created by: Triple C | Jun 23, 2011

Libya

1,131 votes

Will the Libyan rebels ever take Brega

Click on an option to vote

  • Yes
  • No
  • Only after NATO ground forces are in country

Comments (Page 121)

Showing posts 2,401 - 2,420 of2,572
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2445
Jan 18, 2013
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL The Africans rejected Qaddafi's plan way before fellow Africans killed him (1999 Qaddafi proposes plan, then twelve years pass and he gets killed by his own countrymen) even though Mugabe apparently now thinks Arab north Africans aren't real African's.
Naw, idiot. That is not a "Qaddafi Plan". It is an African Plan that was advocated by Abd al-Nasir and Kwame Nkrumah and Sekou Toure before Qaddafi too it up. In fact Marcus Garvey and W.E. Dubois and many others through Afircan history, especially in the African Diaspora advocated and promoted African Unifcation. Now Mugabe has picked it up. What I am trying to dumb down low enough for even you to understand is the fact that when Mugabe goes, there will be someone else. This is the nature of the reality. African Unification is an aspiration of All Africans everywhere. Therefore, it cannot be "decapitated". And it does not matter if one leader thinks another is not African enough or whatever the eff you are trying to suggest. Comrade Bob Mugabe is not a racst like you sick dogs. And if he was, that did not prevent him from accepting Chinese assistance against the illegal economic blockade imposed by the west. Furthermore, it is a known fact thaat Comrade Bob Mugabe regularly takes his vactions in Singaqpre and Malyasia. You want us to believe that he has racist sentiments against his fellow Africans who slightly ligher complexions? I won't buy it.
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>Next time you call someone racist look into a mirror so you can see what a racist really looks like and live by this saying, When you point your finger you got three more fingers pointing back at you!
Naw, fool. I am not a racist. I am a Pan-Africanist like Comrade Bob Mugabe. That means that the blacks and brown skin people in Africa will come together and unite against white western European racism. All of us are Africans. GOD Africa to us. Therefore, we Unite on the basis of our common interest in Africa. And racism has no place in our thought processes.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2446
Jan 18, 2013
 
Ditto Dog wrote:
<quoted text>
A united Africa is certainly a good idea and would definitely solve many of Africa's problems. But Gaddhafi was the wrong man to get this done and African leaders knew it. So they just played along with Gaddhafi, pretended to adore him and let themselves be invited to his fancy conventions and even declared him African King of Kings. Just so long as he kept paying the bills it was a great party.
But it always ended the moment they were supposed to give up power to Gaddhafi. They all knew that was a bad idea. African unity yes, but not with a mentally unstable tyrant ruling. In that way Black African leaders showed that they have common sense.
Why doesn't Nelson Mandela stand for African presidency?
It is you who has a fascist dctator mentality. You think Pan-Africanism means some kind of tyranny. That is the only insanity I see around here.

What Qaddafi did was convene the Assembly of the Kings of Africa. Due to his own noble/royal lineage, he was made King of Kings for that reason. But that did not mean that he would be a dictator. The highest Authority was the Assembly. In other words, Qaddafi could do nothing that the Assemby did approve of. Africa taught democracy to even you white racist dogs. So, African culture is absolutely democratic until you dogs get in the mix. Therefore, whenever Africa is independent, meaning that white man has been kicked out, African create democratic institutions, not dictatorships and fascism such as we have always seen come out of Europe.

Mandela is retired.
Triple C

East Alton, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2447
Jan 19, 2013
 
Abdurratln wrote:
<quoted text>
Naw, idiot. That is not a "Qaddafi Plan". It is an African Plan that was advocated by Abd al-Nasir and Kwame Nkrumah and Sekou Toure before Qaddafi too it up. In fact Marcus Garvey and W.E. Dubois and many others through Afircan history, especially in the African Diaspora advocated and promoted African Unifcation. Now Mugabe has picked it up. What I am trying to dumb down low enough for even you to understand is the fact that when Mugabe goes, there will be someone else. This is the nature of the reality. African Unification is an aspiration of All Africans everywhere. Therefore, it cannot be "decapitated". And it does not matter if one leader thinks another is not African enough or whatever the eff you are trying to suggest. Comrade Bob Mugabe is not a racst like you sick dogs. And if he was, that did not prevent him from accepting Chinese assistance against the illegal economic blockade imposed by the west. Furthermore, it is a known fact thaat Comrade Bob Mugabe regularly takes his vactions in Singaqpre and Malyasia. You want us to believe that he has racist sentiments against his fellow Africans who slightly ligher complexions? I won't buy it.
<quoted text>
Naw, fool. I am not a racist. I am a Pan-Africanist like Comrade Bob Mugabe. That means that the blacks and brown skin people in Africa will come together and unite against white western European racism. All of us are Africans. GOD Africa to us. Therefore, we Unite on the basis of our common interest in Africa. And racism has no place in our thought processes.
You not racist, LMFAO.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2448
Jan 19, 2013
 
Triple C wrote:
<quoted text>
You not racist, LMFAO.
Oh how intelectually stimulating you are. Yawn. UI am so effing bored I could scream.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2449
Jan 19, 2013
 
Gaddafi's Libya Africa's most prosperous democracy


12/01/2013 00:00:00

by Garikai Chengu



Thriving democracy ... Gaddafi with Mugabe



RELATED STORIES



Zimbabwe's land revolution a success

Obama fails Africans at home and abroad

The black man’s burden

US: From democracy to corporatocracy

Resource nationalism has US in retreat

Libya: scramble for arms deals, oil and water

Brazil model for Zim's regeneration

CONTRARY to popular belief, Libya, which western media described as "Gaddafi's military dictatorship", was in actual fact one of the world's most democratic States.

In 1977, the people of Libya proclaimed the Jamahiriya or "government of the popular masses by themselves and for themselves." The Jamahiriya was a higher form of direct democracy with 'the People as President.' Traditional institutions of government were disbanded and abolished, and power belonged to the people directly through various committees and congresses.

The nation state of Libya was divided into several small communities that were essentially "mini-autonomous States" within a State. These autonomous States had control over their districts and could make a range of decisions including how to allocate oil revenue and budgetary funds. Within these mini autonomous States, the three main bodies of Libya's democracy were Local Committees, People's Congresses and Executive Revolutionary Councils.

In 2009, Gaddafi invited the New York Times to Libya to spend two weeks observing the nation's direct democracy. Even the New York Times which was always highly critical of Colonel Gaddafi, conceded that in Libya, the intention was that “everyone is involved in every decision...Tens of thousands of people take part in local committee meetings to discuss issues and vote on everything from foreign treaties to building schools.” The purpose of these committee meetings was to build a broad based national consensus.

One step up from the Local Committees was the People's Congresses. Representatives from all 800 local committees around the country would meet several times a year at People's Congresses in Gaddafi's hometown of Sirte, to pass laws based on what the people said in their local meetings. These congresses had legislative power to write new laws, formulate economic and public policy as well as ratify treaties and agreements.

Continued below...

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2450
Jan 19, 2013
 
Continued from above...
All Libyans were allowed to take part in local committees meetings and at times Colonel Gaddafi was criticised. In fact, there were numerous occasions when his proposals were rejected by popular vote and the opposite was approved and put forward for legislation.

For instance, on many occasions Gaddafi proposed the abolition of capital punishment and he pushed for home schooling over traditional schools. However, the People's Congresses wanted to maintain the death penalty and classic schools, and ultimately the will of the People's Congresses prevailed. Similarly, in 2009, Colonel Gaddafi put forward a proposal to essentially abolish the central government altogether and give all the oil proceeds directly to each family. The People's Congresses rejected this idea too.

One step up from the People's Congresses were the Executive Revolutionary Councils. These Revolutionary Councils were elected by the People's Congresses and were in charge of implementing policies put forward by the people. Revolutionary Councils were accountable only to ordinary citizens and may have been changed or recalled by them at any time. Consequently, decisions taken by the People's Congresses and implemented by the Executive Revolutionary Councils reflected the sovereign will of the whole people, and not merely that of any particular class, faction, tribe or individual.
The Libyan direct democracy system utilised the word ‘elevation’ rather than ‘election’, and avoided the political campaigning that is a feature of traditional political parties and benefits only the bourgeoisie's well-heeled and well-to-do.

Unlike in the West, Libyans did not vote once every four years for a President and local parliamentarian who would then make all decisions for them. Ordinary Libyans made decisions regarding foreign, domestic and economic policy themselves.

Several western commentators have rightfully pointed out that the unique Jamahiriya system had certain drawbacks, inter alia, regarding attendance, initiative to speak up, and sufficient supervision. Nevertheless, it is clear that Libya conceptualised sovereignty and democracy in a different and progressive way.
Democracy is not just about elections or political parties. True democracy is also about human rights. During the NATO bombardment of Libya, western media conveniently forgot to mention that the United Nations had just prepared a lengthy dossier praising Gaddafi's human rights achievements.

The UN report commended Libya for bettering its "legal protections" for citizens, making human rights a "priority," improving women's rights, educational opportunities and access to housing. During Gaddafi's era housing was considered a human right. Consequently, there was virtually no homelessness or Libyans living under bridges. How many Libyan homes and bridges did NATO destroy?

One area where the United Nations Human Rights Council praised Gaddafi profusely is women's rights. Unlike many other nations in the Arab world, women in Libya had the right to education, hold jobs, divorce, hold property and have an income. When Colonel Gaddafi seized power in 1969, few women went to university. Today more than half of Libya's university students are women. One of the first laws Gaddafi passed in 1970 was an equal pay for equal work law, only a few years after a similar law was passed in the U.S. In fact, Libyan working mothers enjoyed a range of benefits including cash bonuses for children, free day care, free health care centres and retirement at 55.

Democracy is not merely about holding elections simply to choose which particular representatives of the elite class should rule over the masses. True democracy is about democratising the economy and giving economic power to the majority.

Continued below...

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2451
Jan 19, 2013
 
Continued from above...

Fact is, the west has shown that unfettered free markets and genuinely free elections simply cannot co-exist. Organised greed always defeats disorganized democracy. How can capitalism and democracy co-exist if one concentrates wealth and power in the hands of few, and the other seeks to spread power and wealth among many? Gaddafi's Jamahiriya however, sought to spread economic power amongst the downtrodden many rather than just the privileged few.

Prior to Colonel Gaddafi, King Idris let Standard Oil essentially write Libya’s petroleum laws. Gaddafi put an end to all of that. Money from oil proceeds was deposited directly into every Libyan citizen's bank account. One wonders if Exxon Mobil and British Petroleum will continue this practice under the new democratic Libya?
Democracy is not merely about elections or political parties. True democracy is also about equal opportunity through education and the right to life through access to health care. Therefore, isn't it ironic that America supposedly bombarded Libya to spread democracy, but increasingly education in America is becoming a privilege not a right and ultimately a debt sentence. If a bright and talented child in the richest nation on earth cannot afford to go to the best schools, society has failed that child. In fact, for young people the world over, education is a passport to freedom. Any nation that makes one pay for such a passport is only free for the rich but not the poor.
Under Mr. Gaddafi, education was a human right and it was free for all Libyans. If a Libyan was unable to find employment after graduation the State would pay that person the average salary of their profession.
For millions of Americans health care is also increasingly becoming a privilege not a right. A recent study by Harvard Medical School estimates that lack of health insurance causes 44,789 excess deaths annually in America. Under Gaddafi, health care was a human right and it was free for all Libyans. Thus, with regards to health care, education and economic justice, is America in any position to export democracy to Libya or should America have taken a leaf out of Libya's book?
Muammar Gaddafi inherited one of the poorest nations in Africa. However, by the time he was assassinated, Libya was unquestionably Africa's most prosperous nation. Libya had the highest GDP per capita and life expectancy in Africa and less people lived below the poverty line than in the Netherlands. Libyans did not only enjoy free health care and free education, they also enjoyed free electricity and interest free loans. The price of petrol was around $0.14 per liter and 40 loaves of bread cost just $0.15. Consequently, the UN designated Libya the 53rd highest in the world in human development.
The fundamental difference between western democratic systems and the Jamahiriya's direct democracy is that in Libya citizens were given the chance to contribute directly to the decision-making process, not merely through elected representatives. Hence, all Libyans were allowed to voice their views directly – not in one parliament of only a few hundred elite politicians – but in hundreds of committees attended by tens of thousands of ordinary citizens. Far from being a military dictatorship, Libya under Mr. Gaddafi was Africa's most prosperous democracy.
Garikai Chengu can be contacted at chengu@fas.harvard.edu
http://www.newzimbabwe.com/opinion-9990-Gadda...

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2452
Jan 19, 2013
 
Qaddafi was Pan-Africanist if memory serves me: http://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/sh...
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2453
Jan 24, 2013
 
Anyone up on this imminent threat on britons?Not welcomed as liberators it seems.Watched Hillary on tv almost break down today.Doesn't matter why they killed that US diplomat,we just have to learn.That's the problem with a woman in her powerful position.Put on the waterworks and everyone backs off asking the hard questions!Over here gillard just calls Abbott a sexist when parliament gets rough.At the end of the report on libya they said the next time we see Hillary she will be running for president.Is Ghaddafis wife still alive?She should run for president.
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2454
Jan 24, 2013
 
Check out the libya herald.lol.Jibril took off on a plane leaving the gnc president languishing in kufra,where I believe he was nearly killed in a hours long firefight,120 kids were in hospital some with missing fingers and serious burns,5 cars crashed from fireworks thrown at them.Code for grenades?lol.And westerners are overflowing in Tripoli airport trying to get out.lol.Must say I also missed the assassination attempt on the Italian ambassador.Teething problems I'm sure?.lol.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2455
Jan 24, 2013
 
arthur wrote:
Anyone up on this imminent threat on britons?Not welcomed as liberators it seems.Watched Hillary on tv almost break down today.Doesn't matter why they killed that US diplomat,we just have to learn.That's the problem with a woman in her powerful position.Put on the waterworks and everyone backs off asking the hard questions!Over here gillard just calls Abbott a sexist when parliament gets rough.At the end of the report on libya they said the next time we see Hillary she will be running for president.Is Ghaddafis wife still alive?She should run for president.
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2456
Jan 24, 2013
 
arthur wrote:
Check out the libya herald.lol.Jibril took off on a plane leaving the gnc president languishing in kufra,where I believe he was nearly killed in a hours long firefight,120 kids were in hospital some with missing fingers and serious burns,5 cars crashed from fireworks thrown at them.Code for grenades?lol.And westerners are overflowing in Tripoli airport trying to get out.lol.Must say I also missed the assassination attempt on the Italian ambassador.Teething problems I'm sure?.lol.
U.K: Imminent threat against Westerners in Benghazi

Britain's Foreign Office urged U.K. nationals to immediately leave
Britain's Foreign Office said it is aware of a "specific and imminent threat"
Warning follows Clinton's testimony on the deadly Sept. 11 attack on U.S. mission in Benghazi

LONDON (AP)— Britain urged its citizens Thursday to immediately leave the eastern Libyan city of Benghazi in response to what it described as an imminent threat against Westerners.

The warning comes a day after U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton testified to the Senate about a deadly September attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi that killed four Americans, including the ambassador to Libya. It also comes as French troops battle al-Qaida linked militants in Mali, and follows the deaths of dozens of foreigners at the hands of Islamist extremists in Algeria — though it remained unclear if those two events were linked to the U.K. warning about Libya.

Britain's Foreign Office on Thursday described the threat as "specific and imminent" and urged all British nationals still in Benghazi to "leave immediately."
( http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013... )

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2457
Jan 24, 2013
 

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2458
Jan 24, 2013
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch...

It is a "failure of leadership". It is failure of Obama's leadership. Obama should have never hired that b-word in the first place. And when she screwed up in Libya, Obama should have fired her months ago. This is why I did not vote for Obama.
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2459
Jan 24, 2013
 
Abdurratln wrote:
Rather bloodthirsty statement.In 50 years the kids of libya will look back at the Lynching of ghaddafi and wonder what type of people their grandparents were.I remember mutassim being filmed in a white singlet,drinking a bottle of water and the next second he is dead.Another war crime.It at least appears to have been quick.
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2460
Jan 24, 2013
 
Abdurratln wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =Xu9fq7B5crU&feature=playe r_detailpage
It is a "failure of leadership". It is failure of Obama's leadership. Obama should have never hired that b-word in the first place. And when she screwed up in Libya, Obama should have fired her months ago. This is why I did not vote for Obama.
He promised the world and delivered hardly anything.That Obamacare is the only good thing Ive seen him do.We have good healthcare for the poor.
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2461
Jan 25, 2013
 
Just thought i would check Wikipedia out as Libya had long ago lost interest for me and i would check what the actual death toll was.Needless to say i was surprised!lol. The deathtoll was 25k not 50k.Thats a lot different to what we were led to believe.50k wounded.17k soldiers defected.20k loyal.200k revos joined soldiers.Not quite overwhelming numbers.There were meant to be up to 50k people in underground prisons for a couple days there.Hmmmm.Im becoming a little suspicious i may have been fed some dubious info by a couple of dubious news channels.lol.
arthur

Australia

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2462
Jan 25, 2013
 
If you read interfactional infighting since the war ended it reads like mad max beyond thunderdome!With machineguns and rpgs though.lol.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2463
Jan 25, 2013
 
arthur wrote:
<quoted text>Rather bloodthirsty statement.In 50 years the kids of libya will look back at the Lynching of ghaddafi and wonder what type of people their grandparents were.
Yeah. I know. They were the kind of people who took orders from a sick queer and crazy monster like Hitlery. Nobody would havbe harmed Qaddafi if Hitlery had not given the green light if not direct orders. She was on the scene of the crime. I hope they put her on trial at the ICC.

Since: Aug 09

Saint Louis, MO

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2464
Jan 25, 2013
 
arthur wrote:
Just thought i would check Wikipedia out as Libya had long ago lost interest for me and i would check what the actual death toll was.Needless to say i was surprised!lol. The deathtoll was 25k not 50k.Thats a lot different to what we were led to believe.50k wounded.17k soldiers defected.20k loyal.200k revos joined soldiers.Not quite overwhelming numbers.There were meant to be up to 50k people in underground prisons for a couple days there.Hmmmm.Im becoming a little suspicious i may have been fed some dubious info by a couple of dubious news channels.lol.
They always doctor the numbers. That cannot be trusted. The best we can do is say, "wikipedia said".

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Showing posts 2,401 - 2,420 of2,572
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:
Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

•••
•••
•••
•••