Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 548,933
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story

Since: Aug 12

Location hidden

#418430 Jan 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually my ignorant friend, the Church added 27 books to scripture. They authoritatively declared it the New Testament. That's how you have a Bible in the first place to beat us over the head with.
NO.
The romanist denomination did not write the Bible.... nor did it give it to anyone.

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

#418431 Jan 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
Only the Catholics!!!!
When Rome went from being pagan to Christian under Constantine, they had to find a replacement for the great mother of paganism. It was not until the time of Constantine that anyone began to look at Mary as a goddess.
Since Mary was the mother of Jesus Christ, she was the most logical person to replace the pagan mother goddess. The pagans could continue their prayers and devotion to the mother goddess, only they would call her Mary.
The pagans worshipped the mother as much or more than her son and this is exactly what the Roman Catholicism does. True Christianity teaches that Jesus Christ is to be worshipped – not his mother.
The fact remains that Jesus never hinted at the idea of Mary worship nor did any of the apostles. Worshipping the mother goddess along with her child took place centuries before Jesus Christ was ever born in many different parts of the world. In 431 A.D. Mary worship became an official doctrine of the church in at the Council of Ephesus.
All these stories played out centuries before. The only difference is the character names are different.

Its all part of our history.

http://pocm.info/

Since: Nov 08

usa

#418432 Jan 27, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
Your comments are based upon NOTHING other than first "one opinion", then "another opinion" and just more and "more additional opinions" all (laced with more of your (bogus) anti-catholic distorted church history. You don't put much stock in "ANYTHING" Catholic that is supported over and over again with bounified, abundant and (proven) Church History for over 2000 years. If there is "any hearsay" regarding Church History, it comes "directly" from your Protestant heretical "hack" historian writers, who will write or attempt to "debunk "anything" against the TRUTH of Jesus Christs historically and biblically PROVEN One True Apostolic Catholic Church.
i do not put stock in any organized group,not just catholic,because none of them tell the whole truth,and partly because constantine and his 100 scholars burned books while putting together the catholic religion,if it didn't fit with paganism,burn it,catholic history come from the catholic church only,there is nothing out there to support your wild theories about the church,and now will you answer my question? you quick to condenm everyone else but i can't get you to answer a question about the c. church,why? how many people did they kill in the name of god, just because the people did not want to join the church??

Since: Nov 08

usa

#418433 Jan 27, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
I will repeat this for people like you jethro8, who have "difficulty comprehending ANYTHING that "debunks" the anti-catholic "trash talking" garbage that you are so famous for!!
How many Catholics were murdered by the Protestants during their "reformation"?
Calvin sought to persecute Roman Catholics so as to keep Protestant believers in the lands divided by the Reformation faithful to his new teachings. He viciously persecuted the Spaniard, Michael Servetus,a Catholic, having him burnt alive on October 27, 1553. As early as 1545, Calvin had written,“If he [Servetus] comes to Geneva, I will never allow him to depart alive.”
Melancthon, one of the more mild reformers and the editor for Luther’s many works and teachings, would write to Bullinger,“I am astonished that some persons denounce the severity that was so justly used in that case.”[In reference to execution of Roman Catholics]
Theodore of Beza wrote:“What crime can be greater or more heinous than heresy, which sets at nought the word of God and all ecclesiastic discipline? Christian magistrates, do your duty to God [speaking in Calvin's Geneva of 1554], who has put the sword into your hands for the honor of His majesty; strike valiantly these Catholic monsters in the guise of men.” He went on to characterize those who demanded freedom of conscience “worse than the tyranny of the pope. It is better to have a tyrant, no matter how cruel he may be, than to let everyone do as he pleases.”
Martin Luther also fanned the flames of Catholic intolerance,“Whoever teaches otherwise than I teach, condemns God, and must remain a child of hell.”
King Henry VIII of England, who took upon himself the role of grand royal inquisitor, took the lives of some 72,000 Catholics, many who were cruelly tortured.
Queen Elizabeth, proved herself the former’s daughter by putting to death more Catholics in one year than the Inquisition had done in 331 years!
Irish Catholic Holocaust ---. By the mid-19th century, Ireland was a country of Eight Million, mostly peasants. As a result of years of exploitation, they survived as tenant farmers and were never far from economic disaster. They were forced to exist on a single crop: the potato. A disease turned the potato into a foul slime. When the Irish masses turned to the British government for relief, they were denied.
Meanwhile,“Food, from 30 to 50 shiploads per day, was removed at gunpoint (from Ireland) by 12,000 British constables, reinforced by 200,000 British soldiers, warships, excise vessels, and coast guards... Britain seized from Ireland’s producers tens of millions of head of livestock, tens of millions of tons of flour, grains, meat, poultry and dairy products-enough to sustain 18-million persons.”[20]. Note: While the British occupied Northern Ireland millions of Irish Catholics were starving from lack of food not the British.
Gallagher estimates 2 million died from the famine. Writer Chris Fogarty, places the numbers “murdered at approximately 5.16 million, making it the Irish holocaust.” Distinguished legal scholars, like Professors Charles Rice of Notre Dame U. and Francis A. Boyle, U. of Illinois, believe that under International Law, that the British pursued a barbarous policy of mass starvation of Catholics in Ireland from 1845-50, and that such conduct constituted “genocide.”
ok now tell us how many people were killed by the church since it's begining just for the sole reason they did not want to be catholic,and they wanted to be "THE" biggest religion in the known world? if catholics had it so bad why didn't they leave england and ireland? if i'm not mistaken,catholics were the first to start the killings,before protestants did and muslims did.
ReginaM

Jackson, NJ

#418434 Jan 27, 2013
Oxbow wrote:
405
<quoted text>
The Catholic religion is a denomination and so are all Protestant religions. Christ never built any denomination or denominations.
He established Christianity...
church: ekklesia, a calling out, i.e.(concretely) a popular meeting, especially a religious congregation (Jewish synagogue, or Christian community of members on earth or saints in heaven or both):--assembly, church.
Christ founded a church, not Christianity. That church is the Catholic Church, so no it isn't a denomination. Denominationalism within Christianity is peculiar to protestantism. It was unheard of until the deformation a few hundred years ago.

You have a penchant for using contemporary American secular resources to define your beliefs (dictionaries, encyclopedias, and the like). An ecclesial gathering/meeting is not properly a church.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418435 Jan 27, 2013
JUST-A-CHRISTIAN wrote:
<quoted text>
NO.
The romanist denomination did not write the Bible.... nor did it give it to anyone.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Then please offer me an alternative scenario.

First of all, thanks for the migraine prayers.

Did the Bible fall out of the sky printed and ready to go- promptly handed out to the folks by the Apostles?
Does your Bible tell you which books belong in it?
No.
How did the books come to fruition as the New Testament and combined with the OT?
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418436 Jan 27, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Christ founded a church, not Christianity. That church is the Catholic Church, so no it isn't a denomination. Denominationalism within Christianity is peculiar to protestantism. It was unheard of until the deformation a few hundred years ago.
You have a penchant for using contemporary American secular resources to define your beliefs (dictionaries, encyclopedias, and the like). An ecclesial gathering/meeting is not properly a church.
If someone went back in a time machine to 200 AD , 800 AD or any year before Protestants established 'denominations' they would quickly find out no one would know what the heck they are talking about when they say, "scripture alone, faith alone, born again, evangelical, denomination, etc..the list goes on.
There was only the Catholic Church.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418437 Jan 27, 2013
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>the FIRST sign or mark of a cult is that they refuse to accept the word of God and try to change it for whatever reason.
so just consider the source and dont accept anything from them.
I would disagree. All 'Christian' cults accept the word of God. Its just their opinion on what its saying...They simply apply their ideology to it and feel justified under sola scripture.
Frankly, Preston, you can't argue with them because you too believe in sola scripture
Who's going to tell either of ya you're wrong?
Guest

Poplar Bluff, MO

#418438 Jan 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
I would disagree. All 'Christian' cults accept the word of God. Its just their opinion on what its saying...They simply apply their ideology to it and feel justified under sola scripture.
Frankly, Preston, you can't argue with them because you too believe in sola scripture
Who's going to tell either of ya you're wrong?
<snicker>

And the RCC had done the same with the scriptures they have confiscated from the early church in Jerusalem and throughout asia minor etc..

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#418439 Jan 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
If someone went back in a time machine to 200 AD , 800 AD or any year before Protestants established 'denominations' they would quickly find out no one would know what the heck they are talking about when they say, "scripture alone, faith alone, born again, evangelical, denomination, etc..the list goes on.
There was only the Catholic Church.
dont act so foolish.

Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be [born again]SEE THAT, STRAIGHT FORM THE LIPS OF JESUS HIMSELF.

so I am not the least surprised that you along with all catholics dont have a clue as to what Jesus was Saying, and if YOU dont know what He meant, then you aint Saved.

Jesus never founded any Church, but he did give Salvation to those who are Born Again. No church ever saved one person!

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#418440 Jan 27, 2013
aussiejohn wrote:
<quoted text>
You should check out the writings of a bloke called "Origin". Now as i recall he was writing within a century or so of Jesus's death and was considered for saint hood. Anyway, he went on about people taking much of the new testament too literally and totally missing the point which was intended. Not sure the writers of the Gospels had a debate on embryos in mind when the penned that one. Something much deeper is actually going on.
aussiejohn

I have read Origen....And I have just skimmed the book "On First Principle", chapter 2 "that many by not understanding the scriptures spiritually and by badly understanding fall into heresies"

It is a short chapter. And I would agree with your assessment of the situation with embryos. I brought it forward as preston seems to be an advocate of the "embryo" theory. And I am trying to imagine how he comes up with Jesus being fully human, but not of human ancestry...?
guest

United States

#418441 Jan 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
Actually my ignorant friend, the Church added 27 books to scripture. They authoritatively declared it the New Testament. That's how you have a Bible in the first place to beat us over the head with.
-
Guest wrote:
<quoted text>Thats why we are to reffer to the orginal source as a referrence point because of the HARM YOUR Church the RCC has caused and done.
-
-
According to the Catholic church, the Jews didn't know what belonged in the scriptures, so they added 7 books!
-
Never mind that the canon of Jewish scripture was closed and the Apocrypha was NEVER included, and are not part of it today.
-
So why does the Catholic church think it can add so many books to the Jewish canon?
-
The same reason the Catholic church does anything: they think Jesus gave the right to Peter to change up everything.
-
They think Peter is the first in a long line of Popes bringing "New Revelation" much like the Mormon Church believes they, too, have New Revelation - and in fact, Catholics claim the Bible is not accurate - much like the Mormons do when they say, "We believe the Bible to be the word of God in so far as it has been translated accurately."
Only thing is: They never tell you that they don't believe the Bible is accurately translated! Which means they have given themselves license to do as they see fit. You know? If the Bible isn't *accurate*... then what?
-
But listen to what Peter himself said:
-
http://niv.scripturetext.com/2_peter/2.htm

2 Peter 2

False Teachers and Their Destruction

1 But there were also FALSE PROPHETS among the people, just as there will be FALSE TEACHERS AMONG YOU. They will secretly introduce DESTRUCTIVE HERESIES, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 MANY WILL FOLLOW THEIR SHAMEFUL WAYS AND WILL BRING THE WAY OF TRUTH INTO DISREPUTE. 3 In their GREED these TEACHERS will EXPLOIT YOU with STORIES THEY HAVE MADE UP. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
-
-
There were FALSE TEACHERS even in the FIRST CENTURY just doing what they wanted to do. Going against the WRITTEN Word of God!
-
About 400 years AFTER Peter uttered the above words at 2 Peter 2, Augustine was busy doing his OWN thing in the so-called "church" that Christ founded. Even though he LATER acknowledged that there was a definite distinction between books of the Hebrew canon, and such "outside books" of the Apocrypha, Augustine initiated inclusion of them into the Hebrew canon.... around 800 years after the Hebrew canon was closed! If that is not arrogant actions of a *false prophet*, I don't know what is. Basically you have a Catholic telling the Hebrews what was correct in their own Bible.
-
What is most amazing though, is it was not until the Council of Trent, in 1546 C.E., that the Catholic Church definitely confirmed its acceptance of those books ... about 30 years AFTER the Protestant Reformation was sparked by Martin Luther. Go figure!
-

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#418442 Jan 27, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
I would disagree. All 'Christian' cults accept the word of God. Its just their opinion on what its saying...They simply apply their ideology to it and feel justified under sola scripture.
Frankly, Preston, you can't argue with them because you too believe in sola scripture
Who's going to tell either of ya you're wrong?
are you on some meds that you are taking now? your post doesnt make sense to me.

cults take away from the Word of God, I who believe in Sola scripture dont.

If you take away words and meanings, then you dont believe in sola scriptures.

he said that originally people werent baptised in the Name of the father, Son and Holy Ghost.

I who believe in SS, couldnt go along with that, in my belief that the Word of God is All Sufficient to meet all Needs, and needs nothing else to align with It.
ReginaM

Jackson, NJ

#418443 Jan 27, 2013
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>dont act so foolish.
Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be [born again]SEE THAT, STRAIGHT FORM THE LIPS OF JESUS HIMSELF.
so I am not the least surprised that you along with all catholics dont have a clue as to what Jesus was Saying, and if YOU dont know what He meant, then you aint Saved.
Jesus never founded any Church, but he did give Salvation to those who are Born Again. No church ever saved one person!
Sorry, Preston, you're wrong. Christ said He would build His church upon the rock of St. Peter...He didn't say he would build Christianity. The NT speaks continuously of His church.

OT: Doesn't 4 live in MO? And isn't he/she fond of using the term <snicker>? The answer to both is yes.....
guest

United States

#418444 Jan 27, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Christ founded a church, not Christianity.

>>> clipped for emphasis <<<
-
Followers of Christ are "Christian."
-
Followers of the Pope are "Catholic."
-
and there is a world of difference between the two.
-
IF CHRIST WAS NOT THE FOUNDER OF CHRISTIANITY, WHO WAS?

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#418445 Jan 27, 2013
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>dont be as stupid as some others on this forum. the word "conceive' means a BEGINNING, IT DOESNT REFER TO SEX BETWEEN GOD AND MARY. A BEGINNING OF HER PREGNANCY , AS SHE NOW BECAME THE SURROGATE MOTHER OF THE SON OF GOD.
your words"God put an embryo from some unknown source " are rediculous, THE SOURCE IS GOD, NOT SOME UNKNOWN SOURCE.
of course there is no mention of the word"embryo" since it wasnt used until 1548, so get real. AND NO, we might not assume that God caused one of her eggs to become an embryo, it doesnt work that way since it takes male sperm to produce an embryo, BUT GOD DIDNT NEED NOR USE ANY EGG FROM HER SINCE THAT MAKES JESUS HALF MAN/ HALF GOD
preston

If God created Adam, and all have descended from Adam, then how can God create a second Adam(Jesus) to redeem the first Adam, if there is nothing of the first Adam within Jesus?

You have removed Jesus from being descended from Adam with your idea that God put "something" in Mary.(You use the word embryo before, but somehow that offends you now....)

You have come up with the idea also of Mary as a SURROGATE, rather than being the direct earthly mother in which SHE conceived in HER womb(Luke 1:31,35) by the overshadowing of the Holy Spirit, as justification for your "something" in Mary.

Your two ideas of embryo implantation by God,(rather than her conceived in her womb by God), and SURROGACY,(from the line of Adam through Mary), are way outside what the Bible declares.

In essence you have reduced Jesus to being some idea of yours you project onto God, of Jesus without being human, thus nullified the death and ressurrection.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418446 Jan 27, 2013
atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>are you on some meds that you are taking now? your post doesnt make sense to me.
cults take away from the Word of God, I who believe in Sola scripture dont.
If you take away words and meanings, then you dont believe in sola scriptures.
he said that originally people werent baptised in the Name of the father, Son and Holy Ghost.
I who believe in SS, couldnt go along with that, in my belief that the Word of God is All Sufficient to meet all Needs, and needs nothing else to align with It.
Lol. no I'm not on any meds.

I don't really think people in cults follow the word of God either.
what I meant to say is, they THINK they are.
And if Sola Scripture was true, they would be no more valid then you. They are seeing the Bible the way they know how and no one who subscribes to Sola Scripture has any right to say anything.
To each his own.
Hence, by the end of this year, there will be over 50,000 denominations in the world. Some will be similar in doctrine, some will be poles apart.
LTM

Fort Frances, Canada

#418447 Jan 27, 2013
JUST-A-CHRISTIAN wrote:
<quoted text>
I am sorry to hear that, and pray you will feel better real soon, Clay. I know it's not fun, by any means.
If clay had a migraine he wouldn't be on a computer I promise you that.
I took migrines for 5 years, I would rather be in labour.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418448 Jan 27, 2013
guest wrote:
<quoted text>
-
<quoted text>
-
-
According to the Catholic church, the Jews didn't know what belonged in the scriptures, so they added 7 books!
-
Never mind that the canon of Jewish scripture was closed and the Apocrypha was NEVER included, and are not part of it today.
-
So why does the Catholic church think it can add so many books to the Jewish canon?
-
The same reason the Catholic church does anything: they think Jesus gave the right to Peter to change up everything.
-
They think Peter is the first in a long line of Popes bringing "New Revelation" much like the Mormon Church believes they, too, have New Revelation - and in fact, Catholics claim the Bible is not accurate - much like the Mormons do when they say, "We believe the Bible to be the word of God in so far as it has been translated accurately."
Only thing is: They never tell you that they don't believe the Bible is accurately translated! Which means they have given themselves license to do as they see fit. You know? If the Bible isn't *accurate*... then what?
-
But listen to what Peter himself said:
-
http://niv.scripturetext.com/2_peter/2.htm
2 Peter 2
False Teachers and Their Destruction
1 But there were also FALSE PROPHETS among the people, just as there will be FALSE TEACHERS AMONG YOU. They will secretly introduce DESTRUCTIVE HERESIES, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 MANY WILL FOLLOW THEIR SHAMEFUL WAYS AND WILL BRING THE WAY OF TRUTH INTO DISREPUTE. 3 In their GREED these TEACHERS will EXPLOIT YOU with STORIES THEY HAVE MADE UP. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
-
-
There were FALSE TEACHERS even in the FIRST CENTURY just doing what they wanted to do. Going against the WRITTEN Word of God!
-
About 400 years AFTER Peter uttered the above words at 2 Peter 2, Augustine was busy doing his OWN thing in the so-called "church" that Christ founded. Even though he LATER acknowledged that there was a definite distinction between books of the Hebrew canon, and such "outside books" of the Apocrypha, Augustine initiated inclusion of them into the Hebrew canon.... around 800 years after the Hebrew canon was closed! If that is not arrogant actions of a *false prophet*, I don't know what is. Basically you have a Catholic telling the Hebrews what was correct in their own Bible.
-
What is most amazing though, is it was not until the Council of Trent, in 1546 C.E., that the Catholic Church definitely confirmed its acceptance of those books ... about 30 years AFTER the Protestant Reformation was sparked by Martin Luther. Go figure!
-
Guest, you're propaganda laced slander does nothing but get you further trapped in deceit.

Couple questions:

Do you think Luther had the authority to determine scripture canon?

The answer should be no.

So, who had the authority to determine scripture canon?

I'm saddened because I spent a great deal of time showing you your error last time.
You were wrong about the Bible.

For some reason, you ignored it. You keep living in some fantasy history.
I wish one of ya could offer a scenario that makes sense, but you can't.
So I guess I have to remain Catholic. You've failed me Guest.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#418449 Jan 27, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
If clay had a migraine he wouldn't be on a computer I promise you that.
I took migrines for 5 years, I would rather be in labour.
I think there are certain degrees of migraines, depending on the person.
BUT, I exaggerated and didn't mean to imply it was severe. I'm fine, but it made me crabby.

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