Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.
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Clay

United States

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#419266
Jan 31, 2013
 

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atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>OK, I feel sorry for you and to help you leanr some truth, the answer is none of them.
however you tossed in a name that wasnt an apostle but who indeed was the brother of Jesus and that is Jude.
here are the names.
Simon Peter; Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee; John his brother; Philip; Bartholomew; Thomas; Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus; Labbaeus, who was surnamed Thaddaeus; Simon the Cananite; Judas Iscariot, in whose stead came in Matthias.
and the names of the brothers are these.
brothers names were, James, Joses(also spelled joseph), Simon and Judas(also spelled jude and judah, and they are all pronouced the same)so you can see why they might be confused with being different people.
First, I thought it would be interesting to look up a little about Jude. Jude is the English form of the name Judas (loudas), the Greek form of Judah, which literally means “to give thanks, or praise”. The English version of the name is used in most versions of the Bible to disassociate Jude from Judas Iscariot. Most theologians agree that Jude was a half-brother to Jesus, as he was spoken of in Matt. 13:55:“Isn’t this the carpenter’s son? Isn’t his mothers name Mary, and aren’t his brothers James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas?”
Verse 1:“Jude, a servant of Jesus Christ and a brother of James, to those who have been called, who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ:”
The first verse starts out:“Jude, a servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James”.... It is thought that Jude was probably being humble because he did not believe that his own half-brother, Jesus, was the Messiah during His earthly days (nor did his other brothers - John 7:5).
So why wouldn't Jesus entrust Mary with her other son, Jude?
Your assumption that his 'brothers and sisters' didn't believe He was the Messiah is not quite right. They believed He was the Jewish version of the Messiah. And frankly, many of His closest Apostles didn't understand what kinda Messiah He was either, until He rose.
By the way, why are you the authority on these Sacred Writings?

Since: Jan 08

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#419267
Jan 31, 2013
 

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Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
So why wouldn't Jesus entrust Mary with her other son, Jude?
Your assumption that his 'brothers and sisters' didn't believe He was the Messiah is not quite right. They believed He was the Jewish version of the Messiah. And frankly, many of His closest Apostles didn't understand what kinda Messiah He was either, until He rose.
By the way, why are you the authority on these Sacred Writings?
I gave you the verse that shows that his brotehrs didnt believe in him and you still are trying to argue with me.

For neither did his brethren believe in him.

Jude was the youngest and the estate would fall to the eldest and that would include actually providing a stipend for mary.

as far as me being an authority, all i can tell you is this. I seem to know more than all of you catholics on here combined. and that saddens me, it really does, to think that people are not able to reason for themselves but must adhere to what their church tells them and they are not allowed to think for themselves, as you just stated the other day
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

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#419268
Jan 31, 2013
 
Chuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Really Tony???
You're better than that
No he isn't
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#419269
Jan 31, 2013
 
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>nice try to deflect, I aint talking to them you are the person trying to tell us that it is mary.lol.
have you ever heard of the word [harmonize}? that is what you need to find out who this is relating to and the dream of Joseph is the key to your understanding, not the vatican nor hahn. the Bible.
Well, I would have assumed that you literalists would want to be consistent and see the woman who "brought forth a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne.." as Jesus's mother.

I guess you only take the bible literally when you see fit.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

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#419270
Jan 31, 2013
 
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>reg is being just alittle deceitful it also means [NAY, BUT RATHER]. AND THAT IS THE USAGE IN THE BIBLE.
He replied, "Blessed [rather[ are those who hear the word of God and obey it."
Thanks Preston
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#419271
Jan 31, 2013
 

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atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>and you aint got the brains, it seems. Jesus was never married and so He never had any children,
you people got to tell one lie after another to try and catch up.lol
Once again I need remind you to either read my posts carefully before you respond or have someone read them to you.
truth

Perth, Australia

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#419272
Jan 31, 2013
 
every spirit is not holy
i am not to much care..not at all
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

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#419273
Jan 31, 2013
 
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
You are taught how to be a good catholic Anthony, and what you must believe to be one.
You were not taught the things of God, and how to be a follower of Jesus Christ.
In the Catholic Church; God it seems is the last person you go to
when it should be the very first.
There is the Priest, the Pope, Mary and other dead saints, whom you ask to go to God for you. That is sad.
Jesus dead to reconcile man with God. So we can go boldly to the throne of God, and talk to Him personaly Anthony.
He doesn't want you to rely your messages and concerns through other people.
How would you like it if your children did that to you, Anthony.
Its terrible how the catholic church teaches you to fear the very person who loves you the most.
There has been much discussion on these vary points you make.

Today young people in greater numbers are becoming more spiritual than religious, and do not seek the authority of any church but have a personal relationship with whatever God they worship.
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

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#419274
Jan 31, 2013
 
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Alright, I've stopped laughing (for the time being).
Do you know what the word 'beatitude' means? Do you know that it is a proper noun, as in the Beatitudes from the Sermon on the Mount, but is also just a 'plain old noun' and is used in Christian theology as such, and has been for 2,000 years?
III. CHRISTIAN BEATITUDE
1720 The New Testament uses several expressions to characterize the beatitude to which God calls man:
- the coming of the Kingdom of God;16 - the vision of God: "Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God"17
- entering into the joy of the Lord;18
- entering into God's rest:19
There we shall rest and see, we shall see and love, we shall love and praise. Behold what will be at the end without end. For what other end do we have, if not to reach the kingdom which has no end?20
1721 God put us in the world to know, to love, and to serve him, and so to come to paradise. Beatitude makes us "partakers of the divine nature" and of eternal life.21 With beatitude, man enters into the glory of Christ22 and into the joy of the Trinitarian life.
1722 Such beatitude surpasses the understanding and powers of man. It comes from an entirely free gift of God: whence it is called supernatural, as is the grace that disposes man to enter into the divine joy.
"Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God." It is true, because of the greatness and inexpressible glory of God, that "man shall not see me and live," for the Father cannot be grasped. But because of God's love and goodness toward us, and because he can do all things, he goes so far as to grant those who love him the privilege of seeing him.... For "what is impossible for men is possible for God."23
1723 The beatitude we are promised confronts us with decisive moral choices. It invites us to purify our hearts of bad instincts and to seek the love of God above all else. It teaches us that true happiness is not found in riches or well-being, in human fame or power, or in any human achievement - however beneficial it may be - such as science, technology, and art, or indeed in any creature, but in God alone, the source of every good and of all love:
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive...
One example of the use of the word 'beatitude'.
From the LA times yesterday.....

....A first round of 14 priest files made public in Los Angeles nearly two weeks ago showed that recently retired Cardinal Roger Mahony and other top officials maneuvered behind the scenes to shield molester priests, provide damage control for the church and keep parishioners in the dark about sexual abuse in their parishes. Those documents, released as part of an unrelated civil lawsuit, were not redacted and provided a glimpse of what could be contained in the larger release expected no later than Feb. 22.

Michael says......so what do you think of retired Cardinal Mahoney who kept the parishioners in the dark of sexually abusive clergy, to shield molesting priests to protect the church, as catholics continued filling the collection baskets at every mass? My My!

This story is about to EXX-P-L-O-D-E!!! 30,000 pages of confidential documents about to become known.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/30/la-c...

Wake up catholics! You have been made fools of too many times........stop the SILENCE and start demanding answers. Remember you pay ALL the bills of the church. You are in control.
Truth

Leesburg, VA

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#419275
Jan 31, 2013
 

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Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
So why wouldn't Jesus entrust Mary with her other son, Jude?
Your assumption that his 'brothers and sisters' didn't believe He was the Messiah is not quite right. They believed He was the Jewish version of the Messiah. And frankly, many of His closest Apostles didn't understand what kinda Messiah He was either, until He rose.
By the way, why are you the authority on these Sacred Writings?
It is true, Clay.....

We need to realize/understand that at the time of Jesus' death, none of His brothers believed in Him.

John was the ONLY disciple who stayed with Christ until He died--showing His dedication and bravery and an intimate relationship between Christ and His disciple whom He loved.

Why would Jesus entrust His mother to His brothers who did not believe in him???

Also, didn't John out live Jesus' mother??? Don't you think that Jesus knew this???

Don't you think that John knew and understood that it would be a GREAT HONOR to take care of Jesus' mother???
Clay

United States

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#419276
Jan 31, 2013
 

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Chuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Clay
I'm wondering how many times does Preston have to post something to you before you get it? Post after post after post and you still don't get it.
**And he's right..we don't follow doctrines..
Well excuuuuse me!

I know you guys do not have a doctrine as in, a collective agreement amongst the thousands of Protestant on scripture.
But each individual community would have a doctrine, no?
Doesn't you church you go to, have a universal understanding of scriptures? Don't you all have to agree that Christ and God and the Holy Spirit are one?
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

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#419277
Jan 31, 2013
 
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
Michael--as I have told you before--you can believe all of your anti-catholic "exaggerated trash articles" that you are so "famous in digging up"! Makes no difference to me, or ANY Catholic on this forum---OR the 1.168 Billion Catholics around the world. You and your Protestant, agnostic and atheist "heretics" (continue to "spin your wheels" as always and will say or do ANYTHING to keep your "hate and hostility heated up" with vengeance toward Jesus Christ and His One (and only) TRUE Apostolic Catholic Church. We,as Catholics will stick to the FULLNESS of the Faith and the FULLNESS of the TRUTH OF DOCTRINE taught ONLY in the One True Church that Jesus established over 2000 years ago. You--can do what you want!!!
Catholics pay ALL the bills of the roman catholic church. Catholics are in control,....... or are they?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/30/la-c...

Clay, where is your anger directed at Cardinal Mahoney, or would you rather blame Michael who did nothing wrong because you fear to question the mighty Cardinal?

Get your priorities straight of what is right and what is not. Start with the leaders of your own church, once you have done that then you can be angry at me all you want.

Catholics should be screaming BLOODY MURDER over what has happened just in Los Angeles over the years regarding your church leaders and abusive subordinates.
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

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$660 MILLION dollars in lawsuits just from the Diocese from Los Angeles in 2007.$660 MILLION! The meter is still running!

Dig deeper catholics, keep paying for the defense of these molesters, liars and deceivers. A percentage of every dollar you give, goes to financially support of defending these criminals that have been caught from dioceses all over the world.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/30/la-c...

$660,000,000.00 just from one diocese and that was from 6 years ago.

7th Day Catholics Rock

Poplar Bluff, MO

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#419279
Jan 31, 2013
 
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>I beleive that the Apostles thought so and that included Paul. now her is why only Sola Scripture should be addressed as the ONLY truth.
read this snippet.
Today we believe a canon of inspired writings is a necessity, but this was not so in the early days of the church. There was a strong oral and apostolic tradition within the early church. As mentioned earlier, the apostles and their associates were the human source of the "word of God" (Acts 4:29-31; 6:2-7; 11:1; 12:24; 13:46; et al.). Many of the early Christians remembered the apostles and their associates' teachings, teachings that were deeply imbedded in their minds. At first unity and lack of controversy within the church meant brethren did not have to constantly turn to a written Word to settle issues. By the middle of the first century, some uninformed individuals caused confusion about the relation of the Mosaic Law and Old Covenant to the Gospel and New Covenant. This issue was addressed by the apostles (Acts, Romans, Galatians, Hebrews, et al.). The apostles' effort largely corrected this problem, and the church was generally unified in doctrine. Also, writing and books were nothing like they are now. Today we generally think that for any idea to be authoritative, it must have come from a book, but this was not so in the early church.
and we see that oral teachings by those other than the Apsotles caused trouble and we now see that on this forum with you catholics believing everything that the vatican tells u
You forgot the url.

http://www.bibleviews.com/earlywrittenword.ht...
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

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#419280
Jan 31, 2013
 
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't tell me, tell your sola scriptura protestant brethren who disagree with you.
Every city "church" is part of THE Church. There is only ONE Church, a concept protestants just can't seem to grasp.
Anthony, how many times have you posted that guilty molesting clergy are scum bags and should be in jail? Lots of times right?

Yet every sunday you drop your hard earned money into the collection baskets, not knowing where all your hard earned money goes. A percentage of your collection money goes to pay for the financial legal defense costs of clergy accused of sexual crimes, yet you tell me they are scum bags.

As you know all the dioceses within the state of Minnesota have had more than their fair share of buggering clergy.....

Catholics should have an accounting of where every hard earned dollar goes..........but they don't and they don't seem to care.

I would believe AN ENTREPENOUR business man such as yourself, would want to know that ALL your money is going to good causes ONLY!

Where is your voice of reason?

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#419281
Jan 31, 2013
 
LTM wrote:
ROMANS 10: YOU SHOULD READ IT ANTHONY, ITS CLEAR WHAT IT SAYS.
I AM INTERPRETING NOTHING. ITS FROM THE HOLY SCRIPTURE IT IS MEANT FOR US TO READ GOD WANTS YOU TO READ IT.

New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
if anything, "Paul" or "God" isn't demanding anyone to read it, but you sure are.
Prove to the forum that "God" said for us to read the Bible.
You do have a specific statement from "God" to Moses, right?
Or are you going to make things up, like your co-patriots, and go into some wild-eyed tangent? Please don't.
Just post the citation to where "God" is saying to all of mankind to read the Bible.
I'll wait.
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
I never demanded anyone to read it I said God wants us to read it and he does want anthony to read it.
Why else would God give us the Holy Scripture.
"YOU SHOULD READ IT ANTHONY, ITS CLEAR WHAT IT SAYS......GOD WANTS YOU TO READ IT. "

Prove it.

That is what I initially asked you to do.

And lookie here LTM - you avoided it.

Why do so-called "Christians" promote honesty and truth, when you can't even provide the truths you promote?

Why do you mislead others?

I'll ask again...

"Prove to the forum that "God" said for us to read the Bible.

You do have a specific statement from "God" to Moses, right?

Or are you going to make things up, like your co-patriots, and go into some wild-eyed tangent? Please don't.

Just post the citation to where "God" is saying to all of mankind to read the Bible."

THis is where honesty comes into play LTM - let's see how well you can use it.
Clay

United States

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#419282
Jan 31, 2013
 

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Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
It is true, Clay.....
We need to realize/understand that at the time of Jesus' death, none of His brothers believed in Him.
John was the ONLY disciple who stayed with Christ until He died--showing His dedication and bravery and an intimate relationship between Christ and His disciple whom He loved.
Why would Jesus entrust His mother to His brothers who did not believe in him???
Also, didn't John out live Jesus' mother??? Don't you think that Jesus knew this???
Don't you think that John knew and understood that it would be a GREAT HONOR to take care of Jesus' mother???
There is a real problem here. You and Preston are saying none of Jesus biological siblings believed in Him. Their own brother? And since they were His siblings, didn't they grow up knowing He was born of a Virgin (their mom)? Didn't Mary tell her other kids about the Angel of Lord appearing to her and telling her who their brother is?? Didn't Joseph tell the other kids that he wasn't the biological father of Jesus, but God is?
Those were not his half siblings. Mary did not have any other children.
Further more, those 'brothers and sisters' referred to in the Bible did believe in Him. They just didn't believe what was really Him. They didn't reject that He was the Messiah, but they just expected something different, like everybody else.
Clay

United States

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#419283
Jan 31, 2013
 
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>I beleive that the Apostles thought so and that included Paul. now her is why only Sola Scripture should be addressed as the ONLY truth.
read this snippet.
Today we believe a canon of inspired writings is a necessity, but this was not so in the early days of the church. There was a strong oral and apostolic tradition within the early church. As mentioned earlier, the apostles and their associates were the human source of the "word of God" (Acts 4:29-31; 6:2-7; 11:1; 12:24; 13:46; et al.). Many of the early Christians remembered the apostles and their associates' teachings, teachings that were deeply imbedded in their minds. At first unity and lack of controversy within the church meant brethren did not have to constantly turn to a written Word to settle issues. By the middle of the first century, some uninformed individuals caused confusion about the relation of the Mosaic Law and Old Covenant to the Gospel and New Covenant. This issue was addressed by the apostles (Acts, Romans, Galatians, Hebrews, et al.). The apostles' effort largely corrected this problem, and the church was generally unified in doctrine. Also, writing and books were nothing like they are now. Today we generally think that for any idea to be authoritative, it must have come from a book, but this was not so in the early church.
and we see that oral teachings by those other than the Apsotles caused trouble and we now see that on this forum with you catholics believing everything that the vatican tells u
Ok, hypothetically if sola scripture is true. Why are your teachings different then the first Christians?

Do you really believe they got it all wrong or Constantine infiltrated Our Lords will?
Wise up.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#419284
Jan 31, 2013
 
Clay wrote:
Does any Protestant agree that the New Testament did not come labeled for us?
Didn't it take an Earthly people to determine if its scriptural or not?
I mean, make some sense y'all.
At least acknowledge that the Catholic Church at Rome compiled the letters, memoirs and Books they thought were inspired by God- in the 4th and 5th Century (60 yrs after Constantine)
Then, if you want, you could say that they fell away from those teachings.
Of course the problem with that would be: Jesus Christ really didn't promise to be with them til the end of the world. And the gates of Hell prevailed against His Church..
You'll exclaim these "truths", but yet you don't seem to acknowledge them to be true:

- men created the Bible
- men chose what texts were to be selected
- religion is man-made
- "thought to be inspired by God" - not afraid to admit the "Self" involved, but refuse to acknowledge it is "Self".

Why?

Not being honest with yourself?
Truth

Leesburg, VA

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#419285
Jan 31, 2013
 

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Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a real problem here. You and Preston are saying none of Jesus biological siblings believed in Him. Their own brother? And since they were His siblings, didn't they grow up knowing He was born of a Virgin (their mom)? Didn't Mary tell her other kids about the Angel of Lord appearing to her and telling her who their brother is?? Didn't Joseph tell the other kids that he wasn't the biological father of Jesus, but God is?
Those were not his half siblings. Mary did not have any other children.
Further more, those 'brothers and sisters' referred to in the Bible did believe in Him. They just didn't believe what was really Him. They didn't reject that He was the Messiah, but they just expected something different, like everybody else.
John 7:5

5 For even his own brothers did not believe in him.

Nuh said....

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