See truth about Abkhazia

[Sasha]

Antique Collector wrote:

Right. Seems a bit sneaky to me. So what you mean is, Russian Federation has this procedure, by which it can grant citizenship to the residents of other countries? You are saying Abkhazia as a state does not exist. Granted, so it is part of Georgia (and as I understand, has been for over 15 centuries). I don't get it. Can Russians use this 'simplified procedure' to convert ANYONE into Russian citizens? e.g. Bavaria, or Shropshire. Legally these are not states either. Please clarify if you can.

Sorry, you haven’t understood this well. Only people which were citizens of the ex - USSR can use the simplified procedure and only if they had become persons without citizenship after collapse SU.
Russia tries to help people which became the victims of collapse SU. People which live in Bavaria have Germany’s citizenship and they lived in ex-SU never. Therefore they can’t use this simplified procedure.
New Baltic States which were ex-Soviet republics have refused to give citizenship many Russian speaking people living in these states. The Russian speaking people from New Baltic states if they don’t have any citizenship can use this simplified procedure because they or they parents had lived in ex-US.

[Xamzat]

Antique Collector wrote:

Xamzat, I am sorry. I don't mean to seem thick or indeed impatient. So, 1. Abkhazia was part of Georgia, and most of the Abkhazian residents were ethnic Georgians. 2. ethnic Abkhazians wanted independence. but to achieve this, they had to either murder ethnic Georgians, or throw them out.
It seems fair to me that Abkhazia as such DOES NOT deserve independence.

In deed!

[Russian official news]

Antique Collector wrote:

So, 1. Abkhazia was part of Georgia, and most of the Abkhazian residents were ethnic Georgians.

Antique Collector

If you think , that most of the Abkhazian residents were ethnic Georgians - why Abkhazia has a name of "Abkhazia" ?... LOL.

Sure , there are some Georgians in Abkhazia , but most of the Abkhazian residents ARE ethnic Abkhazians.

Antique Collector wrote:

2. ethnic Abkhazians wanted independence. but to achieve this, they had to either murder ethnic Georgians, or throw them out.

Why do you think so ?
Is that only way you see ?
Very strange ....

It seems fair to me that Abkhazia as such DOES deserve independence JUST like Georgia.

[Sasha]

Antique Collector wrote:

Xamzat, I am sorry. I don't mean to seem thick or indeed impatient. So, 1. Abkhazia was part of Georgia, and most of the Abkhazian residents were ethnic Georgians. 2. ethnic Abkhazians wanted independence. but to achieve this, they had to either murder ethnic Georgians, or throw them out.
It seems fair to me that Abkhazia as such DOES NOT deserve independence.

Sorry, you don’t know history of Georgian – Abkhazian conflict or war. Abkhazia wanted only autonomy after collapse of SU. But Georgia refused to give autonomy to Abkhazia. Georgia sent military troops to Abkhazia and did ethnical cleaning against Abkhazians. Georgians who lived in Abkhazia helped the Georgian army. Confederation of Caucasian people supported Abkhazians in that war. Many Caucasian people including Chechens battled against Georgia in that war.
Abkhazians and Confederation of Caucasian people had won the war and drove away Georgian military troops and all Georgians from Abkhazia. After this war Abkhazia had wanted only independence. I think it will be true if Abkhazia will be independence.

[Robespierre]

Antique Collector wrote:

Hello Mr. Because. Something I would like to know: how did the Abkhaz residents get Russian passports? On what basis? When?

It's not what you know, it's who you know that matters!!

It's a safeguard. Since they don't want to be part of Georgia, and can't stay stateless; Russia gave them passport and nationality.

There are many Georgians living in Russia who have Russian passports too, as Russian authorities found out when the police wanted to purge 'illegal' Georgians from Russia.

[Crimean Tatar]

Russian Vampire, stop playing your genocidal games in Caucasus.

Go and play such games with the polar bears and the Americans in the north pole.

[Antique Collector]

Russian official News, First of all, allow me to congratulate you on such an ironically post-modern nickname. Abkhazia, as I understand, has always (or mostly) been one of the regions of Georgia. The same way that Kakheti or Imereti. Georgians residing in Abkhazia call themselves Abkhazian too and have done so for centuries. There are quite a lot of ethnic Georgians (Megrelians) who would like independent Abkhazia. So, it seems to me that ethnic division is something that has been assigned to the conflict unnaturally. By a third party perhaps?

[Antique Collector]

Sasha, Hi, I don't for a second intend to show anything but my ignorance of the subject (Georgian-Abkhazian conflict). Could I ask WHY the leadership of Georgia from early 90s is associated with the current regime? Post soviet Georgia was ultra-nationalistic, ultra-religious (which is perhaps still the case) and above all extremely incompetent. Don't we want to agree that things change? Do we treat the current German government as having same agenda as the 1930s one?

[Sasha]

Antique Collector wrote:

Sasha, Hi, I don't for a second intend to show anything but my ignorance of the subject (Georgian-Abkhazian conflict). Could I ask WHY the leadership of Georgia from early 90s is associated with the current regime? Post soviet Georgia was ultra-nationalistic, ultra-religious (which is perhaps still the case) and above all extremely incompetent. Don't we want to agree that things change? Do we treat the current German government as having same agenda as the 1930s one?

Abkhazians want to be independent. Abkhazians are independent de facto, it is only simple formality to recognize the independent de juro. The Georgian president Saakashvili is dictator indeed. All people of Georgia, Russia and Abkhazia know this very well. There is totalitarian mode in Georgia now. Modern Georgia is ultra-nationalistic and above all extremely incompetent too. Unfortunately, these things haven’t changed. But USA officials name Georgian mode as democracy because Saakashvili is puppet of USA.

[Sasha]

Antique Collector wrote:

Sasha,
......

Why do you want to seem so naive? There isn’t any democracy in Georgia. And USA’s officials know this very well. Georgian territory is very important for transit of oil from Azerbaijan and Asia. USA’s officials need a loyal dictator in Georgia like Saakashvili. Dictator needs more territory. USA’s officials support Saakashvili and his aggression against Abkhazia to control Georgian territory. It is oil interest and only but isn’t support of democracy.

[Xamzat]

Sasha wrote:

<quoted text>
Why do you want to seem so naive? There isn’t any democracy in Georgia. And USA’s officials know this very well. Georgian territory is very important for transit of oil from Azerbaijan and Asia. USA’s officials need a loyal dictator in Georgia like Saakashvili. Dictator needs more territory. USA’s officials support Saakashvili and his aggression against Abkhazia to control Georgian territory. It is oil interest and only but isn’t support of democracy.

Hahahahahahahaha..
Kremlin propaganda,..
"USA is Bad,..Georgia is bad, all countries are bad,..only Russia is very very good"..hahahaha

[Observer]

Russian wrote:

The truth is that Abkhazians don't want to be in Georgia.

What has that got to do with Russia? It is an internal matter of Georgia or, at worst, the international community i.e the UN.

[Observer]

Sasha wrote:

<quoted text>
Abkhazians want to be independent. Abkhazians are independent de facto, it is only simple formality to recognize the independent de juro. The Georgian president Saakashvili is dictator indeed. All people of Georgia, Russia and Abkhazia know this very well. There is totalitarian mode in Georgia now. Modern Georgia is ultra-nationalistic and above all extremely incompetent too. Unfortunately, these things haven’t changed. But USA officials name Georgian mode as democracy because Saakashvili is puppet of USA.

There is a lot more democracy in Georgia than there has ever been in Russia.

[Observer]

Robespierre wrote:

<quoted text>
It's not what you know, it's who you know that matters!!
It's a safeguard. Since they don't want to be part of Georgia, and can't stay stateless; Russia gave them passport and nationality.
There are many Georgians living in Russia who have Russian passports too, as Russian authorities found out when the police wanted to purge 'illegal' Georgians from Russia.

You mean when the Russian made the failed economic blockade on Georgia?

[Observer]

Xamzat wrote:

<quoted text>
Hahahahahahahaha..
Kremlin propaganda,..
"USA is Bad,..Georgia is bad, all countries are bad,..only Russia is very very good"..hahahaha

I know I thought the same. Russia is "good" ha..ha.ha..ha.. now that is funny ha..ha...ha... Robbo Crap and Sasha are true dreamers!

[Robespierre]

Observer wrote:

<quoted text>
There is a lot more democracy in Georgia than there has ever been in Russia.

Probably why there have been mass demonstration against Sakhashvili in Tblisi for months. Probably why one prime minister, rival of same Sakhashvili died mysteriously of gas poisoning. Also probably why an opponent of Sakhashvili in the last presidental elections died mysteriously too.

What do you make of the TV channels that have been closed. or the opposition newspapers that have been banned, or members of the cabinet (!) asking for assylum in France?

Why do you think the US start to distance themselves from Georgia? Why so many Georgians living in Russia don't want to go back home?

Democracy, or lack of it, is not something that is decided by YOU Observer!!
You are talking total nonsense, and always end up accusing Russia or finding a way of denigrating Russia.

Sakhashvili is acting like a little tin-pot dictator, but you still call that DEMOCRACY !!
You are completely deranged !!!

[Observer]

Robespierre wrote:

<quoted text>
Probably why there have been mass demonstration against Sakhashvili in Tblisi for months. Probably why one prime minister, rival of same Sakhashvili died mysteriously of gas poisoning. Also probably why an opponent of Sakhashvili in the last presidental elections died mysteriously too.
What do you make of the TV channels that have been closed. or the opposition newspapers that have been banned, or members of the cabinet (!) asking for assylum in France?
Why do you think the US start to distance themselves from Georgia? Why so many Georgians living in Russia don't want to go back home?
Democracy, or lack of it, is not something that is decided by YOU Observer!!
You are talking total nonsense, and always end up accusing Russia or finding a way of denigrating Russia.
Sakhashvili is acting like a little tin-pot dictator, but you still call that DEMOCRACY !!
You are completely deranged !!!

You know Robbo Crap you make Georgia and Sakhashvili sound just like Russia and Putin. What's to choose between them? All these things happen in Russia and you say Russia is democratic ha..ha..ha..!

[Robespierre]

Observer wrote:

<quoted text>
You know Robbo Crap you make Georgia and Sakhashvili sound just like Russia and Putin. What's to choose between them? All these things happen in Russia and you say Russia is democratic ha..ha..ha..!

I am not aware that political opponents 'disappear' in Russia, nor that cabinet members seek assylum abroad.
Also, the Russian government doesn't close down TV channels or newspapers: Russian media are free.

[Observer]

Robespierre wrote:

<quoted text>
I am not aware that political opponents 'disappear' in Russia, nor that cabinet members seek assylum abroad.
Also, the Russian government doesn't close down TV channels or newspapers: Russian media are free.

Then you are a complete and utter idiot Robbo Crap. In fact a real good quality example. What more do I need to say when you mutter such total nonsense.

[Crimean Tatar]

Robespierre wrote:

<quoted text>
Probably why there have been mass demonstration against Sakhashvili in Tblisi for months. Probably why one prime minister, rival of same Sakhashvili died mysteriously of gas poisoning. Also probably why an opponent of Sakhashvili in the last presidental elections died mysteriously too.
What do you make of the TV channels that have been closed. or the opposition newspapers that have been banned, or members of the cabinet (!) asking for assylum in France?
Why do you think the US start to distance themselves from Georgia? Why so many Georgians living in Russia don't want to go back home?
Democracy, or lack of it, is not something that is decided by YOU Observer!!
You are talking total nonsense, and always end up accusing Russia or finding a way of denigrating Russia.
Sakhashvili is acting like a little tin-pot dictator, but you still call that DEMOCRACY !!
You are completely deranged !!!

You would even blame the Jesus if he attempts to criticize Russia.

You are out of control.

Russia has not been doing anything good in Caucasus, and have been bringing quite a misery for almost all Caucasus nations.

How can you really keep on defending a country that has been acting no different than the NAZI Germany?