Just how closely related are Greeks w...

Just how closely related are Greeks with Slavs

Posted in the Macedonia Forum

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Petros

UK

#1 Sep 25, 2008
Did Greeks and Slavs inter marry.

Do the children of mixed marriages claim ancestry from Greeks or from Slavs?
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#2 Sep 25, 2008
Greeks disappeared before the Slavs arrived in the Balkans.

Greeks had integrated into the Roman cosmos.

Slavs settled near the Roman cosmos, and were Christianised by the Eastern Empire.

Their integration, following this event was inevitable.

Roman (Byzantine) rulers could well be South Slavs (Yugo - Slav).

Constantine IA' Paleologus (o Marmaromenos Vasileus), the last Roman Emperor was a typical example of the above.

His mother, Helena Dragash was a Slav, from Kumanovo, modern day Republic of Macedonia, and his father, Manuel B' Paleologus was a Roman (Byzantine) from Mystra, modern day Greece.
lol

Nijmegen, Netherlands

#3 Sep 25, 2008
dissapeared????
like dinosaurs??
interesting....
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#4 Sep 25, 2008
lol wrote:
dissapeared????
like dinosaurs??
interesting....
When you go to the United States please find me a few Incas, Aztecs and Mayas, and ask'em where have they been hiding.
Occasional Observer

Toronto, Canada

#6 Sep 25, 2008
and if the Hellenes intergrated/disappeared, how do you explain the continuation of the Hellenic language.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#7 Sep 25, 2008
CANADEZOS wrote:
<quoted text>ROMIONIMOU!JUST BECAUSE THEY WERE INTEGRATED INTO THE EASTERN ROMAN EMPIRE!THAT DOESN'T MEAN THEY LOST THEIR HELLENIC IDENTITY!FOR THE EXACT REASON WHY THE EMPIRE EVENTUALLY IT BECAME A HELLENISTIC EMPIRE!WHICH MEANS THEIR GREEKNESS PREVAILLED!KWNSTANTINOS PALAIOLOGOS WAS BORN IN MYSTRA SPARTH!HE WAS A SPARTAN NO ROMAN WOP!THE REASON WHY HE FOUGHT AND DIED LIKE HIS SPARTAN ANCESTOR LEONIDAS! AFTERALL IF HE WAS ROMAN!WHERE WAS THE ROMAN ARMY TO SUPPORT HIM DURING THE INVASION OF CONSTANTINOPLE?ROMIONIMOU NA GRAFEIS THN ALY8IA KAI OXI SKOPIAN MALAKIES!
Yeah right, and pigs fly.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#8 Sep 25, 2008
Occasional Observer wrote:
and if the Hellenes intergrated/disappeared, how do you explain the continuation of the Hellenic language.
Ask Roman Emperor Flavius Heraclius Augustus, who was of Armenian origin, yet introduced the use of the Hellenic language to the Roman Empire in 620 AD.
Nikola the Macedonian

AOL

#9 Sep 25, 2008
Occasional Observer wrote:
and if the Hellenes intergrated/disappeared, how do you explain the continuation of the Hellenic language.
What happened in 1833? Greece had just gained its independence from the Ottoman Empire. To be more precise it was given to her by France and Britain.
In return, Greece received a French appointed German ruler, Prince Otto.

Otto was a freshly arrived hit in Greece. He loved the ethnic soup there, though he grew a bit concern as to how he would rule this people.

His biggest concern was Athens, where the Albanians and Turkish dominated.
Prince Otto phoned his twenty seven (27) year old friend Johann Gustav Droysen at Friedrich Wilhelm University. The student turned part time teacher was such an authority on his subject “History” that he was a privatdozent and then a professor (appointed by Otto) without a salary.

Even Prince Otto didn’t think he was good enough to have a salary. Granted, friendship can sometimes go far, as in this case. Johann was hired by Greece’s ruler to create the “new history” for Greece, to unite the populace, give him an idea of a ‘language’ in such a way that the populations wouldn’t be in a conflict.
Johann Gustav had recommended Albanian as the core language of Greece because it dominated Athens. This idea didn’t go well with Prince Otto who explained that people in and outside of Athens spoke Turkish as well. Besides, the idea was to unite the populations.

Johann’s showed his cleverness by suggesting to adopt the long lost Koine language. Imagine Americans today adopting what is now considered the dying Latin language.

Prince Otto loved Johann's idea and it was set in stone. Koine was the language. Better yet, the language was called “Greek”, the German born Greek ruler decided.

learn your history you bum.
Occasional Observer

Toronto, Canada

#10 Sep 25, 2008
Your theories are totally twisted and fabricated.
Nikola the Macedonian

AOL

#11 Sep 25, 2008
Occasional Observer wrote:
Your theories are totally twisted and fabricated.
theories ?.....no, these are facts.

twisted ?....ofcourse, all balkans twist facts to better serve their purpose.

fabricated ?....yes, greece was fabricated, appointed prince otto as ruler, and introduced koine language to replace predominant albanian and turkish languages.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#12 Sep 25, 2008
Nikola the Macedonian wrote:
<quoted text>
What happened in 1833? Greece had just gained its independence from the Ottoman Empire. To be more precise it was given to her by France and Britain.
In return, Greece received a French appointed German ruler, Prince Otto.
Otto was a freshly arrived hit in Greece. He loved the ethnic soup there, though he grew a bit concern as to how he would rule this people.
His biggest concern was Athens, where the Albanians and Turkish dominated.
Prince Otto phoned his twenty seven (27) year old friend Johann Gustav Droysen at Friedrich Wilhelm University. The student turned part time teacher was such an authority on his subject “History” that he was a privatdozent and then a professor (appointed by Otto) without a salary.
Even Prince Otto didn’t think he was good enough to have a salary. Granted, friendship can sometimes go far, as in this case. Johann was hired by Greece’s ruler to create the “new history” for Greece, to unite the populace, give him an idea of a ‘language’ in such a way that the populations wouldn’t be in a conflict.
Johann Gustav had recommended Albanian as the core language of Greece because it dominated Athens. This idea didn’t go well with Prince Otto who explained that people in and outside of Athens spoke Turkish as well. Besides, the idea was to unite the populations.
Johann’s showed his cleverness by suggesting to adopt the long lost Koine language. Imagine Americans today adopting what is now considered the dying Latin language.
Prince Otto loved Johann's idea and it was set in stone. Koine was the language. Better yet, the language was called “Greek”, the German born Greek ruler decided.
learn your history you bum.
Not entirely wrong.

It is a well known fact that, when the Great Powers conferred Greece its conditional independence from the Ottoman Empire with the London Protocol of 1832, they had committed a serious mistake.

The populations of the newly created state whose territory comprised of the Peloponnese and the lands south of Thessaly spoke mainly Arvanite (an Albanian dialect). Athens was indeed an Arvanite village.

This had created a paradox. Although the so called 'Greek' revolution against the Ottomans was conducted by Orthodox Christians subjects to the Rum Millet (Roman Nation) of the Ottoman Empire, such populations being Arvanite, Slavic, Vlach, Armenian, Bulgarian or simply Roman (Romioi) of Anatolia and the Middle East, it was only the 'Romans' or the educated people of the Balkans that spoke and were capable of understanding Greek.

Even the ones that spoke 'Greek', saw their language as 'Romaic', which they knew was different to Greek, as the two were not mutually intelligible.

Thus, newly established Greece was indeed a country with a Bavarian King and an Arvanite-speaking Romaic population with Ottoman habits!

Finally, it is not a coincidence that the 'Greek' revolution was not declared in Greece!

The ...Greek Revolution of 1821 was declared in Jasi (Iasion), in North Eastern Romania (Moldavia), by Romanian Prince Alesandru Konstantinovic Ipsilanti (...Alexandros Ypsilantis lol).

Now it is your turn.

Tell us how Macedonia (the State, not the Roman Theme) was created.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#15 Sep 26, 2008
CANADEZOS wrote:
<quoted text>NONSENSE SLAVONIMOU!WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE OF YOUR ROMIOI NON GREEK LANGUAGE SLAVONIMOU!THE BYZANTINES LANGUAGE WAS PURE GREEK!NOT ROMAN!PALAIOLOGOS LAST LITURGY PSALM "THN YPERMAXW STRATHGO...." WAS ALL GREEK NOT IN ROMAN!ALL OF THE CITIZENS OF THE BYZANTINE EMPIRE SPOKE GREEK!THE CORE OF THE BYZANTINE EMPIRE WAS GREEK PERIOD!THE REASON WHY ATHENS WAS ALBANIAN POPULATED WAS BECAUSE THE GREEKS HAD FLED THE BIG CITIES!TO THE MOUNTAINOUS REGIONS WHERE THEY FORMED THE FREEDOM FIGHTERS BANDS"ARMATOLOI KAI KLEFTES"
Only a fool would believe that Greek is the same language with Demotiki (Romaic). In which Greek dictionary would you find words such as 'mouni', re ...palionimou?

Of course not all citizens of the Vasileia Romaion (Byzantium) spoke Greek.

I wonder why with names such as Constantine, Augustus, Justinian, Armenian and Slavic Emperors, Roman Law, etc you are under the impression that the core of the Empire was Greek.

Father Vlahavas had withdrawn to the mountains, in Pindos, where he famously said 'I was born a Roman and I shall die a Roman'.

Your brain is just too small to grasp what I am saying here, so back off and roll me a Canadian souvlaki with garlic mayonnaise instead of tzatziki.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#16 Sep 26, 2008
CANADEZOS wrote:
<quoted text>JUST BECAUSE THEY WERE UNDER THE TURKISH OCCUPATION FOR 500 YRS!IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE GREEK LANGUAGE DID NOT EXIST MORON!IT WAS THE ORTHODOX CHURCH WHO HELD SECRET GREEK SCHOOLS!AND KEPT THE GREEK LANGUAGE ALIVE!
That is false.

First of all, the Orthodox Church was not 'Greek' and it still is not in Greece. It is in Istanbul (Constantinople, New Rome), where it has been known for centuries as the Ecumenical Patriarchate, or simply as 'Rum Patrikhanesi'(Roman Patriarchate).

In Ottoman times, the Millet system allowed the subjects of the Roman Nation (Rum Millet) use of their language, schools, and even legal system (Roman Code of Justinian), administered by the Leader (Ethnarch) of the Millet (Nation), the Patriarch of Constantinople New Rome.

The Greek Orthodox Church was established by Bavarian King of Greece, Otto, in 1833.
the lie detector

Australia

#17 Sep 26, 2008
Occasional Observer wrote:
and if the Hellenes intergrated/disappeared, how do you explain the continuation of the Hellenic language.
we are all baffled by this great question....your king was bavarian,protestant, the majority of people in athens 1840 spoke albanian 85%,they were of ottoman origin or albanian....the koine languge which was used by the orthodox church, just as latin is in the catholic , was adopted to homoganizs the massive population who all spoke various languages....non of these people spoke greek....
ALEXANDER OF HELLENES

Athens, Greece

#18 Sep 26, 2008
Romanos wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah right, and pigs fly.
ALBANIAN SOON WE WILL FREE THE 400.000 HELLENES AND VLACHS OF NORTHERN EPIRUS AND DESTROY ALBANIAN PROTECTORATE.
YOU ALL ALBANIANS, YOU WILL HAVE TO LEAVE FROM HELLAS.
THOUQH, YOU CAN LEAVE YOUR WOMEN.
ALBANIAN YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT I DATE ALBANIAN WOMEN OF MY AQE(23)AND I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
YES... HEAR IT ONCE AQAIN, I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
EVERY TIME THEY TELL ME THAT I HAVE A MUCH BIQQER DICK THAN THEIR ALBANIANS.
SORRY ,THIS IS LIFE THIEF ALBANIAN!
ONE QUESTION ONLY!
WHY DO ALL HOMOSEXUAL ORQANISATIONS IN ATHENS ALWAYS SUPPORT YOU?
DO YOU SERVE HOMOSEXUALS?
WHY I SEE ALL ALBANIAN WOMEN DATINQ ARYAN HELLENES?
IS THE REAL REASON THE SMALL ALBANIAN DICKS OR THEIR HOMOSEXUAL PREFERENCES?
BYE TURKOMAN ALBANIAN THIEF.
Romanos

Athens, Greece

#19 Sep 26, 2008
ALEXANDER OF HELLENES wrote:
<quoted text>
ALBANIAN SOON WE WILL FREE THE 400.000 HELLENES AND VLACHS OF NORTHERN EPIRUS AND DESTROY ALBANIAN PROTECTORATE.
YOU ALL ALBANIANS, YOU WILL HAVE TO LEAVE FROM HELLAS.
THOUQH, YOU CAN LEAVE YOUR WOMEN.
ALBANIAN YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT I DATE ALBANIAN WOMEN OF MY AQE(23)AND I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
YES... HEAR IT ONCE AQAIN, I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
EVERY TIME THEY TELL ME THAT I HAVE A MUCH BIQQER DICK THAN THEIR ALBANIANS.
SORRY ,THIS IS LIFE THIEF ALBANIAN!
ONE QUESTION ONLY!
WHY DO ALL HOMOSEXUAL ORQANISATIONS IN ATHENS ALWAYS SUPPORT YOU?
DO YOU SERVE HOMOSEXUALS?
WHY I SEE ALL ALBANIAN WOMEN DATINQ ARYAN HELLENES?
IS THE REAL REASON THE SMALL ALBANIAN DICKS OR THEIR HOMOSEXUAL PREFERENCES?
BYE TURKOMAN ALBANIAN THIEF.
Vasei katagwghs, eimai sigouros oti esy eisai Alvanos kai Vlaxos, enw oi dikoi mou progonoi Rwmioi, dhladh Ellhnes. To katalaves re, gyfto?
the lie detector

Australia

#20 Sep 26, 2008
ALEXANDER OF HELLENES wrote:
<quoted text>
ALBANIAN SOON WE WILL FREE THE 400.000 HELLENES AND VLACHS OF NORTHERN EPIRUS AND DESTROY ALBANIAN PROTECTORATE.
YOU ALL ALBANIANS, YOU WILL HAVE TO LEAVE FROM HELLAS.
THOUQH, YOU CAN LEAVE YOUR WOMEN.
ALBANIAN YOU SHOULD KNOW THAT I DATE ALBANIAN WOMEN OF MY AQE(23)AND I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
YES... HEAR IT ONCE AQAIN, I HAVE SEX WITH YOUR WOMEN.
EVERY TIME THEY TELL ME THAT I HAVE A MUCH BIQQER DICK THAN THEIR ALBANIANS.
SORRY ,THIS IS LIFE THIEF ALBANIAN!
ONE QUESTION ONLY!
WHY DO ALL HOMOSEXUAL ORQANISATIONS IN ATHENS ALWAYS SUPPORT YOU?
DO YOU SERVE HOMOSEXUALS?
WHY I SEE ALL ALBANIAN WOMEN DATINQ ARYAN HELLENES?
IS THE REAL REASON THE SMALL ALBANIAN DICKS OR THEIR HOMOSEXUAL PREFERENCES?
BYE TURKOMAN ALBANIAN THIEF.
you are a true specimen of a kok starved gayrecian...arian greeks,,,please you all look like arabs with demented heads....arian what a joke.....
phd

Leiden, Netherlands

#21 Sep 26, 2008
Petros wrote:
Did Greeks and Slavs inter marry.
Do the children of mixed marriages claim ancestry from Greeks or from Slavs?
Yes of course. But one should not go deep into ancient times in order to prove this simple fact.

I know a couple that lives in Republic of Macedonia, the husband slavic speaking Macedonian and the wife Greek or if you want Greek speaking Macedonian from Thessalonica (her parents originally coming from Asia Minor). They have two boys. The kids are told by their parents that they are Macedonians. My question to you: is their identity correct (Macedonians) or it will be more suitable to call themselves North Macedonians or Slav Macedonians?

You know, nobody can stop our people intermarrying each other. There is something called LOVE, a word unfortunately never used on this forum.

Looking forward to your response,
phd
lol

Nijmegen, Netherlands

#22 Sep 26, 2008
do i see racism in the comments???
romane nomiza ta sinaspisthria den einai fasistes?

mono oi ellhnes exafanisthkan kai oi alloi emeinan katharoi...
einai mia "endiaferousa" theoria..p.s. even if greeks dissapeared that doesnt cancel that fact that ancient macedonians..were..if not were..considered themselves greeks..that nothing can change.
Romanos wrote:
<quoted text>
Vasei katagwghs, eimai sigouros oti esy eisai Alvanos kai Vlaxos, enw oi dikoi mou progonoi Rwmioi, dhladh Ellhnes. To katalaves re, gyfto?
the lie detector

Australia

#23 Sep 26, 2008
lol wrote:
do i see racism in the comments???
romane nomiza ta sinaspisthria den einai fasistes?
mono oi ellhnes exafanisthkan kai oi alloi emeinan katharoi...
einai mia "endiaferousa" theoria..p.s. even if greeks dissapeared that doesnt cancel that fact that ancient macedonians..were..if not were..considered themselves greeks..that nothing can change.
<quoted text>
hey watch your mouth mental case, i am a macedonian ......

and never will i put greek anything next to it.....

you were never macedonian, you are a programmed anatolian animal who wishes to be this great macedonian.....now get lost..

a real amcedonian knows that macedonians were never greek, it is the greeks who aspire to be macedonians, never the other way around...

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