Vatican defends Holocaust-era pope

Jul 6, 2010 | Posted by: lois sprague | Full story: www.thestarphoenix.com

Jewish accusations that Nazi-era Pope Pius XII turned a blind eye to the Holocaust are "outrageous" and no one can tell the Vatican whether he should be made a saint, Pope Benedict's deputy said on Thursday.

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The Monkey

Hampton, VA

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#1
Jul 7, 2010
 

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Gotta say, the only good thing I can say about the Vatican right now is that they did not mishandle the oil spill in the Gulf.

Even many off those within the walls think the current pontiff is one of the worst ever.
pete

Arlington, MA

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Jul 7, 2010
 

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Remember what the church did to the Jews! The Jews are Gods chosen people!
Rome,always said ,do not read the Bible. Even in Europe the priests would say ,do not read the Bible. The one the only the father, only through me,
,Jesus! The church is paying big time. The fools still, will not let it go.

AND JESUS DID NOT START THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH!!!

AND PETER RAN THE CHURCH OF JURUSELEM UNTIL 65 ad. THAT THEY CAN SHOW LETTERS IN THE ARCHIVES THAT WERE SENT TO PAUL. Paul taught the Gentiles, Peter taught the Jews.
RCC Truth Squad

Granger, IN

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#4
Jul 7, 2010
 

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pete wrote:
Remember what the church did to the Jews! The Jews are Gods chosen people!
Rome,always said ,do not read the Bible. Even in Europe the priests would say ,do not read the Bible. The one the only the father, only through me,
,Jesus! The church is paying big time. The fools still, will not let it go.
AND JESUS DID NOT START THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH!!!
AND PETER RAN THE CHURCH OF JURUSELEM UNTIL 65 ad. THAT THEY CAN SHOW LETTERS IN THE ARCHIVES THAT WERE SENT TO PAUL. Paul taught the Gentiles, Peter taught the Jews.
Ok...let's see here, So Jesus started His Church (you, know, the one which He promised that "The gates of Hell shall not prevail against".... and then what? It dissolved?

You are a perfect example of why Jesus entrusted the faith to A Church....and not to individual pride filled people. He and the Apostles forsaw the likes of you...diluting and misconstruing the truth and the Gospel. This is why there are 30 to 40 thousand protestant denominations. That is not pleasing to Our Lord.

The Church most certainly is THE Church which Jesus gave to his Apostles. There were not AND are not 2 separate Churches...one for the Gentiles and one for the Jews!!

Roman Catholics read the scriptures at every Mass and are exposed to more scripture than any other denomination. We also read it on our own...but we are smart enough and humble enough to know that on matters of faith...it is NOT up to us to settle disputes concerning the meaning of scripture. We follow the Church.

Read any of the Early Church Fathers...go back to the beginning, to the disciples of the Apostles. The Church worships God and Christ and the Holy Spirit precisely the way the earliest Christians did.

Where is YOUR Eucharist!? I feel sorry for you. "If you do not eat my Body and Drink my Blood you shall NOT have life within you." How much plainer and simpler does it need to be explained to you by our Lord? If you don't have the Eucharist at the center of your faith....then you are on the wrong track. The earliest Christians knew this, accepted this and died for it. Read Justin Martyr. Who do YOU think you are?

Too much PRIDE. The worst of and the source of all sin.

You are a heretic through ignorance....but if you continue to blasheme the Church you WILL BE HELD in judgement for it. The Church continues being persecuted as predicted. You are on the wrong side, friend. Wise up. You don't seem know what you are talking about and you don't seem to be open to accepting what is true.
RCC Truth Squad

Granger, IN

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#5
Jul 7, 2010
 

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The Monkey wrote:
Gotta say, the only good thing I can say about the Vatican right now is that they did not mishandle the oil spill in the Gulf.
Even many off those within the walls think the current pontiff is one of the worst ever.
Who do YOU know inside the Vatican walls? I have actually known a few. Is there diverse opinion on things? Yes. Is there talk of our Pope being the "worst ever"...I have not heard such talk. Please provide quotes of these people inside the walls who share this opinion which you have alerted us to.

Is there any doubt as to the authority of the Pope on matters of faith and morals within the College of Cardinals?

Nope.
The Monkey

Hampton, VA

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#6
Jul 7, 2010
 
RCC Truth Squad wrote:
<quoted text>
Who do YOU know inside the Vatican walls? I have actually known a few. Is there diverse opinion on things? Yes. Is there talk of our Pope being the "worst ever"...I have not heard such talk. Please provide quotes of these people inside the walls who share this opinion which you have alerted us to.
Is there any doubt as to the authority of the Pope on matters of faith and morals within the College of Cardinals?
Nope.
I was at the Vatican for a week last year. If you want, you can disparage me for what I wrote, and as one of the faithful, it is certainly your right. However, what I wrote was true.
Understandably, you faith in the mother church will certainly trump your confidence in my veracity. I get that, and don't take issue with it.

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#7
Jul 7, 2010
 
pete wrote:
Remember what the church did to the Jews! The Jews are Gods chosen people!
Rome,always said ,do not read the Bible. Even in Europe the priests would say ,do not read the Bible. The one the only the father, only through me,
,Jesus! The church is paying big time. The fools still, will not let it go.
AND JESUS DID NOT START THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH!!!
AND PETER RAN THE CHURCH OF JURUSELEM UNTIL 65 ad. THAT THEY CAN SHOW LETTERS IN THE ARCHIVES THAT WERE SENT TO PAUL. Paul taught the Gentiles, Peter taught the Jews.
Peter forbade anyone from referring to him as their "leader".
WinterWind

Kent, OH

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#8
Jul 8, 2010
 

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RCC Truth Squad wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok...let's see here, So Jesus started His Church (you, know, the one which He promised that "The gates of Hell shall not prevail against".... and then what? It dissolved?
You are a perfect example of why Jesus entrusted the faith to A Church....and not to individual pride filled people. He and the Apostles forsaw the likes of you...diluting and misconstruing the truth and the Gospel. This is why there are 30 to 40 thousand protestant denominations. That is not pleasing to Our Lord.
The Church most certainly is THE Church which Jesus gave to his Apostles. There were not AND are not 2 separate Churches...one for the Gentiles and one for the Jews!!
Roman Catholics read the scriptures at every Mass and are exposed to more scripture than any other denomination. We also read it on our own...but we are smart enough and humble enough to know that on matters of faith...it is NOT up to us to settle disputes concerning the meaning of scripture. We follow the Church.
Read any of the Early Church Fathers...go back to the beginning, to the disciples of the Apostles. The Church worships God and Christ and the Holy Spirit precisely the way the earliest Christians did.
Where is YOUR Eucharist!? I feel sorry for you. "If you do not eat my Body and Drink my Blood you shall NOT have life within you." How much plainer and simpler does it need to be explained to you by our Lord? If you don't have the Eucharist at the center of your faith....then you are on the wrong track. The earliest Christians knew this, accepted this and died for it. Read Justin Martyr. Who do YOU think you are?
Too much PRIDE. The worst of and the source of all sin.
You are a heretic through ignorance....but if you continue to blasheme the Church you WILL BE HELD in judgement for it. The Church continues being persecuted as predicted. You are on the wrong side, friend. Wise up. You don't seem know what you are talking about and you don't seem to be open to accepting what is true.
a little full of yourself, aren't you? it's fine to hold on to your personal beliefs, but you have no right to dictate the beliefs of others and condemn them for disagreeing with you. i was raised catholic, spent many years serving mass, and always thought the idea of "one church", being the "only true church", was a pretentious belief. i've known too many good and kind people, who don't happen to be catholic, to believe that they would be" cast into the fires of hell" simply because they were not roman catholic. currently the church has no right to neither preach morality nor claim the position of being "the one true church". remember, the people in charge of the organization are just that, people. with temptations and weakness and failures, just like the rest of us. strength is in the individual, not in the organization he or she belongs to. that strength often comes from personal beliefs, but none of us has the right to judge others beliefs. before you throw your condemnation blanket over those who disagree with you, look to your own heart and see if you can find that love and forgiveness, compassion and understanding, that jesus spoke of.
the Angelus

Stillwater, OK

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#9
Jul 9, 2010
 

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WinterWind wrote:
<quoted text>
a little full of yourself, aren't you? it's fine to hold on to your personal beliefs, but you have no right to dictate the beliefs of others and condemn them for disagreeing with you. i was raised catholic, spent many years serving mass, and always thought the idea of "one church", being the "only true church", was a pretentious belief. i've known too many good and kind people, who don't happen to be catholic, to believe that they would be" cast into the fires of hell" simply because they were not roman catholic. currently the church has no right to neither preach morality nor claim the position of being "the one true church". remember, the people in charge of the organization are just that, people. with temptations and weakness and failures, just like the rest of us. strength is in the individual, not in the organization he or she belongs to. that strength often comes from personal beliefs, but none of us has the right to judge others beliefs. before you throw your condemnation blanket over those who disagree with you, look to your own heart and see if you can find that love and forgiveness, compassion and understanding, that jesus spoke of.
Most beautiful words, WinterWind!
They remind me of as essay written by a Catholic priest, the late Fr. Richard John Neuhaus in which he warned others about overbearing institutional pride:
“Tribalism has no place in this discussion. As John Paul II reminded Catholics in his 1990 encyclical Redemptoris Missio, being a Catholic is not reason for proprietorial pride but for profound gratitude for a grace received, all undeserved on our part. Moreover, a Catholic who does not earnestly want to recognize and rejoice in the gifts of grace to be found in other Christian communities will almost certainly be more hindrance than help in this discussion.”
RCC Truth Squad

Granger, IN

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#10
Jul 27, 2010
 

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WinterWind wrote:
<quoted text>
a little full of yourself, aren't you? it's fine to hold on to your personal beliefs, but you have no right to dictate the beliefs of others and condemn them for disagreeing with you. i was raised catholic, spent many years serving mass, and always thought the idea of "one church", being the "only true church", was a pretentious belief. i've known too many good and kind people, who don't happen to be catholic, to believe that they would be" cast into the fires of hell" simply because they were not roman catholic. currently the church has no right to neither preach morality nor claim the position of being "the one true church". remember, the people in charge of the organization are just that, people. with temptations and weakness and failures, just like the rest of us. strength is in the individual, not in the organization he or she belongs to. that strength often comes from personal beliefs, but none of us has the right to judge others beliefs. before you throw your condemnation blanket over those who disagree with you, look to your own heart and see if you can find that love and forgiveness, compassion and understanding, that jesus spoke of.
We are a community of believers. Jesus uses the metaphor of sheep and shepherd over and over. We are a flock....not sheep to picked off individually. We have been given a shepherd. I am not DICTATING ANYTYHING. You are trying to rob people of their right to express an opinion. This is shameful.

Where were you educated to believe that you have the right to be completely shielded from other points of view by the force of law or anything else?

Grow up.
The Monkey

Hampton, VA

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#11
Jul 27, 2010
 
Well I think the Mother Church has every reason to be proud, after it stopped burning heretics and non believers at the stake using confessions extracted by ruthless torture.
And I'm certain that in the coming centuries the Church will discontinue the act raping of young boys in the care of parish priests, monseigneurs, et al.

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#12
Jul 27, 2010
 
RCC Truth Squad wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok...let's see here, So Jesus started His Church (you, know, the one which He promised that "The gates of Hell shall not prevail against".... and then what? It dissolved?
You are a perfect example of why Jesus entrusted the faith to A Church....and not to individual pride filled people. He and the Apostles forsaw the likes of you...diluting and misconstruing the truth and the Gospel. This is why there are 30 to 40 thousand protestant denominations. That is not pleasing to Our Lord.
The Church most certainly is THE Church which Jesus gave to his Apostles. There were not AND are not 2 separate Churches...one for the Gentiles and one for the Jews!!
Roman Catholics read the scriptures at every Mass and are exposed to more scripture than any other denomination. We also read it on our own...but we are smart enough and humble enough to know that on matters of faith...it is NOT up to us to settle disputes concerning the meaning of scripture. We follow the Church.
Read any of the Early Church Fathers...go back to the beginning, to the disciples of the Apostles. The Church worships God and Christ and the Holy Spirit precisely the way the earliest Christians did.
Where is YOUR Eucharist!? I feel sorry for you. "If you do not eat my Body and Drink my Blood you shall NOT have life within you." How much plainer and simpler does it need to be explained to you by our Lord? If you don't have the Eucharist at the center of your faith....then you are on the wrong track. The earliest Christians knew this, accepted this and died for it. Read Justin Martyr. Who do YOU think you are?
Too much PRIDE. The worst of and the source of all sin.
You are a heretic through ignorance....but if you continue to blasheme the Church you WILL BE HELD in judgement for it. The Church continues being persecuted as predicted. You are on the wrong side, friend. Wise up. You don't seem know what you are talking about and you don't seem to be open to accepting what is true.
For the most part, I agree with you. But how can you (or anyone) claim to know what happens to us after death?
Jack Mehoff

Lambertville, NJ

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#13
Jul 28, 2010
 

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Well, the current pope was a member of the Hitler Youth so what did you expect from a nazi?

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#14
Jul 28, 2010
 
Jack Mehoff wrote:
Well, the current pope was a member of the Hitler Youth so what did you expect from a nazi?
You got that right!

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#15
Jul 28, 2010
 
The Monkey wrote:
Gotta say, the only good thing I can say about the Vatican right now is that they did not mishandle the oil spill in the Gulf.
Even many off those within the walls think the current pontiff is one of the worst ever.
The Vatican cares only about power.
QUITTNER

Toronto, Canada

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#16
Jul 29, 2010
 
4:43 pm, Thursday, July 29, 2010:
RE: Vatican defends Holocaust-era pope
Jack Mehoff wrote:
Well, the current pope was a member of the Hitler Youth so what did you expect from a nazi?
..... As I remember reading, the current pope was never a Nazi.
..... From Wikipedia: "... Following his 14th birthday in 1941, Ratzinger was conscripted into the Hitler Youth — as membership was required by law for all 14-year old German boys after December 1939[9]— but was an unenthusiastic member who refused to attend meetings.[10] His father was an enemy of Nazism, believing it conflicted with the Catholic faith...."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XV...

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#17
Jul 29, 2010
 
QUITTNER wrote:
4:43 pm, Thursday, July 29, 2010:
RE: Vatican defends Holocaust-era pope
<quoted text>
..... As I remember reading, the current pope was never a Nazi.
..... From Wikipedia: "... Following his 14th birthday in 1941, Ratzinger was conscripted into the Hitler Youth — as membership was required by law for all 14-year old German boys after December 1939[9]— but was an unenthusiastic member who refused to attend meetings.[10] His father was an enemy of Nazism, believing it conflicted with the Catholic faith...."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Benedict_XV...
Wait a sec - In catechism, kids are taught that they should be willing to give their lives for the church if necessary - at least when I was taught in the 50's - Ratzi wasn't willing to do that, was he?

Since: Apr 10

Drums, PA

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#18
Jul 31, 2010
 
The Monkey wrote:
Well I think the Mother Church has every reason to be proud, after it stopped burning heretics and non believers at the stake using confessions extracted by ruthless torture.
And I'm certain that in the coming centuries the Church will discontinue the act raping of young boys in the care of parish priests, monseigneurs, et al.
Wow! You mean it's gonna stop all that stuff?
WinterWind

Kent, OH

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#19
Aug 1, 2010
 
RealSheryl wrote:
<quoted text>
For the most part, I agree with you. But how can you (or anyone) claim to know what happens to us after death?
i think he's the epitome of what archie bunker called a meathead...meat head, dead from the neck up...that's how he knows...just a little humor...i know, very little...
WinterWind

Kent, OH

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#20
Aug 2, 2010
 

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RCC Truth Squad wrote:
<quoted text>
Ok...let's see here, So Jesus started His Church (you, know, the one which He promised that "The gates of Hell shall not prevail against".... and then what? It dissolved?
You are a perfect example of why Jesus entrusted the faith to A Church....and not to individual pride filled people. He and the Apostles forsaw the likes of you...diluting and misconstruing the truth and the Gospel. This is why there are 30 to 40 thousand protestant denominations. That is not pleasing to Our Lord.
The Church most certainly is THE Church which Jesus gave to his Apostles. There were not AND are not 2 separate Churches...one for the Gentiles and one for the Jews!!
Roman Catholics read the scriptures at every Mass and are exposed to more scripture than any other denomination. We also read it on our own...but we are smart enough and humble enough to know that on matters of faith...it is NOT up to us to settle disputes concerning the meaning of scripture. We follow the Church.
Read any of the Early Church Fathers...go back to the beginning, to the disciples of the Apostles. The Church worships God and Christ and the Holy Spirit precisely the way the earliest Christians did.
Where is YOUR Eucharist!? I feel sorry for you. "If you do not eat my Body and Drink my Blood you shall NOT have life within you." How much plainer and simpler does it need to be explained to you by our Lord? If you don't have the Eucharist at the center of your faith....then you are on the wrong track. The earliest Christians knew this, accepted this and died for it. Read Justin Martyr. Who do YOU think you are?
Too much PRIDE. The worst of and the source of all sin.
You are a heretic through ignorance....but if you continue to blasheme the Church you WILL BE HELD in judgement for it. The Church continues being persecuted as predicted. You are on the wrong side, friend. Wise up. You don't seem know what you are talking about and you don't seem to be open to accepting what is true.
First, let me suggest that you meant “not sheep to (be) picked off individually.” Well, RCC Truth Squad, you appear to have a full grasp on pride and sin, since every time you put pen to paper you produce a composition filled with self-importance and arrogant dialogue. You dared criticize me, claiming I was attempting to rob people of their right to express an opinion. Where have I ever said that? You’re the one condemning people for not accepting your values, not me. I’ve simply stated that you have no right to pass judgment on anyone for their views, even if those views fly in the face of your sacred beliefs. You have a right to state your beliefs, but you are not the judge and jury on this planet. You can interpret the teachings of Christ to make yourself feel righteous, but in doing so, you blatantly express the pride you describe as “The worst of and the source of all sin”. You’re the one with arrogance enough to actually call yourself “RCC Truth Squad”, which in your case is the perfect example of an oxymoron. Do you actually have the impertinence to believe that you are an expert on the Catholic Church? If that doesn’t show pride in oneself, I don’t know what does. Everyone has a right to their beliefs and the expression of their faith. However, you do not have right to condemn anyone simply because their notion of religion differs from yours.
WinterWind

Kent, OH

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#21
Aug 2, 2010
 
RCC Truth Squad wrote:
<quoted text>
We are a community of believers. Jesus uses the metaphor of sheep and shepherd over and over. We are a flock....not sheep to picked off individually. We have been given a shepherd. I am not DICTATING ANYTYHING. You are trying to rob people of their right to express an opinion. This is shameful.
Where were you educated to believe that you have the right to be completely shielded from other points of view by the force of law or anything else?
Grow up.
First, let me suggest that you meant “not sheep to (be) picked off individually.” Well, RCC Truth Squad, you appear to have a full grasp on pride and sin, since every time you put pen to paper you produce a composition filled with self-importance and arrogant dialogue. You dared criticize me, claiming I was attempting to rob people of their right to express an opinion. Where have I ever said that? You’re the one condemning people for not accepting your values, not me. I’ve simply stated that you have no right to pass judgment on anyone for their views, even if those views fly in the face of your sacred beliefs. You have a right to state your beliefs, but you are not the judge and jury on this planet. You can interpret the teachings of Christ to make yourself feel righteous, but in doing so, you blatantly express the pride you describe as “The worst of and the source of all sin”. You’re the one with arrogance enough to actually call yourself “RCC Truth Squad”, which in your case is the perfect example of an oxymoron. Do you actually have the impertinence to believe that you are an expert on the Catholic Church? If that doesn’t show pride in oneself, I don’t know what does. Everyone has a right to their beliefs and the expression of their faith. However, you do not have right to condemn anyone simply because their notion of religion differs from yours.

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