Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 554,616
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#441851 May 17, 2013
Regina wrote:
<quoted text>
She was Protestant, not Catholic.
I was a Heinz 57.

I was not Protestant in the sense that I believed in a hell or salvation of some and not others. Out of the mixture of the two religions practiced by my mother and father I created what worked for me, and that was ... I preferred to believe that the creator loved all "humans" with no conditions put upon that love.

That lulled my conscience until I was seventy years of age, and then my conscience would not stay asleep any longer.

So many of the dogmas just didn't work their magic on me any more ... and for that I am thankful.

I have no regrets about my journey that lead me out of religion.

I do have regrets for some of the nonsense I believed while I was under the spell of religion, but I am at peace with the regrets in that I accept that when I knew no better, I could do no better.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441852 May 17, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you know your texts are inspired by God?
- Because "God" inspires everyone.
- "Thomas" was an Apostle chosen by Jesus, who, in your eyes was "God".

Why don't you accept Thomas as an inspired writer?
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you know Thomas wrote the Gospel of Thomas?
I don't unfortunately.....as I don't know the true author of any of the texts, except that of GoLuke and Acts (both by "Luke" supposedly) and some of the letters by "Paul".

Sounds like you and I are in the same boat with the legitimacy of the NT, huh?

Unless you have proof that those authors did write the books they are attributed to.

I like this - you seem to be focused on this topic, okay. Let's be completely honest with each other.
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
If you ask me how I know the Catholic NT is, I would answer that, Christ started a Church and if you trace through historical evidence, you can see its the Catholic Church as we have it today. So I'm going to obviously listen to this Church ... since it came from Jesus Christ Himself. That's called real faith. Not a conspiracy secret hidden religion like so many of you think Jesus preached.
Jesus never wrote anything down, so that aspect of your post above has nothing to do with the originating authors of the NT texts.

No - there is no "Apostolic Succession" - this is a ruse. Way to many "popes" either died in office, ousted, or simply were not "righteous". You'll have to prove that each pope had actually passed down 2000 years of papal succession COMPLETELY, in which you cannot. Especially when you have a Pope dying after 30 days. We both know that 2000 years of information cannot be disclosed in 30 days - unless you know of a new way to pass these details from person to person in some large information database transfer to the brain. Do you?

"since it came from Jesus Christ Himself. That's called real faith."
- so did GoThomas

BUT - you had to qualify your whole post and belief into that one word..."faith"....

Faith is not fact - but just a belief you formulated from hearing about the "ruse". That would be Self.

So in essence you actually stated - "that's called real Self".

Now that we've cleared that obstacle, what else you got?
Just Sayin

Antioch, TN

#441853 May 17, 2013
Religion A Delusion wrote:
<quoted text>
No thanks, that's plenty.
I believe we are steering off course, into philosophical "science" and away from the natural science we commonly refer to as "science" today.
Is there any official church teaching that claims that faith is derived or based on natural science and "scientific method?"
So far, it's all Plato philosophy, but no scientific method.
In summary, if there was a true science of religion, then you could use that science in a court of law. None of the "science" described so far would be admissible.
Why not?
Faith and Science

The Vatican Observatory serves as a bridge between science and the Catholic Church. Studies involving science, philosophy and theology have formed an explicit part of the Observatory's activity since its founding.

Through the pursuit of scientific understanding of the universe, something of the Creator of the universe is discovered. Faith and science are not irreconcilable. Pope John Paul II said this, and Pope Benedict XVI has reaffirmed it. Faith and reason are the two wings on which the human spirit takes flight.

There is no contradiction between what we know through our faith and what we can learn through science. In fact, the sciences, especially astronomy, cosmology and biology make tremendous contributions to faith and theology. Our knowledge of the universe and of nature enriches and nourishes faith and our understanding of God.

The Church, therefore, does not fear science and its discoveries. Rather, through the work of her scientists, she engages in the discoveries and is a significant voice in understanding them.



http://www.vaticanobservatory.org/VOF/index.p...

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441854 May 17, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
Those prophecies have come true not once, but twice, as you pointed out. Propecies yet to come are in book of Revelation. And some of those are coming true right now in these years. All the world is heading toward a one world government, one world religion, and one world leader, just like John predicted in Revelation.
Edgar Cayce prophecized/claimed that evidence supporting the lost continent of Atlantis would appear in 1968 or 1969.

The "Bimini Road" was discovered in 1968.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology...

Which prophets are we supposed to believe and which ones are we supposed to not believe? Because of why?

Which is actually men just telling otehr men to do as they have said.

Gotcha.

Why don't you believe Jesus again?

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#441855 May 17, 2013
When I look at others, I don't want to see them as Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Agnostics, Atheists, etc.

I want to see them as mortal human beings on a journey of planet earth ... being confused as I am confused ... being joyful as I am joyful. I want them not to suffer, but to feel whole just as they are.

I want what's best for all humans and all non-human forms of life.

I will wait to see if life continues after death of my body, and until then I will try to be as kind to others as my selfish nature allows. I am fully aware I can do no better than my best.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441856 May 17, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
As soon as you provide proof that you have any authority to infallibly interpret scripture or that your personal judgement of scripture carries any weight I'll gladly answer you.
Until then you are nothing more than a noisy gong and clanging cymbal.
Where is yours? I've yet to see any declaration made by "God" that anything you accept was authorized.

You really don't understand how your religion came to be, huh?

*sighs*

You just think of 'Pentecost', and you are off to the races.

*hands you his roadmap and compass*
If you need help with understanding these tools, I will be available right here to assist you.
Religion A Delusion

Titusville, FL

#441857 May 17, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
Witnessed by (at least) the 12 Apostles and the women who were with them. Recorded in the gospels by Matthew Mark Luke and John.
Without looking up exact dates, all those gospels were written in the 1st century.
If Jesus hadn't resurrected and appeared to them, why would they suddenly have the courage to go out and loudly proclaim the gospel and die horrible deaths defending it?
No one would do that for a lie.
I ask again: IT WAS RECORDED BY WHOM?

What evidence do you have that all Gospels were written in the first century and that any are first-hand accounts?

You are in imaginary mode. If I am correct, not even the CC makes the claims you do.

I state again -- all evidence of the resurrection is hearsay, period.

You are welcome to prove me wrong. There are no admissible accounts of what you claim. Once again, that is called hearsay and based on centuries of learning, mankind's best justice systems (in my opinion at least, starting with English Common Law)-- say hearsay is not to be used for the purposes of justice.

Think about it.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441858 May 17, 2013
Anthony - you know something, you sound like you are actually on an "off-road rally" and there are many pot holes you need to avoid, but don't have the right shocks to support the ride.

;o)

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#441859 May 17, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
This is "typical media hype" using words such as "denouncing. blasting, demanding" to exaggerate the Popes "actual tone of words" in his homily regarding wealthy's neglect of the poor.
If your pope preaches too much about serving the poor, it is my guess he will find himself travelling down the road as did this ancient pope.
>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>

Sex Lives of the Popes … by Nigel Cawthorne .

The conclave following the death of Pope Nicolas IV (1288—92) made a terrible mistake. After over two years of stalemate, they elected a genuinely good man – a hermit called Peter of Morone, who lived in a cave a thousand feet up in the Apennines near Abruzzi. He was crowned Celestine V (1294, but he could not stand the licentious ways of Rome and moved to Naples.

The cardinals soon began to realize their mistake when Celestine began giving away the wealth of the church – to the poor, of all people! He had no flair for corruption or simony at all. And the princes of the Church worried that they would soon be bankrupt. Cardinal Benedict Gaetani, the papal notory, saw his chance. To gain Celestine’s confidence, he built the old hermit a humble wooden shack inside the huge rooms of the Castello Nuovo, the five towered castle that over-looks the Bay of Naples. There, Caetani prevailed upon Celestine to abdicate.

Just fifteen weeks after consecration, Celestine called his cardinals together, begged them to banish their mistresses to nunneries and to live in poverty like Jesus. Then, as an example to them all, Celestine put aside his papal gown, resumed his hermit’s rags, resigned and rode off, like Jesus, on a donkey.

Having engineered this coup, Gaetani had himself elected pope by the grateful cardinals and was crowned Boniface VIII (1294—1303).

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441860 May 17, 2013
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
He will not fight against you as you are ATTEMPTING TO DO against him..
ALL HE HAS TO DO IS.... do nothing and
let you and your father the devil
SELF DESTRUCT.
The unfounded claims of so-called "Christians".

Why do you think you know the mind of "God"?

Cool - the "devil" will be self-destructing. NICE!

Out with the bastard once and for all!! June, I am counting on you to save the world from the devil - all because GiF says that you will "self destruct" along side the "devil".

Are you with me? I'll promote your act - as pure kindness towards the world and humanity - and especially towards GiF and his wife!!

This will help avert the prophecy of the "anti-christ" rising and taking over. I know you can do this. C'mon - save the world - you will be imfamouosly honored. Possibly almost to the stature of Jesus.

A last meal request?

:o)

GiF, I've concluded that you really don't think too much about what you write, huh?
Just Sayin

Antioch, TN

#441861 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Edgar Cayce prophecized/claimed that evidence supporting the lost continent of Atlantis would appear in 1968 or 1969.
The "Bimini Road" was discovered in 1968.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology...
Which prophets are we supposed to believe and which ones are we supposed to not believe? Because of why?
Which is actually men just telling otehr men to do as they have said.
Gotcha.
Why don't you believe Jesus again?
We are supposed to be careful about what prophet we believe. Very careful. The prophets in the Bible have proven themselves to be inspired by God since their prophecies have come true. There have been countless others since then whose prophecies have not come true. The stupidest ones are those that claim they know the day (and hour even) that Jesus will return, then *poof*, nothing.
Religion A Delusion

Titusville, FL

#441862 May 17, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
When I look at others, I don't want to see them as Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, Agnostics, Atheists, etc.
I want to see them as mortal human beings on a journey of planet earth ... being confused as I am confused ... being joyful as I am joyful. I want them not to suffer, but to feel whole just as they are.
I want what's best for all humans and all non-human forms of life.
I will wait to see if life continues after death of my body, and until then I will try to be as kind to others as my selfish nature allows. I am fully aware I can do no better than my best.
(Tongue-in-check...)

What a terrible thing to say :o)

According to the God Game, aren't we supposed to pick sides based on mystical Iron Age tales?

What fun is it if everyone wins? Better that those who don't agree why *my* chosen mysticism are treated harshly. That way,*my* position is more exclusive.

Sorry June, but Limbo (neutrality) was retired long ago. I will pray that June picks my side of the religion delusion, so she won't be boiled in the big kettle forever. It's June's choice. Amen.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441863 May 17, 2013
June VanDerMark wrote:
<quoted text>
It seems you still have the Catholic in you that you maintain you took out of you.
All of your Jesus-talk makes it plain that you still are heavy into the idea that a god and his spirit is that on which you rely.
I get the impression that you are very arrogant in the attitude that you are very "spiritually aligned to the pure essence of the savior Jesus."
It's nauseating to say the least.
All this "know thyself" preaching doesn't convince me that you know your self at all. You just believe that is the case.
Your avatar "New Age Spiritual leader" about says it all!
Funny - still addressing me about my beliefs. They really seem to be nagging at you.

Bummer that you can't accept I have something different than you.

You shouldn't worry about it at all, yet you do.....hmmmmm.

Would you like to be my therapist?

;o)

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441864 May 17, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
He was a protestant his first 20 years, an atheist til he was 50. It means he was lost for 50 years and has found the truth. I think he's under 60.
Do you know "CatholicGuy"?

Maybe you should let him answer and correct his post......but thanks for helping.

I also thought this same thing, that is why I was asking him to clarify.

Since: Sep 09

Fraser Lake, Canada

#441865 May 17, 2013
Through time there were many stories written about sons of gods that came to earth as saviors.

Yet not one of those supposed sons of gods wrote anything down anywhere. Not even one signature has been found of Jesus or the other supposed saviors. The stories were all told about what the saviors said and did.

Why were these men so accredited with knowledge not able or WILLING to write on behalf of their selves?

From my perception, it's because they didn't exist TO write on their own behalves.

That is why the fitting term is "mythology."

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441866 May 17, 2013
Just Sayin wrote:
<quoted text>
That is quite a stretch.
It is recorded that Jesus resurrected and had a body. That is in the canon of the Bible. GoTom is not part of the canon because it includes such oddities as this.
....it's not recorded in the earliest bibles - Codex Sinaiticus or Vaticanus.

Are you saying since your Bible is newer, you have a more clear-cut "truth"?

Don't believe everything you read or have been given.
Religion A Delusion

Titusville, FL

#441867 May 17, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
This is "typical media hype" using words such as "denouncing. blasting, demanding" to exaggerate the Popes "actual tone of words" in his homily regarding wealthy's neglect of the poor.
Deep crawling-under-the-rug denial.

OK, so what did the Pope say about the "cult of money" and the world's financial system?

Oh wait! Why don't we ask the Pope to open up the Vatican bank books, and he can simply show the world how Jesus would invest.

Don't tell us, show us. That "tone" would be sensible, right?
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#441868 May 17, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Where is yours? I've yet to see any declaration made by "God" that anything you accept was authorized.
You really don't understand how your religion came to be, huh?
*sighs*
You just think of 'Pentecost', and you are off to the races.
*hands you his roadmap and compass*
If you need help with understanding these tools, I will be available right here to assist you.
Dont' confuse us with the protestants who pick up a bible and consider themselves an authority.

I am taught and believe that God's Son, Jesus, commissioned the apostles who handed this authority on down through the ages. That is supported by the bible and all those who came after them. That's where we get the authority.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#441869 May 17, 2013
Regina wrote:
<quoted text>
No.
A work does not have to be inspired to be valid, however, it's validity rests on the fact that it is free of doctrinal or moral error, that it does not contradict or change in any way that which *is* inspired (scripture). Canonicity was determined largely by comparing the texts to that which the Church had always taught (the Apostolic faith/Tradition). GoThomas does not qualify in either case.
This is true - decisions by men to decide what beliefs other men are to believe.

You fell for it.

Bummer.

You should've believed Jesus instead.
Just Sayin

Antioch, TN

#441870 May 17, 2013
Religion A Delusion wrote:
<quoted text>
I ask again: IT WAS RECORDED BY WHOM?
What evidence do you have that all Gospels were written in the first century and that any are first-hand accounts?
You are in imaginary mode. If I am correct, not even the CC makes the claims you do.
I state again -- all evidence of the resurrection is hearsay, period.
You are welcome to prove me wrong. There are no admissible accounts of what you claim. Once again, that is called hearsay and based on centuries of learning, mankind's best justice systems (in my opinion at least, starting with English Common Law)-- say hearsay is not to be used for the purposes of justice.
Think about it.
Near universal consesus of historians and other professionals alike as to when these books were written:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dating_the_Bible

For the NT books, scroll about halfway down.

Authorship of the Bible:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorship_of_th...

For the NT books, scroll about halfway down.

This stuff is not hard to find.

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