Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.
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409,381 - 409,400 of 538,892 Comments Last updated 10 min ago

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424784 Feb 26, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a dumb statement. Everything quoted on Jesus in the Bible wasn't written by Him anyway. It was written by men, 30 -50 yrs after He died. To say we think Paul is more 'enlightened' is funny. It all flows together. Matthew and Marks memories of what Our Lord said, does not contradict Pauls writings.
Okay - I understand your viewpoint.

It still doesn't answer why you don't beleive in all of what Jesus taught, now does it?

My thinking is this.....

Men chose for what you are to believe, and you've accepted it.

Men also chose for what you are NOT to believe, and you've accepted it.

So why do you believe men?

In other words, why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus? Is it because of men?

A: Yes.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424785 Feb 26, 2013
Free Mind wrote:
<quoted text>
NASL writes -- "Man doesn't have the capacity to understand "God". The RCC and Christianity, and every religion created does the same thing - they think they can define "God""
Most, but not every.
Otherwise, good point. Thomas Jefferson wrote similarly.
I agree - I did over-exaggerate a little with "every religion".

I was trying to make a point in relation to just religion in general - and the top beliefs.

Even then, I'm not sure, but I don't think Hinduism defines "God".

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424786 Feb 26, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
I have given you this answer several times yet you remain faithful to your strawman. Perhaps you can show me where I've stated Paul was more enlightened than Jesus, otherwise this is your strawman and highlights your intellectual dishonesty.
I can't provide it - because you never stated your answer.

Stop trying to play me. If you are so sure you answered, then go back and review your posts and post it.

All you have ever shown in your posts is your dishonesty and diversion from answering.

Want to know why?

Because it proves your religion is false and bullshite.

Something that requires honesty to admit. In which you haven't.

Why don't you believe Jesus?

Why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus?

“let's do this thang!”

Since: Aug 10

Location hidden

#424787 Feb 26, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Okay - I understand your viewpoint.
It still doesn't answer why you don't beleive in all of what Jesus taught, now does it?
My thinking is this.....
Men chose for what you are to believe, and you've accepted it.
Men also chose for what you are NOT to believe, and you've accepted it.
So why do you believe men?
In other words, why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus? Is it because of men?
A: Yes.
hey new ager, may i jump in?

i know we've been down this road before, but i'm still puzzled as to where you think you got your doctrine, if not handed down from "men"???

"there is nothing new under the sun" Solomon
Free Mind

Melbourne, FL

#424788 Feb 26, 2013
By Garry O'Sullivan -- Managing Director of 'The Irish Catholic'

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/ga...

"Historically, the institutional church manufactured fear based on its own fears; fear of science and progress, of educated followers, of other religions, of bible reading, of change, and it is fear that drives the institution today. A humble church for the people became a church that took from the Emperor Constantine the clothes of a dying empire, parting ways with the simplicity of its early foundation.

From then on, it would be 'princes of the church' instead of fishermen in charge; Popes would run empires and start wars rather than humbly lead; those who spoke out would be deemed heretics and burned at the stake. Catholicism had truly lost its way."

Amen

Thank you Garry O'Sullivan -- Managing Director of 'The Irish Catholic.' That is why I am here.

If the RCC has lost Ireland, then I am needed more than ever.
Free Mind

Melbourne, FL

#424789 Feb 26, 2013
"Papacy needs a Gorbachev to confront tired empire"

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/ga...
Free Mind

Melbourne, FL

#424790 Feb 26, 2013
Exactly....

"The Vatican is not the church and as an institutional centre it really has become an embarrassment for ordinary Catholics. It is steeped in clericalism. The protection of the clerical state at all costs was more important than believing children."

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/ga...
Free Mind

Melbourne, FL

#424791 Feb 26, 2013
From a Catholic who isn't afraid of his church's history and reality......

"The Vatican wasn't founded by Jesus, and the modern papacy is only a construct that came into being after the French Revolution."

"Popes weren't always elected by Cardinals. Lay people were involved. A lay person can technically become Pope."

Something few Catholics consider...

"There is a democratic tradition in the early church that has long been side-lined, and so much of the so-called tradition around the papacy as we know it is only a few hundred years old."
Clay

United States

#424792 Feb 26, 2013
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
What is important to me is the beliefs and worship practices I follow were practiced in the first century, something your leadership does not and cannot mirror.
This precisely captures my point about "Lent". A "religious" event started by men and nowhere highlighted in the Holy and inspired Word of God.
Oh, and now we will have to decide what to call this retiring pope. As usual we will make it up as we go since we have no biblical authority for the office in the first place.
How can you possibly demand that every little 'i' and 't' about Catholicism be highlighted in the Bible, when Catholicism itself produced the Christian Bible 400 yrs after Christ? Bishops of the Catholic Church with the Pope (Damaseus) signed off on the New Testament Canon, and you demand that the word 'Pope' should be in the Bible. Seems very odd.

I read somewhere that the writings of the Apostolic fathers - particularly Clement of Rome and Ignatius of Antioch - almost made it into the New Testament. But it was decided by the CC to include only the writings from the Apostles themselves and not their students.
Funny, but none of you guys would have ever come into existence had this been done.
Martin Luther fought to eliminate the Books of Revelation and James from the Bible. Can you imagine all of the cults that would have never come to be, had Revelation not been available to them?
4GVN

Jackson, MO

#424793 Feb 26, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you possibly demand that every little 'i' and 't' about Catholicism be highlighted in the Bible, when Catholicism itself produced the Christian Bible 400 yrs after Christ? Bishops of the Catholic Church with the Pope (Damaseus) signed off on the New Testament Canon, and you demand that the word 'Pope' should be in the Bible. Seems very odd.
I read somewhere that the writings of the Apostolic fathers - particularly Clement of Rome and Ignatius of Antioch - almost made it into the New Testament. But it was decided by the CC to include only the writings from the Apostles themselves and not their students.
Funny, but none of you guys would have ever come into existence had this been done.
Martin Luther fought to eliminate the Books of Revelation and James from the Bible. Can you imagine all of the cults that would have never come to be, had Revelation not been available to them?
Clay, what you don't seem to understand is that the scriptures were 'God breathed', and were around well before the formation of the RCC. All of the scriptures were completed and being circulated amonst the churches. The catholic church was simply instrumental in putting these scriptures into a BOOK. Nothing more.
Clay

United States

#424794 Feb 26, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Okay - I understand your viewpoint.
It still doesn't answer why you don't beleive in all of what Jesus taught, now does it?
My thinking is this.....
Men chose for what you are to believe, and you've accepted it.
Men also chose for what you are NOT to believe, and you've accepted it.
So why do you believe men?
In other words, why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus? Is it because of men?
A: Yes.
Jesus taught that all of the authority in Heaven has been given to Him. He in turn, gave Peter the keys. "whatever you bind on Earth shall be bound in Heaven. Whatever you loose on Earth shall be loosed in Heaven". He gave the Apostles real authority. They chose Paul as one of their Apostles. Peter endorsed the writings of Paul - telling people to listen to "Our dear brother Paul".

-if Jesus Christ gave Peter real authority.. Matthew 16:18

-and Peter endorsed the writings of Paul..2Peter 3:15-16

Then it seems to me you're guilty of ignoring what Jesus Christ said by way of Peter. You're saying the Apostles had no authority to make Paul a brother and Peters opinion of Paul's Epistles does not matter to you....even thou Peter clearly was given the authority by Jesus Christ Himself to make those declarations about Paul.
Clay

United States

#424795 Feb 26, 2013
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>Clay, what you don't seem to understand is that the scriptures were 'God breathed', and were around well before the formation of the RCC. All of the scriptures were completed and being circulated amonst the churches. The catholic church was simply instrumental in putting these scriptures into a BOOK. Nothing more.
True that.
Those scriptures in the New Testament were already written. But not until 30-50 yrs after Jesus died.
As I pointed out, many writings were held dear to the early Church. Including that of the Apostolic fathers. Why wouldn't they be? Its a first hand account of what the Apostles actually taught, by people who walked with them. There can be no dispute.
Of course, you and many found a loophole by simply ignoring the letters of the Disciples of the Apostles. You created an idea that if it ain't in the New Testament,'we don't care'.
Well, thats irresponsible as a serious Christian.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424796 Feb 26, 2013
waaasssuuup wrote:
<quoted text>
hey new ager, may i jump in?
i know we've been down this road before, but i'm still puzzled as to where you think you got your doctrine, if not handed down from "men"???
"there is nothing new under the sun" Solomon
And I'll state it again, since you refuse to accept my answer....

I don't accept the belief of men as my belief.

I may utilize what men have written, as they are the only ones trying to define "God". But this is only a utilization of those texts. It doesn't define my belief.

My belief in anything is based upon information I've come across, compare it to others, and weed out the bullshite that had overshadowed the "truth".

Just because I don't follow a prescribed edict, it doesn't mean I am wrong, but it does mean that I've chosen (Self) to place my belief in a spiritual entity that has not been proven to exist.

In other words, my faith is of my own making, just like yours.

No religion needed.

What are you afraid of?
Saban fan

Mobile, AL

#424797 Feb 26, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
I can't provide it - because you never stated your answer.
Stop trying to play me. If you are so sure you answered, then go back and review your posts and post it.
All you have ever shown in your posts is your dishonesty and diversion from answering.
Want to know why?
Because it proves your religion is false and bullshite.
Something that requires honesty to admit. In which you haven't.
Why don't you believe Jesus?
Why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus?
You are asking a strange and ignorant question in the attempt of creating a strawman. Its like asking a good man if he still beats his wife.

It is up to you to show me where I have said I think Paul is more enlightened than Jesus. You are correct on one point - you can't provide it.

Now, go ahead and respond by asking the same question again....(insane?)
Saban fan

Mobile, AL

#424798 Feb 26, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you possibly demand that every little 'i' and 't' about Catholicism be highlighted in the Bible, when Catholicism itself produced the Christian Bible 400 yrs after Christ? Bishops of the Catholic Church with the Pope (Damaseus) signed off on the New Testament Canon, and you demand that the word 'Pope' should be in the Bible. Seems very odd.
I read somewhere that the writings of the Apostolic fathers - particularly Clement of Rome and Ignatius of Antioch - almost made it into the New Testament. But it was decided by the CC to include only the writings from the Apostles themselves and not their students.
Funny, but none of you guys would have ever come into existence had this been done.
Martin Luther fought to eliminate the Books of Revelation and James from the Bible. Can you imagine all of the cults that would have never come to be, had Revelation not been available to them?
Have you ever thought that perhaps, no matter what man did, the Holy Spirit preserved God's Word for us so people like you and me could know God's Will for our lives and be able to recognize the false teachers His Word warns us about?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424799 Feb 26, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus taught that all of the authority in Heaven has been given to Him. He in turn, gave Peter the keys. "whatever you bind on Earth shall be bound in Heaven. Whatever you loose on Earth shall be loosed in Heaven". He gave the Apostles real authority. They chose Paul as one of their Apostles. Peter endorsed the writings of Paul - telling people to listen to "Our dear brother Paul".
-if Jesus Christ gave Peter real authority.. Matthew 16:18
-and Peter endorsed the writings of Paul..2Peter 3:15-16
Then it seems to me you're guilty of ignoring what Jesus Christ said by way of Peter. You're saying the Apostles had no authority to make Paul a brother and Peters opinion of Paul's Epistles does not matter to you....even thou Peter clearly was given the authority by Jesus Christ Himself to make those declarations about Paul.
Where are you coming up with this new version of me?

Please provide a citation, or stop misleading others and making up things about me. You so-called "Christians", when called out directly, I think the only way you guys can handle it, is divert it abck to the non-Christian partisan who pointed out the error in your ways.

"Then it seems to me you're guilty of ignoring what Jesus Christ said by way of Peter."
- Wrong - I ignore that "Paul" and Peter for that matter, is more enlightened than Jesus. I accept all of what Jesus taught as critical for learning, not just what you do.

Fail #1

"You're saying the Apostles had no authority to make Paul a brother and Peters opinion of Paul's Epistles does not matter to you."
- No I am not. Please post these exact words, as stated by me.
- You won't because you can't, because you made it up.
- I have stated that you regard "Paul's Epistles" over what Jesus said. I don't.

Fail #2

"even thou Peter clearly was given the authority by Jesus Christ Himself to make those declarations about Paul."
- "Get behind me Satan" is what Jesus said. If you think this is giving him "the keys" - you are wrong. The "keys" is the understanding and knowing of your Self, in order to "enter the kingdom of God."

Fail #3

Are you going to answer my question(s), or just continue to divert from them.

"Honesty is the best policy." - Aesop
Clay

United States

#424800 Feb 26, 2013
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>Clay, what you don't seem to understand is that the scriptures were 'God breathed', and were around well before the formation of the RCC. All of the scriptures were completed and being circulated amonst the churches. The catholic church was simply instrumental in putting these scriptures into a BOOK. Nothing more.
'simply instrumental' is a soft way to put it.

'real God given authority' is the correct way..

You say all scriptures were 'God breathed'.
Who's scriptures? The Bible has 72 separate books. Are all of them God breathed according to you? Well, we know 7 of those books are not.
Separate Jewish sects had different books that they considered scripture. The Quaman Jews of the infamous Dead Sea Scrolls discovery had the Book of Tobit in their possession. Is the Book of Tobit 'scripture' to you?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#424801 Feb 26, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
I can't provide it - because you never stated your answer.
Stop trying to play me. If you are so sure you answered, then go back and review your posts and post it.
All you have ever shown in your posts is your dishonesty and diversion from answering.
Want to know why?
Because it proves your religion is false and bullshite.
Something that requires honesty to admit. In which you haven't.
Why don't you believe Jesus?
Why do you think "Paul" was more enlightened than Jesus?
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
You are asking a strange and ignorant question in the attempt of creating a strawman. Its like asking a good man if he still beats his wife.
"strange and ignorant question"?
- I think not. with you not answering the question(s), just goes to show your lack of honesty in your belief. You trully would rather believe other men thant to state an opinion that goes against your religion.

No strawman at all. FACT! Live with it coward.
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
It is up to you to show me where I have said I think Paul is more enlightened than Jesus. You are correct on one point - you can't provide it.
Like I've stated - you haven't, didn't, and refuse to. How can I post something you are afraid to post?

Your refusal to do so in "so many ways", is the only strawman action being taken.
Saban fan wrote:
<quoted text>
Now, go ahead and respond by asking the same question again....(insane?)
Okay, I will.

"Why do you think "Paul" is more enlightened than Jesus?"

I'll add a couple of more to help you realize the truths you refuse to acknowledge.

- Why do you think a 3rd generation disciple over many of the original 13 Apostles?
- Why do you only believe in less than 6 of the original 13 Apostles?

Thanks for reading my posts!

Since: Nov 08

usa

#424802 Feb 26, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
EXACTLY!! We as Catholics listen to Jesus, His own SPOKEN, STATED and EXPRESSED WORDS---"In the Gospels)--every day at Daily Mass..... We, not only listen to Him but we follow and adhere to His Words, His teachings and His "explicit directions" (every day) IN THE GOSPELS and the TRUTH that has been proclaimed, over and over again, for 2000 years of Church History in:
Matthew 16:13-21--re: His(only)One True (Universal-Catholic Church
John 6:47-59 --re: the Eucharist (Jesus' TRUE BODY AND BLOOD
Mark 4:1-re: baptism for the remission of sin-
Mark 16:16---re: he that believeth and is baptized shall be saved
John 1:31-re:I baptize with water, but HE will baptize with the HS
Why don't YOU, Confrinting, instead of just quoting "bible verses"----believe, follow, "act" on, and live the SPOKEN words of Jesus (each day)!!!
i see your still playing pope,"we as catholics?" you speak for every catholic on here? do all catholics here and around the world have a say as to who the next pope should be? no you don't,jesus doesn't even have a say,and it's suppose to be his church,and the main choice of the vatican council is from boston, father o'malley and he doesn't want the job.jesus is not going to him and speaking "you father o'malley, i hear by declare you the new leader of my church",it's nt decided that way, a group of ordinary men get together and decide who is best at coverups and deciefulness to protect the church from the outside world from finding out the truth about the evil the church has and will continue to do in thr future.they like o'malley because he did a great job here in boston in smoothing things over about the abuse cases,and he is a man of his word,he will not lie for the sake of the church,so it's surprising they are picking an honest man for the job.he would bring sweeping changes to the church that would shock the vatican council into realizing they made a mistake by picking him,he would make all things public,open the doors to the church for the world to see,and that will not sit well the the higherarchy in vatican city.i have read many interviews and watched him on tv interviews,he takes his cinvictions very seriously,and all this corruption going on in the church would come to an end.this why he is turning down the position,because there would be great conflict in the church,no more criminal activities would be allowed,no more cover-ups,you would have a church that you could take a little pride in,but still there is one thing he nor anyone else can do and say and that is the C.C. is jesus' church,if it were jesus would be picking benny's replacement,not a group of men who most likely bought their positions within the church.
Saban fan

Mobile, AL

#424803 Feb 26, 2013
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Where are you coming up with this new version of me?
Please provide a citation, or stop misleading others and making up things about me. You so-called "Christians", when called out directly, I think the only way you guys can handle it, is divert it abck to the non-Christian partisan who pointed out the error in your ways.
"Then it seems to me you're guilty of ignoring what Jesus Christ said by way of Peter."
- Wrong - I ignore that "Paul" and Peter for that matter, is more enlightened than Jesus. I accept all of what Jesus taught as critical for learning, not just what you do.
Fail #1
"You're saying the Apostles had no authority to make Paul a brother and Peters opinion of Paul's Epistles does not matter to you."
- No I am not. Please post these exact words, as stated by me.
- You won't because you can't, because you made it up.
- I have stated that you regard "Paul's Epistles" over what Jesus said. I don't.
Fail #2
"even thou Peter clearly was given the authority by Jesus Christ Himself to make those declarations about Paul."
- "Get behind me Satan" is what Jesus said. If you think this is giving him "the keys" - you are wrong. The "keys" is the understanding and knowing of your Self, in order to "enter the kingdom of God."
Fail #3
Are you going to answer my question(s), or just continue to divert from them.
"Honesty is the best policy." - Aesop
Frankly, New Age Spiritual Leader, your attitude and remarks remind me of someone I used to know that had short-man's disease and smoked dope.

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