially when its official name is a "Right to protect". Any idea how many lives all this democratic thing will cost? At least roughly.
Do you think young fighters from Libya, Senegal or else, just present in Aleppo, fully understand for what great idea they lay down their lives?
ocxz

Reunion

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#1105
Aug 25, 2012
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
Exactly then it's on to wrest control of Central Asia from their former Soviet masters and stop China from filling the void and finally Pakistan if the civilian govt. succumbs to their version of the religious far right.
After that if Russia is still in the anti west camp I can envision the US supporting anti Kremlin forces in the North Caucasus while helping pro democracy activist mobilize and wrenching Belarus out of the Russian sphere of influence while expanding NATO with the addition of Ukraine and Georgia as well as helping the Ukraine expel the Russian navy from Sevastopol and helping Georgia reclaim her renegade provenience's from the pro Russian proxy forces.
Then it's all about China but it is hard to predict what action will be taken because the true strength of China is unknown but apparently weaker then the image the CCP has shown the world.
If that is not asking for trouble...or seeding the seeds of unrest, but then its good ol' Usa
Triple C

East Alton, IL

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#1106
Aug 25, 2012
 
ocxz wrote:
<quoted text>
If that is not asking for trouble...or seeding the seeds of unrest, but then its good ol' Usa
So you are telling me Russia supporting Iran (a state who sponsors anti govt. forces throughout the middle east and southwest Asia) not because they have the same ideology but because they both fear the United States is not asking for trouble? Or are you telling me that Russia invading a sovereign nation and forcibly partitioning that nation is not asking for trouble?

Or what about China and the future limited conflicts she is angling for so that the CCP can have a clean leadership transition?

The only reason everyone hates the USA is because we are currently on top and have trusted and powerful allies that will support us be it politically or militarily. Yes we don't do everything perfectly but you name an empire who did.
ocxz

Reunion

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#1107
Aug 25, 2012
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
So you are telling me Russia supporting Iran (a state who sponsors anti govt. forces throughout the middle east and southwest Asia) not because they have the same ideology but because they both fear the United States is not asking for trouble? Or are you telling me that Russia invading a sovereign nation and forcibly partitioning that nation is not asking for trouble?
Or what about China and the future limited conflicts she is angling for so that the CCP can have a clean leadership transition?
The only reason everyone hates the USA is because we are currently on top and have trusted and powerful allies that will support us be it politically or militarily. Yes we don't do everything perfectly but you name an empire who did.
Is Russia presently invading a nation ?
Is China in conflict ?

Count all the countries in the world where the USA have conducted military operations and covert operations and tell me which of these countries have actually attacked directly the USA on its territory.

Since: Jul 11

Höchstadt, Germany

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#1108
Aug 26, 2012
 
ocxz wrote:
<quoted text>
Is Russia presently invading a nation ?
Is China in conflict ?
Count all the countries in the world where the USA have conducted military operations and covert operations and tell me which of these countries have actually attacked directly the USA on its territory.
LOL! How ignorant. A few facts:

China:
Occupation and repression of Tibet
Occupation and repression of Inner Mongolia.
Occupation and repression of Aksai Chin
Continuous military intimidation of the state of Taiwan
Continuous military intimidation of India for South Tibet
Continuous military intimidation of Japan for the Senkaku Islands
Continuous encroachment of parts of Siberia
Continuous encroachment of parts of Mongolia
Continuous border disputes with Russia

Russia:
Military intervention in Georgia in support of Abkhazia and South Ossetia separatist rebels.
Massive interference in internal political affairs in the Ukraine.
Continuous occupation of the Japanese Northern Territories (The Southern Kurils)
Continuous occupation of parts of Finland (Continuous)
Continuous military intervention in Moldova in support of Transnistrian separatist rebels

I could go on but I think you get the message.

The problem with guys like Kiwi and ocxz is that they refuse flatly to accept that the world is not a peaceful place, never has been and never will be. If the West would tomorrow disband NATO and swear never again to intervene in any disputes outside its borders it wouldn’t make the slightest difference, the bombing and killing would still go on without a break and others would step in and carry on where NATO left off.

Quite honestly, I’m not at all a fan of empire building alliances, military adventures, proxy wars, interventions in other countries and widening of spheres of influence but since I can’t stop them I at least want to see our sphere of influence protected and widened.

The West might not be an angel but it is still far more desirable than anything any other country has to offer. Or would anyone like to be ruled by someone like Assad, who’s only claim to power is that his dad had the position before him, Gaddhafi who’s only claim to power was a ridiculously badly written green book, or an ancient Shiite clerical who’s only claim to power and any education at all is the study of 1400 year old stories?

Since: Jul 11

Höchstadt, Germany

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#1109
Aug 26, 2012
 
George wrote:
<quoted text>
You are too quick to generalize. Read more clearly as the posting by Ditto was a lot more detailed than a good guy bad guy approach.
Please read again.
US/NATO/West = bad
Repressive dictators = good

LOL! I'm just wondering what kine of spin Kiwi will put on the story if and when Russia decides it might be better to cosy up to NATO.
ocxz

Reunion

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#1110
Aug 26, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL! How ignorant. A few facts:
China:
Occupation and repression of Tibet
Occupation and repression of Inner Mongolia.
Occupation and repression of Aksai Chin
Continuous military intimidation of the state of Taiwan
Continuous military intimidation of India for South Tibet
Continuous military intimidation of Japan for the Senkaku Islands
Continuous encroachment of parts of Siberia
Continuous encroachment of parts of Mongolia
Continuous border disputes with Russia
Russia:
Military intervention in Georgia in support of Abkhazia and South Ossetia separatist rebels.
Massive interference in internal political affairs in the Ukraine.
Continuous occupation of the Japanese Northern Territories (The Southern Kurils)
Continuous occupation of parts of Finland (Continuous)
Continuous military intervention in Moldova in support of Transnistrian separatist rebels
I could go on but I think you get the message.
The problem with guys like Kiwi and ocxz is that they refuse flatly to accept that the world is not a peaceful place, never has been and never will be. If the West would tomorrow disband NATO and swear never again to intervene in any disputes outside its borders it wouldn’t make the slightest difference, the bombing and killing would still go on without a break and others would step in and carry on where NATO left off.
Quite honestly, I’m not at all a fan of empire building alliances, military adventures, proxy wars, interventions in other countries and widening of spheres of influence but since I can’t stop them I at least want to see our sphere of influence protected and widened.
The West might not be an angel but it is still far more desirable than anything any other country has to offer. Or would anyone like to be ruled by someone like Assad, who’s only claim to power is that his dad had the position before him, Gaddhafi who’s only claim to power was a ridiculously badly written green book, or an ancient Shiite clerical who’s only claim to power and any education at all is the study of 1400 year old stories?
You did not answer the question thus invaded the main problem.
ocxz

Reunion

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#1111
Aug 26, 2012
 
edit : evaded the problem
George

Red Deer, Canada

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#1112
Aug 26, 2012
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
US/NATO/West = bad
Repressive dictators = good
LOL! I'm just wondering what kine of spin Kiwi will put on the story if and when Russia decides it might be better to cosy up to NATO.
LOL, we have quite a few on here that would be throwing fits of rage and whining.

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