Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.

Comments (Page 21,909)

Showing posts 438,161 - 438,180 of532,272
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:
OldJG

Rockford, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454219
Jun 19, 2013
 
Baptism is one of the most controversial issues in the Christian faith. Infant baptism vs. believer's baptism? Baptism by immersion or baptism by sprinkling/pouring? Baptism as a symbolic act of obedience and identification with Christ's death and resurrection vs. baptism as a requirement that God will not grant salvation without? Out of all of these debates, by far the most important is the question: Is baptism required for salvation?

What makes this question difficult is the fact that there are some Scripture verses which seem to indicate that baptism is necessary for salvation (Mark 16:16; John 3:5; Acts 2:38; 22:16; Galatians 3:27; 1 Peter 3:21). However, there are numerous other Scripture references which clearly and explicitly state that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (John 1:12; 3:16, 18, 36; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8-9). Further, in 1 Corinthians 1:14-17, the Apostle Paul makes it clear that baptism is not an aspect of the gospel. In Paul's brief outline of the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-8, baptism is not even mentioned.

To add baptism, or any other work, to the gospel is to say that Jesus' death on the cross was not sufficient to secure our salvation. To say we must be baptized in order to be saved is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ's death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus' death alone paid for our sins (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21). If we must do anything beyond receiving by faith God's salvation, that makes salvation dependent on our works, instead of dependent on the perfect and complete sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

Yes, there are some verses that seem to indicate baptism as a necessary requirement for salvation. However, Scripture does not contradict Scripture. If the Bible says that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (and it says that numerous times), then there is nothing else that can be added as a requirement for salvation with making God's Word contradict itself. The Bible verses that clearly link salvation and baptism do so because baptism identifies conversion; it is the declaration that salvation has occurred. The idea of an un-baptized believer was anathema to the New Testament writers. If a person claimed to believe in Christ, but was ashamed to proclaim that faith in public, it would be an indication that the person's faith was not genuine.

Baptism is not necessary for salvation. Baptism is an important step of obedience that every Christian should take. Baptism is a public declaration of faith in Christ. Baptism is an identification of an old life dying with Christ and a new life being resurrected as a new creation (1 Corinthians 5:17). So, while baptism is very important, it is not a requirement for salvation. To make baptism a requirement for salvation is an attack on the perfection and sufficiency of God's provision of salvation through Jesus Christ.
OldJG

Rockford, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454220
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I responded.
Thanks
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.

1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.

2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454221
Jun 19, 2013
 
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
The Latin vulgate translates to "Hail, full of grace".
Douay-Rheims & Wycliffe.
It was before the NABre....the NABre is their latest pope approved version of the Catholic Bible...they changed their teaching....

But...that does not teach she was a virgin evermore...nor that she was sinless...nor that she was conceived in an other way than you and I were...
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454222
Jun 19, 2013
 
Oxbow wrote:
<quoted text>
And...where does it say she was conceived without sin????
28And coming to her, he said,“Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you.
Luke 1:28.

She is called "full of grace".

She's given the name "full of grace" and in the Greek perfect tense, indicating that this permanent state of Mary was completed.

Remember Greek? You were very insistent on it RE: 2 Tim 3:16.

'St. Luke uses the perfect passive participle, kekaritomene, as his "name" for Mary. This word literally means "she who has been graced" in a completed sense. This verbal adjective, "graced," is not just describing a simple past action. Greek has another tense for that. The perfect tense is used to indicate that an action has been completed in the past resulting in a present state of being. "Full of grace" is Mary’s name. So what does it tell us about Mary? Well, the average Christian is not completed in grace and in a permanent sense (see Phil. 3:8-12). But according to the angel, Mary is.'

http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/hai...
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454223
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
Baptism is one of the most controversial issues in the Christian faith. Infant baptism vs. believer's baptism? Baptism by immersion or baptism by sprinkling/pouring? Baptism as a symbolic act of obedience and identification with Christ's death and resurrection vs. baptism as a requirement that God will not grant salvation without? Out of all of these debates, by far the most important is the question: Is baptism required for salvation?
What makes this question difficult is the fact that there are some Scripture verses which seem to indicate that baptism is necessary for salvation (Mark 16:16; John 3:5; Acts 2:38; 22:16; Galatians 3:27; 1 Peter 3:21). However, there are numerous other Scripture references which clearly and explicitly state that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (John 1:12; 3:16, 18, 36; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8-9). Further, in 1 Corinthians 1:14-17, the Apostle Paul makes it clear that baptism is not an aspect of the gospel. In Paul's brief outline of the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-8, baptism is not even mentioned.
To add baptism, or any other work, to the gospel is to say that Jesus' death on the cross was not sufficient to secure our salvation. To say we must be baptized in order to be saved is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ's death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus' death alone paid for our sins (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21). If we must do anything beyond receiving by faith God's salvation, that makes salvation dependent on our works, instead of dependent on the perfect and complete sacrifice of Jesus Christ.
Yes, there are some verses that seem to indicate baptism as a necessary requirement for salvation. However, Scripture does not contradict Scripture. If the Bible says that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (and it says that numerous times), then there is nothing else that can be added as a requirement for salvation with making God's Word contradict itself. The Bible verses that clearly link salvation and baptism do so because baptism identifies conversion; it is the declaration that salvation has occurred. The idea of an un-baptized believer was anathema to the New Testament writers. If a person claimed to believe in Christ, but was ashamed to proclaim that faith in public, it would be an indication that the person's faith was not genuine.
Baptism is not necessary for salvation. Baptism is an important step of obedience that every Christian should take. Baptism is a public declaration of faith in Christ. Baptism is an identification of an old life dying with Christ and a new life being resurrected as a new creation (1 Corinthians 5:17). So, while baptism is very important, it is not a requirement for salvation. To make baptism a requirement for salvation is an attack on the perfection and sufficiency of God's provision of salvation through Jesus Christ.
It's not controversial.

Christian belief and practice until the Reformation taught that Baptism is salvific.
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454224
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
1.) John 3:5

2.) None that I'm aware of.
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454225
Jun 19, 2013
 

Judged:

1

1

1

OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
"Hey boy"?

Someone's feelings get hurt when I pointed out your Luther/Catechism debacle?

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454226
Jun 19, 2013
 
LTM wrote:
Old Natures Never Die
A daily devotion for June 19th
Read the Scripture: Genesis 20
close
And Abimelech asked Abraham,“What was your reason for doing this?”(Genesis 20:10).
Has anyone had to say to you,“As a Christian, what were you thinking of when you did this thing?” Have you ever had to say it to yourself:“What got into me anyway? I thought I was further along in the Christian life than this. Here I have done this thing that I thought had long ago passed out of my life. Whatever got into me?” If you have ever had to ask yourself that, you need to learn the lesson Abraham had to learn here.
You are still capable of the worst sin that you have ever committed—and more. Abraham has been a coward for thirty years, and he is still capable of being the same coward he was at the beginning, hiding behind his wife, subjecting her to dishonor and disgrace and shame in order to protect his own skin.
This old nature with which we are born, which is perverted and twisted so that it never operates as God intended it to, is totally depraved. That does not mean that it cannot do what appears to be nice things in the eyes of others and even of ourselves. There is something about the old self, the flesh, which is able to simulate righteousness. In the flesh's pursuit after pseudorighteousness, even if it succeeds in an outward demonstration of a sweet and lovely nature, it has never achieved anything but self-righteousness. Self-righteousness always demands self-praise, a longing to be admired and to win the attention of others. If you fail in your pursuit of self-righteousness, the result is self-pity. Either way, it is the flesh, and it can never please God. This is why when God comes into the human heart through Christ, He never tries to do anything about cleaning up that old nature. He writes it off as worthless. No matter how it looks in the eyes of others, if it comes from the self-advancing, self-centered core, it is worthless, and it always will be. What you now are in the flesh you always will be, if you live a hundred years. If you lay hold of that concept, you will find it one of the most encouraging truths in your Christian life, because it will release you from that awful burden of self-effort that tries to make the old nature behave itself. You must renounce self as the Word of God tells you to and quit feeding it, protecting it, polishing it up, trying to make it look good. Give it up. Accept all that Jesus Christ is in you and wants to be through you, for His nature is perfect.
Any dependence upon self always results in the kind of experience that Abraham had. After thirty years of walking with God and learning wonderful lessons in the spiritual life, the minute he steps out of a dependence upon God, he steps back into that same ugly nature he had in the beginning, and it is unchanged after thirty years. Old natures have to be kept under control by walking in the Spirit.“Live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature,” Paul tells us (Galatians 5:16).
Father, You have not called me to improve myself. Help me to recognize what I am, that in myself I can never be good enough, and to appropriate all that Christ can be to me and through me, for His life is satisfying to You.
This is a keeper. Thanks!!!
marge

Ames, IA

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454227
Jun 19, 2013
 
Ecc3:11
Yet God has made everything beautiful for its own time. He has planted eternity in the human heart, but even so, people cannot see the whole scope of God's work from beginning to end.
Disciple

San Diego, CA

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454228
Jun 19, 2013
 
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
Is that why Jehovah created non-human animals to suffer???
No. You should stop beating on your pet.
OldJG

Rockford, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454229
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
1.) John 3:5
2.) None that I'm aware of.
You said,quote, "1.) John 3:5" End quote.

John 3:5, "Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."

NO BAPTISM!!! NONE.

Born of water......natural birth; everyone is born of water.

Born of the Spirit....super-natural birth

Again, NO BAPTISN <<<<>>> >> NONE!!!

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454230
Jun 19, 2013
 
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
Sure.
She was an exception.
Show Scripture that says she was an exception...you can't...because she was a sinner...she was thankful for her Savior..per Scripture...sinless people do not need a Savior...

My bet stands...you will play your "tradition" card...to trump Scripture.....that is what I call trashing the Bible...

And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
OldJG

Rockford, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454231
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
"Hey boy"?
Someone's feelings get hurt when I pointed out your Luther/Catechism debacle?
You said, quote, "Someone's feelings get hurt when I pointed out your Luther/Catechism debacle?" End quote.

Luther/Roman Catholic/Catechism.......

I said, quote, "Same BS just a different Roman Catholic author." End quote.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454232
Jun 19, 2013
 
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
Luke 1:28.
She is called "full of grace".
She's given the name "full of grace" and in the Greek perfect tense, indicating that this permanent state of Mary was completed.
Remember Greek? You were very insistent on it RE: 2 Tim 3:16.
'St. Luke uses the perfect passive participle, kekaritomene, as his "name" for Mary. This word literally means "she who has been graced" in a completed sense. This verbal adjective, "graced," is not just describing a simple past action. Greek has another tense for that. The perfect tense is used to indicate that an action has been completed in the past resulting in a present state of being. "Full of grace" is Mary’s name. So what does it tell us about Mary? Well, the average Christian is not completed in grace and in a permanent sense (see Phil. 3:8-12). But according to the angel, Mary is.'
http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/hai...
You are a baldfaced liar.....

In the NABre pope approved Bible she is not referred to as "full of Grace"....I will show you again....

And coming to her, he said,“Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you.”
OldJG

Rockford, IL

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454233
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
Baptism is one of the most controversial issues in the Christian faith. Infant baptism vs. believer's baptism? Baptism by immersion or baptism by sprinkling/pouring? Baptism as a symbolic act of obedience and identification with Christ's death and resurrection vs. baptism as a requirement that God will not grant salvation without? Out of all of these debates, by far the most important is the question: Is baptism required for salvation?
What makes this question difficult is the fact that there are some Scripture verses which seem to indicate that baptism is necessary for salvation (Mark 16:16; John 3:5; Acts 2:38; 22:16; Galatians 3:27; 1 Peter 3:21). However, there are numerous other Scripture references which clearly and explicitly state that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (John 1:12; 3:16, 18, 36; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8-9). Further, in 1 Corinthians 1:14-17, the Apostle Paul makes it clear that baptism is not an aspect of the gospel. In Paul's brief outline of the gospel in 1 Corinthians 15:1-8, baptism is not even mentioned.
To add baptism, or any other work, to the gospel is to say that Jesus' death on the cross was not sufficient to secure our salvation. To say we must be baptized in order to be saved is to say we must add our own good works and obedience to Christ's death in order to make it sufficient for salvation. Jesus' death alone paid for our sins (Romans 5:8; 2 Corinthians 5:21). If we must do anything beyond receiving by faith God's salvation, that makes salvation dependent on our works, instead of dependent on the perfect and complete sacrifice of Jesus Christ.
Yes, there are some verses that seem to indicate baptism as a necessary requirement for salvation. However, Scripture does not contradict Scripture. If the Bible says that salvation is received by faith, with no other requirement (and it says that numerous times), then there is nothing else that can be added as a requirement for salvation with making God's Word contradict itself. The Bible verses that clearly link salvation and baptism do so because baptism identifies conversion; it is the declaration that salvation has occurred. The idea of an un-baptized believer was anathema to the New Testament writers. If a person claimed to believe in Christ, but was ashamed to proclaim that faith in public, it would be an indication that the person's faith was not genuine.
Baptism is not necessary for salvation. Baptism is an important step of obedience that every Christian should take. Baptism is a public declaration of faith in Christ. Baptism is an identification of an old life dying with Christ and a new life being resurrected as a new creation (1 Corinthians 5:17). So, while baptism is very important, it is not a requirement for salvation. To make baptism a requirement for salvation is an attack on the perfection and sufficiency of God's provision of salvation through Jesus Christ.
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
It's not controversial.
Christian belief and practice until the Reformation taught that Baptism is salvific.
Really? Provide Biblical proof. Was Abraham baptized? Was Moses baptized? Was Peter baptized? Was John? Were any of the original 12 apostles baptized? If so, who? Proof required. Biblical proof only. Not tradition, not here say, not conjecture. PROOF!
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454234
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
<quoted text>
You said,quote, "1.) John 3:5" End quote.
John 3:5, "Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."
NO BAPTISM!!! NONE.
Born of water......natural birth; everyone is born of water.
Born of the Spirit....super-natural birth
Again, NO BAPTISN <<<<>>> >> NONE!!!
What do you think the water's for?

The "water" here doesn't refer to childbirth.

"Unless one is born, then born of the spirit....."

How would one BE born of the spirit unless they'd been born in the first place?

Just goes to show you the lengths people will go to waterboard the Bible trying to explain why they don't believe Jesus.

Sad.

Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454235
Jun 19, 2013
 
Oxbow wrote:
<quoted text>
You are a baldfaced liar.....
In the NABre pope approved Bible she is not referred to as "full of Grace"....I will show you again....
And coming to her, he said,“Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you.”
I gave you the Greek here.

It means what it means. You don't get to decide what Greek means on your own.

Sorry.

Since: Feb 12

Location hidden

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454236
Jun 19, 2013
 

Judged:

1

Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
You seemed quite certain that they didn't. Several times, in fact.
I was going by our fasting of 40 days expect on Good Friday.We fast 40 days of strict fasting...
hojo

Minneapolis, MN

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454237
Jun 19, 2013
 
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
I WILL STRIVE TO FOLLOW THE WORDS OF JESUS.
Then why don't you!!! How about Matthew 16:13-21 (in Jesus' OWN SPOKEN AND STATED WORDS) regarding HIS One True Apostolic (Universal-Catholic) Church. The same heirarchical, authoritative VISIBLE CHURCH (with Bishops, deacons, priests and elders in Acts 20. The same Church that is referred to over 30 times in the New Testament. The same Church that Paul refers to in I Timothy 3:15 when he calls THE CHURCH (not the bible alone) as the pillar, pinnacle and foundation of the TRUTH.----How about John 6:47-59 (In Jesus' OWN SPOKEN AND STATED WORDS) regarding HIS TRUE BODY AND TRUE BLOOD in the Eucharist--"For unless you eat my body (which is REAL FOOD) and drink my blood ( WHICH IS REAL DRINK) you CANNOT have eternal life".---You keep saying that you follow the words of Jesus!......NO YOU DON'T!!!
Dan

Omaha, NE

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#454238
Jun 19, 2013
 
OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
OldJG wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you gonna answer the questions? Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? How many did Jesus baptize?
<quoted text>
Hey boy, you did not respond because if you did we all would know your answer. So boy, I will ask again and again until you answer.
1. Jesus said water baptism is necessary for what? Give us a Bible verse or two if you would please.
2. How many did Jesus baptize? How many??????
<quoted text>
You said, quote, "Someone's feelings get hurt when I pointed out your Luther/Catechism debacle?" End quote.
Luther/Roman Catholic/Catechism.......
I said, quote, "Same BS just a different Roman Catholic author." End quote.
Other than it's not the same, you're right on.

Do you start 7th or 8th Grade next fall?

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

Showing posts 438,161 - 438,180 of532,272
|
Go to last page| Jump to page:
Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000
Type the numbers you see in the image on the right:

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Other Recent Pope Benedict XVI Discussions

Search the Pope Benedict XVI Forum:
Topic Updated Last By Comments
United House of Prayer for All People: Bishop's... (Apr '08) 17 hr Married in 8,118
More Tue Warner 1
In Manila, Catholics pray for smooth succession (Mar '13) Mon SeniorPersonalsDating 102
Serbian patriarch reportedly opposed to canoniz... Mon Marko 3
Newlywed El Pasoan meets Pope Francis Jul 18 Imperial Chicano 6
.com | Pope's hints on married priests trouble ... Jul 16 truth 1
Pope calls for Middle East cease-fire Jul 13 Zioni 5
•••
•••
•••
Enter and win $5000
•••
•••