created by: The_Baron | Apr 6, 2013

Serbia

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Which Hungarian cities were Serbian majority once ?

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181 - 200 of 1,001 Comments Last updated Sep 29, 2013
google

Sarajevo, Bosnia and Herzegovina

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#188
May 12, 2013
 
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday.

Now you will tell us why Habsburgs settled Serbs there. Because of their good heart or what? There should be a reason, don't you think so?
Burlesque

Zagreb, Croatia

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#189
May 12, 2013
 
google

To have people over there keen in providing them with whatever they want.
After all they already had the "reference" of centuries long, obedient vasalship to the Turks with them :-)

Since: Sep 12

In your mind.

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#190
May 12, 2013
 
google wrote:
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday.
Now you will tell us why Habsburgs settled Serbs there. Because of their good heart or what? There should be a reason, don't you think so?
After ethnic cleansing of Hungarians happened in Ottoman Hungary, Serbs began to move into these lands, and settle into empty Hungarian towns, villages, cities, and so on.

Also Serbs were trusted by both the Habsburgs and the Turks.

Did you know that ORthodox and Muslim South Slavs were responsible for the ravaging and pillaging of Ottoman Hungary?
Burlesque

Ljubljana, Slovenia

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#191
May 12, 2013
 
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/serbia/TOI69...
Burlesque wrote:
You want to say they settled people who were ready to fight Ottomans (most of them did not have other choice). The Hungarian peasants did not want to fight. "
"Fighter Serbs" who escaped from Kosovo in fear for their nomadic shepherd lives endangered by the Turks. If these are Your fighters then You mast be joking.
You ever heard why the Catholic church belles are ringing at noon ? In the whole world. Already now its a centururies old tradition.
"Were not ready to fight", You lousy tractor driver.
Burlesque

Zagreb, Croatia

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#192
May 12, 2013
 
google bre !

No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday."

Then You know who János Hunyadi was. You know by now even the contemporary name of the city Nándorfehérvár wich was defended by Hunyadi's glorious army against the invading Ottomans (supported to no negligible extent by Serb jancars, too).

Belgrade was in fact offered to Hungarian king Sigismund by Serb ruler Lazar who paniced of Turks and agreed to be Sigismunds vasal. He get from the Hungarian king a small Danube beachside hamlet, called Szentendre and ordered to kepp his mouth shut.

Since: Sep 12

In your mind.

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#194
May 12, 2013
 

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Burlesque wrote:
google bre !
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday."
Then You know who János Hunyadi was. You know by now even the contemporary name of the city Nándorfehérvár wich was defended by Hunyadi's glorious army against the invading Ottomans (supported to no negligible extent by Serb jancars, too).
Belgrade was in fact offered to Hungarian king Sigismund by Serb ruler Lazar who paniced of Turks and agreed to be Sigismunds vasal. He get from the Hungarian king a small Danube beachside hamlet, called Szentendre and ordered to kepp his mouth shut.
Belgrade was first time in history part of Serbia when Hungary gave it to Stefan Dragutin as a gift in 1248
Burlesque

Ljubljana, Slovenia

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#195
May 12, 2013
 
Burlesque wrote:
google bre !
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday."
Then You know who János Hunyadi was. You know by now even the contemporary name of the city Nándorfehérvár wich was defended by Hunyadi's glorious army against the invading Ottomans (supported to no negligible extent by Serb jancars, too).
Belgrade was in fact offered to Hungarian king Sigismund by Serb ruler Lazar who paniced of Turks and agreed to be Sigismunds vasal. He get from the Hungarian king a small Danube beachside hamlet, called Szentendre and ordered to kepp his mouth shut.
But in reality Croats and Croatia were vassals to Hungarians

Since: Sep 12

In your mind.

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#196
May 12, 2013
 

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The answer to this debate is very simple.

Before 1526, most demographers put Hungary as 80% Hungarian.

However after 1526, Hungary was a perpetual battlefield between the Ottomans, the Habsburgs,Catholic Hungarians, Protestant Hungarians, and various other groups. This nonstop warfare which happened in mostly ethnic Hungarian territory devastated the population, while some groups such as the Slovaks who mostly lived in Mountains were left in peace as the war did not reach them.

This demographic catastrophe for Hungary was taken advantage of by Serbs, who began flooding Southern and Central Hungary, as well as new German, Vlach settlers. The nobles are partially responsible for it it,, because they did not care who ploughed their fields, but the main reason was due to the fact that Hungarians were not trusted (rebellious nature).

To give you an idea of the resettlement plans:

The president of the Viennese Hofkriegsrath, Raimondo Montecuccoli draw a plan of "pacification" under the title "L'Ungheria nell'anno 1677". According to that Royal Hungary would be occupied by three Austrian armies, the remnants of the Hungarian constitution abolished and a grand-scale program of German colonisation implemented. Chancellor Paul Hocher, one of the most influential man in the Habsburg government, agreed with Montecuccoli's plan. In the Secret Council he declared that "all Hungarians are traitors".
google

Sarajevo, Bosnia and Herzegovina

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#197
May 12, 2013
 
Burlesque wrote:
google bre !
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday."
Then You know who János Hunyadi was. You know by now even the contemporary name of the city Nándorfehérvár wich was defended by Hunyadi's glorious army against the invading Ottomans (supported to no negligible extent by Serb jancars, too).
Belgrade was in fact offered to Hungarian king Sigismund by Serb ruler Lazar who paniced of Turks and agreed to be Sigismunds vasal. He get from the Hungarian king a small Danube beachside hamlet, called Szentendre and ordered to kepp his mouth shut.
kaj ti ne spikas kajkavstinu i nisi iz lepega belega grada?
google

Sarajevo, Bosnia and Herzegovina

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#198
May 12, 2013
 
TheRealMagyar wrote:
The answer to this debate is very simple.
Before 1526, most demographers put Hungary as 80% Hungarian.
However after 1526, Hungary was a perpetual battlefield between the Ottomans, the Habsburgs,Catholic Hungarians, Protestant Hungarians, and various other groups. This nonstop warfare which happened in mostly ethnic Hungarian territory devastated the population, while some groups such as the Slovaks who mostly lived in Mountains were left in peace as the war did not reach them.
This demographic catastrophe for Hungary was taken advantage of by Serbs, who began flooding Southern and Central Hungary, as well as new German, Vlach settlers. The nobles are partially responsible for it it,, because they did not care who ploughed their fields, but the main reason was due to the fact that Hungarians were not trusted (rebellious nature).
To give you an idea of the resettlement plans:
The president of the Viennese Hofkriegsrath, Raimondo Montecuccoli draw a plan of "pacification" under the title "L'Ungheria nell'anno 1677". According to that Royal Hungary would be occupied by three Austrian armies, the remnants of the Hungarian constitution abolished and a grand-scale program of German colonisation implemented. Chancellor Paul Hocher, one of the most influential man in the Habsburg government, agreed with Montecuccoli's plan. In the Secret Council he declared that "all Hungarians are traitors".
Madjar,
with the Turks the demographic picture had changed totally. What would have happend if the new people had not been settled in the empty villages and cities? Can you imagine? Don't forget you were under Habsburgs and they needed soldiers not abadonded land. If the Hungarians could not provide soldiers, they brought them.
Today people who live somewhere 300+ years are natives now.
lulu

UK

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#199
May 12, 2013
 
What conclusions emerge about the character of seventeenth-century Ottoman Hungary? Koller emphasizes the importance of recovering the history of this region as a whole. He argues that the fragmentation of study of Ottoman Hungary within national contexts in Hungary, Croatia, and Serbia has tended to obscure how this part of the medieval Hungarian monarchy became integrated into the Ottoman Empire. Koller also encourages readers to think about the history of Ottoman Hungary not as a unique frontier zone but in comparative perspective, taking into account parallel developments in other border zones of the Ottoman Empire. Ottoman Hungary lay on one side of a relatively stable border between the 1560s and 1680s, which was defended by chains of fortresses and garrisons. At the same time, the Ottoman Empire in theory remained committed to the business of expansion, and only after the peace of Karlowitz was there at least implicit acknowledgement of a demarcated boundary to the Ottoman state and recognition of the territorial integrity of its northern neighbor. The border was seen from both sides as marking a profound cultural and religious divide. However, the analysis provided by Koller supports a view of this region as marked by complex patterns of exchange and interaction between Muslim authorities and Christian communities. Ottoman Hungary’s governance and society forms part of a broader story of the development of the Ottoman Empire and, as Koller stresses, should also be seen in the context of other frontier zones across the Continent and in light of the emerging state system of the early modern period.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/351509...

Since: Mar 13

Melbourne, Australia

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#200
May 12, 2013
 
It's funny when you think about it, but when you look above the whole thing, discount the petty rivalries, even forget about the whole Orthodox , Catholic and Islamic divide all you see are historical processes and demographic changes taking place. A cold hard reality.

I would have preferred a Serbian Kosovo to reflect the medieval legacy of the Serbs, but it is not about what we want. In any case Serbs don’t change, but we are adaptable to whatever fate throws ate us and a new destiny is opening up.

How many major turning points have the Serbs gone through in history, pre Balkan pagan Serbs, settlement in the Balkans and admixture with the locals, Byzantine period up until the Ottoman conquests, the political struggles that came afterwards and the Kosovo tradition.

I see a new phase and one component of this new period relates to the slow demise of the Hungarian peoples. Lets face facts, the Hungarians only lasted this long because they were bolstered by the Germans and the Austrians with Slavic input.

In a way we can say that the Hungarians are the last of the Uralic Altaic peoples, going the way of the Avars, Huns, Cumans and the Khazars before them.

Even the Hungarians realise this.

Slavs are in an energetic flux of sorts in this era, a new order is forming from the chaos, but the Hungarians have given up, aware of what is happening to them, unable to turn things back.

Since: Mar 13

Melbourne, Australia

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#201
May 12, 2013
 
Ask yourself, why is it that there are hardly any Hungarians on on these forums. Look at this place, mostly Slavs,only one that proclaims himself as a 'magyar', same deal in the Hungarian forum, and he is one of only two on Romanian forum. Both of these show anguish and rage at the rest of their neighbours. The irony is that one of those is originally from Slovakia, native born Hungarians have given up.

It is an anger against the natural historical processes taking place.

Hungarians are a depressed lot. Described as gloomy, solitary and cold. Look at the ones in this picture. What a sorry lot.

‘Now, we’re not the first ones to diagnose Hungarians with suffering from collective depression’

http://blog.juan-n-ognen.org/2007/12/24/sleep...

‘Gloom, depression and suicide seem to be part and parcel of Hungarian culture. "You can hardly meet with a Hungarian who wouldn't have relatives or friends who really committed suicide - it's a kind of national disease, it's a kind of sickness,"’

http://www.phespirit.info/gloomysunday/articl...

Serbs are one of the people that fill a new vacuum in the central European and Balkan political landscape. This all driven by forces that we can't control wether we like it or not.

Since: Mar 13

Melbourne, Australia

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#202
May 13, 2013
 
Later instalments will include a quick historical run down in relation to Serb input in Hungary from the late medieval period onwards.
Kurvatica

Adelaide, Australia

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#203
May 13, 2013
 

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TheRealMagyar wrote:
Yes, we all know that Servs waited until Hungarians were massacred, who then began to move into Hungarian territories. Baron, we all know how proud you must be.
But did you know, that Belgrade was first part of Serbia when Hungarian King gave it to you? Hahaha
When hungarians arrived in southern europe they occupied slavic land. Its time to give it back. Vojvodina was a good start. And do go on about Illyrians, Dacians and Thacians, they were assimilated and became part of slavs.
reality

Adelaide, Australia

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#204
May 13, 2013
 

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google wrote:
No, but I've checked it now. In the honour of Hiunday.
Now you will tell us why Habsburgs settled Serbs there. Because of their good heart or what? There should be a reason, don't you think so?
same reason turks settled serbs there, needed idiots to kill each other.
why not people who will kill their own?
reality

Adelaide, Australia

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#205
May 13, 2013
 

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Strahd wrote:
Ask yourself, why is it that there are hardly any Hungarians on on these forums. Look at this place, mostly Slavs,only one that proclaims himself as a 'magyar', same deal in the Hungarian forum, and he is one of only two on Romanian forum. Both of these show anguish and rage at the rest of their neighbours. The irony is that one of those is originally from Slovakia, native born Hungarians have given up.
It is an anger against the natural historical processes taking place.
Hungarians are a depressed lot. Described as gloomy, solitary and cold. Look at the ones in this picture. What a sorry lot.
‘Now, we’re not the first ones to diagnose Hungarians with suffering from collective depression’
http://blog.juan-n-ognen.org/2007/12/24/sleep...
‘Gloom, depression and suicide seem to be part and parcel of Hungarian culture. "You can hardly meet with a Hungarian who wouldn't have relatives or friends who really committed suicide - it's a kind of national disease, it's a kind of sickness,"’
http://www.phespirit.info/gloomysunday/articl...
Serbs are one of the people that fill a new vacuum in the central European and Balkan political landscape. This all driven by forces that we can't control wether we like it or not.
they say same for serbians ur point was not thought through properly.
serbistan is also very big consumer of anti depressives these days.
u stay here and complain from where it is safe.
keep eating ur mama's goulash and mousaka
reality

Adelaide, Australia

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#206
May 13, 2013
 

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Strahd wrote:
Later instalments will include a quick historical run down in relation to Serb input in Hungary from the late medieval period onwards.
only serb input in hungary (haha) is because they were part of turkish empire's expansion into europe.
'the defenders of christianity' changed sides very quickly indeed,
unlike croatia and hungary
Strahd

Melbourne, Australia

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#207
May 13, 2013
 

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reality wrote:
<quoted text>
they say same for serbians ur point was not thought through properly.
serbistan is also very big consumer of anti depressives these days.
u stay here and complain from where it is safe.
keep eating ur mama's goulash and mousaka
I beg to differ. Even our Australia here has one of the highest rates of suicide in the western world, and you are well that this is pill popper heaven, but in spite of that the country is doing much better in terms of living standards and the economic side when we consider the ailing U.S. economy or the dying EU. In fact, world economic considerations aside Australia is a much better place to live than in the U.S. A week doesn't go by where we are not hearing of another mass shooting in the U.S.

I have been involved in real state ventures in regional Victoria and I am happy with the overall resources and facilities, guess where I am at the moment. Yeah, I was one of those who went to the country expo and regional living in Vic few weeks ago.

Back to Serbia, Vojvodina stands at the border of central and Balkan Europe. It has it's problems, what country doesn't, but with Hungary we have a diminishing ethnic population, not just in Serbia, but Transylvania and Slovakia. Face facts, the ethnic border is being pushed back towards Hungary, only logical that it will have other implications on the region and the future fortunes of Serbs.

You have to think outside the simple 'serbistan' chauvinistic mindset.
teddy

Ljubljana, Slovenia

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#209
May 13, 2013
 
reality wrote:
<quoted text>
only serb input in hungary (haha) is because they were part of turkish empire's expansion into europe.
'the defenders of christianity' changed sides very quickly indeed,
unlike croatia and hungary
not really

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