If the Jews ever Knew!

[ZinbadAlive]

The major turning point in how the government of the military officers handled the Egyptian Jewry took place after the Trio Aggression done by Britain, France & Israel in 1956.

This War was a proper justification for the presence of collateral coordination between the British/French desire to maintain Egypt as a colony and the Zionist threat coming from Israel, the Egyptian authorities believed in this conspiracy.

On October 31 evening to November the 1 st in 1956, a big number of Jews were randomly arrested, their financial possessions put under governmental custody (freezed), and a governmental department was assigned to monitor every Jewish assets in the Egyptian lands.

Then the Egyptian government issued Orders to every British/French subject to leave Egypt, many of those having British/French passports were Jews. Also Orders were given to every Jewish subject without any nationality/passport/ID card to leave Egypt.

Inspite of this expulsion, there were about 21000 Jews still present in Egypt in Autumn 1957, a year after the 1956 War. The number of Jews who were still in Egypt during the 6 Day War in 1967 was about 7000 person. Presently only 300 Jews are still in Egypt.

Numbers speak for its significance, they shockingly reveal the difficulty of being belonging to a given minority when the country pass through a Crisis.

When Egypt had most of its Jewry (locals plus foreign) expuled assuming they don't have a choice but to go to Israel, Egypt was in contradiction with its rejection of having a place to a Jewish population to live in.

Then, we observe that most of those who left to Israel were of the poorest class of the Egyptian Jewry, while most of the well-off Egyptian Jews preferred to settle in either Europe or America.

According to the Egyptian Government policy of Nationalizing/Egyptianizing every economic resource/activity, it had to get rid of all the social groups which refused to merge with the rest of the society. The Egyptian Jews were not the only group which suffered from this squeezing policies done by the Egyptian government but they were the most affected group with such policies.

Pages 98&99
Chapter # 3
Egyptian Jewry in 19 & 20 th Centuries
by
Gudrun Kramer & Alfred Morabia

To be Continued

[ZinbadAlive]

Chapter # 3; Egyptian Jewry face to face with Modernization:

Summary of Chapter # 3:

The Egyptian Jewry lived through the conversion process with all of its consequences;
It began its very preliminary steps within the Egyptian society in the 19 th century.
By the influence of Europe and for its own behalf, the Egyptian economy witnessed fast changes for modernization which were accompanied with a considerable Jewish community surfacing atop the Egyptian society.

This rising affluent Jewish community though only a marginal sector of the Egyptian society; it kept drifting away from the rest of its surroundings as it was too much westernized.

The modernization in agriculture, the growth of cities, modernization of both education and administrative services, all of these fast changes resulted in enhancing the social competition between the Muslims, Copts & the Jews of Egypt.

The Egyptian Jewry felt that it became a victim of the political circumstances, especially when the Zionist movement was revising its stand towards the merger of the Jewish Arabs with the rest of the populations of their home countries.

The Egyptian Jewry had to take a decisive and also hard choice, several options were at hand at that time. The AntiZionist attitude among the Arabs was growing, it had different reasons based on their own visions, from Muslim Brotherhoods to Communists.

This lead to a revival of a prejudice against the Jews considering them as nonMuslims and they are "different/others". With no doubt, this is due to political/economic reasons.

All of the "Nationalist" movements which were against the colonial system considered the Jews as the most benefiting from the foreign control over the Egyptian economy, and also considered the Jews as built-in supporters of a Zionist State which the West will transplant into the Arabs' lands.

The Palestinian problem was used by these ideologically diverse Nationalist movements to feed the anti Jewish attitude as it united these factions with a common cause!

The Arabs' anti Zionist attitude, and in fact it wasn't free from anti Jewish attitude too, Must theoretically disappear with solving the Palestinian problem,
as we can not confirm from the study of the history of the Egyptian Jewry that wherever the Jews exist anti Semitism also exist.

Pages 99 & 100
Chapter # 3
Egyptian Jewry in 19 & 20 th Centuries
by
Gudrun Kramer & Alfred Morabia

" Histoire des Juifs du Nil "

by

Jacques Hassoun
1990, Minerve

To be Continued

[ZinbadAlive]

When it was half of the Century:

By Eglal Aurira
(Born in Alexandria, Egypt, in 1950. In 1962, she migrated to France to continue her studies)

In the 19 th century; Egypt was influenced by Shiekh " Gamal El Din ", an Afgan intellectual who traveled through most of the MidEast calling for a Revival of the Islamic Civilization. Then comes the influence done by one of his Egyptian students, Shiekh " Mohammed Abedu ". The efforts of both the Afgan & his Egyptian student resulted in an intellectual movement calling for defending Islam, high-lighting the positive traits of Islam, rejecting the blind copying of the Western model. The new generation of the intellectual leaders of this movement called for getting back to the original spirit of Islam as the Prophet and his four Caliphs had formulated.

The climax of this intellectual activity expressed itself in the mutiny lead by Army General " Ahmed Orapi " Pasha, in 19881. He, with the support of the Egyptian army challenged the authority of the descendents of " Mohammed Aly " monarchy. However, this nationalist movement was short lived as it ended up with the British occupation of Egypt in 1882.

Egypt at then was practically bankrupt due to the overspending done by Khedawi "Ishmael" in his poorly-calculated rush to add European outlook over the Egyptian lands. He relied on borrowing loans from European sources to sponsor his dreamy projects. This paved the road for Europe to interefere into the Egyptian policy making/executing, and eventually Egypt turned into a typical colony for Britain to exploit for the best of its interests.

Orapi's revolution had Islamic background/foundations without any visionary consideration of its surrounding Arabic populations. The Egyptian nationalist movement up to the thirties of the 20 th century didn't include any consideration towards belonging to the Arab league. Even during the 1919 Revolution against the British occupation, the leader of the revolution " Saad Zaglol " set a logo for the angry masses saying " Egypt for the Egyptians ".

The Egyptians have up till this date, 30s of the 20 th century, maintained their strong desire of their being different from the Arab neighbors/surroundings in both custom and culture. Then, surprisingly enough; the Britons encouraged a newly born attitude towards belonging to a Pan Arab nationalist cause paralleled with an Islamic movement.

The expression of these reactions within the Egyptians showed up in 1952, as " Gamal abed el Nasser " with his fellow army officers lead a mutiny over the last descendant of " Mohamed Aly " monarchy, King " Farouk ". Later, Nasser defined 3 interacting circles within each Egypt has its own interests/belonging; Africa, Arabic league, and finally the Islamic circle.

Nasser failed to have his own Dream of one united Arabic league into Reality, as facts on the Ground. The economic hardship as a consequent result of Nasser's political turmoil in dealing with his 3 circles of interests resulted in setbacks for all of the minorities living in Egypt. The Jews in particular, more than any other minority, were in Chaos. The relationship between Islam and Judaism has always been ambiguous and also complicated since the early times of the Prophet, Mohammed ( Zinbad the Translator: PBUH) during his spreading of the religion in the Arabian desert in the 7 th century.

At that time; there was not any ideological conflict or ethnic friction between Islam and Judaism as it was the case between Judaism & Christianity.

There was acceptance of Semitism within the Egyptian society which resulted from the Western influence/presence. When the nationalist traits needed a confirmation; it wasn't the Jew to be blamed or the Jew's behaviors to be faced with resistance, but the Jew's dispersion which makes the Jew as an Odd and also as Stranger.

To be Continued.

[Il Principe]

It all a gigantic conspiracy....muslims never, never, never, never, never, never did anything wrong. They never killed anyone....they spread their religion with peace....in fact they were like the hippies....make love - not war.....loooool

It's always someone else.....

PS

You can take it off now, Zinbad...

[ZinbadAlive]

Il Principe wrote:

PS
You can take it off now, Zinbad...

Glad that yu had been reading my translation of excerpts from that book about the Egyptian Jewry.

I post these translations not for yu PrincipleII or the rest of the Zionist gang here in this Forum, this thrad is intended to reach out to the nonZionist Americans hoping they can read what Jewish scholars revealed as their own interpretation of the History/Daily Life of the Egyptian Jewry.
So, in yr threads they read awful things about Islam and the Prophet,
while in these translations they can find the otherside of the story.

If yu had any former graduate studies/research, yu could have been prepared to study a given topic with viewing both the weaknesses and strength.

A Religion like Islam lived 1.5 Millenium and one Billion person (most of them outside the Arab countries) believe in it can't be that Evil religion yu and the rest of the Gang here daily attack.

So, as long as I am still reading in the few chapters left in that book, I won't "take it off now"!!!

PS. All the authors/contributors in that book about the Egyptian Jewry are Jewish persons.

[Il Principe]

ZinbadAlive wrote:

<quoted text>
Glad that yu had been reading my translation of excerpts from that book about the Egyptian Jewry.
I post these translations not for yu PrincipleII or the rest of the Zionist gang here in this Forum, this thrad is intended to reach out to the nonZionist Americans hoping they can read what Jewish scholars revealed as their own interpretation of the History/Daily Life of the Egyptian Jewry.
So, in yr threads they read awful things about Islam and the Prophet,
while in these translations they can find the otherside of the story.
If yu had any former graduate studies/research, yu could have been prepared to study a given topic with viewing both the weaknesses and strength.
A Religion like Islam lived 1.5 Millenium and one Billion person (most of them outside the Arab countries) believe in it can't be that Evil religion yu and the rest of the Gang here daily attack.
So, as long as I am still reading in the few chapters left in that book, I won't "take it off now"!!!
PS. All the authors/contributors in that book about the Egyptian Jewry are Jewish persons.

Whatever dude....All I am saying is that you can take it off.

[Il Principe]

ZinbadAlive wrote:

<quoted text>
Glad that yu had been reading my translation of excerpts from that book about the Egyptian Jewry.
I post these translations not for yu PrincipleII or the rest of the Zionist gang here in this Forum, this thrad is intended to reach out to the nonZionist Americans hoping they can read what Jewish scholars revealed as their own interpretation of the History/Daily Life of the Egyptian Jewry.
So, in yr threads they read awful things about Islam and the Prophet,
while in these translations they can find the otherside of the story.
If yu had any former graduate studies/research, yu could have been prepared to study a given topic with viewing both the weaknesses and strength.
A Religion like Islam lived 1.5 Millenium and one Billion person (most of them outside the Arab countries) believe in it can't be that Evil religion yu and the rest of the Gang here daily attack.
So, as long as I am still reading in the few chapters left in that book, I won't "take it off now"!!!
PS. All the authors/contributors in that book about the Egyptian Jewry are Jewish persons.

I have converted to zionism.....

[Il Principe]

Pls respect my religion....it has been spread with peace and love just like islam....

looooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooool

[ZinbadAlive]

This morning, while driving on my way to the country club for my Running exercise, I thought of that " yu can take it off now Zinbad ",
asked myself: could there be a language problem with me? I interpret it differently than what PrincipleII meant it to be?

I thought of that expression of yrs as: Stop this translation work yu are carrying on in this thread, or just Stop this thread right now.

But both yu & that wild TA made it clear for me, or what I think as clear: do yu hint about my former mentioning somewhere in this forum of sleeping without underwear?

second language problem: if it was like that: Zinbad take off yr underwear right now, still in my cultural background: Zinbad, just jump over me, squeeze me inbetween yr arms!!! then yu know the rest!!!

If someone say it to someone else; could it mean: take it off so yu will be ----ed?

well, I am trying to make this thread a learning experience about the Egyptian Jewry, and yu apparently adding "languistics" dimension!!!!

[ZinbadAlive]

Il Principe wrote:

Pls respect my religion....it has been spread with peace and love just like islam....
looooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooool

A Religion that theoretically speaking calls for Love/Peace is Christianity
but Christianity has witnessed forced conversions,
examples: Muslims of the subSaharan west african regions were taken by force to America as Slaves then by force were converted to Christianity and given Christian names. Read " Roots " by Alex Haigely if yu don't like to read in Encyclopedias.
Also, Christianity was used to cover up for 4 major European Crusades into our Lands with the blessings of the Popes of Rome.

When I write a reply like the above, is it considered by yu as having no respect for yr religion? Should everything evil copy/pasted into Islam, and nothing evil/wrong should be with other religions?!!!!

[Il Principe]

ZinbadAlive wrote:

<quoted text>
A Religion that theoretically speaking calls for Love/Peace is Christianity
but Christianity has witnessed forced conversions,
examples: Muslims of the subSaharan west african regions were taken by force to America as Slaves then by force were converted to Christianity and given Christian names. Read " Roots " by Alex Haigely if yu don't like to read in Encyclopedias.
Also, Christianity was used to cover up for 4 major European Crusades into our Lands with the blessings of the Popes of Rome.
When I write a reply like the above, is it considered by yu as having no respect for yr religion? Should everything evil copy/pasted into Islam, and nothing evil/wrong should be with other religions?!!!!

Have you ever heard about irony and sarcasm?

[ZinbadAlive]

By the way:

This morning, after my early morning Running exercise, and during fixing myself a cup of Coffee at the kitchen, the Radio was set at Quran Karim station, so I heard this:

the Program Host asked: There are 4 times when the Holy Quran mentioned the signs by which Abraham knew the coming of Isach, tell us the part of the Holy Quran that has each of those 4 signs, and elaborate on their significance.

The Guest, a Professor from El Azhar University, answered.

I mention this here as I was thinking about How Islam is insulted by those Jewish Extremists, the Zionists of America, while both the Program Host and the Guest were talking about Abraham/Isach with All of their respect considering them our Prophets. I was comparing the manners which Islam taught us; to speak about each Prophet of Jeudasm with Respect, while we read awful things thrown at our Prophet, Mohamed (PBUH)! As if the Jews, the extremist Jews, did not get their full satisfaction of hurting/insulting/deluding with the treaties they had with him, still they are at War with him while he is helpless in a grave!

Could they ever Stop their Trials/Accusations/Insults/Thr eats to him to his religion to his followers? Could they?!!!

Aren't they satisfied yet with their Military Might equipped with 300 Nukes ready to demolish most of the Nations of Islam?
Aren't they satisfied yet with their daily Killing of the Palestinians? Imprisoning entire Populations in Ghettoes with brick-walls then bombing them from the American-made F-14s?

Trials for the historic events,
Killing/Humiliating the population which they just pushed away of their own lands at gunpoints!

When they can come to Rest?
To just Live and let Others Live as the rest of the "normal" humanbeings?!!!!!!!!!

----------

And this morning too, I was listening to radio "Quran karim"
when a professor from El Azhar University was talking about the Pharoh of Egypt explaining to the audience How He, the Pharoh, was a Symbol of Oppressive Dictatorship, and how that status prevented the Pharoh from accepting the Prophet Mosas as a Messenger of God the Creator. The Prof elaborated on the Conflict inside the Pharoh's own judgement, between having an absolute unquestioned Power to rule and yielding to see his own population worshipping some other "absolute" though invisible Power named God the Creator.

That Prof favoring Mosas, the Jewish Prophet, over our great Pharohs is Egyptian Muslim,

See How we the Muslim Egyptians talk about 'their" Prophets and just have a look at the titles of the threads in this Forum.
The difference is obviously huge.

[Il Principe]

ZinbadAlive wrote:

By the way:
This morning, after my early morning Running exercise, and during fixing myself a cup of Coffee at the kitchen, the Radio was set at Quran Karim station, so I heard this:
the Program Host asked: There are 4 times when the Holy Quran mentioned the signs by which Abraham knew the coming of Isach, tell us the part of the Holy Quran that has each of those 4 signs, and elaborate on their significance.
The Guest, a Professor from El Azhar University, answered.
I mention this here as I was thinking about How Islam is insulted by those Jewish Extremists, the Zionists of America, while both the Program Host and the Guest were talking about Abraham/Isach with All of their respect considering them our Prophets. I was comparing the manners which Islam taught us; to speak about each Prophet of Jeudasm with Respect, while we read awful things thrown at our Prophet, Mohamed (PBUH)! As if the Jews, the extremist Jews, did not get their full satisfaction of hurting/insulting/deluding with the treaties they had with him, still they are at War with him while he is helpless in a grave!
Could they ever Stop their Trials/Accusations/Insults/Thr eats to him to his religion to his followers? Could they?!!!
Aren't they satisfied yet with their Military Might equipped with 300 Nukes ready to demolish most of the Nations of Islam?
Aren't they satisfied yet with their daily Killing of the Palestinians? Imprisoning entire Populations in Ghettoes with brick-walls then bombing them from the American-made F-14s?
Trials for the historic events,
Killing/Humiliating the population which they just pushed away of their own lands at gunpoints!
When they can come to Rest?
To just Live and let Others Live as the rest of the "normal" humanbeings?!!!!!!!!!
----------
And this morning too, I was listening to radio "Quran karim"
when a professor from El Azhar University was talking about the Pharoh of Egypt explaining to the audience How He, the Pharoh, was a Symbol of Oppressive Dictatorship, and how that status prevented the Pharoh from accepting the Prophet Mosas as a Messenger of God the Creator. The Prof elaborated on the Conflict inside the Pharoh's own judgement, between having an absolute unquestioned Power to rule and yielding to see his own population worshipping some other "absolute" though invisible Power named God the Creator.
That Prof favoring Mosas, the Jewish Prophet, over our great Pharohs is Egyptian Muslim,
See How we the Muslim Egyptians talk about 'their" Prophets and just have a look at the titles of the threads in this Forum.
The difference is obviously huge.

Take it off, dude....it ain't funny any longer....

[Amz]

Pharoah was not a Muslim that is why he perished when he was in pursuit of Moses, although he did say he believes in faith just before he drowned that belief became too late and now he awaits a very painful punishment in hell. Moses was a powerful messenger of God.

I don't see what people get from abusing faiths at the end of the day it is just words that won't mean anything to a person that believes strongly.

[ZinbadAlive]

" Histoire des Juifs du Nil "
by
Jacques Hassoun
1990, Minerve

Chapter 4
When it was Half of the Century
By Eglal Aurira
(pages: 112&113)

(Zinbad translating from Arabic to English)

There wasn't any Ghetto in Alexandria, Damanhour, Mansoura, or Tanta as the Western World used to have, and also there were not certain residential areas for the Jews who managed to flee from Spain and settle among the Arabs of North Africa. In both areas, Egypt & North Africa, there was that mix of residents belonging to different faiths. There closeness in distance resulted in knowing each others with an extent sufficient enough to have normal relationships as typical neighbors.

The Egyptian Jewry faced a vague situation with uncertainty when their destiny was concerned. They didn't have an answer for a persistent question: Is it possible for the Arab Nationalist Movement to stay away from them so they could be able to stay in their home lands in spite of the warning signals they managed to interpret?

It is another story which doesn't give any thought/calculation for the clash between the Arab Nationalist Movement and any other opposing movement. Egypt during Nasser's regime found itself in a state of confusion (Zinbad: the Translator literally used " torn apart ") because of the Arab-Israeli Conflict.

In parallel to the rise of the Arab / Egyptian nationalist Movement an identical Movement began to show up in the 30 s / 40s of the 20 th century which is the Movement for an Arabic / Palestinian identity, and fighting the British Authority over Palestine.

Here, the Christian minority of the Palestinians chose to be excessive in their Nationalist trend to get rid of any suspicions that their Muslim fellows may have when their "loyalty" was concerned. They, like the Jews/Greeks of Egypt, were the leaders of the communist movement.

Palestine witnessed the most violent clashes between the Zionist fighters and the Palestinian Nationalists. The British Authority managed to contain the violence with that typical wicked colonial method; differentiate to rule, in which all the playing cards get confused.

Both WWII & the Holocaust speeded the emergence of the State of Israel. With the establishment of a Jewish state, the Arabs became a minority in what "was" their home country, and this has been a new and radical turning point for the Jewish Arabs and also the Arabic Masses. As if a History box suddenly got brocken to reveal a Jewish face pulling the attention of everyone in the region.

In the years 1948, 56, 67 & 73 repeated military clashes between Israel & its Arab neighbors took place. The more the Zionist Movement becomes stiffer and the Palestinian Problem more violent, the destiny of the Jewish minorities in the Lands of the Nations of Islam get more vagueness. Egypt was in the front line of this turmoil where the Egyptian Jewry are the most of the minorities to be involved.

To be Continued
Stay with us!

[Danetoo]

Here Zinbad ... not that it would presumably make one iota of difference in your totally brainwashed opinion that "it is all the fault of the jews/zionists" ... but ...
If you are a "truth" seeker .. here may be some truths, from an Arab journalist ...

Another Arab journalist admits Israel not to blame for Palestinian refugees

A top Palestinian journalist wrote last week that it is the Arab world, and not Israel, that is to blame for the so-called Palestinian "refugee crisis."

Jawad al Bashiti, a Jordan-based correspondent for the Palestinian daily Al-Ayyam, noted in his May 13 2008 editorial that during the "first war between Arabs and Israel...the 'Arab Salvation Army' came and told the Palestinians:'We have come to you in order to liquidate the Zionists and their state. Leave your houses and villages, you will return to them in a few days safely."

Bashiti lamented that in evacuating Palestinians before doing battle with the Israelis, it was the Arabs who were in fact responsible for what the Arab world refers to as the "nakba," the catastrophe of Israel's successful rebirth in the biblical Land of Israel. Had those hundreds of thousands of Palestinian Arabs not been removed, their descendants would likely continue to outnumber the Jews.

Israeli watchdog group Palestinian Media Watch, which translated Bashiti's article, pointed out a trend among Palestinian journalists who are becoming increasingly bold in blaming the Arab world, rather than Israel, over the refugee issue. Four other similar article written by leading Palestinian journalists over the past few years were also translated as evidence of this trend.

Removing blame from Israel over the Palestinian refugee issue effectively eliminates one of the major foundations of the Palestinian struggle against the Jewish state. It also compels major international movements to rectify the Palestinian refugee situation, including the United Nations' own committee on the issue, to refocus their attention on the true perpetrators -the Arab states.

[ZinbadAlive]

TA----------o wrote:

<quoted text>And look at the land now, the backward fcuks live in a sheit hole, as is typical of the dumb religion the keeps them backward,
And the jewish part thrives, in industry, science progress and agriculture.
And as for arabs being a minority in their home country, from the year one, israel was a jewish state, before your disgusting violent religion jewish people roamed the lands, remember moses even in your pathetic country....who built your pyramids ?????????? slave jews.
During that time there was not a single scum fcuk muslim, killing people. In fact, it was the big nose egyptian that were the friggin killers, because middle east arabs have always been savages.
When israel did become a rightful state, on a very small portion of the land, mother fcuking muslims in the tens of tousands attacked israel and lost three times..........And as far as I'm concerned they should never be given that land back you pathetic losers lost it to the jews.......... Your big army was and still is the laughing stock of the world, how that small country kicked you arab asses back to your camel stables......... "big nose".
every time i think of your aggressive asses getting kicked by that little country of smart people, I laugh my ass off at you pathetic dummies.....
Go Israel.
fcuk muslims, the pervert modamid and the made up moon god allah

TA

from yr language/vocabulary,
from yr very impulsive emotional response

I candraw a picture of yu

yu most propably wearing a sleevless Jacket of Jeans material, either black or blue, Jeans as trousers, a boot nearing to yr knee, a leather belt with a knife fixed to its right or left side depending on the hand yu use in yr fights
drugs/beer can permanently in one hand? may be not quite sure of that
earings? possibly yes
tatoo over the muscles of yr arm? definetely yes
tatoo over other parts? may be

As long as yu are in yr America,
no problem to me
But I am afraid if America send yu with the latest technologically advanced weaponary to teach us how to be civilized enough to appreciate knowing/practicing Democracy American-made with yr methods/skills.
Yu will kill as much of us as yr immunition can afford, then yu will ask for more immunition
yu will claim to yr superiors that the Infidels are carrying guns and shooting on yu
but actually yu have been waiting for that moment when a Butcher like G W Bush send yu to our lands.

[ZinbadAlive]

" Histoire des Juifs du Nil "
by
Jacques Hassoun
1990, Minerve

Chapter 4
When it was Half of the Century
By Eglal Aurira
(pages: 112&113)

both Jacques Hassoun & Eglal Aurira are Jewish
I really liked and also respect the style that Ms Aurira wrote her chapter with. I seriously spent quite a time trying to have my translation reflecting her very sensitive awareness towards the region, but the charm of the language loses considerable sum of its brightness on translating from a language to another.
I was working on that transaltion to provide something could be counted as research/study while in the mean time there others posting insults to spoil the cause I am working for, To show a work done by Intellectual persons to enlight us whether their findings with or against us.

Anyway, I won't give up
there should be smart viewers who visit this thread and learn from its posts.

[Don]

I support Israel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

[Don]

Israel ROCKS !

I support Israel, and I am not a Jew.
I just respect a good thing when I see it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

May God Bless israel.