Farah building: Tax breaks won't be i...

Farah building: Tax breaks won't be issued until tenants move in

There are 80 comments on the El Paso Times story from Feb 23, 2009, titled Farah building: Tax breaks won't be issued until tenants move in. In it, El Paso Times reports that:

Western Refining CEO Paul Foster and his real estate partners at Hawkins Regency on Tuesday received the last chunk of tax incentives they needed to raze the old Farah building and build a new lifestyle ...

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“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#61 Feb 25, 2009
No to Fosterville wrote:
<quoted text>
No high tech or well paying jobs. More of the same just different products.
We should welcome them.
Still not worth tax incentives. The infrastructure still isn't there. The Interstate needs extra lanes there to begin with and better entrances and exits from Paisano to Zaragosa. The roads in the area need expansion and improvements.
Maybe it should be developed. These business people should pay what everybody else does. They are no better than the average business owner.
Hence my problem with this whole deal. They will develop and improve the property, but still pay ONLY what the property is worth now. THAT's a bad deal for El Paso tax payers.
Bill

Austin, TX

#62 Feb 25, 2009
Oh, well, guess you'll just have to get over it now...Unfortunately for you, El Paso will move forward with or without you...
No to Fosterville

El Paso, TX

#63 Feb 25, 2009
rudedog wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah you're right we need extra lanes on our roads because there are so many places to drive to. what do we need the extra lanes for if there is nothing else but work and home to drive to? i can understand if downtown had its share of tourists and there were nice places to see, like an upscale mall for example, but we dont have anything here and with that attitude we never will. just look out the window, we have the best weather in the world and no one else but El Pasoans know because there is nothing here worth seeing. Juarez used to be an attraction but now it's too dangerous. All i know is that its a start and we need to grow up. hasn't anyone thouhgt about TOURISM covering the cost? We cant even rely on that. i am tired of every other city having everything we don't.
Good observation.
The one upper

Silver City, NM

#64 Feb 26, 2009
meg wrote:
Let me see, Mervyn's closed, Dillards, Old Navy and Sears are laying off employees and consumer confidence is at an all time low. The Mexican Peso is at 14.98 per dollar so the Mexicans aren't shopping in El Paso. We are giving 12 million in tax breaks for a new shopping center to be built? How does this make sense???? How many of you are on the take????
VERY GOOD POINTS!! I SAY AN AUTOPLEX MALL CONSOLIDATE DEALERSHIPS OR PUT A TOYOTA OR HONDA PLANT HTERE.
Proud American

El Paso, TX

#65 Feb 26, 2009
PatriotMissile wrote:
<quoted text>
Hence my problem with this whole deal. They will develop and improve the property, but still pay ONLY what the property is worth now. THAT's a bad deal for El Paso tax payers.
Seriously?.....8 Gripes on the same forum!..You gripe, moan and beetch, and question others.
Please do us all a favor, and make your next posting YOUR solution instead of putting down everyone that you dont agree with.
Patriot Missile=WHINER
lol..8 whines in the same forum
not one foot

El Paso, TX

#66 Feb 26, 2009
i will not step my foot on that socialistic purchased mall. i hope it goes broke and would say that to all the 50 percent of the people who voted in the poll that it is coorperate city giveaway.

here's my new slogan " boycott regency ."

“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#67 Feb 26, 2009
Proud American wrote:
<quoted text>Seriously?.....8 Gripes on the same forum!..You gripe, moan and beetch, and question others.
Please do us all a favor, and make your next posting YOUR solution instead of putting down everyone that you dont agree with.
Patriot Missile=WHINER
lol..8 whines in the same forum
My first solution is to let business operate as business always has, cost and risk analysis bounced off of possible profit margins. If there's profit to be made, Regency and Foster would jump at this WITHOUT asking for our tax dollars.

As for what to do with that site other than another empty strip mall, there needs to be something unique to El Paso, and unique to the region. On a previous forum about this issue, I suggested a large inland aquarium, to draw tourism from all around this area here, rather than elsewhere, which would bring new money funnelling into the economy; not simply redistribute what's already here. An undertaking such as this would also require technical and biological specialists, and offer a place for the best and brightest among El Pasoens to work without going far for long. That would boost tourism, even draw tourism from the cities that El Pasoens normally go to, AND it would bring technical experts in fields that El Paso is severly lacking in to El Paso, bringing new money into our economy, and hopefully keeping some of the intelligent El Pasoens around, so that those with two brain cells to rub together will come up with ideas that'll help El Paso as a whole, and stop the "me" thinkers, like the City Council, County Commissioners, and most of the current business leaders, such as Foster and De La Vega, from running the city without intelligent, organized opposition.

“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#68 Feb 26, 2009
Proud American wrote:
<quoted text>Seriously?.....8 Gripes on the same forum!..You gripe, moan and beetch, and question others.
Please do us all a favor, and make your next posting YOUR solution instead of putting down everyone that you dont agree with.
Patriot Missile=WHINER
lol..8 whines in the same forum
Where's your solution?
rudedog

Roseland, NJ

#69 Feb 26, 2009
PatriotMissile wrote:
<quoted text>
My first solution is to let business operate as business always has, cost and risk analysis bounced off of possible profit margins. If there's profit to be made, Regency and Foster would jump at this WITHOUT asking for our tax dollars.
As for what to do with that site other than another empty strip mall, there needs to be something unique to El Paso, and unique to the region. On a previous forum about this issue, I suggested a large inland aquarium, to draw tourism from all around this area here, rather than elsewhere, which would bring new money funnelling into the economy; not simply redistribute what's already here. An undertaking such as this would also require technical and biological specialists, and offer a place for the best and brightest among El Pasoens to work without going far for long. That would boost tourism, even draw tourism from the cities that El Pasoens normally go to, AND it would bring technical experts in fields that El Paso is severly lacking in to El Paso, bringing new money into our economy, and hopefully keeping some of the intelligent El Pasoens around, so that those with two brain cells to rub together will come up with ideas that'll help El Paso as a whole, and stop the "me" thinkers, like the City Council, County Commissioners, and most of the current business leaders, such as Foster and De La Vega, from running the city without intelligent, organized opposition.
now we're talking. an aquarium would be great. something other that consumption.
Bill

Austin, TX

#70 Feb 26, 2009
An aquarium in the middle of the desert? Yeah, that totally makes sense! El Paso could become known for having the best aquatic displays in the country! Totally makes sense SINCE WE'RE NOWHERE EVEN CLOSE TO AN OCEAN.

I mean, you were joking right?

Seriously, all you people with grand ideas about what would be "cool" to put there clearly have never owned a business.

Do you really think enough El Pasoans and outside tourists would visit this aquarium to keep it open? We barely sell out concerts and sporting events, how would this work?
Bill

Austin, TX

#71 Feb 26, 2009
Also, if the retail development at the Farah is required to have no more than 10 percent of existing stores, how is that not beneficial. What's wrong with some new stores in El Paso, a city that already lags behind other big Texas cities?

“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#72 Feb 26, 2009
Bill wrote:
An aquarium in the middle of the desert? Yeah, that totally makes sense! El Paso could become known for having the best aquatic displays in the country! Totally makes sense SINCE WE'RE NOWHERE EVEN CLOSE TO AN OCEAN.
I mean, you were joking right?
Seriously, all you people with grand ideas about what would be "cool" to put there clearly have never owned a business.
Do you really think enough El Pasoans and outside tourists would visit this aquarium to keep it open? We barely sell out concerts and sporting events, how would this work?
Bill,

I ask you the same, where's your solution?

We don't sell out concerts because those same concerts go to all the cities that we would normally draw from. That and most are canceled because El Pasoens wait until the day of to buy tickets, where any self-respecting band isn't going to play unless they're sold out 2 months in advance.

An aquarium in this region would be unique, and would be an attractant simply because we're in the middle of the desert. Unlike those concerts you mentioned, no one else anywhere close to here has an aquarium. It would also require highly specialized technical jobs that would have to be drawn from outside of El Paso, hence, getting new blood, outside of the military, to move here. It would open up biological and aquatic fields for the high school and "JUTEP" to study and take part in, improving education. And, it would suck in tourist money, not just local money, which would introduce new money into the El Paso community rather than simply recycling what is already here.

Take critical thinking 101. It'll help before you go showing your ass.

“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#73 Feb 26, 2009
Bill wrote:
Also, if the retail development at the Farah is required to have no more than 10 percent of existing stores, how is that not beneficial. What's wrong with some new stores in El Paso, a city that already lags behind other big Texas cities?
New stores at a new strip mall will be more of the same. Mindless minimum wage blue-collar service industry jobs that will take profits and send them to corporate headquarters elsewhere in the country rather than leaving them here and enriching the El Paso community. It will, in effect, take MORE money out of our economy and send it elsewhere. Especially with the 10 years or #12 million, whichever comes first tax breaks that were offered WITHOUT A SINGLE VOTER HAVING ANY SAY. To add insult to injury, they were offered to a man who is richer than the next five richest people in the city, out of the pockets of those who live in a city where the median salary is $21K a year. This is a good deal ONLY for those select few who will get the contracts to demolish and build the strip mall, and of course Foster, who gets to pawn off a defunt site that he purposely allowed to sit defunct for a decade. Not to mention our glorious City Council and County Commissioners, who, I'm sure received a hefty bonus from Mr. Foster himself for selling El Paso taxes so cheaply. Where do you think Regency will be in 10 years when the profits (OUR taxes) stop rolling in? Just another strip mall that will end up with empty store fronts, like the rest of the city.

And completely unimaginative, with absolutely NO tourist draw whatsoever.
rudedog

Roseland, NJ

#74 Feb 26, 2009
albuquerque has one and they are not close to an ocean. but i guess you have a point. the reason nothing sells out is that nothing good comes to el paso. last time i checked all the good concerts go to albuquerque which has an aquarium!
rudedog

Roseland, NJ

#75 Feb 26, 2009
Bill wrote:
An aquarium in the middle of the desert? Yeah, that totally makes sense! El Paso could become known for having the best aquatic displays in the country! Totally makes sense SINCE WE'RE NOWHERE EVEN CLOSE TO AN OCEAN.
I mean, you were joking right?
Seriously, all you people with grand ideas about what would be "cool" to put there clearly have never owned a business.
Do you really think enough El Pasoans and outside tourists would visit this aquarium to keep it open? We barely sell out concerts and sporting events, how would this work?
didnt the UT vs. UTEP game almost sell out. how do you explain that?
Bill

Austin, TX

#76 Feb 26, 2009
Why don't you call the folks at the zoo and see how well they have been doing over the last few years...Seriously, an aquarium is a ridiculous idea. As for my idea - retail development is fine. If it fails, then it fails and the rich people you hate (are jealous of) so much will have to sell it or shut it down. That's how it works in America...

As for your quote, "WITHOUT A SINGLE VOTER HAVING ANY SAY.."

You have your say at county commission meetings or council meetings, not to mention YOU elect the council people and county commissioners. And don't say you can't go to the meetings because of work...you sure spend enough time on here immediately replying to dozens of posts per day...I think you have plenty of time to go to a meeting and express your opinion...
hemlock

AOL

#77 Feb 26, 2009
You have your say at county commission meetings or council meetings, not to mention YOU elect the council people and county commissioners. And don't say you can't go to the meetings because of work...you sure spend enough time on here immediately replying to dozens of posts per day...I think you have plenty of time to go to a meeting and express your opinion...

Oh please! Have you read about what goes on here? MONEY=POLICY ....period!!!!!!

That cannot be debated. I have yet to see a citizen change the mind of any elected offical by simply going to the podium and making their points. It's already done by the time we know about it.

Remember our choice for county judge? babs unethical perez...or tony crook cobos. lordy

“Feel The Force”

Since: Dec 08

Fort Huachuca, AZ

#78 Feb 26, 2009
Bill wrote:
Why don't you call the folks at the zoo and see how well they have been doing over the last few years...Seriously, an aquarium is a ridiculous idea. As for my idea - retail development is fine. If it fails, then it fails and the rich people you hate (are jealous of) so much will have to sell it or shut it down. That's how it works in America...
As for your quote, "WITHOUT A SINGLE VOTER HAVING ANY SAY.."
You have your say at county commission meetings or council meetings, not to mention YOU elect the council people and county commissioners. And don't say you can't go to the meetings because of work...you sure spend enough time on here immediately replying to dozens of posts per day...I think you have plenty of time to go to a meeting and express your opinion...
Yes well, there's quite a bit of difference between driving out to the County seat and logging onto the Internet, isn't there. Aside from that, all anyone would be able to express is their opinion their, not actually vote on it. Those idiots didn't get my vote, they only got elected because of the retard mindset to vote straight Democratic ticket, which people were instructed to do, primarily in Spanish, at the poll itself, which is illegal.

If they were to REALLY let the voters have a say, they'd actually put it on a ballot and let the actual voters vote on it. But, since it would be a yes or no vote, and not subject to a straight yes or no voting block, as the parties are, they'd lose and there goes their big pay off from Foster.

I have no issue with retail succeeding or failing, as long as it's done on their own dime, not on the backs and sweat of the tax payers, as is the case here. I also have nothing against rich people. Most of them actually earn their money, though around here the rich seem to be excessively corrupt, Paul Foster is a great example of that. It's the corruption I have a problem with.

BTW, I'm a member of the zoological society here, and they're doing quite well. They're actually about to open up an African section within the next year or so, and have opened quite a few new areas, with new animals in the last two years.

Now, again, I ask, where is your brilliant idea to help the local economy? Or are you a Foster parrot, standing behind him and saying "What he said!" after he comes up with an idea to make (take) money without costing him a penny?

An aquarium is only a ridiculous idea to those who wouldn't make any money out of it. I have actually bounced that idea off of quite a few locals, none of whom are of the 6 or 7 companies that routinely get construction contracts, like Jobe, mind you; but everyone I've talked to would LOVE to go to an aquarium without have to drive 6 - 12 hours, and universally agree that it would be a huge tourist draw from the surrounding desert areas, like West Texas, New Mexico, and Arizona.
Tom

El Paso, TX

#79 Mar 1, 2009
rudedog wrote:
albuquerque has one and they are not close to an ocean. but i guess you have a point. the reason nothing sells out is that nothing good comes to el paso. last time i checked all the good concerts go to albuquerque which has an aquarium!
When is Bon Jovi, KISS, Scorpions, Van Halen, and others playing? Give me the website of the concerts. Your right each time I pass Alb. someone is going there and it is not lousy tribute bands. Rock on.
No to Fosterville

El Paso, TX

#80 Mar 1, 2009
PatriotMissile wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes well, there's quite a bit of difference between driving out to the County seat and logging onto the Internet, isn't there. Aside from that, all anyone would be able to express is their opinion their, not actually vote on it. Those idiots didn't get my vote, they only got elected because of the retard mindset to vote straight Democratic ticket, which people were instructed to do, primarily in Spanish, at the poll itself, which is illegal.
If they were to REALLY let the voters have a say, they'd actually put it on a ballot and let the actual voters vote on it. But, since it would be a yes or no vote, and not subject to a straight yes or no voting block, as the parties are, they'd lose and there goes their big pay off from Foster.
I have no issue with retail succeeding or failing, as long as it's done on their own dime, not on the backs and sweat of the tax payers, as is the case here. I also have nothing against rich people. Most of them actually earn their money, though around here the rich seem to be excessively corrupt, Paul Foster is a great example of that. It's the corruption I have a problem with.
BTW, I'm a member of the zoological society here, and they're doing quite well. They're actually about to open up an African section within the next year or so, and have opened quite a few new areas, with new animals in the last two years.
Now, again, I ask, where is your brilliant idea to help the local economy? Or are you a Foster parrot, standing behind him and saying "What he said!" after he comes up with an idea to make (take) money without costing him a penny?
An aquarium is only a ridiculous idea to those who wouldn't make any money out of it. I have actually bounced that idea off of quite a few locals, none of whom are of the 6 or 7 companies that routinely get construction contracts, like Jobe, mind you; but everyone I've talked to would LOVE to go to an aquarium without have to drive 6 - 12 hours, and universally agree that it would be a huge tourist draw from the surrounding desert areas, like West Texas, New Mexico, and Arizona.
Agree with almost everything. Taxes should be paid by everyone and welcome the new businesses. Build the infrastructure and without taxpayer help. The aquarium would be something and should already be here.

The disagreement is leave politics aside. The discussion is no to tax breaks for these individuals.

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