Croatia opens race for army modernization

Full story: Defence Talk 55
ZAGREB: Croatia invited Finland's Patria and Austria's Steyr to submit offers for sale of 126 armored personnel carriers to the former Yugoslav republic, state television HTV reported on Friday. Full Story
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Goran Jurcevic

Zagreb, Croatia

#1 Feb 13, 2007
I really dont know what is going on with Pandur II..It is still prototype without productions line..Steyr are trying to make another vehicle..with stronger engine, better protection..1,5 tone more weight then before..Is it the same vehicle ??? and weight of the vehicle Pandur II in comparison with power of engine is still weak..completely disaster.Steyr wants to make another prototype..nobody knows final product..Where is the certificate about mine protection..nobody knows
Mike from Kanada

Toronto, Canada

#3 Feb 13, 2007
Can someone tell me if the Croats will start to build the Degman (M-95) main battle tank for its own military and for export !!?? The HS-2000 (hrvatski samokres 2000) is the choice of handgun for the United States FBI and will it be sold to other countries for their police forces?
The Croats will soon make a choice to purchase, either, the (refurbished) F-16 Falcons or the Saab Gripen Jas-39 for its airforce- I hope they choose the Gripen!!!!
smart

Croatia

#4 Mar 7, 2007
we don't have money.
www.yourCRO.info
KROAT

Australia

#5 Apr 6, 2007
As far as I know the Degman project has been halted until the Croatian Government decides if its worthwhile persuing the project. The Degman has been offered for export and was first shown at the IDEX show in Saudi Arabia. This provided numerous leads with possible exports to Jordan (110) and also to Egypt (90) as well as other countries in the region. The Degman is a great tank, very low in cost and maintanence and is well suited to the desert terrain.

Since: Mar 07

Freeport, NY

#6 Apr 6, 2007
KROAT wrote:
As far as I know the Degman project has been halted until the Croatian Government decides if its worthwhile persuing the project. The Degman has been offered for export and was first shown at the IDEX show in Saudi Arabia. This provided numerous leads with possible exports to Jordan (110) and also to Egypt (90) as well as other countries in the region. The Degman is a great tank, very low in cost and maintanence and is well suited to the desert terrain.
Does Degman have a fire control system capable of accurate fire on the move. Until it does its a 3rd generation tank when countries are now working on 5th.
There is a great benefit to having an MBT built in your own country.
albanian

Ålborg, Denmark

#7 Apr 6, 2007
Go Hrvatska Go !!!
WMD

Hamilton, Canada

#8 Apr 13, 2007
albanian wrote:
Go Hrvatska Go !!!
are you sure about that...
albanian

Ålborg, Denmark

#9 Apr 13, 2007
WMD wrote:
<quoted text>are you sure about that...
why not!
WMD

Hamilton, Canada

#10 Apr 18, 2007
albanian wrote:
<quoted text>
why not!
i guess...
KROAT

Australia

#11 Apr 20, 2007
Yes it does have a fire control system that can be used on the move. It is a 'Galileo FCT' system produced in Italy and it has been implemented to the UK Challenger tanks recently. Recent news also includes interest from Kuwait for 57 pieces as well as an upgrade of all their M-84A (Desert Fox)tanks that were bought in the early 1990s. The upgrade includes 250 tanks that were produced in the same factory. As I said before, these tanks are well suited to the desert terrain and are orientated to the middle eastern markets as the West has not discovered the quality of these tanks and have their own productions.
Mike from Kanada

Windsor, Canada

#12 Apr 20, 2007
Well then, the Croatians should get to market the Degman main battle tank for the Croat and foreign armies !!!
marko

Canada

#13 Apr 25, 2007
Cro M-84 D
[IMG]http://i110.photobucket.c om/albums/n83/Dan12345_2006/M- 84D.jpg[/IMG]
300 Million Dollar Deal for Djuro DjakovicTHE KUWAITI ARMY has not responded to Polish and Serbian offers to upgrade their M-84 tanks, nor for the purchase of US Abrams tanks, because it wants the upgraded Croatian M-84D tank
A recent statement Croatian Defence Minister Berislav Roncevic made before top Kuwaiti state officials that Croatian Government guarantees that the company Djuro Djakovic is technologically and organisationally entirely capable of meeting and fulfilling the demands of upgrading 150 Kuwaiti M-84 tanks and if need be to manufacture a further 66 tanks that were never delivered to Kuwait, but should have been in the early 1990s, has put Djuro Djakovic in a position to clinch the most lucrative deal in its history, worth about $300 million. The price of upgrading one tank would be up to a million US dollars, depending on the equipment package the Kuwaitis opt for, while the price of a new tank is about $2.5 million.
Kuwait has for several years now had offers to upgrade its M-84 tanks under consideration, but has not, however, given positive answers to any of the offers, not even to the most serious ones coming from Poland and Serbia back in 2005. It has also not answered positively the US proposal to sell its M-84's and replace them with more of the Abrams tanks already present in Kuwaiti armoured vehicle units. There are several reasons why Kuwait has shown great interest for Croatia. For Kuwait it was exceptionally important that the Djuro Djakovic Company maintained continuity and the development of its tank program with the M-84 over the past years, that tanks manufactured at Djuro Djakovic are used in Croatian Army units, that Croatia has continued to finance the program and that the Croatian Army will also use the new upgraded tank designated M-84D, for which it wants to close a deal with Kuwait on.
marko

Canada

#14 Apr 25, 2007
The M-95 is the thing of the past
marko

Canada

#15 Apr 25, 2007
Besides that, the upgraded Croatian tank will have the same caterpillar treads made by German manufacturer Diehl that the Kuwaiti M-84 tanks already use, and which were installed just under two years ago, which demonstrates that Croatian product compatibility has been maintained with that of Kuwait.
Kuwait is very happy with the M-84 tanks manufactured back in the time of the former Yugoslavia because of their mobility in desert conditions, few breakdowns and much easier maintenance that is the case with the heavy American Abrams tanks, whose motors fail much more often in the desert. This happens because of a poorly designed air filtering system, allowing desert sand to enter the motor turbine, which is then starved of air, causing the motor to overheat and forcing a stop. When the turbine is ruined a new one takes up to a month to be delivered from the USA. The Abrams has poor mobility because of its weight and is an easier target, having a 2.5 square metres larger surface area than the M-84, which is in the large open spaces of the desert terrain, where there are no shelters, a significant problem. The M-84 is also ten tons lighter than the Abrams and can as such pass over all of the bridges trucks can use, which the Abrams cannot.
marko

Canada

#16 Apr 25, 2007
As we have learned from the defence ministry, the Slavonski Brod-based company is not considering collaborating on this project with Serbian companies as it already has a wide network of partners with whom it can completely round off the M-84D tank program. Unlike the M-84 tanks currently in Kuwaiti armoured units, the upgraded tank will have a thermovisual camera through which it will be able to detect all targets emitting heat at a distance of up to several kilometres from the tank, regardless of fog, night or if they are hidden in the shadow if some other object.

An electrically powered cannon and cupola, and accompanying assemblies, whose installation is in process, will be procured from well-known Western European manufacturers of tank equipment. Up to now the cannon and cupola propulsion was hydraulic. Electric cannon and cupola propulsion is the trend in the development of modern tanks, used on the US Abrams and the French Leclerc. The tank commander will be able to fire on two targets at once, even if the second crew member responsible for firing is incapacitated, as the operation and aiming of the firing station will be possible from the cupola, both of the 125 mm cannon and the remote control of the 12.7 mm machine gun without exposure to enemy fire. Air conditioning will also be installed on the tank. The protection of the tank and its crew, the commander, gunner and driver, has been significantly improved with the new SZ-D defence system which, for example, in the case of a nuclear strike and the used of chemical weapons immediately shuts down the engine and closes its exit shutters, shuts off the positive air pressure compressor and ensures the filtering of the crew's air supply, quicker and more efficiently than previously. Soon after a critical situation of that kind, the defence system raises all existing combat functions regardless of the level of pollution in the soil and atmosphere.
marko

Canada

#17 Apr 25, 2007
Cro M-84 D
[IMG]http://i110.photobucket.c om/albums/n83/Dan12345_2006/M- 84D.jpg[/IMG]
300 Million Dollar Deal for Djuro DjakovicTHE KUWAITI ARMY has not responded to Polish and Serbian offers to upgrade their M-84 tanks, nor for the purchase of US Abrams tanks, because it wants the upgraded Croatian M-84D tank
A recent statement Croatian Defence Minister Berislav Roncevic made before top Kuwaiti state officials that Croatian Government guarantees that the company Djuro Djakovic is technologically and organisationally entirely capable of meeting and fulfilling the demands of upgrading 150 Kuwaiti M-84 tanks and if need be to manufacture a further 66 tanks that were never delivered to Kuwait, but should have been in the early 1990s, has put Djuro Djakovic in a position to clinch the most lucrative deal in its history, worth about $300 million. The price of upgrading one tank would be up to a million US dollars, depending on the equipment package the Kuwaitis opt for, while the price of a new tank is about $2.5 million.
The_Croatian

Freeport, NY

#18 Apr 27, 2007
I cant find anything on the web about M-84D
The_Croatian

Freeport, NY

#19 Apr 27, 2007
Does anyone know if Croatia chose a armored vehicle yet and is the french frigate deal still alive.
Mike to Marko

Windsor, Canada

#20 Apr 27, 2007
Thanks for your favorable stories on the Croatian M-84 Main Battle Tank and I hope that the United Arab Emirates (and others) purchase the Croat tanks!!! But you didn't say why the Degman is a thing of the past?!
PS: How are things in Edmonton, as I haven't been back in over 20 years since high school (Boony Doone) and a lot of people are going to Alberta, not because they want to , but because in a country (Canada which is over 5000 miles long) there is work in only one province- what a sad country Kanada is!!!
Marko

Canada

#21 Apr 28, 2007
Oh sorry i meant because the degman know had substancialy upgraded like new armour new optronic sensors, and will be fitted with a new gun, and armour. Sorry if i couldnt be clearer. heres info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-95_Degman
Go to the Production & Modernisation section of it. It will tell u the new upgrades and changes
Things in Edmonton are going pretty good. The pay had increased since the last couple of years, new jobs opend its great thanx

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