Roman Catholic church only true churc...

Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

There are 641127 comments on the CBC News story from Jul 10, 2007, titled Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican. In it, CBC News reports that:

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CBC News.

Just Sayin

Nashville, TN

#473338 Aug 27, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
Another thought on this post is, you sure have a lot of unanswered questions for others. What are youur answers to these same questions?
If you claim, that these are for our benefit [Self], why even be a partcipant in religion if your spirituality is restricted?
You don't limit "God", do you, like Christianity has done?
<quoted text>
If you would like calrification of the question, then don't be shy or frustrated without responding, ask for clarity.
That is why it makes no sense to you, because you seem to refuse to follow-up on what it does mean.
Your question:
"Why be a participant in religion if your spirituality is restricted?"
My answer:
Firstly, Catholicism is not a "religion" in so far as it was not man who came up with it, it was God. One doesn't "participate" in Catholicism, one participates in a relationship with God. Catholicism teaches the way to have a healthy relationship with Him. Catholicism is not one religion among many, each "just as good" as the next.
Secondly, if you are trying to say that Catholicism restricts people's spirituality, all I can say is that you are wrong, or at least that your idea of non-restricted spirituality is very different than mine.
Come to think of it, describe what you think/feel is unrestricted spirituality. I'm curious.
hojo

Minneapolis, MN

#473339 Aug 27, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Listen Baptist hojo, you don't hold any truth, you never did.
You are correct New Age!...... I don't hold ANY truth, but Jesus Christ and HIS One TRUE Apostolic Catholic DOES hold the TRUTH!!!! And furthermore, it holds the FULLNESS of that TRUTH....Everything else; Every other Protestant bible only denomination since the Reformation has " gradually rejected" more and more of that truth, until today in the 21st century, all there is left is a hodge-podge of divided denominations of individual (half-truth) beliefs where each person "interprets their own truth ( better known as "relative truth"!!
Plain Jane

Orlando, FL

#473342 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
In the Old Testament times, God had chosen a group of people to reveal Himself to primarily. And through them, others could come to know God. As well as in the New Testament times, God has chosen a group of people to reveal Himself to primarily, and that is His Church. And through the Church, others might come to the knowledge of His revelation to mankind.
So like the old Tribes of Israel, Catholics are now God's new chosen people.

I've never heard that before. Where can we find this new Catholic teaching?
Pad

Rockford, IL

#473343 Aug 27, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course I studied the bible. That's how I recognized the lies.
You could do it too ... if only you would pay heed and tribute to your conscience for instance that a god of love would not allow a hell to exist anywhere, any time in his kingdom. That is a contradiction of terms ... one among many.
I recognized that was a lie when I was still a child.
I never believed in the existence of hell ... whether it was for Catholics, Protestants ... or those that disobeyed the teachings by the warring theologians in other religions.
Why does H e l l bother you so much June? So you think that if I agree with you God should not have it,and that it does not exist,because we do not believe it exists,that all of a sudden it will disappear?

I hate the whole concept of heaven and hell,actually I would like a place that makes everyone a changed vessel,so that they will throw away thinking that is garbage,and open their hearts and minds to God the Creator.But the Book tells us that both heaven and hell do exist and that those who reject evil and cling to the GOOD will ultimately go to heaven,and the opposite will end up in hell.

I did not make up the Bible,and even though I may not get goose bumps everytime I read it,it does set in my spirit a conformity to what is truth vs what is a lie.It bothers me everytime I read about the Hebrews killing everyone living in the places they took over,and when whole multitudes are wiped out,I think of the human suffering,as I am a human being.I do not get excited when the wicked suffer,nor do I want to see them all destroyed.Nevertheless,it troubles me when the wicked escape earthly judgment.But since I am only human,I have come to realize that heaven,hell,even the concept of purgatory as the Catholics believe are far above my own intellect.I cannot change what IS,I can only deal with my personality,and ask the LORD to change me from within.HE DOES just that! So all the things that are out there that I cannot change will have to remain either TRUTH or a LIE.

You want those things that trouble you to go away June,and sorry dear one,but the truth remains real,in spite of what you think,and lies remain active as long as human beings support them also.I do not doubt that God wants more than anything to set you straight that HE is not a Lie,but the ONE who will erase all doubt in you so that you can know HE is all Truth!
Clay

Garden City, MI

#473344 Aug 27, 2013
Helpful Hints wrote:
<quoted text>When you say Catholic church do you mean the white pagan Roman Catholic Church of Mithra, the Jerusalem Catholic Church, the Antioch Catholic Church, the Alexandria Catholic Church or the Turkey Catholic Church?
White pagan Roman Catholic Church?? Whatever that is. Lol
The Catholic Church consist of over 20 Churches, in communion with the Bishop of Rome (Pope Francis).
'Roman' Catholic is a label that's not officially in use by the Church @ Rome. In fact,'Roman' is really a term that's used primarily in the English speaking world. It was first used by the Anglicans because they wanted to act like they were the Catholic Church and the people who follow the Pope, would now be called 'Roman' Catholics.
The Roman Catholic Church is the Church of the West.(I believe there are 22 other Catholic Churches of the East. But they still follow the Roman Pontif.)
Whatever, the Church is the Church. Our Lord started one.
'Catholic' is a Greek word meaning 'Universal'. Its original purpose was an Adjective describing the Church. Latin, Bryzantine Catholic, Syrian Catholic, Coptic, Oriental, Ethiopian, Greek, Roman etc, are all universal (Catholic) Churches.
Clay

Garden City, MI

#473345 Aug 27, 2013
Plain Jane wrote:
<quoted text>
So like the old Tribes of Israel, Catholics are now God's new chosen people.
I've never heard that before. Where can we find this new Catholic teaching?
If Jesus Christ is God; And He started a Church....this Church would obviously replace Israel.
Its not a new teaching. Its as old as the Apostles.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#473346 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
What? Have you never read the Old Testament? Remember how God told Noah to build an ark by which His chosen might be saved? Remember how God spoke through a burning bush to Moses? Remember how Moses, at God's instruction, took his rod and cast it down before pharaoh and it turned into a snake? Remember the serpent on the pole that God told Moses to make so that the people who looked upon it might be healed?(Num 21:8) Have you never read the book of Exodus where God instructs Moses how God wanted the Tabernacle to be made? Did you just gloss over the elaborate detail involved? And how about the altar? The holy vessels to be used on the altar? The Ark of the Covenant? Remember how God told Moses to put the images of the seraphim on top of it? What about the temple Solomon built for God? Have you read how it was made? The details? The carvings, the olive trees, palm trees, pomegranates, oxen, lions? The cherub statues? The ephod and the theraphim and priestly garments?
Didn't God say to use water for baptism? Didn't Jesus use spit and mud as a paste to cure blindness? Indeed didn't Jesus become Incarnate Himself?
You really think God doesn't use matter to convey His graces and His messages?
All these things are not for God's benefit, but for ours.
"But when that which is perfect has come." The very fact that Jesus is the Word,and that we have the WORD today,gives us a Door of openness,that has been hidden from those of the old covenant for centuries.YET God in His mercy as recorded in Hebrews still met the needs of those old patriarchs and women who followed God without ever experiencing what we can have today.

The Bible in its full extent with both the OLD and NEW Covenants brings us to not only faith,but to practice and endeavor that INCLUDES God rather than to just obtain a religious belief system.

Believing in God and following a set of rules and regulations,doing certain things to our person in order to please God no longer applies to us as believers in Christ.His sacrifice or rather from HIS holy Incarnation thru to the Resurrection brings a way of life to us as believers and saints in Him,that is not possible in any other religious structure.

God did not want a totalitarian way of life with His Hebrews(Jews),He wanted to be their: God,King,only Love,Friend,Savior,Protector,G uide,Comforter,and so on.

Since the Jews had to come by this the hard way through Canon Law and whatever,they could not perceive that God could be anything but a delegator of law and commands.Only a few Prophets,and leaders of Jewish generations really knew the full heart of God.The People for the most part missed the mark,even when God showed tremendous ways of deliverance for them.

We are no different today.Unless we open our eyes to the New Covenant and allow Jesus to birth in us through the Holy Spirit that spiritual New Creation,we are in the dark as to what the will and heart of God is for us.We are quick to follow rules and regulations,and to do something physical to try to please God,and of course wearing things that might appeal to the Kingdom as well.

But in Christianity and through the written pages of the New Testament,we can have the reality of living as New Creatures in Christ Jesus.That does not require the use of images to kneel before and kiss,as God is in our hearts,He is real to us from within,we do not have to seek Him through that which we create with our hands,to represent Him.For the Kingdom of the Father is within us.
Just Sayin

Nashville, TN

#473347 Aug 27, 2013
Plain Jane wrote:
<quoted text>
So like the old Tribes of Israel, Catholics are now God's new chosen people.
I've never heard that before. Where can we find this new Catholic teaching?
You can start in the Bible.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473348 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
If God were to reveal Himself to you in all His entirety (not veiling HImself in any way) and tell you everything He knows and everything about Himself, do you think you could understand it all and retain it all?
I'm smart - yes. In the least, I rcvd directly what "God" wants to do - and not thorugh some unknown author.

Why?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473349 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
If God were to reveal Himself to you in all His entirety (not veiling HImself in any way) and tell you everything He knows and everything about Himself, do you think you could understand it all and retain it all?
Don't you love these "IF" games people play?

What "IF" Christianity uses all of what Jesus taught, do you think they would understand the message he was trying to convey - better?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473350 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
"Replaced" does not equal "fulfilled."
That was my point.
The NT did not "replace" the OT. The NT *fulfilled* the OT.
That is why I "promote" Jewish stuff, because it is the background for Christian stuff.
As I stated to Anthony - no it doesn't.

The Jews only accept Jesus as a prophet, lower than "God", and not as the "Messiah".

No fulfillment.

IMO - "replaced" is a better description, because then it makes the NT exclusive.

If there were any truth to what you say, Jews would be using the Bible jsut as much as you try.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#473351 Aug 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
How has the Church "Mixed Paganism" with Christianity?
Come on Pad, don't just yelp out a convenient accusation with no basis.
Is it Sunday worship that's Pagan, to coincide with the Sun god worship? Nope, Sunday observance came from the Apostles.
Is it because we have statues? Get real. Pagans weren't the only ones who had statues. Besides, they worshiped statues. We don't.
Does it interest you at all.....that Jewish temples are being unearthed today, that contain statues? Not only did God allow statues, He commanded it.
"And you shall make two Cherubim of gold; of HAMMERED WORK SHALL YOU MAKE THEM" Exodus, 25:18
Thats a graven image of Angels, Pad. God commanded the Jews to make graven images.
You guys have no right taking the first commandment out of context like that. God is not jealous of a graven image of Mary holding the infant Jesus, you goof.
The Cheribim were not knelt before and kissed and venerated,they existed on the Arc to show that they were the protectors of that ARC. The High praises of God are within the Angels He created as messengers,worshipers of the Almighty,and warriors of the heavenly realm against the Fallen Angels that serve Satan(Lucifer).

Using that does not compel me as a believer within the New Covenant to buy statues,and use them to bring into my life the Presence of the Living God.It is already a fact that when we are born of His Spirit we have allowed the Holy One to be with us.That is why He says"He will never leave us or forsake us."Literally Clay,we believers of the New and everlasting Covenant do not have NEED of religious articles to embellish our faith,because the Living God is present with us through the Holy Spirit,who reveals Jesus to us.

I as a believer in th New Covenant am not compelled to go to an edifice where a physical thing is set up to have me be in the presence of God,when no matter where I am the Presence of God is with me and in me,due to the power of the Holy Spirit.God our Father is OMNIPRESENT and He abides with us as we abide with Him.

The only thing that separates God from us is sin. When we abide in Him He abides in us.Jesus told us to come to Him,or open the Door so that He may come into us and SUP with Him.That is an invitation of Presence that goes beyond any human endeavor to bring about a presence.We can pray and seek God,and humble ourselves,that will bring about God willing His Spirit ot hover over us,and move in ways to teach us things,or even CALL us to His will.

The use of statues and shrines to embellish His presence is not a New Covenant treatise for any believer who is born of the Spirit of God.So realistically the whole matter is redundant to us who live by faith,and not by sight.We are to evangelize people in the same manner,so that they can become born again of the Spirit of God and walk in that Truth.

Clay there is no reasoning in this world that can convince me that I must have those trappings your Church uses to enhance my faith in the Living God.They are actually incumberances to us,distractions as it were.If you like them,that is fine for you,but remember that when you see many believers reject your church for those reasons,you might want to understand WHY?The bible does not support such beliefs you have for the use of Images,and all the other additives as it were,what to wear,and emulate,and beads to pray with(similar to Buddhists and Hindus,also the Muslims) Your in a large company of practitioners of these things used to embellish the presence of God,when in fact God is already present through the Holy Spirit,and in the Revelation of the Lord Jesus Christ!

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473352 Aug 27, 2013
It seems you figured out my question, without requiring additional information....good, because I thought it was pretty clear the first post I made.
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
Your question:
"Why be a participant in religion if your spirituality is restricted?"
My answer:
Firstly, Catholicism is not a "religion" in so far as it was not man who came up with it, it was God. One doesn't "participate" in Catholicism, one participates in a relationship with God. Catholicism teaches the way to have a healthy relationship with Him. Catholicism is not one religion among many, each "just as good" as the next.
a. True - Catholicism is not a religion, it is a form of belief. Christianity is the religion.

b. Man devised Christianity, not "God".
- If you think this isn't true, please post where "God" specifically states which texts are to be used for Christianity and which ones are not to be used and then discarded.

c. You stated - "Catholicism teaches the way to have a healthy relationship with Him."
- Gotcha - a person must take ALL the steps in order to achieve this "salvation". That would still be Self.

It all starts and ends with YOU. No religion or belief needed.
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
Secondly, if you are trying to say that Catholicism restricts people's spirituality, all I can say is that you are wrong, or at least that your idea of non-restricted spirituality is very different than mine.
It does. It restricts me from believing the way I do. And since I believe differently, I can't be a Catholic, unless I revert back to what they would like for me to believe.

It restricts spirituality and beliefs. You are just to afraid to admit it, because it goes against the beleif you have been instructed to uphold.

Bummer for you.
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
Come to think of it, describe what you think/feel is unrestricted spirituality. I'm curious.
Self.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473353 Aug 27, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
You are correct New Age!...... I don't hold ANY truth, but Jesus Christ and HIS One TRUE Apostolic Catholic DOES hold the TRUTH!!!! And furthermore, it holds the FULLNESS of that TRUTH....Everything else; Every other Protestant bible only denomination since the Reformation has " gradually rejected" more and more of that truth, until today in the 21st century, all there is left is a hodge-podge of divided denominations of individual (half-truth) beliefs where each person "interprets their own truth ( better known as "relative truth"!!
Yes, your Baptist learning has caused you to believe this erroneously.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#473354 Aug 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
If Jesus Christ is God; And He started a Church....this Church would obviously replace Israel.
Its not a new teaching. Its as old as the Apostles.
Too bad, Jesus wasn't "God".
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#473355 Aug 27, 2013
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>The Cheribim were not knelt before and kissed and venerated,they existed on the Arc to show that they were the protectors of that ARC. The High praises of God are within the Angels He created as messengers,worshipers of the Almighty,and warriors of the heavenly realm against the Fallen Angels that serve Satan(Lucifer).
Using that does not compel me as a believer within the New Covenant to buy statues,and use them to bring into my life the Presence of the Living God.It is already a fact that when we are born of His Spirit we have allowed the Holy One to be with us.That is why He says"He will never leave us or forsake us."Literally Clay,we believers of the New and everlasting Covenant do not have NEED of religious articles to embellish our faith,because the Living God is present with us through the Holy Spirit,who reveals Jesus to us.
I as a believer in th New Covenant am not compelled to go to an edifice where a physical thing is set up to have me be in the presence of God,when no matter where I am the Presence of God is with me and in me,due to the power of the Holy Spirit.God our Father is OMNIPRESENT and He abides with us as we abide with Him.
The only thing that separates God from us is sin. When we abide in Him He abides in us.Jesus told us to come to Him,or open the Door so that He may come into us and SUP with Him.That is an invitation of Presence that goes beyond any human endeavor to bring about a presence.We can pray and seek God,and humble ourselves,that will bring about God willing His Spirit ot hover over us,and move in ways to teach us things,or even CALL us to His will.
The use of statues and shrines to embellish His presence is not a New Covenant treatise for any believer who is born of the Spirit of God.So realistically the whole matter is redundant to us who live by faith,and not by sight.We are to evangelize people in the same manner,so that they can become born again of the Spirit of God and walk in that Truth.
Clay there is no reasoning in this world that can convince me that I must have those trappings your Church uses to enhance my faith in the Living God.They are actually incumberances to us,distractions as it were.If you like them,that is fine for you,but remember that when you see many believers reject your church for those reasons,you might want to understand WHY?The bible does not support such beliefs you have for the use of Images,and all the other additives as it were,what to wear,and emulate,and beads to pray with(similar to Buddhists and Hindus,also the Muslims) Your in a large company of practitioners of these things used to embellish the presence of God,when in fact God is already present through the Holy Spirit,and in the Revelation of the Lord Jesus Christ!
You and this guy must think alike. Neither of you has a clue.

Human Being

Kinder, LA

#473356 Aug 27, 2013
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>The Cheribim were not knelt before and kissed and venerated,they existed on the Arc to show that they were the protectors of that ARC. The High praises of God are within the Angels He created as messengers,worshipers of the Almighty,and warriors of the heavenly realm against the Fallen Angels that serve Satan(Lucifer).
Using that does not compel me as a believer within the New Covenant to buy statues,and use them to bring into my life the Presence of the Living God.It is already a fact that when we are born of His Spirit we have allowed the Holy One to be with us.That is why He says"He will never leave us or forsake us."Literally Clay,we believers of the New and everlasting Covenant do not have NEED of religious articles to embellish our faith,because the Living God is present with us through the Holy Spirit,who reveals Jesus to us.
I as a believer in th New Covenant am not compelled to go to an edifice where a physical thing is set up to have me be in the presence of God,when no matter where I am the Presence of God is with me and in me,due to the power of the Holy Spirit.God our Father is OMNIPRESENT and He abides with us as we abide with Him.
The only thing that separates God from us is sin. When we abide in Him He abides in us.Jesus told us to come to Him,or open the Door so that He may come into us and SUP with Him.That is an invitation of Presence that goes beyond any human endeavor to bring about a presence.We can pray and seek God,and humble ourselves,that will bring about God willing His Spirit ot hover over us,and move in ways to teach us things,or even CALL us to His will.
The use of statues and shrines to embellish His presence is not a New Covenant treatise for any believer who is born of the Spirit of God.So realistically the whole matter is redundant to us who live by faith,and not by sight.We are to evangelize people in the same manner,so that they can become born again of the Spirit of God and walk in that Truth.
Clay there is no reasoning in this world that can convince me that I must have those trappings your Church uses to enhance my faith in the Living God.They are actually incumberances to us,distractions as it were.If you like them,that is fine for you,but remember that when you see many believers reject your church for those reasons,you might want to understand WHY?The bible does not support such beliefs you have for the use of Images,and all the other additives as it were,what to wear,and emulate,and beads to pray with(similar to Buddhists and Hindus,also the Muslims) Your in a large company of practitioners of these things used to embellish the presence of God,when in fact God is already present through the Holy Spirit,and in the Revelation of the Lord Jesus Christ!
Pad

Peace

If God is present through the Holy Spirit and in the Revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ, then there is no reason not to have symbols upon which to reflect, and expand one's knowledge, increase one's faith and commitment to God through prayer.

The question of "must have symbols", is negligible since all of Creation can be a reflection, and all its parts of the glory of God....

Peace

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#473357 Aug 27, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
You've never been to a Mass then obviously.
Only for forty years.....
Clay

Garden City, MI

#473358 Aug 27, 2013
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>
I as a believer in th New Covenant am not compelled to go to an edifice where a physical thing is set SNIPPEDt!
You are not a believer in the new covenant. The new covenant was a sacrament.(the Eucharist) You reject it.

Also, make up your mind. Is it ok for us to have graven images in our Churches like God commanded the Jews or not?
Remember, the issue is GRAVEN IMAGES. You and the others cite the first commandment to condemn us. We are not to have GRAVEN IMAGES of anything.

How come God disagrees with you? He commanded graven images of Angels be on the Ark.

Also, how could you possibly believe God is jealous of a graven image of Mary holding His Son?
You see the removal of logic that's required to be a fundie?
Regina

Bloomfield, NJ

#473359 Aug 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
You are not a believer in the new covenant. The new covenant was a sacrament.(the Eucharist) You reject it.
Also, make up your mind. Is it ok for us to have graven images in our Churches like God commanded the Jews or not?
Remember, the issue is GRAVEN IMAGES. You and the others cite the first commandment to condemn us. We are not to have GRAVEN IMAGES of anything.
How come God disagrees with you? He commanded graven images of Angels be on the Ark.
Also, how could you possibly believe God is jealous of a graven image of Mary holding His Son?
You see the removal of logic that's required to be a fundie?
We don't have "graven" images, Clay. Graven images are those whose sole purpose is idol worship. Obviously, not all images are "graven".

Dan (Pad) knows better, but he likes to play that card because he doesn't have anything else.

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-w...

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