Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

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The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
Dust Storm

Minneapolis, MN

#475508 Sep 9, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah yeah, the 1054 date, when 'we split' from you. I get that you say you are the true church. Fine, it doesn't bother me at all. I respect the Orthodox faith.
You should consider the next thousand yrs after the split though, the Orthodox went into relative obscurity. Even today, most of the world doesn't know you, and certainly doesn't understand what you guys believe to be truth. I've conversed with 4 different Orthodox on this forum and I am still confused.
This would be a good start Clay. http://www.catholicbridge.com/catholic/orthod...

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#475509 Sep 9, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah yeah, the 1054 date, when 'we split' from you. I get that you say you are the true church. Fine, it doesn't bother me at all. I respect the Orthodox faith.
You should consider the next thousand yrs after the split though, the Orthodox went into relative obscurity. Even today, most of the world doesn't know you, and certainly doesn't understand what you guys believe to be truth. I've conversed with 4 different Orthodox on this forum and I am still confused.
==========
OK, so you are "confused" by Orthodoxy but understand this:
The Division of Dogma follow the lines of the divisions of faith.
(1) GENERAL OR SPECIAL (2) MATERIAL OR FORMAL (3) PURE OR MIXED (4) SYMBOLIC OR NON-SYMBOLIC;
==========
Dogmas also can differ according to their various degrees of necessity.
SPECIAL DOGMAS are the truths revealed in private revelations. Special Dogmas, therefore, are not, strictly speaking, dogmas at all. They are not Revealed Truths transmitted from the Apostles They are not Defined or Proposed by the Church for the Acceptance of the Faithful Generally.
==========
MATERIAL DOGMAS (or Divine Dogmas, or Dogmas in themselves, in se) when abstraction is made from their definition by the Church, when they are considered only as Revealed; and they are called Formal Dogmas (or Catholic, or "in relation to us", quoad nos) when they are considered Both as Revealed and Defined.
PURE DOGMAS ( can be known only from Revelation), as the Trinity, Incarnation, etc.;
==========
The infallibility of the Magisterium extends also to teachings which are deduced from such truths (FIDES ECCLESIASTICA). These Church teachings or Catholic truths (VERITATES CATHOLICAE) are not a part of divine revelation, yet are intimately related to it. The rejection of these "secondary" teachings is not heretical, but involves the impairment of full communion with the Catholic Church.[23]
FIDES ECCLESIASTICA
There are three categories of these "SECONDARY" TEACHINGS (FIDES ECCLESIASTICA):
•THEOLOGICAL CONCLUSIONS:(conclusiones theologicae) religious truths, deduced from divine revelation and reason.
•DOGMATIC FACTS (facta dogmatica) historical facts, not part of revelation but clearly related to it. For example the legitimacy of the papacy of Pope Benedict XVI, and the Petrine office
•PHILOSOPHICAL TRUTHS, such as existence of the soul, "freedom of will", philosophical definitions used in dogmas such as transubstantiation
==========
1.De fide Divine revelations with the highest degree of certainty, considered infallible revelation
2.Fides ecclesiastica Church teachings, which have been definitively decided on by the Magisterium, considered infallible revelation
3.Sententia fidei proxima Church teachings, which are generally accepted as divine revelation but not defined as such by the magisterium
4.Sententia certa Church teachings without final approval but clearly deduced from revelation
5.Sententia communis Teachings which are popular but within the free range of theological research
6.Sententia probabilis Teachings with low degree of certainty
7.Opinio tolerata Opinions tolerated within the Catholic Church, such as pious legends
==========
ENCYCLICALS
Pope Pius XII stated in Humani Generis, that PAPAL ENCYCLICALS, even when they are not ex cathedra, can nonetheless be sufficiently authoritative to end theological debate on a particular question:

RAN OUT OF ROOM

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#475510 Sep 9, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Man-made texts trying to define, as you stated, sufficient clarity that they can then discover God through living and relationship "The Eucharist is a mystery" to continue a ruse and mislead others.
Way to go!!
Self.
New Age Though I know of my church's position of consubstantiality,the church also says they used that concept reluctantly and did not go into specifics of how the change occurs.My own judgment is its best not to speculate about things that surpass our minds knowledge and processes and then try to capture it in language which is also limited. The church always gets into trouble when it assumes it can explain the mind and workings of God.I am of the position that we should explain enough to give people some coordinates and then then let them discover God's Truths through relationship with him and through living the Truths

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#475511 Sep 9, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
BTW GiF - the main focal point for your supposed "scriptures" should be "God".
Looks like you failed at that too.
Your focal point is neither GOD nor JESUS...

IT IS SELF...

THAT IS ALL THAT YOU ATTEMPT TO GLORIFY...

YOU ALWAYS PRESENT YOUR SELF AS YOUR SAVIOR...

YOU ARE IN FOR A RUDE AWAKENING ...WHEN YOU FACE GOD...

A SELF MADE PERSON..CAN ALWAYS BE IDENTIFIED BY THE SIZE OF THEIR MOUTH.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#475513 Sep 9, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
He was catholic - which supercedes your version of Catholic.
Accept the truth Dan, the history is secure.
But alas, trying to protect man's virtues is how it always has been, huh?
The arrogance of Christianity.
*sighs*
The ignorance of Gnosticism.

Diocletian wasn't a Christian.

He persecuted Christians.
hojo

Minneapolis, MN

#475514 Sep 9, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
<quoted text>
Love it!!!! Stay on course!!!! Continue calling your pope a liar!!!
The NABre pope approved Catlick bible says: Church: this word (Greek ekkl&#275;sia) occurs in the gospels only here and in Mt 18:17 (twice). Jesus’ church means the community that he will gather and that, like a building, will have Peter as its solid foundation. That function of Peter consists in his being witness to Jesus as the Messiah, the Son of the living God.
The largest denomination in the USA is the Catholic denomination...tain't what Christ built!!!!
It matters not "one iota" to ANY of us Catholics, as to WHAT you believe!! You, Ox, are a bible only "self-interpreting" ---- "island unto yourself"---with (ZERO) credibility in which (little or none) of your other contradicting 42,000+ Protestant "fundies" believe you EITHER. We, as Catholics know the biblical and historical TRUTH, that Jesus Christ initiated, established and formed ONE TRUE APOSTOLIC CHURCH and it was Catholic. You can believe ALL the Protestant lies and the fraudulent anti-catholic BS that you want!! IT IS ALL YOURS!!!!
marge

Ames, IA

#475515 Sep 9, 2013
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>New Age Though I know of my church's position of consubstantiality,the church also says they used that concept reluctantly and did not go into specifics of how the change occurs.My own judgment is its best not to speculate about things that surpass our minds knowledge and processes and then try to capture it in language which is also limited. The church always gets into trouble when it assumes it can explain the mind and workings of God.I am of the position that we should explain enough to give people some coordinates and then then let them discover God's Truths through relationship with him and through living the Truths
That sounds good Hermi but clearly Jesus was not giving His disciples literally His flesh and blood to consume.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#475516 Sep 9, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
It matters not "one iota" to ANY of us Catholics, as to WHAT you believe!! You, Ox, are a bible only "self-interpreting" ---- "island unto yourself"---with (ZERO) credibility in which (little or none) of your other contradicting 42,000+ Protestant "fundies" believe you EITHER. We, as Catholics know the biblical and historical TRUTH, that Jesus Christ initiated, established and formed ONE TRUE APOSTOLIC CHURCH and it was Catholic. You can believe ALL the Protestant lies and the fraudulent anti-catholic BS that you want!! IT IS ALL YOURS!!!!
Love it!!!! Stay on course!!!! Continue calling your pope a liar!!!

The NABre pope approved Catlick bible says: Church: this word (Greek ekklsia) occurs in the gospels only here and in Mt 18:17 (twice). Jesus’ church means the community that he will gather and that, like a building, will have Peter as its solid foundation. That function of Peter consists in his being witness to Jesus as the Messiah, the Son of the living God.

The largest denomination in the USA is the Catholic denomination...tain't what Christ built!!!!

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#475517 Sep 9, 2013
Rosesz
You never answered my question: Do you have any idea what Christ said must, absolutely, without any doubt whatever, no exceptions, happen for you to enter into Heaven?????

You, evidently, don't know, or you would have replied.

You call God, Father. No one can claim that status as a natural birthright...some are children of the father of all lies...the devil..

Share with us the events that occurred in your life that culminated in you becoming one of His daughters...
truth

Perth, Australia

#475518 Sep 10, 2013
Diocletian is been rule as many rule exist on the world since Adam and Eva..whats problem with that..
its not be very easy rule..
then explain education='we a pen $'=o you scribe o you this or that..

d io cleti kletti curse
kelti celtic

see words

in beginning is word

i follow in past mount's numbers

147
see each semaphore.semw phore=see words
see i past direction around buildings art as geometric direction i don't relize what stay within buildings station too..

but i find something with geometric direction someone as something who live on big huge farm
must be weathbelt..as well i find stars as kate

as well
what i see
i am not going tell you its going not to promise understood from anyone if i wrote

but you never know what you can see in your dream..maybe dream is very bad dream but can be as well very bad things..

me
noooooooo

i don't prepare nothing if i see
but i will drove correction what ever and so ever..

if you liked go further you will find me there
where on CROSS INRI..take your Cross and go..

i walk in this city ..in future not will be nothing not at all..i am very tired
truth

Perth, Australia

#475519 Sep 10, 2013
rule its mean measure
centimeter meters km and so on

they say
you can't search king or queen heart no meassure..

i say to you
who search they will find

you not explain magnet field
Clay

Chicago, IL

#475520 Sep 10, 2013
Seraphima wrote:
<quoted text>Then stick to what is simple for you.The Orthodox is concerns is to preserve the Faith not in numbers or changing to please others.
But aren't you the one who said there will 'just be another split' if the Orthodox and Catholics reunite? That language sounds stubborn. Truth can't keep splitting. Haven't the Protestants split enough? They are some kinda mutant form of a evangelical religion now; completely unrecognizable to anything the Apostles taught. Splits have caused this. Lots and lots of splits.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#475521 Sep 10, 2013
Seraphima wrote:
<quoted text>Then stick to what is simple for you.The Orthodox is concerns is to preserve the Faith not in numbers or changing to please others.
Preserving the faith is good. But I think Jesus also wanted us to evangelize. I can look at a map and see (since 1054) that the Catholic Church brought the faith to much of the globe, while the Orthodox largely stayed in your respective communities. The CC did this in spite of the turmoil around them; the crusade wars against Muslims and protesters who were trying to undo the faith.. It was still important to spread the Gospel.
Like I said, today, the Bishop of Rome -representing the Lords Church- is visible for everyone to see. Even people on a south pacific secluded island know who the Bishop of Rome is and the faith which he preaches.
To me, that has the clear markings of the true Church that Jesus Christ started. Christian teachings outside of this Church are scattered all over the place. Truth is not so clear. People don't know what one Christian sect teaches from the one across the street. If salvation is so important, wouldn't truth have to be conveyed without error? Well, only one can be right than.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#475522 Sep 10, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
But aren't you the one who said there will 'just be another split' if the Orthodox and Catholics reunite? That language sounds stubborn. Truth can't keep splitting. Haven't the Protestants split enough? They are some kinda mutant form of a evangelical religion now; completely unrecognizable to anything the Apostles taught. Splits have caused this. Lots and lots of splits.
~~~

You talk of protestants as if you are not one...

You not only have joined yourself up with a group of those that teach Constantin-ism as apposed to Christianity ...like the devil ....you claim to be authentic..

Roman Catholicism protested/left.. true Christianity eons ago...

God worked through the renaissance and reformation to attempt to draw your wondering religious organization back to Himself

But

your religious organization...rebelled and has strayed further away...

Act_7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

Rom_13:2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

Pro 1:22 How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?

Pro 1:23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

Pro 1:24 Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded;

Pro 1:25 But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof:

Pro 1:26 I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;

Pro 1:27 When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you.

Pro 1:28 Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me:

Pro 1:29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD:

Pro 1:30 They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof.

Pro 1:31 Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices.

Pro 1:32 For the turning away of the simple shall slay them, and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them.


Pro 1:33 But whoso hearkeneth unto me shall dwell safely, and shall be quiet from fear of evil.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#475523 Sep 10, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
Rosesz
You never answered my question: Do you have any idea what Christ said must, absolutely, without any doubt whatever, no exceptions, happen for you to enter into Heaven?????
You, evidently, don't know, or you would have replied.
You call God, Father. No one can claim that status as a natural birthright...some are children of the father of all lies...the devil..
Share with us the events that occurred in your life that culminated in you becoming one of His daughters...
~~~

You are always saying...

"You never answered my question:"

WHO ARE YOU... to require answers of any one.../

If you are attempting to learn it might be legit to ask questions..

But

If you are attempting to teach...cease your personal opinions and private

interpretations...

Give the eternal word of God..

Let the other person

learn from ....GOD BREATHED (HOLY GHOST ANOINTED/INSPIRED) WORD ..

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is

quick, and

powerful, and

sharper than any twoedged sword,

piercing even to the dividing asunder

of soul and

spirit, and

of the

joints and

marrow, and

is a discerner of the thoughts and

intents of the heart.

Heb 4:13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do.
___

THE PSALMIST WROTE.

Psa 119:89 . For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven.

Psa 119:90 Thy faithfulness is unto all generations: thou hast established the earth, and it abideth.

Psa 119:91 They continue this day according to thine ordinances: for all are thy servants.
every false way.

Psa 119:105 NUN. Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.

Psa 119:106 I have sworn, and I will perform it, that I will keep thy righteous judgments.

Psa 119:107 I am afflicted very much: quicken me, O LORD, according unto thy word.

Psa 119:108 Accept, I beseech thee, the freewill offerings of my mouth, O LORD, and teach me thy judgments.

Psa 119:109 My soul is continually in my hand: yet do I not forget thy

law.
Psa 119:110 The wicked have laid a snare for me: yet I erred not from thy precepts.

Psa 119:111 Thy testimonies have I taken as an heritage for ever: for they are the rejoicing of my heart.

Psa 119:112 I have inclined mine heart to perform thy statutes alway, even unto the end.

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

#475524 Sep 10, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
But aren't you the one who said there will 'just be another split' if the Orthodox and Catholics reunite? That language sounds stubborn. Truth can't keep splitting. Haven't the Protestants split enough? They are some kinda mutant form of a evangelical religion now; completely unrecognizable to anything the Apostles taught. Splits have caused this. Lots and lots of splits.
Look Clay, believe what you want but any Orthodox will tell you that they believe the Orthodox Church is the true church that Christ founded.The Church began in the East not the west and survived to this day carrying and preserving the faith.This will always be a disagreement between us.And again,they will be spilt within the Orthodox Church if they are to reunite.Not all Orthodox view this as a good thing.

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

#475525 Sep 10, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Preserving the faith is good. But I think Jesus also wanted us to evangelize. I can look at a map and see (since 1054) that the Catholic Church brought the faith to much of the globe, while the Orthodox largely stayed in your respective communities. The CC did this in spite of the turmoil around them; the crusade wars against Muslims and protesters who were trying to undo the faith.. It was still important to spread the Gospel.
Like I said, today, the Bishop of Rome -representing the Lords Church- is visible for everyone to see. Even people on a south pacific secluded island know who the Bishop of Rome is and the faith which he preaches.
To me, that has the clear markings of the true Church that Jesus Christ started. Christian teachings outside of this Church are scattered all over the place. Truth is not so clear. People don't know what one Christian sect teaches from the one across the street. If salvation is so important, wouldn't truth have to be conveyed without error? Well, only one can be right than.
Just because the Catholic church has spread as you say vastly throughout the world does not mean that your church is the true church. it could also mean the something else which I wont get into.I wouldn't call a bunch of uneducated indian tribes in the jungles of nowhere being able to understand the deepness of the Christian faith and its full meaning.Numbers mean nothing if the Faith is not preserved.The Church stand on the Trueth and Actions of Christ,his Love and Compassion for non Christians and the free will of HIs Love.......

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#475526 Sep 10, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
But aren't you the one who said there will 'just be another split' if the Orthodox and Catholics reunite? That language sounds stubborn. Truth can't keep splitting. Haven't the Protestants split enough? They are some kinda mutant form of a evangelical religion now; completely unrecognizable to anything the Apostles taught. Splits have caused this. Lots and lots of splits.

~~~

THE APOSTLE PAUL WROTE CONCERNING... DIVISIONS/FACTIONS/SPLITS...


1Co 11:18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.

NOTE

1Co 11:19 ==> For there must be also heresies among you,

that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. <==

Since: Jul 08

Powell, OH

#475527 Sep 10, 2013
What?

Did June bug out of here?

I'm gonna miss her like I'd miss a carbuncle on my caboose.

"June bug"

**snort**

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#475528 Sep 10, 2013
confrinting with the word wrote:
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
But aren't you the one who said there will 'just be another split' if the Orthodox and Catholics reunite? That language sounds stubborn. Truth can't keep splitting. Haven't the Protestants split enough? They are some kinda mutant form of a evangelical religion now; completely unrecognizable to anything the Apostles taught. Splits have caused this. Lots and lots of splits.
~~~
THE APOSTLE PAUL WROTE CONCERNING... DIVISIONS/FACTIONS/SPLITS...
1Co 11:18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
NOTE
1Co 11:19 ==> For there must be also heresies among you,
that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. <==
~~~

FACTIONS DIVIDES THE SHEEP FROM THE GOATS..

JUST AS THE REFORMATION AND RENAISSANCE HAVE DIVIDED THE SHEEP FROM THE

ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH AND MADE MANIFEST THOSE THAT GOD APPROVES..

~~~
YOU ROMAN CATHOLICS COMPARE/MEASURE/COMMEND YOURSELVES BY YOURSELVES..

2Co 10:12 For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.

THE BIBLE /WORD OF GOD..IS OUR MEASURE.

2Co 10:13 But we will not boast of things without our measure, but according to the measure of the rule which God hath distributed to us, a measure to reach even unto you.

2Co 10:14 For we stretch not ourselves beyond our measure, as though we reached not unto you: for we are come as far as to you also in preaching the gospel of Christ:

2Co 10:15 Not boasting of things without our measure, that is, of other men's labours; but having hope, when your faith is increased, that we shall be enlarged by you according to our rule abundantly,

ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD

2Co 10:16 To preach the gospel in the regions beyond you, and not to boast in another man's line of things made ready to our hand.

2Co 10:17 But he that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

NOTE
2Co 10:18 For not he that commendeth himself is approved, but whom the Lord commendeth.

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