The Treaty of Waitangi

[trixie5]

since 1975 the treaty was overturned an in its place a false treaty..

http://youtu.be/2PE-j9ZOhrg

[Adam Rangiaho]

trixie5 wrote:

since 1975 the treaty was overturned an in its place a false treaty..
http://youtu.be/2PE-j9ZOhrg

that video is flawed because the so called littlewood lost final draft treaty is nothing but....

"Appended to this English text, however, was a note by Clendon:
Memo: This Translation is from the Native Document and not a Copy of the
Official Document in English from which the Native one is made, and although
the words may be different from what they were in the Original I think the sense
is much the same;– but on the return of Capt. Hobson from the Southward I
shall apply officially to him for a Copy and translation of the Treaty for the
purpose of sending it to the Government of the United States.
[signed] James R Clendon
U.S. Consul. 27 [emphasis added]
"

[trixie5]

Adam Rangiaho wrote:

<quoted text>
that video is flawed because the so called littlewood lost final draft treaty is nothing but....
"Appended to this English text, however, was a note by Clendon:
Memo: This Translation is from the Native Document and not a Copy of the
Official Document in English from which the Native one is made, and although
the words may be different from what they were in the Original I think the sense
is much the same;– but on the return of Capt. Hobson from the Southward I
shall apply officially to him for a Copy and translation of the Treaty for the
purpose of sending it to the Government of the United States.
[signed] James R Clendon
U.S. Consul. 27 [emphasis added]
"

You are wrong, The Final English Draft (Littlewood Document) is the word for word the Treaty of Waitangi (It is no back-translation)
http://www.treatyofwaitangi.net.nz/ReadtheTre...

[trixie5]

literal rendition of the Treaty of Waitangi based upon the final draft, written on the 4th of February 1840 by James Busby, British Resident. From about the 2nd of February 1840 Busby was acting as Hobson's secretary and advisor in the Treaty drafting incentive. This final draft, in Busby's handwriting and dated the 4th of February 1840, is held in the collection of the National Archives, Wellington, New Zealand. Back translations of the Maori version confirm that Busby's 4th of February draft mirrors the Maori text in perfect eloquence and content

http://www.treatyofwaitangi.net.nz/ReadtheTre...

[Torqueing Heads]

Time to dismantle the entire treaty industry rort and give back those assets and money to the people of NZ.

[Gatvol]

Torqueing Heads wrote:

Time to dismantle the entire treaty industry rort and give back those assets and money to the people of NZ.

And buy that I assume you me everyone in NZ, and not select race groups but ALL New Zealanders, regardless of race, colour or creed

[Torqueing Heads]

Gatvol wrote:

<quoted text>
And buy that I assume you me everyone in NZ, and not select race groups but ALL New Zealanders, regardless of race, colour or creed

Exactly

[Gatvol]

Torqueing Heads wrote:

<quoted text>Exactly

Then you have my vote sir

[trixie5]

Torqueing Heads wrote:

Time to dismantle the entire treaty industry rort and give back those assets and money to the people of NZ.

yes time for some transparency over the truth of our Real Treaty meaning and the Gravy Train will have to pay the money back!!!

[kiwi in oz]

Torqueing Heads wrote:

<quoted text>Exactly

I totally agree.. well said. Iam part-Maori, but enough is enough, fair treatment for all kiwis.

[kiwi in oz]

Gatvol wrote:

<quoted text>
Then you have my vote sir

and mine, well said,fair treatment for all kiwis.

[kiwi in oz]

trixie5 wrote:

<quoted text>
yes time for some transparency over the truth of our Real Treaty meaning and the Gravy Train will have to pay the money back!!!

well said.

[sick of them]

trixie5 wrote:

<quoted text>
yes time for some transparency over the truth of our Real Treaty meaning and the Gravy Train will have to pay the money back!!!

you fellows have it all wrong,for the government to move forward, they have to pay the wrongs of the past,but once these land claims are settled, we all will be in the shit then ,as we have bankers running this country and john key aint going to let his investments dry up, so he will be doing all he can to keep his own gravy train going, but so long as most of you fellows are moaning about maori it gives key the smoke screen he needs to continue his big ripoff,look at dot com,hes starting to dictate to our ministers now,what im getting at is if you have money, the government will listen, but if your just another tax paying wage earner, they dont really care about us, they do just enough,

[sick of them]

trixie5 wrote:

<quoted text>
yes time for some transparency over the truth of our Real Treaty meaning and the Gravy Train will have to pay the money back!!!

transparency.....hmmm....to have this, every crime, murder torture, inslavement ,every forcefull removal of marae,every crime that the first settlers government and soldiers had repeatedly done in them days, should be put in the papers and on tv ,so that short memory folk, like afew on here, can acually find out why settlements are in order,most of the fellows here speak about stuff they know nothing about,get the facts and all the facts not just the facts that you want to know,the first 50 years that pakiha were here were" id say" the hardest for all maori, we took them off thier marae and got marae moved in some cases,put them into town like setups,allianated them from thier hunting, feeding grounds in thier own country,this is a big complex situation,pity that most maori wont see anything from these claims, but once its over its over,bleating half truths wont help,every tribe has thier own tail to tell,but so many on here have dumped all maori into the same basket,ask yourselfs, why has ngai tahu got such a big piece of the pie?, when we all know through our history books that the northern tribes went to war for the south, before pakiha got here,so why is it that the government has to pay out ngai tahu and have to keep giving them handouts,so long as this sort of payout goes on there will never be transparency

[truebluekiwi]

sick of them wrote:

<quoted text>transparency.....hmmm. ...to have this, every crime, murder torture, inslavement ,every forcefull removal of marae,every crime that the first settlers government and soldiers had repeatedly done in them days, should be put in the papers and on tv ,so that short memory folk, like afew on here, can acually find out why settlements are in order,most of the fellows here speak about stuff they know nothing about,get the facts and all the facts not just the facts that you want to know,the first 50 years that pakiha were here were" id say" the hardest for all maori, we took them off thier marae and got marae moved in some cases,put them into town like setups,allianated them from thier hunting, feeding grounds in thier own country,this is a big complex situation,pity that most maori wont see anything from these claims, but once its over its over,bleating half truths wont help,every tribe has thier own tail to tell,but so many on here have dumped all maori into the same basket,ask yourselfs, why has ngai tahu got such a big piece of the pie?, when we all know through our history books that the northern tribes went to war for the south, before pakiha got here,so why is it that the government has to pay out ngai tahu and have to keep giving them handouts,so long as this sort of payout goes on there will never be transparency

I certainly do not suffer from short-memory bud..I know my family whakapapa, and as you say, every iwi has its own tale to tell. I just choose to not, live in the past. To me, whats done is done, I focus on the here and now, what use is it to me and my tamariki, to carry the weight of the past, into the future. It wont help them to survive, in todays modern world. I am half-Maori, but I dont have any claims to any land in N.Z, and nor would I accept money, that I did not earn. I dont need to get on here, like many Maoris and preach about the past, trying to be intellect. Just get over it and get on with life. My tipuna were some of the ones wronged, and so what, that was their time, now its mine, fair treatment for all kiwis mate.

[sick of them]

truebluekiwi wrote:

<quoted text>I certainly do not suffer from short-memory bud..I know my family whakapapa, and as you say, every iwi has its own tale to tell. I just choose to not, live in the past. To me, whats done is done, I focus on the here and now, what use is it to me and my tamariki, to carry the weight of the past, into the future. It wont help them to survive, in todays modern world. I am half-Maori, but I dont have any claims to any land in N.Z, and nor would I accept money, that I did not earn. I dont need to get on here, like many Maoris and preach about the past, trying to be intellect. Just get over it and get on with life. My tipuna were some of the ones wronged, and so what, that was their time, now its mine, fair treatment for all kiwis mate.

you missed i was meaning for the government to make private beaches and rivers for tourisim they need to sort out thier past wrongs and with the way white folk go on on here they dont know the truth,but the gov has to have been seen to settle to inforce thier prestiage,you make it sound like i have a claim ,your wrong but i can see why the gov needs to do what they do,im part maori and i dont like half of this race and the shit they do,but to stop racist shit slinging from both sides, be good if kiwis knew the truth about what happened rather than comment on stuff they know nout about,if i had my way wed get rid of all claims and give maori the middle finger,but the crown dont work like that so we gotta go through the motions but 70% of kiwis dont know a thing about,as for me my great greatgreat grandfather was a plowmen from taranaki,and on the other side my popa was a government surveyour of that time

[Adam Rangiaho]

trixie5 wrote:

<quoted text>
You are wrong, The Final English Draft (Littlewood Document) is the word for word the Treaty of Waitangi (It is no back-translation)
http://www.treatyofwaitangi.net.nz/ReadtheTre...

there is no mystery....its been solved ....... people still pushing final english draft crap are just dumb..... especially when the answers are looking at you in the face.

bad research is bad research.....this guy is NOT a researcher....he's a guesser..... he makes crap up....its a sad thing to do.......

" An examination of the Littlewood document and the historical evidence relating to it
does not, in my opinion, provide any support for Mr. Doutré’s proposition that this is the
long-lost final English draft of the Treaty of Waitangi, or a copy of it. His argument relies
heavily on assertions about the role played by J.S. Clendon in the drafting of the Treaty
which do not appear to have much substance. His argument that the document is not a back-
translation of the Maori text of the Treaty flies in the face of Clendon’s own clear and
unambiguous statement to the contrary, which Mr Doutré is unable to explain away. It is
further undercut by Dr. Parkinson’s forensic analysis of the text in question, which firmly
concludes that it is indeed a back-translation. "

[Adam Rangiaho]

trixie5 wrote:

<quoted text>
You are wrong, The Final English Draft (Littlewood Document) is the word for word the Treaty of Waitangi (It is no back-translation)
http://www.treatyofwaitangi.net.nz/ReadtheTre...

bay.... you just tried to tell me it's word for word exactly the same........ hey, you are on another planet....saying things that are not true...

littlewood document article 2 says:

The Queen of England confirms and guarantees to the chiefs & tribes and to all the people of New Zealand the possession of their lands, dwellings and all their property. But the chiefs of the Confederation and the other chiefs grant to the chiefs Queen, the exclusive right of purchasing such land as the proprietors thereof may be disposed to sell at such prices as shall be agreed upon between them and the persons appointed by the Queen to purchase from them.

official english text article 2 says:

Her Majesty the Queen of England confirms and guarantees to the Chiefs and Tribes of New Zealand and to the respective families and individuals thereof the full exclusive and undisturbed possession of their Lands and Estates Forests Fisheries and other properties which they may collectively or individually possess so long as it is their wish and desire to retain the same in their possession

come on ...this looks bad for you....as you can plainly see they are DIFFERENT...... they dpnt even start with the same words....can you see?....one says THE Queen... and the other says...HER Majesty....hahahahahahaha... word for word my assss.....hahahaha

[Torqueing Heads]

Adam Rangiaho wrote:

<quoted text>
bay.... you just tried to tell me it's word for word exactly the same........ hey, you are on another planet....saying things that are not true...
littlewood document article 2 says:
The Queen of England confirms and guarantees to the chiefs & tribes and to all the people of New Zealand the possession of their lands, dwellings and all their property. But the chiefs of the Confederation and the other chiefs grant to the chiefs Queen, the exclusive right of purchasing such land as the proprietors thereof may be disposed to sell at such prices as shall be agreed upon between them and the persons appointed by the Queen to purchase from them.
official english text article 2 says:
Her Majesty the Queen of England confirms and guarantees to the Chiefs and Tribes of New Zealand and to the respective families and individuals thereof the full exclusive and undisturbed possession of their Lands and Estates Forests Fisheries and other properties which they may collectively or individually possess so long as it is their wish and desire to retain the same in their possession
come on ...this looks bad for you....as you can plainly see they are DIFFERENT...... they dpnt even start with the same words....can you see?....one says THE Queen... and the other says...HER Majesty....hahahahahahaha... word for word my assss.....hahahaha

The Queen and her Majesty are one and the same Adam. You are the one sounding desperate.

[Adam Rangiaho]

Torqueing Heads wrote:

<quoted text>The Queen and her Majesty are one and the same Adam. You are the one sounding desperate.

hahahaha...NOT!!!!! lol.....do you know what "word for word" means?....it means EXACTLY the same....its NOT exactly the same..!!!:)

is the littlewood document word for fro the same as the official english?..... nah....only desperate person is the one who said they were the same...... word....