Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 567,539
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
Pad

Rockford, IL

#417913 Jan 24, 2013
hojo wrote:
"Why the Catholic Church is the Only True Christian Church"!
It is becoming less and less popular these days to consider the term 'Christian' to mean Catholics, or even the numerous Protestant denominations. When someone says that he or she is 'Christian,' they are generally referring to Fundamentalism. Fundamentalism, however, is based primarily on the teachings of Paul, rather than Jesus; and those who adhere to it merely "pick and choose" specific lines and passages which will uphold their erroneous beliefs, leaving out or misinterpreting anything which is not convenient to their stand.
Fundamentalists routinely dismiss the Catholic Church in such contemptuous terms as "the whore of Babylon," and attempt to grant it unsavory status by likening it to an equally-contemptuous term, "Judaizers." To briefly note the correlations between the two, Fundamentalists have great negativity toward such aspects as Priests, Altars, Holy Water, Dietary Regulations, the bread/wafers, and keeping the Ten Commandments. In other words, the Catholic Church following the same precepts as the Jewish religion which Jesus lived, is something which Fundamentalists point at as "wrong." Teaching that Jesus, and belief in Jesus, represents the irrelevance of the Old Testament, Fundamentalists dismiss one of the most important precepts which Catholics adhere to:
Matthew 5:17-19 says "Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place. Therefore, whoever breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven. But whoever obeys and teaches these commandments will be called greatest in the kingdom of heaven."
The subject of what constitutes "salvation" is one of the most significant dividers. As Fundamentalists fully believe that once one has "accepted Christ as one's personal savior" that one individual act constitutes being "saved," they are dismissing everything that is clearly written in black and white, clearly stating that that is not so. With that belief, Fundamentalists take extreme exception to much of what the Catholic Church is based upon-- they do not believe in the sacraments, even the Eucharist and confession are scorned. Nothing past the act of being "saved" is considered relevant.
As is written in Matthew 7:21: "Not everyone who says to Me, "Lord, Lord," shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven." This is only one passage which is given to mean that one's actions are indeed relevant. What is the will of God? One can begin that answer with the Commandments. One can continue answering by recalling the words of Jesus in his Sermon on the Mount:
Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
In those words alone one cannot deny the importance of how one lives one's life. Those who have given themselves to the Catholic Church, either as its leaders or followers, know this. And one need look no further than the eighth Beatitude to understand. The question you can ask yourself is are you a Fundamentalist, or are you a true Christian?
Continued for space:
Clay

United States

#417914 Jan 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Your Holy Bible???? Wow Clay
God gave His Holy Word to the world.
The catholic church isn't the whole world.
I dare say God would have Entrusted your church,
with his Holy Word.
Then in your opinion, Christianity didn't really begin until 1450 AD, when 'the whole world' could obtain a Bible.
Absolutely God gave us the Bible AND the Catholic Church to infallibly interpret it. Why would God not have an Earthly authority to safeguard it?

If its not the CC, then which one of you 42,000 is it?
You guys refuse to acknowledge the massive doctrinal mess you're all trapped in. Somehow, you've convinced yourselves the Holy Spirit is guiding you while interpreting the Holy Scripture.
7th Day Catholics Rock

Poplar Bluff, MO

#417915 Jan 24, 2013
Full of Love wrote:
<quoted text>
Lord have mercy 7th,what in the world is wrong with you.
That was very nasty.I wish now I hadn't clicked on that link.
Only in ones own mind maybe. They really did sell them at Wal-Greens check on the internet.
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

#417916 Jan 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
I dare say God would have Entrusted your church,
with his Holy Word.
The fact is--THAT "HE" DID!!! The Early Church Fathers formulated, compiled and translated the documents, letters, scrolls and parchments from the Apostles, over 450 years after Jesus initiated His first Apostolic Church at Antioch (Acts 2), forming the "Canon of Scripture in 382,393, and 397AD, "entrusting His Written Word" (the Bible) to His One True Church----the Catholic Church.----The same "written Word of God" that Protestants have "butchered,(eliminating 7 of the original books of the Bible, mis-quoted, mis-interpreted, and mis-represented the TRUTH of the SPOKEN, STATED and EXPRESSED words of Jesus Christ HIMSELF. Jesus' words in the Gospels are clear, concise and explicit regarding His One (and ONLY)True Church (Matt 16:1`3-21) and His TRUE body and TRUE blood, in the Eucharist (John 6:47-59). "Spin and going around in circles" will get you nowhere LTM, except a "temporary joy-ride" round and around on the tea cups at Disneyland!!
Clay

United States

#417917 Jan 24, 2013
7th Day Catholics Rock wrote:
<quoted text>Only in ones own mind maybe. They really did sell them at Wal-Greens check on the internet.
If I was with my buddys, maybe i would chuckle.

But this a forum where the focus is religion and Jesus Christ. We talk Christianity and theology. Its not appropriate for that kinda humor.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#417918 Jan 24, 2013
hojo,you have every right to post what you did,and no doubt we all have given discertations about our particular persuasions,and we are either agreed with or the opposite. So I am not going to hurl negative rhetoric at you.

Nevertheless I think hojo that you are misinformed about what fundamentalism is all about,and that the posters(non-Catholic) on here especially are not fundamentalist.

The evangelicals who get on this thread are not fundamentalists,and they come from backgrounds of strong evangelical denominations which came out of the Reformer churches.I am not a fundamentalist!

preston's church is not a fundamentalist church,but from a strong line of holiness churches which are old Methodist,that which is not liberal hogwash.

Fundamentalists are known in every group that is true,and they usually are a distinctive m i n o r i t y.

Fundamentalism is based in legalism,and holds to a strong and stubborn canon,which is the letter of the law.Christian fundamentalists may speak about being saved and no doubt they do,but in a legalistic,rigid way that as Jesus said"Strains a ngat."

Salvation is very clear in the Bible,and that clarity is in the PERSON of Jesus Christ,what He lived,suffered,died and was resurrected for.The study of the Bible can lead one either to a fundamentalist legalistic end or a true Christian persepctive that includes L O V E, HOPE,and JOY.

Most fundamentalists are not filled with J o y,but rigid discipline to further their u n d e r s t a n d i n g of the Scriptures and so on.

By the way, all Christians are under the 8th Beatitude including the fundamentlists.And also those fundamentalists are brothers and sisters in Christ,and need our love,as they often forsake the treasures of the Joy of the Lord to press righteousness and holiness.But they do not realize that what they need is the JOY of Christ and to forsake legalism which many of them are bound in.

You can preach the gospel with sincerity and truth,and be right on,pounding your message into the ears of the listeners,but without the Spirit.The Spirit makes the difference and He brings even the worst message of hell-fire but with MERCY and love.Fundamentalists are often incapable of bringing strong gospel teaching with love and mercy,because they rely on a PROPHET platform.

As for being immersed in Paul's teachings to a fault,I believe that perhaps you especially being a former Lutheran are turned off to Paul because Luther was so bent on the epistles,and used them as amunition against the corrupt Papacy of his day.

I have seen Catholic priests who were fundamentalists in their own right,dogmatic,cold and austere,determined to propagate ROMAN Catholicism above even the Lord Jesus Himself. You are in no better shape being a RC than anyother type of Christian,if the Spirit of Love,and Mercy and CHRIST is not in you,so ponder that for awhile.
RCC Superiority -- BUSTED

Melbourne, FL

#417919 Jan 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Your Holy Bible???? Wow Clay
God gave His Holy Word to the world.
The catholic church isn't the whole world.
I dare say God would have Entrusted your church,
with his Holy Word.
Catholics have morally superior teachings.

Just look at the real world and see.
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

#417920 Jan 24, 2013
RCC Superiority -- BUSTED wrote:
<quoted text>
Question of the day:
Why are there more people today interested in "dog rescue" than child rescue?


RCC Superiority says......Why are there more people today interested in "dog rescue" than child rescue

Michaels opinion....

..Pro-life lobbyists, direct more anger towards a girl willing to abort, and anger at the system for allowing it, than the love they would have to adopt her child. People need to stop judging the pregnant girl and start focusing on whats most important. Adoptions of these unwanted children.

...Adopting a rescue dog, is a total labor of love. People don't care who the rescue dogs mother is, or the circumstances of how she got pregnant. They know a rescue dog will be their loyal companion.

caveat.....there are groups who do adopt these unwanted babies, and good for them, but too many others march with placards with church members, or call for a day of prayer actually do very little in solving this on going dilema.

Action always speak louder than words.

Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#417921 Jan 24, 2013
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
YOU WROTE
You're not ready, may not ever be ready to be a teacher of scripture.
SEZ YOU...
AND BY WHAT AUTHORITY TO YOU JUDGE HER...
SHE HAS THE LEADERSHIP, GUIDANCE... OF THE HOLY GHOST....
QUESTION...
How can you.... that denies the authenticity of the scripture ...
WHICH THE HOLY GHOST INSPIRED make such a declaration.
Your belief is based upon CONJECTURE AND FABLES...pre-scriptural conjecture that is nothing more than hearsay, with nothing from the OLD OR NEW TESTAMENT TO VALIDATE BACK IT UP.
YOU CHURCH DOES NOT HAVE A MONOPOLY OR A FRANCHISE ON THE LEADERSHIP OF THE HOLY GHOST...
NO ONE HAS..
BUT EVERY HONEST SEEKER... THAT IS BORN AGAIN ...OF THE SPIRIT ...HAS THIS PROMISE FROM JESUS...
Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
Joh 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Joh 16:15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
Pro_16:18 Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.
Pro_17:19 He loveth transgression that loveth strife: and he that exalteth his gate seeketh destruction.
Pro_18:7 A fool's mouth is his destruction, and his lips are the snare of his soul.
Pro_18:12 Before destruction the heart of man is haughty, and before honour is humility.
Pro_21:15 It is joy to the just to do judgment: but destruction shall be to the workers of iniquity.
And what I said to LTM goes for you too. Any chump who buys into the fraud Benny Hinn shouldn't be allowed to teach Sunday school to 5 year olds.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#417922 Jan 24, 2013
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
More Protestant BS Propaganda! We as Catholics read the bible every day, as well as hear the word of God "every single day" at daily Mass. The difference is that (each) bible only Protestant puts "their own" (individual)42,000+ contradicting and conflicting mis-interpretations of "spin" on what they read.....while Catholics "follow, adhere to, and accept" the TRUE interpretation of the Bible given by the Early Church Fathers in 382,393 and 397 AD......Jesus, initiated, formed and left for His disciples, apostles and His followers (today) His One True (Universal) Catholic Church, in Matt 16:13-21.---of which Paul (in 1Tim 3:15) calls the Church (not the Bible) the pillar, pinnacle and foundation of the TRUTH!!
Take away your statues,rosary beads,and apparitions of Mary,priests who alone can consecrate the Communion supper which( ALL believers practice ),plenary indulgenses,scapulars giving false hope to those who wear it,the Roman Curia and Papacy,and WHAT ever else that is not biblical,and maybe we will become ROMAN Catholics.

By the way all Christians were Catholic(universal) believers,before the ROMAN infiltration that politicized the Christian faith.No doubt many great and marvelous teachers and people lived under the auspices of Roman Catholicism,but it is not the Lord Jesus' only true church."To live is Christ,to die is gain".We need Him alone,and,He is the proof that HE alone is able to sustain us and to be with us against that day. You can have your church,and call it all you like,but when you stand on your mountain and proclaim you are the only true,holy,CAtholic, and Apostolic,you are stating to all Christians that Christ is not sufficient for them,and they need your church to be truly identified in Him.That is not true,not Scriptural,and is a LIE from Satan.
MICHAEL

Hamilton, Canada

#417923 Jan 24, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
And what I said to LTM goes for you too. Any chump who buys into the fraud Benny Hinn shouldn't be allowed to teach Sunday school to 5 year olds.
(LOL) As if there aren't enough issues going on right this minute with many of your own church leaders?

For starters just read the ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH NEWS at the top right hand column of this forum.

Many of your church leaders, make Benny Hinn look like a LIGHTWEIGHT.

ReginaM

Jackson, NJ

#417924 Jan 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Sharlayne, I don't I posted that; then Posted what the bible truly says .:)
Well, well, well, look who's here...LTM the murderer.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#417925 Jan 24, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
"Joining the RCC does not make you anymore better a believer than watching Martial Arts on TV makes you a practitioner of Martial Combative Arts."
Being able to partake of the Bread of Life and the Cup of Salvation is reason enough for most converts.
REMEMBERING and partaking of the elements of the bread and the wine(juice) is sufficient for millions of believers,and does not take one iota of holiness away from what Christ suffered.It is semantics we squabble over,because Christ cannot be divided into whether He is in a piece of bread or a cup of wine,but that His sacrifice was sufficent enough for our salvation.The real debate is in the sacrifice,because we are called to believe it,for our salvation.The Elements are for the believer to partake and remember what Christ did.There is no proof whatsoever Anthony that you partaking of the REal Presence makes you a better believer than a non-Catholic Christian who partakes of his or her communion.Christ is not divided,and that is the real issue here.

ROMAN Catholics talk about being fulfilled,when a changed life is the epitome of fulfillment in Him who DOES it."Faithful is He who calls you who also will do it."Thessalonians.I know Catholics who partake of the Eucharst weekly yet they are not walking with Christ,are often very liberal,and mock other Christians,I have seen it. What did they take in their bodies?

What is more powerful is that one walks in Christ experiences His transforming power and remembers the death of the Lord and walks in holiness.

You are fulfilled in being Roman Catholic,I am fulfilled in Christ,is that what we have to say to each other?Is that really what it boils down to?
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#417927 Jan 24, 2013
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
And what I said to LTM goes for you too. Any chump who buys into the fraud Benny Hinn shouldn't be allowed to teach Sunday school to 5 year olds.
Anthony, let me get one thing straight with you ok.
First I am not a fan of Benny Hinn,He has a brother who came here to Sudbury and appeared at the Grand Theater, I left don't very impressed with him.
I have gone to prayer meetings of other preachers, when I went up for prayers, I wasn't expecting it but the preacher came at me and sort of hit me on the forehead and pushed me down some stairs.
I was not as they say slayed in the spirit.
I do not watch T.V. teachers although there is one I like very much. he is small time, and preaches straight from the Bible.
I have gone to many churches and prayer meetings over the years, 2 of them I remember very much and they were both black preachers.
One preached from a store front, he wrote the song "RUN TERRY RUN".
The other man was from, a place if you even looked like you are thinking Jesus they would kill you right away.
Not once did they put their Bibles down, Gods presents was every where Anthony, They preached Jesus, the Power of God, and the freedom in the Joy of knowing who Christ is . Not once did they ask for money or donations.
They were offered a place to sleep and a plate at the guest table that was their payment.
There were no envelopes passed around, no offering plates.
They were not adore in robes of gold , fancy suits chains of gold around there necks, or a 35 credit ring on their fingers.
They had no big fancy church to go back to, just a small following of men who travelled with them.
I didn't want to leave, I was sorry when the meetings were over.
They past through and on to another place.
Gods word is a live Anthony, what a man preshes should always match up with the Bible, if it doesn't its false teaching.
When a person who is born again, Baptism in the Holy Spirit, you know when you are getting solid teaching from a man who is anointed by God , and when they are not.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#417928 Jan 24, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, well, well, look who's here...LTM the murderer.
Well Well Well, Regina, who did I murder.
That is a pretty strong charge against me.

I will not play the name calling game with you Regina grow up.
ReginaM

Jackson, NJ

#417929 Jan 24, 2013
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>Take away your statues,rosary beads,and apparitions of Mary,priests who alone can consecrate the Communion supper which( ALL believers practice ),plenary indulgenses,scapulars giving false hope to those who wear it,the Roman Curia and Papacy,and WHAT ever else that is not biblical,and maybe we will become ROMAN Catholics.
By the way all Christians were Catholic(universal) believers,before the ROMAN infiltration that politicized the Christian faith.No doubt many great and marvelous teachers and people lived under the auspices of Roman Catholicism,but it is not the Lord Jesus' only true church."To live is Christ,to die is gain".We need Him alone,and,He is the proof that HE alone is able to sustain us and to be with us against that day. You can have your church,and call it all you like,but when you stand on your mountain and proclaim you are the only true,holy,CAtholic, and Apostolic,you are stating to all Christians that Christ is not sufficient for them,and they need your church to be truly identified in Him.That is not true,not Scriptural,and is a LIE from Satan.
When the Church adheres to these words in faith, she is not being triumphalistic but humbly recognizing in wonder and thanksgiving the victory of God over and through human weakness. Whoever deprives these words of their force for fear of triumphalism or of human usurpation of authority does not proclaim that God is greater but diminishes him, since God demonstrates the power of his love, and thus remains faithful to the law of the history of salvation, precisely in the paradox of human impotence. For with the same realism with which we declare today the sins of the popes and their disproportion to the magnitude of their commission, we must also acknowledge that Peter has repeatedly stood as the rock against ideologies, against the dissolution of the word into the plausibilities of a given time, against subjection to the powers of this world.

When we see this in the facts of history, we are not celebrating men but praising the Lord, who does not abandon the Church and who desired to manifest that he is the rock through Peter, the little stumbling stone:“flesh and blood” do not save, but the Lord saves through those who are of flesh and blood. To deny this truth is not a plus of faith, not a plus of humility, but is to shrink from the humility that recognizes God as he is. Therefore the Petrine promise and its historical embodiment in Rome remain at the deepest level an ever-renewed motive for joy: the powers of hell will not prevail against it …4

4. Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, Called to Communion: Understanding the Church Today, Ignatius Press (1996): 61-65, 72-74.

http://www.calledtocommunion.com/2012/08/the-...
ReginaM

Jackson, NJ

#417930 Jan 24, 2013
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Well Well Well, Regina, who did I murder.
That is a pretty strong charge against me.
I will not play the name calling game with you Regina grow up.
Who are you kidding? You call names on here every single day.
It's you who needs to grow up.

So how many Catholics have you murdered so far today?
Pad

Rockford, IL

#417931 Jan 24, 2013
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
He was a Minister at Trinity Presbyterian Church in Fairfax, VA
Are you saying this Church questioned the Trinity??
Scott Hahn and his wife Kimberly claim they were former EVANGELICAL Presbyterians.
The term evangelical is used to describe a narrow approach to serving Christ.But to many it simply means that to express the message of the Gospel.

Evangelicals adhere to the Bible and the experience of being born-Again. All Presbyterian institutions cover both the liberal and conservative end of their profession of faith.Presbyterians by nature are more liberal,because they base their theology on what John Calvin taught.Calvinism in teaching selection and predestination has caused many who follow to wonder whether they themselves in fact are truly saved.It is a fallacy of theology to believe anything Calvin taught on Predestination,and the security of only those chosen for salvation.

I am not surprised that Marcus Grodi and Scott Hahn converted to Catholicism.

When you hear their testimonies and when they expound,they often separate the evangelical from their own Presbyterian theology they came out of.

So they became Catholics? What is wrong with that right? But they both act as though they previously were great protestants and link all of non-Catholic Christianity with their Presbyterian roots.Presbyterians often mix all of what they learn and come up with their own bent on Christian philosophy and so on.But they are rooted in the elitism of pre-selection,and that is a deep error within their theology.

There are times I can stomach Marcus Grodi,and there are times when he turns my stomach.But than I realize he was a presbyterian for a whole life time,and that is what he came out of,not evangelical Christian faith.I do watch JOURNEY HOME as often as I can.Same old Catholic rhetoric,many prots who convert need to be part of the winning team as they see it,a team that has been around a long time,Catholicism has become so,as for the most part presbyterians,methodists,angli cans and congregationalists and reformers are not winning teams any longer.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#417932 Jan 24, 2013
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>And that is true of the Apostles in the first century,they turned the world upside down,we know that being changed by the LORD through His Son,and in the power of the Holy Spirit,makes that difference that we can turn the world upside down as well.Christians are suffering for the Lord in many countries,martyrs are being sent to the Lord daily,and the countries where Christians suffer persecution are going through upheavals.The Christians are salt and light,we are making a difference.
I like what Preston posted that you responded to,it is about conversion,and not to a church,but to HIM who died at Calvary.The church is the creation,not the CREATOR!
Thank you for your post Pad, and you are so right on.

"The church is the creation,not the CREATOR!"

We are not to sing praise to a denomination or boost their doctrine, we are to sing praise to God, and boost the works of our Lord.
I totally believe what ever denomination a person sits in there is a realm of Gods True Church, born and taught by the Holy Spirit who leads us to all truths.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#417933 Jan 24, 2013
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
Who are you kidding? You call names on here every single day.
It's you who needs to grow up.
So how many Catholics have you murdered so far today?
Regina, if you say I have, and believe it to be true please show me so I can apologize to that person.
Name calling and swearing at people is something I am totally against.
but we all have Our moments don't we.

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