Choir member accused of taking pictur...

Choir member accused of taking pictures of nude boys

There are 32 comments on the Salt Lake Tribune story from Oct 3, 2006, titled Choir member accused of taking pictures of nude boys. In it, Salt Lake Tribune reports that:

Officials from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints confirmed the arrest of an Orem man, a member of the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, who is accused of taking pictures of young boys in the nude while on ...

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Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#3 Oct 6, 2006
I'd say that any group with more than a few members is bound to have some weirdos.:) The only point that I'm trying to make is that LDS people don't judge themselves by the weirdos in their midst, so they shouldn't judge other groups by the weirdos among them. I think we tend to be a little hypocritical in this regard.

You mentioned the 12 million members of the church. I think that it's safe to say that by numbers alone, the LDS church has more spouse and child abusers than the fundamentalist they condemn. Lately, it seems that whenever the church speaks about those who engage in polygamy, that they always sneak in the word "abuse" to help describe them. I think this is wrong and dishonest. How would we like the world to judge the LDS church based on the actions of this deviant who takes pictures of naked boys? Should we judge monogamy by the deviants within the monogamous lifestyle? Yet the leaders of the church are guilty of doing the very same thing to fundamentalist. The persecuted have become the persecuters.
Oooo Yeah

Oakley, CA

#5 Oct 6, 2006
Brent Hartman wrote:
Wow. With the arrest of Warren Jeffs, I heard all kinds of people jumping on the bandwagon to lynch him and all those child molesting perverts. It turns out that those LDS members didn't have even have to leave their own church. The just had to visit the Mormon Tabernacle Choir or go on an LDS campout. Should we blame this on monogamy?:)
why do you think it's a witch hunt? What makes you think it's only catholic priest who dod this. Maybe because the LDS is so closed to the public. They do have sectors of the church. Im told that the main Temple in SLC is only reserved for "higher members". so it sparks interest in peoples minds. This isnt someones home being invaded, its a public entity. The church is for all the people, and when you have different sectors (and yes the catholics too), people are going to be curious. And when you do find out someone is fiddling children, well thats one law that is seriouslly looked down upon in the country. Thats what seperates us from the Middle east where it's considered OK.
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#6 Oct 6, 2006
And the FLDS are just a small portion of the fundamentalist. Yet the church continues to lump all fundamentlist in the same category with the FLDS. Child molesters are a small portion of the LDS church, so should we lump all the LDS in to the same category as the child molesters?
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#7 Oct 6, 2006
By the way, Jim, how do we know what really goes on in the FLDS community? From ex-members and the media? Maybe we should use the same sources to find out what really goes on in the LDS church, ya think?:)
Oooo Yeah

Oakley, CA

#8 Oct 6, 2006
Brent, You're pointing the finger only at the FLDS and not thinking it could be happening in the LDS itself? I wouldnt let my children stay at your house anytime soon.
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#9 Oct 6, 2006
Oooo Yeah,

Where did I state that I thought this was a "witch hunt"? Where did I state that only catholic priest do this?

You mentioned the law in your post. The last time I checked we are still presumed innocent in this country until proven guilty. Warren Jeffs is only charged with marrying underage girls. Ministers do that every day in this country. Is it your position that they should all be put in prison?
Oooo Yeah

Oakley, CA

#10 Oct 6, 2006
Brent Hartman wrote:
Oooo Yeah,
Where did I state that I thought this was a "witch hunt"? Where did I state that only catholic priest do this?
You mentioned the law in your post. The last time I checked we are still presumed innocent in this country until proven guilty. Warren Jeffs is only charged with marrying underage girls. Ministers do that every day in this country. Is it your position that they should all be put in prison?
You are.. Im not pointing fingers. I agree. What i am saying is that, to suggest that one sector of religion in society is free from this is pure ignorance. Maybe I miss understood what you're saying. I dont know if that man is guilty or not. Only God knows. Im just saying that the LDS cant be pure. that every member is free of this sickness. Plus, the Mormon Church sort of compramised its system and belief over the last 120 years. All Mormons used to believe it was ok to marry 13 year old girls and to have multiple wives until the Laws of the US stepped in. Then it broke off into sectors. I don't want to say "Guilty by association" but your history proves so. But Im not saying anyone person is guilty. I was just stating that people of the LDS arent all pure.
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#12 Oct 6, 2006
Oooo Yeah,

Up until modern times, most churches found it acceptable to marry teenagers. That wasn't a Mormon invention. Nor was polygamy. They both have their roots in the Bible. I agree with you that LDS people aren't all pure, much like those of every other religion.
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#13 Oct 6, 2006
The sheer number of cases of child abuse and spousal abuse by LDS people could tell us something as well. My sister volunteers for LDS social services and she is shocked by many of the things she has found. In the case of the LDS, they certainly are a top heavy autocracy whose former leaders have also been arrested, fugitives, and have even been on trial.

Jim, you are judging the majority by the actions of the minority. Why?
Oooo Yeah

Oakley, CA

#14 Oct 6, 2006
Brent Hartman wrote:
Oooo Yeah,
Up until modern times, most churches found it acceptable to marry teenagers. That wasn't a Mormon invention. Nor was polygamy. They both have their roots in the Bible. I agree with you that LDS people aren't all pure, much like those of every other religion.
I thought the bible mentioned something about 18 for women and 21 for men. I think it's an old jewish proverb?
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#16 Oct 6, 2006
Oooo Yeah,

Here's what I found through a little research on the topic.

“…under Judaism, boys could marry or make religious vows at 14-years-old and girls at 12-years-old, both only with parental permission, which parental permission was required until both boys or girls were 21-years-old”("Adult Age," McClintock and Strong Encyclopaedia).

“Ancient marriages were usually arranged between the oldest male family members within the same group or family clan (Genesis 27:46-28:2). This guaranteed the future existence of the overall group and preservation of culture and values. Girls were given in marriage when they were old enough to bear children, whereas men married when they either received their inheritance or obtained their own resources. It was also common for the groom to give a dowry, or purchase his wife from his future father-in-law. In the case of Jacob, since he evidently had no such dowry, he indentured himself to his father-in-law in exchange for his wives (Genesis 29:15-21).”(Rushmore, Louis. Biblical Companions: Geography, Archaeology & Sacred History. Cameron: Louis Rushmore, 2000.)

“During the first century, however, it appears to have been the general rule that young people who were "of age" could arrange their own marriages. A girl was considered of age at twelve years and one day. The Jewish rabbis set the minimum age for marriage at twelve years for the girl, and thirteen years for the boy. A boy should certainly be wed by the time he was eighteen to twenty. Betrothal was a vital part of marriage in biblical times. Once a young man had chosen his prospective bride, and she had consented (if of age), a formal declaration of marital intent was made in the presence of two witnesses. The couple was then betrothed. The betrothal period was fixed by law. For a maiden, it was from ten months to a year; for a widow, three months. From the time of her betrothal until the marriage actually took place, a woman was treated as if she were actually married. The betrothal could not be dissolved except by divorce; breach of faithfulness was regarded as adultery.”(Jackson, Wayne. Background Bible Study. Montgomery: Apologetics Press, 1986)
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#17 Oct 6, 2006
Well that last post got all jumbled up. I quoted three sources. You'll be able to find them if you look. Sorry!
Brent Hartman

Overland Park, KS

#19 Oct 7, 2006
Jim,

Do you think those changes in marriage are inspired by God? Is the world becoming more righteous?

How did the Amish get it so good? I'd say that through the years, they've had some righteous people in their midst. We could all learn a lot from the Amish. I've always thought that if you could combine two religions to form a better one that it would be the LDS and the Amish. I would say that they are closer to living a Zion life than most LDS today.
louise

Melbourne, Australia

#20 Oct 16, 2006
ilov rock and rock
Lucie Martial

Mirabel, Canada

#21 Oct 16, 2006
I do not understand what you mean by special members go to the SLC temple. I am an ordinary LDS member and I have been to the temple. Please be more specific and clarify what you said.
Harry

Columbus, OH

#22 Oct 20, 2006
We see only a part of the bigger picture. We see nude priests and sexual allegations. We don’t see the broader social issues that encourage such behavior. Priests are people. They too have sexual desires. There is no point in denying the existence of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. What matters is how they co-exist in a peaceful manner. At present society does not provide a space for Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde to talk to one another. This idea seems to be gaining acceptance. Found these images. Very interesting. Make you think critically.

http://pixeldeep.net/paintings/index1.html
vicki hamilton

Hudson, FL

#23 Dec 5, 2006
as jesus said there will always be poor there will always be sick people exploiting others
vicki hamilton

Hudson, FL

#24 Dec 5, 2006
what a perv
justin

Chihuahua, Mexico

#25 Jan 23, 2007
que flojera con sus comentarios.
estan echos garras!!
fetch you!!
sunny

India

#27 May 19, 2007
best

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