Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#43 Dec 12, 2012
Written just for you:
www.scribd.com/doc/31322017/Salvation ...
Morten

Oslo, Norway

#44 Dec 12, 2012
^^ You're an idiot who thinks that the opinion of people from many other countries even matter at all. If they haven't been in Norway or Finland, they don't know anything about us anyway, and all it is based on then, is PERCEPTION. You cannot take a survey based on PERCEPTION (not reality) seriously. Are you mentally challenged Johnny? By the way, in Norway Johnny is considered a very "farmish," rural and unsophisticated name...:)

It is only YOUR perception, yourself, that Finland is more urban, dynamic, European than Norway. ALL NORDIC COuNTRIES ARE LIKE THIS; THINK THEMSELVES ARE BEST. The difference is that I see this; and criticize you for falling trap to this mental lie that people in all of the Nordics believe!

You are plain wrong; I will never consider Finland more capitalistic and urban than Norway. It is just that YES we are a LITTLE smaller nation than you in population; but Norway has 4-5 main cities and population places, Finland only has 2-3 and really only one that matters in any way outside Finland. In Norway, in addition to Oslo, Bergen and Stavanger are also very strong centers of economy and business. Norway is looking out towards Britain, Denmark, Netherlands, Finlands neighbours that YOU pick up impulses from are Russia, Estonia and Sweden -+ a little bit Germany. LOL, Norway is much better situated to be a part of the Global community in a way that people actually notice.

Norway is more like Scotland and thereafter the UK (which we also have close bonds to), Finland is more like a cross between the Baltics, Russia, the Sami people, and the Swedes.

:)
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#45 Dec 12, 2012
Morten wrote:
^^ What makes you think Norwegians cannot offer themselves nice goods? I know one guy on welfare who smokes usually every day a pack of cigs (most expensive cigs in Europe), he smokes a bit of cannabis from time to time, and he has a big flatscreen TV, smartphone, Ipad, Laptop, Stationary gaming PC, he drinks although he's not alcoholic, and he manages to get a proper dinner meal every day (+ some other food also of course).
I am totally sure that it would be impossible in many countries to live as good as this guy does, on welfare.
So again, wrong....
Couple of month ago my jobless friend bought 42" flatscreen tv. All those things you described are everyday life even for poor jobless persons in Finland. Iīm not lying. How on earth do you think that those things are something special? Every people in Finland have new smartphones. Nokia 920 is the most wanted now.

I want to ask you something, just because it interests me. What kind of rents do you have in Norway? My family has 110 square meter apartment in Helsinki 15 kilometers from city center. It takes 22 minutes to go to city center by underground. Our rent is 1050 euros in a month, which is 7697 norske kroner. How much would it be in Oslo?
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#46 Dec 12, 2012
He is Coming Soon wrote:
Written just for you:
www.scribd.com/doc/31322017/Salvation ...
Yesterday is just thought, O God, I hope I have not violated some christian brother or sister in that Norway-discussion. Iīm so sorry if I have been too rude. That was ment to be just a some kind of joke, a game, but people seems to take that quite seriously.
What was that sigh in my spirit? Was it you? Once again, Iīm sorry.:)
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#47 Dec 12, 2012
Morten wrote:
^^ You're an idiot who thinks that the opinion of people from many other countries even matter at all. If they haven't been in Norway or Finland, they don't know anything about us anyway, and all it is based on then, is PERCEPTION. You cannot take a survey based on PERCEPTION (not reality) seriously. Are you mentally challenged Johnny? By the way, in Norway Johnny is considered a very "farmish," rural and unsophisticated name...:)
It is only YOUR perception, yourself, that Finland is more urban, dynamic, European than Norway. ALL NORDIC COuNTRIES ARE LIKE THIS; THINK THEMSELVES ARE BEST. The difference is that I see this; and criticize you for falling trap to this mental lie that people in all of the Nordics believe!
You are plain wrong; I will never consider Finland more capitalistic and urban than Norway. It is just that YES we are a LITTLE smaller nation than you in population; but Norway has 4-5 main cities and population places, Finland only has 2-3 and really only one that matters in any way outside Finland. In Norway, in addition to Oslo, Bergen and Stavanger are also very strong centers of economy and business. Norway is looking out towards Britain, Denmark, Netherlands, Finlands neighbours that YOU pick up impulses from are Russia, Estonia and Sweden -+ a little bit Germany. LOL, Norway is much better situated to be a part of the Global community in a way that people actually notice.
Norway is more like Scotland and thereafter the UK (which we also have close bonds to), Finland is more like a cross between the Baltics, Russia, the Sami people, and the Swedes.
:)
Of course Finland is strongly related to Baltic countries and Russia. We have been very much influenced by estonians, russians germans, swedes, all nations on the Baltic sea. You are an Atlantic nation, you live in totally different world. But Russia and Estonia are very cosmopilitan and intresting countries compared to our Nordic countries. I like to visit Estonia. I takes 2 hours by a huge carferry, where you can eat and drink and do the shop, and then you are in Eastern Europe. Just think about that! Two hours and you are in totally different civilization. That is exciting!
Morten

Oslo, Norway

#48 Dec 12, 2012
Johnny wrote:
<quoted text>
Couple of month ago my jobless friend bought 42" flatscreen tv. All those things you described are everyday life even for poor jobless persons in Finland. Iīm not lying. How on earth do you think that those things are something special? Every people in Finland have new smartphones. Nokia 920 is the most wanted now.

I want to ask you something, just because it interests me. What kind of rents do you have in Norway? My family has 110 square meter apartment in Helsinki 15 kilometers from city center. It takes 22 minutes to go to city center by underground. Our rent is 1050 euros in a month, which is 7697 norske kroner. How much would it be in Oslo?
How on earth do I think those things are special? I don't, but I do think it's special to live that well on the welfare/SOCIAL BENEFITS, he is living on the lowest form of support in Norway. THAT is a little bit special, not the things in themselves. Smartphones are totally standard in Norway too, so that's no different. I don't give a damn if one brand of smartphone that exists actually is a Finnish brand; in fact I used to like Nokia back in the day and almost support it; don't know if I want to ever do that again after this discussion, and a little Norway hate from Finland I've seen other places. What's your problem with Norway, Finns, it cannot be any other thing than some form of jealousy?

Are you jealous that our image is so much brighter, nicer, more positive and happy than your own image as a nation? If you know anything about what Norway REALLY is known for, you should know that Norway's image as a nation and people is simply much HAPPIER and POSITIVE than Finland's image.:)

The rent level in Oslo is possibly a little higher than in Finland, but not EXTREMELY much from the example you provided. But yes, a littlebit. But you can find very varied prices around the Oslo area especially for small rent apartments, some places you can be lucky and find slightly cheap smaller apartments for rent. I know one apartent complex in the inner parts of Oslo with rents around 6200 NOK for around 36 sq.m. apartment with balcony with evening sun, not really that bad... That's sort of a scoop though, there are many higher priced rent apartments also.

Oslo's housing market still is in a sort of "boom" mode that still hasn't been hit by world recession, so that's a part of the reason for this. Demand is still high in Oslo, while for instance in Copenhagen there's almost been a crash, so the pressure is actually lower right now in Copenhagen than Oslo...(And you were talking about us NOT being capitalistic...:)
Morten

Oslo, Norway

#49 Dec 12, 2012
Note; When I wrote about the price level on apartments, that the example I mentioned was a small apartment for RENT, not for SALE, while I believe the example you mentioned, was the monthly price for an apartment your family has BOUGHT. I.e. two different types of apartments, one for rent and one for sale.

The monthly price for SALEs apartments are of course lower than the monthly price for RENT apartments, in Norway too.
ThehalfSamihalfN orwegian

Alta, Norway

#50 Dec 12, 2012
Morten wrote:
^^ You're an idiot who thinks that the opinion of people from many other countries even matter at all. If they haven't been in Norway or Finland, they don't know anything about us anyway, and all it is based on then, is PERCEPTION. You cannot take a survey based on PERCEPTION (not reality) seriously. Are you mentally challenged Johnny? By the way, in Norway Johnny is considered a very "farmish," rural and unsophisticated name...:)
It is only YOUR perception, yourself, that Finland is more urban, dynamic, European than Norway. ALL NORDIC COuNTRIES ARE LIKE THIS; THINK THEMSELVES ARE BEST. The difference is that I see this; and criticize you for falling trap to this mental lie that people in all of the Nordics believe!
You are plain wrong; I will never consider Finland more capitalistic and urban than Norway. It is just that YES we are a LITTLE smaller nation than you in population; but Norway has 4-5 main cities and population places, Finland only has 2-3 and really only one that matters in any way outside Finland. In Norway, in addition to Oslo, Bergen and Stavanger are also very strong centers of economy and business. Norway is looking out towards Britain, Denmark, Netherlands, Finlands neighbours that YOU pick up impulses from are Russia, Estonia and Sweden -+ a little bit Germany. LOL, Norway is much better situated to be a part of the Global community in a way that people actually notice.
Norway is more like Scotland and thereafter the UK (which we also have close bonds to), Finland is more like a cross between the Baltics, Russia, the Sami people, and the Swedes.
:)
Norway would be more like The UK, with the Sami as scotland, and if Norway still owned Iceland, It would be northern ireland.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#51 Dec 12, 2012
German people buy clothes in Armani and Boss stores.
Norwegian people buy clothes at Fretex ;)
ThehalfSamihalfN orwegian

Alta, Norway

#52 Dec 12, 2012
La Gioconda wrote:
German people buy clothes in Armani and Boss stores.
Norwegian people buy clothes at Fretex ;)
Whats the difference? Clothes are clothes, and everyone got their own style.
Morten

Oslo, Norway

#53 Dec 12, 2012
La Gioconda wrote:
German people buy clothes in Armani and Boss stores.
Norwegian people buy clothes at Fretex ;)
Why when I traveled to Southern Italy last year, the majority of people did not feel especially stylish to me (Some were quite alright though, I'm not saying ALL). Oslo felt like 10 times more up to the times than the small city I visited in South Italy.

And we all know the famed fashion and well-clothed rumor about Italians.

So the moral of my little story is; you're fairly wrong really. Oslo is, today, quite on par with, for instance, Copenhagen.

The only thing different is that, for many years, suits on men were less usual to see in the day-to-day in Norway than many other European countries. That's our HISTORY, my friends. This is also changing today. Norwegians, at least in the Oslo region, are upgrading their style factor every day. Stop with these fake lies!
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#54 Dec 13, 2012
In Helsinki the rent of 30 square meter apartment could be 300 euros (2200 NOK), but in the most desirable neighborhoods 30 square meter apartment could cost 800 euros (5800 NOK) per month, but that is extremly high cost in a very good area.

Couple years ago we were living in 75 sq. meter house in Helsinki, and the rent was 410 euros (3010 NOK).

We have also tens of thousands of those wrecks (old cars) in Finland, but youngsters use those cars. BMW 316 model year 1995-2003 is quite ordinary first car for young guys. And in finnish countryside almost every house use to have a "fieldcar", which could be for exaple a Volvo from the beginning of 90īs. Many of those cars are normally registered, and young guys try to be rally stars of their own life with those cars.

I have heard that cars could be extremly pricey in Norway. If Skoda Octavia year model 2010 costs 300.000 NOK (40 900 euros), does that really make sense? In Finland Skoda Octavia year model 2010 would cost 13800-24000 euros (101.300-176.300 NOK) and finns really hate our car tax, because it makes cars so expensive in Finland. Thatīs why finns export 45 000 used cars from Germany every year, because they donīt want to pay finnish car prices. That really amazes me. Itīs bubbling in my mind, how can anyone buy a car in Norway without feeling angry?
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#55 Dec 13, 2012
Matpakke, the packed lunch sounds great, but in Finland we have school canteens, where food is totally free for students and costs quite little for teachers. And in workplaces we have workplace canteens, where a meal costs typically 6-8 euros (44-59 NOK). If the workplace does not have a canteen, then we go to a restaurant. In fastfood places a normal dinner costs also 6-8 euros, and in better places even 10 euros (73 NOK). That is much. Many people in Finland cannot understand, why it is so expensive nowadays in restaurants.

I like to go to a local chinese restaurant here in Helsinki. Take-away meal costs 6,50-7,00 euros (48-51 NOK) and I can just pay that. I think that 5 euros could be the right price, but we have to live with that price level in Finland.
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#56 Dec 13, 2012
Morten wrote:
Note; When I wrote about the price level on apartments, that the example I mentioned was a small apartment for RENT, not for SALE, while I believe the example you mentioned, was the monthly price for an apartment your family has BOUGHT. I.e. two different types of apartments, one for rent and one for sale.
The monthly price for SALEs apartments are of course lower than the monthly price for RENT apartments, in Norway too.
No, our rent is 1050 euros (7700 NOK) and the apartment is 110 square meter. Itīs 400 meters to underground station, and it takes 22 minutes to go by underground to the city centre. We have not bought it, because it would cost at least 300 000 euros. I will buy a house only if the market will collapse.:) We have a food store in the same house, where a liter of milk costs one euro (7 NOK), which is quite normal price here. If I buy a bag of food, ie meat, milk, juice, pasta,a bottle of lemonade and fruits, it usually costs 15-20 euros (110-146 NOK), and in Lidl even 20-30% less. But the quality of Lidl is not so high, so I tend to go to finnish markets.
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#57 Dec 13, 2012
Morten wrote:
<quoted text>
How on earth do I think those things are special? I don't, but I do think it's special to live that well on the welfare/SOCIAL BENEFITS, he is living on the lowest form of support in Norway. THAT is a little bit special, not the things in themselves. Smartphones are totally standard in Norway too, so that's no different. I don't give a damn if one brand of smartphone that exists actually is a Finnish brand; in fact I used to like Nokia back in the day and almost support it; don't know if I want to ever do that again after this discussion, and a little Norway hate from Finland I've seen other places. What's your problem with Norway, Finns, it cannot be any other thing than some form of jealousy?
Are you jealous that our image is so much brighter, nicer, more positive and happy than your own image as a nation? If you know anything about what Norway REALLY is known for, you should know that Norway's image as a nation and people is simply much HAPPIER and POSITIVE than Finland's image.:)
The rent level in Oslo is possibly a little higher than in Finland, but not EXTREMELY much from the example you provided. But yes, a littlebit. But you can find very varied prices around the Oslo area especially for small rent apartments, some places you can be lucky and find slightly cheap smaller apartments for rent. I know one apartent complex in the inner parts of Oslo with rents around 6200 NOK for around 36 sq.m. apartment with balcony with evening sun, not really that bad... That's sort of a scoop though, there are many higher priced rent apartments also.
Oslo's housing market still is in a sort of "boom" mode that still hasn't been hit by world recession, so that's a part of the reason for this. Demand is still high in Oslo, while for instance in Copenhagen there's almost been a crash, so the pressure is actually lower right now in Copenhagen than Oslo...(And you were talking about us NOT being capitalistic...:)
Morten, now you are offended. I didnīt know, that you norwegians are so sensitive people. I just thought, that you will hit me very hard and effectively, but now you are in pain. You maybe canīt believe it, but Iīm sorry. You see, I donīt know very comprehensively what kind of people you are mentally. Swedes are quite hard and sometimes Itīs nice to quibble with swedes, because their self-confidence can not be shaken, but now I know that you are different. I should have been more polite.

Finland is a nation strongly linked to other nations on the Baltic sea. But that world is also intresting. It always happens much in that reality. But of course baltic and russian criminals In Helsinki are something new and not so nice.

I just thought, that is that distrust between Finland and Norway something, which dates back to the Cold War era, when we were friends of Russians (but still totally independent and very free compared to this EU-age) and you were NATOīs slaves?:) Is it, that every people know, that if something still happens between Russian and NATO, Norway and Finland maybe are not at the same side?
SDN

Vestnes, Norway

#58 Dec 13, 2012
I disagree with a few comments. I live in Norway and work as an engineer. The salaries in Norway are almost double of what people earn in Sweden and Finland. I lived 2 yrs in Sweden as well, The average starting salary in Sweden is 20 thounsand sek which is about 2200 euros where as in Norway it is around 3600 euros after tax. Plus if you visit Sweden or Norway the prices of clothing is the same, the only difference is that in Sweden you pay in SEK whereas, in Norway you pay in NOK and the exchange rate is 1 NOK = 1.12 SEK which doesnt make a big difference at all. As for food items, it can be slightly expensive then its neigbouring countries but still believe me by the end of the month you end up saving more money then you would have if youd be living in Finland or Sweden.
Yes cars tend to be a bit expensive but that is not an item you go out and buy monthly, so that is a one time investment and mostly people buy cars through bank financing options and considiring you earn so much in Norway it wont affect you or your pocket.
For the germany part, Gucci and Armani woule be popular brands in Germany but in Norway they dont have these outlets. They have other brands here which are equally expensive and not chinese as someone quoted above.
P.S
Those who dont work in Norway, and visit Norway will always find it rediculously expensive, but those who live and earn their find other countries extremely cheap.
Johnny

Helsinki, Finland

#59 Dec 13, 2012
In Finland average salary is now 3300 euros (24.244 NOK). In Norway it is 35.200 NOK, but in Finland income taxes are much lower than in Norway. If your tax level in Norway is 30%, in Finland it would be 20%, if salary is the same in both countries.

And for example teachers salaries in Finland are higher than in Norway.
Morten

Oslo, Norway

#60 Dec 13, 2012
Well I can say one thing, I have actually, believe it or not, thought about it a time or two, that the almost non-existant relationship between Norway and Finland, is a littlebit strange. I thought about this a couple of times even years ago actually.

It is a little strange, even if the big Sweden being between us probably has a lot to do with it.

Anyway, I don't mean to offend when I just say that to most people in south-eastern Norway, Finland is a relatively "blank spot" on the map. I'm not saying it to offend - it has it's clear logical reasons. Obviously, Norway probably isn't very high on Finns lists of interests either. But for Norway, the draw of especially the UK and US, and thereafter Denmark+other European countries (+ yes Sweden too, of course), is much stronger than the draw in the Finnish direction. So for Norwegians, at least, this has extremely logical reasons. Our attention simply isn't going much in the Eastern direction, and especially not much east of Sweden.

This is a fact and yes, it may partially have historical reasons, but it's also a undescribable feeling of all "warmth" being more in the direction of Spain, the UK and the U.S., not in the direction of Finland, Russia and Siberia....:)

ipi

Since: Dec 12

Trondheim, Norway

#61 Dec 13, 2012
Morten wrote:
Well I can say one thing, I have actually, believe it or not, thought about it a time or two, that the almost non-existant relationship between Norway and Finland, is a littlebit strange. I thought about this a couple of times even years ago actually.
It is a little strange, even if the big Sweden being between us probably has a lot to do with it.
Anyway, I don't mean to offend when I just say that to most people in south-eastern Norway, Finland is a relatively "blank spot" on the map. I'm not saying it to offend - it has it's clear logical reasons. Obviously, Norway probably isn't very high on Finns lists of interests either. But for Norway, the draw of especially the UK and US, and thereafter Denmark+other European countries (+ yes Sweden too, of course), is much stronger than the draw in the Finnish direction. So for Norwegians, at least, this has extremely logical reasons. Our attention simply isn't going much in the Eastern direction, and especially not much east of Sweden.
This is a fact and yes, it may partially have historical reasons, but it's also a undescribable feeling of all "warmth" being more in the direction of Spain, the UK and the U.S., not in the direction of Finland, Russia and Siberia....:)
I can back this up.

ipi

Since: Dec 12

Trondheim, Norway

#62 Dec 13, 2012
And I would also mention some numbers.

In Trondheim in Norway, the rent is around 4000-4500NOK (540-610euro) for a standard 40-70 sq.m. apartment. Usually, the higher the sq.m. in this price range, the less attractive it is geographically. But this is still in center of the town, no more than a 40min walk from the absolute center of Trondheim.

I would also like to point out that these are outrageous prices, I think that. As a student, we don't get enough money each month to be capable of having such an apartment, with all the other expenses we also have. Half of the students here have jobs so that they can afford both the apratment, food and social life.

But thinking that we "almost get this money for free" (extremely low interest, which does not take effect after the studies are finished, and also considering that we get half for free if we finish our study), we should be grateful. I don't think of Norway as extremely expensive, but that is directly linked to the good welfare we have in this country.

I'm not saying you are wrong to point out that some things in Norway is expensive, but you have to see the country as a whole. For an example (stupid example), I can't conclude with Finland being an expensive country, because I find the boat prices to be double of what we have in Norway. You can't base an argument on comparisons on specific products, without taking everything else that matters out of the way.

Finland lives, Norway lives. We don't have civil wars, we don't have large extremists groups terrorizing the country. We're doing great, apparently. How can you ever argue with that?

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