Who are darker, Greeks, Spaniards or ...

Who are darker, Greeks, Spaniards or Italians?

Created by Alessandro DiVincenzi on Sep 30, 2008

19,069 votes

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Greeks

Spaniards

Italians

Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#497 Sep 12, 2009
SeeYouReallyDumb wrote:
LOL
Spaniards are becoming the new nazis because of that R1b they like so much talking about.
LOL
Many N.Italians carry on a greater amount of R1b than some spaniards,and North Italy is one of the richest place in Europe..now they will come to say it is because of spaniards..lol
Unfortunately for spanish,germans are richer than everybody else in Europe and they carry less R1b than some southern Italians.
Now beyond the fact that genetic is not a precise science and that after the first impressions many genetists started to say that Iberia is not the birth place of R1b because it lacks the oldest R1b haplogroups which are instead present in North Italy...lol
What makes spaniards believe people think that is so important have a big amount of R1B??
At the end the greatest cultures in history were never born in Spain.
To be real Spain has never given nothing to Europe to be proud of.
Stop, already... You are being emotional and don't really have the facts straight. Do you even know that the E3b subclades found in Iberia are native origin Berber and very ancient? Are you aware that the original Berbers were / are (what's left of them) Eurasian (White, not Arabic). Please educate yourself a bit. No one here is putting down Italians or any one else. I certainly am not. I'm not even Iberian, I'm Irish, but I know Spain and Portugal extremely well (and Italy too), having lived and worked in both countries for many years. Clam down and learn the facts.

The oldest DNA in Europe is found in Iberia. That in and of itself means nothing to anybody, but it is a fact. Spaniards and Portuguese are heavily Paleolithic, and likely the most direct descendants of Cro-Magnon (the first "Europeans"). Just a fact, that all.
Mark-Norway

Barcelona, Spain

#498 Sep 13, 2009
Yes spaniards are much seriuos than italians no doubt. The only thing anyone has to do to prove it is to read your post here all full of nonsenses.You have said so many clownish nonsenses (very Berlusconi -like)that I am not even taking the effort to answer them. LOL!
Mark-Norway

Barcelona, Spain

#499 Sep 13, 2009
Of course my last comment is addressed to the Real Dumb italian. Hey pal, good nick. It defines you pretty well!!
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#500 Sep 15, 2009
SeeYouReallyDumb wrote:
Quote
"Spaniards are more serious than italians"
LOL
Is that because spaniards have nothing to be happy since their country is going down as any other country in Europe before??
Quote
"North Italians are similar to spaniards central southern italians are similar to middle easterns"
LOL

As if we were speaking about spanish being germans and a point of arrival..lol
In my point of view J2 of southern italians make you not more middleastern that a nice 40% e-m81 of some northern spaniards make them africans.
At the end J2 is greco-roman\etruscan and it is present in almost every european country whilst e-m81 is a completely different thing and it is almost non-existant in Europe save Spain.
Nuff said.
Strange post. Who said anything about Spaniards being Germanic? Iberians (Spaniards and Portuguese) have Germanic strains, but they are pretty minor. Found more in the territories controlled by the Swabians dating back to the early 5th century - central west and north west Spain and Portugal.

You need to seriously educate yourself on genetics and history.
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#501 Sep 15, 2009
SeeYouReallyDumb wrote:
LOL
Spaniards are becoming the new nazis because of that R1b they like so much talking about.
LOL
Many N.Italians carry on a greater amount of R1b than some spaniards,and North Italy is one of the richest place in Europe..now they will come to say it is because of spaniards..lol
Unfortunately for spanish,germans are richer than everybody else in Europe and they carry less R1b than some southern Italians.
Now beyond the fact that genetic is not a precise science and that after the first impressions many genetists started to say that Iberia is not the birth place of R1b because it lacks the oldest R1b haplogroups which are instead present in North Italy...lol
What makes spaniards believe people think that is so important have a big amount of R1B??
At the end the greatest cultures in history were never born in Spain.
To be real Spain has never given nothing to Europe to be proud of.
How can you possibly say that genetics is not a precise science? What a silly comment. Genetics is about as precise a science as there is. DNA does not lie. Yes, no question, there are badly structured genetic studies. However, overall, the haplogroup research has been so thorough and accurate that any reasonably informed person is usually sanguine with the conclusions reached.

It's hard to understand the purpose of such a scattered post. Your words come off as nothing more an illogical put-down of Spaniards (indeed, all Iberians). What is your point?
Mark-Norway

Spain

#502 Sep 16, 2009
Wesleyanum wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you possibly say that genetics is not a precise science? What a silly comment. Genetics is about as precise a science as there is. DNA does not lie. Yes, no question, there are badly structured genetic studies. However, overall, the haplogroup research has been so thorough and accurate that any reasonably informed person is usually sanguine with the conclusions reached.
It's hard to understand the purpose of such a scattered post. Your words come off as nothing more an illogical put-down of Spaniards (indeed, all Iberians). What is your point?
His point is very clear and you already mentioned it: putting down Spain and spaniards.As simple as that.

This is the same italian guy that has been writting stupid comments before under other equally stupid nicks saying big nonsenses as that spaniards are moorish while italians are germanic and viking (Hahaha!...what a moron!). Believe me he is not interested at all in what genetics, anthropology or history have to say. He will deny them all. He is only a troll.

It seems to me there are a lot of italians like this poor guy here very jealous and envious about spaniards and Spain and I can understand it taking into account the present situation of total decadence in Italy about industry, economics, politics, civil rights, mafia, corruption, sex scandals, etc...besides they have a circus clown as a prime minister that is the shame of all Europe to whom they vote again and again, and again...It seems every italian wants to be like him so they must be as clownish as him!LOL!
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#503 Sep 16, 2009
Mark-Norway wrote:
<quoted text>
His point is very clear and you already mentioned it: putting down Spain and spaniards.As simple as that.
This is the same italian guy that has been writting stupid comments before under other equally stupid nicks saying big nonsenses as that spaniards are moorish while italians are germanic and viking (Hahaha!...what a moron!). Believe me he is not interested at all in what genetics, anthropology or history have to say. He will deny them all. He is only a troll.
It seems to me there are a lot of italians like this poor guy here very jealous and envious about spaniards and Spain and I can understand it taking into account the present situation of total decadence in Italy about industry, economics, politics, civil rights, mafia, corruption, sex scandals, etc...besides they have a circus clown as a prime minister that is the shame of all Europe to whom they vote again and again, and again...It seems every italian wants to be like him so they must be as clownish as him!LOL!
Yes, Berslusconi is a corrupt, mendacious mountebank who is an embarrassment not only to Italy but the entire E.U. as well. He makes "W" look good by comparison (thought I would never say something like that). An old, dried up superficial little man, concerned only with assuaging his primal insecurities and consolidating power. It's unfortunate, Italy is a wonderful country but clearly deteriorating badly on many levels.
Ann

Greece

#504 Sep 19, 2009
Dont say that..I'm a Greek and i have pale skin,brown eyes n' hair..it doesn't matter where are you from but your DNA.
I have seen Poles who have blue eyes blonde hair and dark skin...
Also,I think the Spaniards have dark complexion...most of mexicans,are from Spain..Of course,there are many people in Spain who have fair and pale skin...
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#505 Sep 19, 2009
Ann wrote:
Dont say that..I'm a Greek and i have pale skin,brown eyes n' hair..it doesn't matter where are you from but your DNA.
I have seen Poles who have blue eyes blonde hair and dark skin...
Also,I think the Spaniards have dark complexion...most of mexicans,are from Spain..Of course,there are many people in Spain who have fair and pale skin...
"Most of the Mexicans are from Spain???? Do you have any idea what you are talking about? Have you ever been to Spain or Portugal? Do you know the genetic and historical FACTS (not myth. distortion and fantasy) about Iberia? Are you even cognizant that Spain and Portugal had the greatest Celtic saturation of any area in Europe? Educate yourself, PLEASE!! You read VERY, VERY foolish...
Mark-Norway

Terrassa, Spain

#506 Sep 20, 2009
Ann wrote:
Dont say that..I'm a Greek and i have pale skin,brown eyes n' hair..it doesn't matter where are you from but your DNA.
I have seen Poles who have blue eyes blonde hair and dark skin...
Also,I think the Spaniards have dark complexion...most of mexicans,are from Spain..Of course,there are many people in Spain who have fair and pale skin...
So now spaniards have a dark complexion because.. most of mexicans,are from Spain!. Hahaha! My God, what a nonsence!

First of all spaniards dont have a darker complexion than an average european. It depends which people you compare spaniards with. If you compare spaniards with norwegians or swedes, yes they have a darker complexion, if you compare them with british or germans, they are only sligthly darker, if you compare them with portuguese, french or italians, they have the same complexion, if you compare them with turcs or greeks they are slightly lighter...so spaniards have on average a typical european complexion no doubt.

Now dear Ann, I recommend you to read more about the subject as you are clearly ignorant about many facts: In Mexico there are only about a 10% of white people direct descendants of the ancient spaniards, 30% are pure indian native without any spanish blood, and 60% are mestizo of indian and spaniard.

Exception made of a few countries like Argentina, Uruguay or Chile, there is a minority of people with european ancestry in the rest of latin american countries. Only a very reduced minority of latin americans resemble europeans, while the vast majority of them have clear mongoloid (indian) and mestizo traits.
Gio

Mastic Beach, NY

#507 Sep 24, 2009
Greek and Sicilian is the best mix you can have. We're stonger than eva smater the eva and got the best looks.
-represent Long Island, NY all day every day
Zazzaglia

Smithtown, NY

#508 Sep 29, 2009
italians and the greeks seem to be more olive greener to me than the spanish and portugese.but the portugese are definetly the darkest,as a whole population.overall there skin is darkest.
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#509 Sep 29, 2009
Zazzaglia wrote:
italians and the greeks seem to be more olive greener to me than the spanish and portugese.but the portugese are definetly the darkest,as a whole population.overall there skin is darkest.
I totally disagree. I have lived and worked in Portugal (and Spain) for many years and Portuguese, on average, have the same skin tone as Spaniards and are lighter than Italians and Greeks. I'm not exactly sure what "Portuguese" people you are referring to. People in the Algarve (far south) are about as dark as Southern Spaniards and Southern Italians. If you are referring to mulattos or other "colonial" mixtures in Portugal (or any other country) they are NOT NATIVE ORIGIN ETHNIC Portuguese (or any other European people). Have you ever travelled throughout Portugal? Three quarters of the country is of Celtic heritage. Take a good look at what REAL ethnic Portuguese look like. There are plenty of examples out there. Case closed.
Mark-Norway

Spain

#510 Sep 30, 2009
Wesleyanum wrote:
<quoted text>
I totally disagree. I have lived and worked in Portugal (and Spain) for many years and Portuguese, on average, have the same skin tone as Spaniards and are lighter than Italians and Greeks. I'm not exactly sure what "Portuguese" people you are referring to. People in the Algarve (far south) are about as dark as Southern Spaniards and Southern Italians. If you are referring to mulattos or other "colonial" mixtures in Portugal (or any other country) they are NOT NATIVE ORIGIN ETHNIC Portuguese (or any other European people). Have you ever travelled throughout Portugal? Three quarters of the country is of Celtic heritage. Take a good look at what REAL ethnic Portuguese look like. There are plenty of examples out there. Case closed.
Sure!. Besides I will never get tired of saying that skin pigmentation has NOTHING to do with race: It doesnt talk about your origins, while genetics does. Every genetist knows this, but people continue and continue thinking about ethnic origin based of skin tone...It is boring!.
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#511 Sep 30, 2009
Mark-Norway wrote:
<quoted text>
Sure!. Besides I will never get tired of saying that skin pigmentation has NOTHING to do with race: It doesnt talk about your origins, while genetics does. Every genetist knows this, but people continue and continue thinking about ethnic origin based of skin tone...It is boring!.
Indeed! It is beyond boring... It's actually ignorant and somewhat comical. Not only that, most people don't have a clue about ethnicity and go by ridiculous stereotypes - Most Germans are blond, Most Iberians are Arab, most Irish are red heads... Such freaking stupidity!... LOL!
Mark-Norway

Spain

#512 Sep 30, 2009
Wesleyanum wrote:
<quoted text>
Indeed! It is beyond boring... It's actually ignorant and somewhat comical. Not only that, most people don't have a clue about ethnicity and go by ridiculous stereotypes - Most Germans are blond, Most Iberians are Arab, most Irish are red heads... Such freaking stupidity!... LOL!
Iberians Arab?. Hahaha! anyone saying that is already quite ignorant and stupid!

But if you think people is stupid look here for more real freaking stupidity!.

http://www.topix.com/forum/world/europe/THGL8...

In this thread believe me people surpasses the limit of stupidness like in a Guiness record!
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#513 Sep 30, 2009
Mark-Norway wrote:
<quoted text>
Iberians Arab?. Hahaha! anyone saying that is already quite ignorant and stupid!
But if you think people is stupid look here for more real freaking stupidity!.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/europe/THGL8...
In this thread believe me people surpasses the limit of stupidness like in a Guiness record!
I think some of the cretins posting on that thread are way beyond stupid. No wonder our world is such a freaking mess, look at the incredibly low quality of people we have.
Nicholas

Williamsburg, VA

#514 Oct 1, 2009
Wesleyanum wrote:
<quoted text>
Stop, already... You are being emotional and don't really have the facts straight. Do you even know that the E3b subclades found in Iberia are native origin Berber and very ancient? Are you aware that the original Berbers were / are (what's left of them) Eurasian (White, not Arabic). Please educate yourself a bit. No one here is putting down Italians or any one else. I certainly am not. I'm not even Iberian, I'm Irish, but I know Spain and Portugal extremely well (and Italy too), having lived and worked in both countries for many years. Clam down and learn the facts.
The oldest DNA in Europe is found in Iberia. That in and of itself means nothing to anybody, but it is a fact. Spaniards and Portuguese are heavily Paleolithic, and likely the most direct descendants of Cro-Magnon (the first "Europeans"). Just a fact, that all.
some of the oldest but not entirely true. while some of the most ancient colonies are in spain, greece was settled well before by egyptian mesopotamian and asia minor tribes. just know the oldest human settlement of europe is on the island of lemnos greece of the coast of turkey. which is pretty cool cause my parents are from there. which also explains why i got a bin laden beard
Mark-Norway

Spain

#515 Oct 1, 2009
Nicholas wrote:
<quoted text> some of the oldest but not entirely true. while some of the most ancient colonies are in spain, greece was settled well before by egyptian mesopotamian and asia minor tribes. just know the oldest human settlement of europe is on the island of lemnos greece of the coast of turkey. which is pretty cool cause my parents are from there. which also explains why i got a bin laden beard
Dear Nicholas: Greeks are the most modern mediterranean peoples because they have some of the most recent genetic influences, like those ethiopians I already mentioned here:

http://www.topix.com/forum/afam/TNPLQF0N9GFQM...

It has been extensively proven that specially southern greeks have close genetic links with sub-Saharan populations from Ethiopia (Amhara, Oromo), Sudan (Nuba) and West Africa (Rimaibe, Fulani, Mossi, due to a recent massive migration from Ethiopia to Greece, dating the pharaonic times. Just read the whole report here:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11260506 ...

Other genetists arrive exacly to the same conclusions: See how Edwards et Al. cluster southern greeks as Somalids instead of europids.

http://thegeneticatlas.com/study_edwards.htm

As you can see Spaniards cluster well inside the Europid pie, while italians (and particularly sicilians) although they also cluster as europids, they are much closer related to greeks and arabids (semitic peoples). Southern Greeks dont even cluster as europids but as somalids (due to ethiopian massive migration into Greece).

On the other hand, Macedonians are much older. Now, could I expect you will be rational about this or you will continue insulting in this thread also as you usually do when some statement irritates you but you are unable to refute the argument rationally?
Wesleyanum

Alexandria, VA

#516 Oct 1, 2009
Nicholas wrote:
<quoted text> some of the oldest but not entirely true. while some of the most ancient colonies are in spain, greece was settled well before by egyptian mesopotamian and asia minor tribes. just know the oldest human settlement of europe is on the island of lemnos greece of the coast of turkey. which is pretty cool cause my parents are from there. which also explains why i got a bin laden beard
A "B-L beard"? That's a hard burden to bear, my friend.

I should have said "oldest in Western Europe." However, evidence suggests that the first Cro-Magnon in Europe settled in Iberia and actually may have mated somewhat with the Neanderthals.

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