What Can Washington Do About Iran?

Dec 6, 2012 Full story: Mother Jones 165

The current U.S. strategy is not exactly a raging success-perhaps detente rather than military power is how we might breach that Wall of Mistrust with Iran.

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“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#104 Dec 12, 2012
Force Majeure

Sweden

#105 Dec 12, 2012
Kenhunt wrote:
<quoted text>
Maybe you are not Catholic...
I'm an ex-Catholic, Kenny. I now believe in the state, chairman Mao, Al Qaida, the all-mighty Euro, and the demise of the United Snakes.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#106 Dec 12, 2012
Force Majeure wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm an ex-Catholic, Kenny. I now believe in the state, chairman Mao, Al Qaida, the all-mighty Euro, and the demise of the United Snakes.
I am a Catholic. I believe in nothing you listed, even tongue in cheek. I do believe in nothing, of course.
Force Majeure

Sweden

#107 Dec 12, 2012
Kenhunt wrote:
<quoted text>
I do believe in nothing, of course.
You've just described yourself.

"Bless him Father for he has sinned ...."

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#108 Dec 12, 2012
Force Majeure wrote:
<quoted text>
You've just described yourself.
"Bless him Father for he has sinned ...."
Do you not believe in nothing?
Force Majeure

Sweden

#109 Dec 12, 2012
Kenhunt wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you not believe in nothing?
I've never been comfortable speaking in double negatives.

I believe in socialism (the democratic sort that we once had in Sweden) Olaf Palme, Alexander Dubcek, Mikael Gorbatjov, Nelson Mandela, Martin Luther King, the possibility of the EU succeeding, the destruction of the American capitalist system, that puppy dogs will cry at my funeral and that my wife and children will remember me as a good man.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#110 Dec 12, 2012
Perhaps if I capitalize "Nothing" you will better understand the question/statement. Try this. It is impossible that at one time nothing existed, because if that we so there'd have been no laws. With no laws nothing would have been prohibited.

I suppose socialism can work on a small scale like Sweden. After all, its population is less than some US metropolitan areas. There are more people of Swedish descent in the USA than in Sweden. I think its economic position is tenuous, as is that of the EU collectively. Probably going OK for the King, eh.

As for ol' Olaf, not much he can do for Sweden now.

I like Gorby, too. He helped kill the Soviet Union, bugged out and embraced capitalism by getting rich giving speeches and writing books.

Mandela suffered terribly and showed great courage. He served with distinction. Our own Martin Luther King shares certain aspects with Mandela. King was a man I admired as a teen.

The EU's possibility of succeeding is about the same as its possibility of failing. I hope it hangs on.

The American system is approaching 240 years old, and for most of those years some, like you, hoped it would fail. It fooled them as it has you. Its contributions to humankind are amazing and many: http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap120518.html If you want, I can list a few.

I too hope your wife and children will remember you.

I would tell you what else I believe in, but it seems from your previous posts that you know, or think you do, to the degree you think.
Force Majeure

Sweden

#111 Dec 12, 2012
Kenhunt wrote:
Perhaps if I capitalize "Nothing" you will better understand the question/statement. Try this. It is impossible that at one time nothing existed, because if that we so there'd have been no laws. With no laws nothing would have been prohibited.
You're thinking in mere 3-dimensional limitations and we don't how many dimensions your "NOTHING" was - or what it might be in a possible after life.
Kenhunt wrote:
I suppose socialism can work on a small scale like Sweden. After all, its population is less than some US metropolitan areas.
Size has absolutely nothing to do with it. It is simply the will of people to see the greater picture of humanity and the value of a materialistic existance. Social-Democracy isn't confined to Sweden, don't you know. Rather all of Scandinavia ..... plus Germany, etc.
Kenhunt wrote:
There are more people of Swedish descent in the USA than in Sweden.
A point that has neither relevance nor actual fact.
Kenhunt wrote:
I like Gorby, too. He helped kill the Soviet Union
Gorbatjov did not help kill the USSR. He, as Alexander Dubcek before him, gave socialism/communism an opportunity to increase its level of democracy. It was neither's wish to kill the principle's of socialist philosophy.
Kenhunt wrote:
The American system is approaching 240 years old, and for most of those years some, like you, hoped it would fail. It fooled them as it has you.
No one is "fooled". As the U.S. increases its treacherous deeds so too will its demise be sooner coming.

The problem with American, simplified rhetoric is that it indocrinates a "black or white" "with us or against us" philosphy. It fails to recognise the colour "grey" and that black becomes white when blended with lighter colours. I would have expected you to understand that already and I'm disappointed that you don't.
Kenhunt wrote:
I would tell you what else I believe in, but it seems from your previous posts that you know,
Try it. You may surprise me. You've already surprised me with a non-slanderous reply.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#112 Dec 12, 2012
On the subject of nothing, you know nothing, obviously.

Size has much to do with it, that and the diversity of the population. One of the problems I see in Europeans when they opine about the USA is, they have almost no grasp of the size and diversity here. We are the third most populous nation on earth. We are the most ethnically diverse nation on earth.

Our government is far more than the federal level: every city, town, county, and state has a hierarchy of government. Our infrastructure is huge, yet one is almost inevitably within an easy drive of a fine university, a good hospital, emergency services, an airport, a nature preserve, all kinds of recreation, a river, stream, or lake.

Our population is every color, every race, every religion or lack thereof, many languages, different cultures, mixed in every way. If you look for grey in our people, it is easy to find. We have not forcefully purged ourselves of people we don't like as so much of Europe has done. We are different and we are fused (like our cuisine).

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#113 Dec 12, 2012
You fantasy world of socialism in Europe seeing the greater picture of humanity is some kind of a joke! Look at Sweden in WWII, selling iron to the Nazis, providing its rails to the wehrmacht to transport its soldiers on. Meantime, the USA had to send soldiers 7000 miles from their homes to fight the Third Reich. Right outside your door your own neighbors are frightened of the increasing size of your Islamic immigrants, of increasing gang rapes, and crime! Antisemitism lies just under the surface in Germany even today. I have lived in Europe and you can have it, if anything is left after it is over populated with Muslims and run aground in socialist policies it cannot pay for.

We shall not agree about Gorby or about the virtues of socialism. It seems we do agree about the value of democracy, even in a kingdom.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#114 Dec 12, 2012
Over 400,000 Americans died in the defense of western Europe. America put together NATO that deterred the Soviets and in a large part brought down the wall an took the Soviet boot off of the necks of eastern Europe. In so doing it many have show a greater compassion than, say, Sweden's cowards and profiteers.

Our contributions to humankind go beyond the sacrifices we made on the battlefields (yes, I agree that in recent history that is an uneven subject. I said I disagreed with the second Gulf War, for instance, as I do with Vietnam).

Our contributions in medicine have saved and is saving countless lives around the globe. Our medical schools are renowned, as our universities which we have hundreds of and many ranked as among the very best in the world. Our contributions in agriculture have saved a billion lives, both with improved farming techniques and improved crops. Our contributions in the aviation industry are without equal. Our space exploration has given the world all kinds of knowledge about our planets, moons, asteroids, and our universe. Most of what your kids learned about modern astronomy came from our efforts, provided free to the world.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#115 Dec 12, 2012
America has won over 300 Nobel prizes, most of which were ground-breaking discoveries from the quantum world to distant worlds.

We have gone from our days of slavery, a civil war in which more Americans died than in any other war, rampant racism, and division, to having a President like Obama (you must like him as he is as close to a socialist President as we will have).

Our ideals have inspired others around the world, and those ideals are what I like best about the USA. We surely do not always realize them at any given time, but we try to stay on course.

We are the most charitable nation on earth. I am not referring so much to what our government gives for HIV research and protection in Africa, nor to the help we provide other nations struck by disasters. I refer to individual charity provided around the globe by our NGOS, our churches, and by individuals. That comes to just under 300 billion dollars a year!

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#116 Dec 12, 2012
On my street where I live we have a Korean family, a 2d generation family of Indian heritage, a black family with a Muslim father, a family from Hawaii, a Russian-born man and his American-born wife, a very young couple, and a couple of geezers like me. And we are all friends.

I encourage you to not rely on TV or the movies to try and understand us. Come and visit. See Hawaii, Alaska, our coasts, our mountains, our Cajuns and Creoles, our Orientals, our blacks, our Jews, Christians, Muslims, agnostics, atheists, small businesses, great rivers, and just everyday living. Spend time here.

I have in fact been to Sweden, a lovely place but too dark and cold for me too much of the time. I saw some beautiful women! Then again, I have lived in Hawaii and seen beautiful women too. I once picked up a new Saab there and I lament the end of that marque.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#117 Dec 12, 2012
I encourage you to see the USA in whole and in person, its contributions to the world, its beauty and its ugliness, and then appraise it. I wish you and your family happiness and health and whatever kind of government and economic system you want.
bohart

Newport, TN

#118 Dec 12, 2012
Force Majeure wrote:
<quoted text>
You're thinking in mere 3-dimensional limitations and we don't how many dimensions your "NOTHING" was - or what it might be in a possible after life.
<quoted text>
Size has absolutely nothing to do with it. It is simply the will of people to see the greater picture of humanity and the value of a materialistic existance. Social-Democracy isn't confined to Sweden, don't you know. Rather all of Scandinavia ..... plus Germany, etc.
<quoted text>
A point that has neither relevance nor actual fact.
<quoted text>
Gorbatjov did not help kill the USSR. He, as Alexander Dubcek before him, gave socialism/communism an opportunity to increase its level of democracy. It was neither's wish to kill the principle's of socialist philosophy.
<quoted text>
No one is "fooled". As the U.S. increases its treacherous deeds so too will its demise be sooner coming.
The problem with American, simplified rhetoric is that it indocrinates a "black or white" "with us or against us" philosphy. It fails to recognise the colour "grey" and that black becomes white when blended with lighter colours. I would have expected you to understand that already and I'm disappointed that you don't.
<quoted text>
Try it. You may surprise me. You've already surprised me with a non-slanderous reply.
Good post , it has a ring of wisdom to it ,years ago we did value humanity but today? We know the price of everything and the value of nothing, we were once a Democratic republic but are now run by corporate capitalists. Sad but true, when a nation is 16 trillion dollars in debt,wages constant warfare , has it's military in 140 nations around the globe with over 700 foreign bases it doesn't take a crystal ball to see the outcome, just a history book.

Since: Aug 12

Izmir, Turkey

#119 Dec 12, 2012
You cannot do anything to iran . Why you'r bothering , necause of they have weapons ? ;Who is you ?:) why you have weapons ? are you police of the world ?

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#120 Dec 12, 2012
B_Girl_Turco wrote:
You cannot do anything to iran . Why you'r bothering , necause of they have weapons ? ;Who is you ?:) why you have weapons ? are you police of the world ?
What one can do is different from what one may do. If one really thought it necessary, Iran could be obliterated. But who in their right mind would kill millions upon millions of innocent people, kids, women, elderly, noncombatants? The US could in a few blinding flashes end Iran forever, but doing so would change the world for the worse, almost forever. Sadly, Iran seems to think having a nuke would deter such an event, when IMHO it paints a big bullseye on Iran. It is all a disgrace to humankind.

We have weapons in large part because of the history of the world since about 1916. Read up on it. We have weapons because not everyone is rational, and because some folks would do the unthinkable. On 9-11 some folks murdered 3000 people, almost all ordinary innocent people, from over 100 countries. Our weapons did not deter that.

In the long run, the worst weapon seems to be the ordinary gun, the AK47, the M16 and such, which kill people every day. How do you think the world should be policed? I wonder if it might be possible to rid the world of all weapons. Do you think that would be a good idea? Would you start with your own country?

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#121 Dec 12, 2012
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Good post , it has a ring of wisdom to it ,years ago we did value humanity but today? We know the price of everything and the value of nothing, we were once a Democratic republic but are now run by corporate capitalists. Sad but true, when a nation is 16 trillion dollars in debt,wages constant warfare , has it's military in 140 nations around the globe with over 700 foreign bases it doesn't take a crystal ball to see the outcome, just a history book.
When has history ever known the value of humanity? In the macro sense, never. Individually, forever. I think by and large we know the value of love, compassion, family, community, charity, good, sacrifice, truth, and such. Have you lost sight of that?

We are a democratic republic and are not run by corporations any more now than 200 years ago. I do wonder as you imply if we are first capitalists, then democracies or visa versa. And I lament our failed news reporting and our less than stellar education system below college level.

I agree we are over extended militarily by some factor, maybe half, so I voted for Obama as it seems he shares that opinion; beyond that motive, I would have preferred a different candidate as he is too socialist for comfort given our current debt.

That 700 bases thing has floated around on line for years, but in fact our presence in Europe is a fraction of what it was just 20 years ago (it ought to be zero, I think); the 700 includes things like housing areas for families, recruiting stations around the US, reserve armories, PX/commissary facilities, and other nonmilitary or administrative posts with a handfull of people. Many major US bases have closed, as have many abroad. Look up the facts.

Since you lament our debt, as any thinking person would, I am surprised you applaud as wisdom someone who supports socialism, which is rapidly proving as unsustainable in Europe as our own many social programs are here. Socialist European countries like Spain, Grease, Portugal, and others are on the brink, and the Euro is teetering.

Since: Dec 11

Fort Worth, TX

#122 Dec 12, 2012
Force Majeure wrote:
Considering the history of discord beginning with the CIA destruction of the Democratic government of Iran with "Operation TP Ajax" and Washington's intimidation and out-right hostile attitude towards Iran every since, then the real question might be ....... "What Can Tehran Do About the U.S.?
Not much. We're bigger and more powerful.

“bless the USA”

Since: Apr 07

Location hidden

#123 Dec 12, 2012
It also counted every embassy with Marine guards and places where we had less than ten military present!

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