Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 579,180
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Read more
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#412447 Dec 30, 2012
the New Testament makes it abundantly clear that Christ is both the foundation (Acts 4:11, 12; 1 Corinthians 3:11) and the head (Ephesians 5:23) of the church. It is a mistake to think that here He is giving either of those roles to Peter. There is a sense in which the apostles played a foundational role in the building of the church (Ephesians 2:20), but the role of primacy is reserved for Christ alone, not assigned to Peter. So, Jesus’ words here are best interpreted as a simple play on words in that a boulder-like truth came from the mouth of one who was called a small stone. And Christ Himself is called the “chief cornerstone”(1 Peter 2:6, 7). The chief cornerstone of any building was that upon which the building was anchored. If Christ declared Himself to be the cornerstone, how could Peter be the rock upon which the church was built? It is more likely that the believers, of which Peter is one, are the stones which make up the church, anchored upon the Cornerstone,“and he who believes on Him will by no means be put to shame”(1 Peter 2:6).
marge

Ames, IA

#412448 Dec 30, 2012
Think about what 'The Bible' says when we have a arguement between eachother, take it to the 'church', well you both have to agree on 'who' that is before it can happen.

They are not of us 4gvn to reason with don't ya think, different master.
marge

Ames, IA

#412449 Dec 30, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
WHY CANT YOU JUST STAY ON THE SUBJECT AT HAND..
EVIDENTLY THE SUBJECT IS BEYOND YOUR EXPERTISE.
and even in this case who can reason... So lets stay with the subject at hand, the reason for every season! Jesus!

either one has been forgiven of their sins by God, or not.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412450 Dec 30, 2012
ReginaM wrote:
If you are a Lutheran, your religion was founded by Martin Luther, an ex-monk of the Catholic Church, in the year 1517.
If you belong to the Church of England, your religion was founded by King Henry VIII in the year 1534 because the Pope would not grant him a divorce with the right to remarry.
If you are a Presbyterian, your religion was founded by John Knox in Scotland in the year 1560.
If you are a Protestant Episcopalian, your religion was an offshoot of the Church of England founded by Samuel Seabury in the American colonies in the 17th century.
If you are a Congregationalist, your religion was originated by Robert Brown in Holland in 1582.
If you are a Methodist, your religion was launched by John and Charles Wesley in England in 1744.
If you are a Unitarian, Theophilus Lindley founded your church in London in 1774.
If you are a Mormon (Latter Day Saints), Joseph Smith started your religion in Palmyra, N.Y., in 1829.
If you are a Baptist, you owe the tenets of your religion to John Smyth, who launched it in Amsterdam in 1605.
If you are of the Dutch Reformed church, you recognize Michaelis Jones as founder, because he originated your religion in New York in 1628.
If you are a member of the Churches of Christ your church began near the beginning of the 19th century in New England. Abner Jones, Barton Stone and Alexander Campbell were some of the most well known originators of your religion.
If you worship with the Salvation Army, your sect began with William Booth in London in 1865.
If you are a Christian Scientist, you look to 1879 as the year in which your religion was born and to Mrs. Mary Baker Eddy as its founder.
If you belong to one of the religious organizations known as "Church of the Nazarene," "Pentecostal Gospel," "Holiness Church," "Pilgrim Holiness Church," "Jehovah's Witnesses," your religion is one of the hundreds of new sects founded by men within the past century.
If you are a Seventh Day Adventist, Mrs. Ellen Gould White inaugurated your group in 1860.
If you are a believer at the Vineyard Chrstian Fellowship, your denomination was started by Ken Guillickson and Keith Green in Santa Monica, California in 1974.
If you are a member of Calvary Chapel, Chuck Smith began your congregation in Costa Mesa, California in 1975.
If you are Catholic, you know that your church was founded in the year 33 by Jesus Christ the Son of God, and it is still the same Church.
http://www.fatherpeffley.org/docs/HowOld.pdf
Religions have a completely different belief system that does not originate from God to begin with,but man's search for God.Christianity is God's Hand reaching out to human kind,along with Judaism.The world sees Christianity as religion,and labels it as such,but God reaching down to Man is the faith In Christ and trusting in His Salvation,and Believing on His Name. Each prot denomination is not a seaparate religion,but all part of Chriatianity,along with Catholicism.I am a Christian because I follow Christ,you the same,your church affiliation and mine can easily stear us away from Christ,and we could very well become religious,rather than born of His Spirit. If you want religion that is your choice,I'll choose Christ as my Savior,thank you!
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412451 Dec 30, 2012
StarC wrote:
Q.
Did Our Lord write any part of the New Testament or command His Apostles to do so?
A.
Our Lord Himself never wrote a line, nor is there any record that He ordered his Apostles to write; He did command them to teach and to preach. Also He to Whom all power was given in Heaven and on earth (Matt. 28-18) promised to give them the Holy Spirit (John 14-26) and to be with them Himself till the end of the world (Mat. 28-20).
He did comand them to built His Church. Mt 16:18
However we must be thankful that the Bible was compiled and distributed even though with much resistance.The Bible is not a book of affiliation,but God's inspiredW o r d,and it is spiritually discerned.No group has claim to it,but we all can benefit with humility from its great history and its Divine Roots.When I read the Word,I do not consider the Book to be Protestant or Catholic or Orthodox,but a WORD from the Living God,Inspired into Jewish Men,including one Gentile(Luke).
There is nothing denominational or that of an organization religious system.We are all subject to its Content not vice versa!
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412452 Dec 30, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
The "Roman" Catholic Church was written to by St. Paul. Your KJV would call it "Romans".
Thanks.
Than why is the RCC so different from the Believers who were in Rome at the time of Paul?
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412453 Dec 30, 2012
Dust Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
Some good tidbits. Most people have no clue what the inquistions entailed or were really about. The tales grow taller all the time. The Muslims had conquered Spain and occupied it. Only one tiny section remained and it took hundreds of years to regain control. To avoid losing land and power Muslims pretended to convert. It would be like if suddenly a mass group of Muslims came into any Christian church and suddenly converted. Do you suppose the Muslims would look on a bunch of white Christians with a little suspicion today if they converted to Islam?:-) Sure I have heard some protestants boasting on these forums that they go to Catholic Churches and work on converting people from the inside. Yes there were some very strange beliefs as well, but the involvement of the church at all was more or less to stop the mob mentality which was going on. If anything the Churches involvement added civility and protections that otherwise would not have been there. Here is brief snipit from an article the link below.
"Spain had just concluded a bloody battle with the Moslems. The Moslems were known for their ruthless killing of every man woman and child of the Catholic towns that they had captured. Complicating this issue was the fact that the Jews had fought on the side of the Moslems. At night the Jews would open up the city gates of the Catholic towns to the invading Moslem Moors.
In the centuries before, the Jews had been granted permission by the Catholics in Spain to come there as refugees. Unlike the Catholics who considered usury as sinful, the Jews became very powerful in the business of money lending.
“In Aragon they charged twenty percent, in Castile thirty-three percent, and in the famine of 1326, in Cuehca they refused to lend money for sowing except at forty percent interest. Added to this was their practice of insulting the Christian religion. Even today the epithet,“Christian dog”(perro cristiano), comes from those times.”
Because of the devastating years of battle with the Moslems, and those Jews who assisted them, Spain had rescinded the Jew’s permission to stay there and ordered them to leave Spain in order to preserve the fragile government.
Some Jews had faked conversion. Because the government did not want to make itself vulnerable to possible traitorous acts committed by those who were still aligned with Moslem forces it needed to make determinations as to whether or not those who claimed to be converted to Christianity were being honest. It was the Inquisitors job to make this determination. The Inquisition had no jurisdiction, and therefore no authority over any practicing Jew or Moslem because they were not baptized. The Inquisition only investigated professed Christians suspected of being fakes. The Inquisitors did use some torture in their examinations, but any statement that was made during this torture was not accepted as evidence if the individual later retracted any such confession. It was the state and not the Church that carried out the sentence or punishment against those who were found guilty.
http://www.defendingthebride.com/hs/spanish.h...
Your last sentence shows how ignorant Catholics think we all are.The RCC ruled over Europe with an IRON Fist,it stands to reason that any public individuals were being controled by the RC clergy who delegated the proceedings of any given Inquisitional court in those times.No public peoples living in those times completely acted on their own outside of the Church to exercise Inquisitional court on thsoe deemed heretics.
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412454 Dec 31, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
you guys are so clueless, you don't even realize you're the people Paul was talking about.
The Catholic and Orthodox teachings don't change. Yours changes from generation to generation.
Sola scripture.
You are preaching a false gospel and no one can say anything because you created a fantasy of Sola Scripture. This false teaching opened the door to thousands of more false teachings.
Why don't you list them one by one? It must be put in writing,so we can see it for ourselves as People of the Book,it is important that we know our changes we made from generation to generation.In other words Clay,be specific!
Clay

Chicago, IL

#412455 Dec 31, 2012
chuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Instruction in RIGHTEOUSNESS Clay.....INSTRUCTION in RIGHTEOUSNESS...what else do Christians need?
I think you know its not the only thing. I'm not sure why you guys continue on with this false teaching, when its clear from scripture itself its not the only thing.

How do you explain that Pauls letter was written at a time when the New Testament wasn't even written? hmmm.
If scripture is the only thing, why did Christ wait for 400 yrs for His followers to have a clear set? hmmm
Clay

Chicago, IL

#412456 Dec 31, 2012
chuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Righteous means free from guilt or sin which is given by God. The Bible says it can train us in RIGHTEOUSNESS and your argument is where does it say it's the only thing ....really Clay??
You are caught up in keeping your man made rules.....
The Apostle Paul says there is something more. TRADITIONS by word of mouth.
You say 'sorry Paul, there is no traditions by word of mouth. We have the Bible that's enough'

And now look what you all have done! Do we need anyone data to show how sola scripture is false?
Clay

Chicago, IL

#412457 Dec 31, 2012
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>Why don't you list them one by one? It must be put in writing,so we can see it for ourselves as People of the Book,it is important that we know our changes we made from generation to generation.In other words Clay,be specific!
Get real Pad. We cover these changes everyday.

Start with the Holy Eucharist...

The first Protestants denied Christ in the Eucharist.. this was clearly taught by the Apostles and their disciples
Then they added the word 'alone' to Rom 3:28 to invent 'faith alone'.
They removed 7 books from the old testament.. thus siding with the Jews of 100 AD and not Christians of 33 AD.
Then they added Sola scripture, which was unheard of before then. In fact, no evidence shows it was ever taught by Christ nor His Apostles.

But these first Protesters understood the sacred teachings of things like, Mary's ever virginity, water Baptism.
And things used for worship... like statues, paintings and other artwork.

A couple generations after the first Protesters, things really took off. Born agains removed water baptism; said Mary had a bunch of children; said Mary is sleeping in the ground; and everything keeps evolving Pad. It won't stop because you guys don't recognize an authority to stop you!

Your grandkids will practice an entirely different Christianity than you!
When one looks at the chronology of Protestantism, you can easily recognize a military type attack by Satan and his minions. He started with a carefully laid out plan that is still in the works. We can see the hatred forming in so-called Christians on here. We can see the slander and lies they rely on just to teach their faith. It all reeks
of the devil.
Michelle

Batesville, IN

#412458 Dec 31, 2012
Scary stuff here..........Can we all agree on the 10 Commandments? Instead of studying the Bible and getting so many different interpretations, maybe if we focused on these.......and studied them...maybe ......give a person some hope and peace of mind???
Probably not.........that would be too simple.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#412459 Dec 31, 2012
Michelle wrote:
Scary stuff here..........Can we all agree on the 10 Commandments? Instead of studying the Bible and getting so many different interpretations, maybe if we focused on these.......and studied them...maybe ......give a person some hope and peace of mind???
Probably not.........that would be too simple.
I am confused. When I quote from the OT, I am told that those laws of god's are no longer enforced, but the 10C's are in the OT!

Also, not many christians follow the 10C's! They don't even try. Oh sure, they may not go out and kill anyone, but they have no problem eating a few grapes in the grocery store. They have no problem fudging their taxes.

When is the sabbath and how should it be kept? Not too many christians follow that one!

Number 2: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

Do you have any pictures or statues in your house or church?

Once you christians start taking the 10C seriously, maybe the rest of us would... No, not really.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#412460 Dec 31, 2012
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>i did it through catholic history,in order to have true devine apostolic succession a person must be chosen by holy people agree? well that's not how it was done in a few cases here's one. "POPE
Benedict IX, born Theophylactus of Tusculum, is known mainly for two things: 1) he held office on three separate occasions, and 2) he is the only pope who ever sold the papacy (to his own godfather, of all people).
Benedict became pontiff at a very young age, thanks to the political prowess of his father, who had managed to get the papacy reserved ahead of time for his son. With little actual training or preparation that qualified him to act as pontiff, Benedict led a highly immoral life, and was accused of various rapes, adulteries, and murders. According to St. Peter Damian, Benedict was “a demon from hell in the disguise of a priest,” and his carousing eventually caused him to be forcefully expelled from Rome.
Benedict managed to regain his throne, but then – surprise, surprise!– he was sidetracked by a prospective marriage (to his cousin) and sold the papal chair for a significant amount of money to his godfather, a priest who named himself Pope Gregory VI. His later repentance and attempt to resume his position created quite a controversy, forcing the German King Henry III to intervene. Benedict was subsequently excommunicated from the church.
“His life as a pope,” wrote Pope Victor III,“was so vile, so foul, so execrable, that I shudder to think of it.”
JETHRO:take note " his father, who had managed to get the papacy reserved ahead of time for his son." jethro: this suggests the chair was obviously bought for him,so how can you have true succession? it's a joke.
Why do you ignore our ACTUAL beliefs?

You're not allowed to define Apostolic succession for us. Its our belief. We get to define it.

The teachings went thru 265 Popes so far.
But the Popes themselves were ALL SINNERS. Every single one of them.
Our Lord protected the doctrine and dogma from error and the teachings Magistrium of the Church will always be without error in teachings because of this.
Clay

Chicago, IL

#412461 Dec 31, 2012
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>Why don't you list them one by one? It must be put in writing,so we can see it for ourselves as People of the Book,it is important that we know our changes we made from generation to generation.In other words Clay,be specific!
Did you just identify yourselves as "People of The Book"?

That's a heck of a title Pad.

I would advise you all to get together and come up with a unified understanding of The Book. This would be the responsible thing to do, right?

You guys don't venture deep enough into scripture to call yourselves that. You barely scratch the surface and pretty much ignore the Old Testament... because of that, you don't understand things like the Eucharist and the Passover; the sacrificial Lamb pertaining to the Lamb of God.
The Jews understood the importance of partaking in the sacrificial Lamb. They consumed it.
Christ is the Lamb of God.
Now do you see the importance of The Mass and partaking in the Eucharist? You see why The Old Testament and New, flow together?
Free Mind

Pinellas Park, FL

#412462 Dec 31, 2012
jethro8 wrote:
<quoted text>i did it through catholic history,in order to have true devine apostolic succession a person must be chosen by holy people agree? well that's not how it was done in a few cases here's one. "POPE
Benedict IX, born Theophylactus of Tusculum, is known mainly for two things: 1) he held office on three separate occasions, and 2) he is the only pope who ever sold the papacy (to his own godfather, of all people).
Benedict became pontiff at a very young age, thanks to the political prowess of his father, who had managed to get the papacy reserved ahead of time for his son. With little actual training or preparation that qualified him to act as pontiff, Benedict led a highly immoral life, and was accused of various rapes, adulteries, and murders. According to St. Peter Damian, Benedict was “a demon from hell in the disguise of a priest,” and his carousing eventually caused him to be forcefully expelled from Rome.
Benedict managed to regain his throne, but then – surprise, surprise!– he was sidetracked by a prospective marriage (to his cousin) and sold the papal chair for a significant amount of money to his godfather, a priest who named himself Pope Gregory VI. His later repentance and attempt to resume his position created quite a controversy, forcing the German King Henry III to intervene. Benedict was subsequently excommunicated from the church.
“His life as a pope,” wrote Pope Victor III,“was so vile, so foul, so execrable, that I shudder to think of it.”
JETHRO:take note " his father, who had managed to get the papacy reserved ahead of time for his son." jethro: this suggests the chair was obviously bought for him,so how can you have true succession? it's a joke.
Exactly.

They claim that Jesus demands no accountability. None. Zero.

Silly -- the supposed teacher of "perfect morals" accepts zero accountability for itself.

The ONLY reason the Pope apologized to the world for the largest child sex abuse cover-up in history was NOT because it was right.

Nope, the Vatican was caught red-handed in its lies -- thanks to among other things -- a police raid on a Bishops Conference in Belgium.

How does anyone make sense of Jesus requiring a police raid before guiding his supposed church to tel the truth?

It makes no sense and Jesus comes out looking like a buffoon.

BUSTED....
Free Mind

Pinellas Park, FL

#412464 Dec 31, 2012
Jesus quiz.....

How would Jesus guide His one-true church during the decades long child sex-abuse scandal?

1... Would Jesus have His Church confront the issue head-on once the first evidence emerged and His earthly vicar (the Pope) first became aware -- thus saving the souls of countless children?

or.....

2.... Would Jesus guide His church to cover-up the child abuse for decades longer, guide His church to use diplomatic immunity in order to avoid giving evidence and answering questions, and only have His church admit the truth after a police raid in Belgium seized many boxes of secret documents?

OK kids -- how much do you know about Jesus?

Reality 101 -- sorry Catholics-in-denial -- Jesus is not OK with child rape.

Sorry Catholics, but Jesus would not honor any Apostle who facilitated HUNDREDS of such crimes.

(Catholics respond; "Cardinal Law good -- the nuns are the problem, the nuns are the problem.")

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Free Mind

Pinellas Park, FL

#412465 Dec 31, 2012
1... The RCC wants us to judge them by their words.

2... Jesus wants us to judge them by their deeds.

Question: Whose advice is correct?

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#412466 Dec 31, 2012
Free Mind wrote:
1... The RCC wants us to judge them by their words.
2... Jesus wants us to judge them by their deeds.
Question: Whose advice is correct?
Here's how that works!

Rule 1: Trust what god says.

Rule 2: Unless you like what jesus said better.

Rule 3: If you like what paul said better than the other two, then follow paul.

Rule 4: You can switch between the three anytime you like, even in mid sentence.

Of course, everyone wants to be judged by words! They are easy to produce!
Pad

Rockford, IL

#412467 Dec 31, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Did you just identify yourselves as "People of The Book"?
That's a heck of a title Pad.
I would advise you all to get together and come up with a unified understanding of The Book. This would be the responsible thing to do, right?
You guys don't venture deep enough into scripture to call yourselves that. You barely scratch the surface and pretty much ignore the Old Testament... because of that, you don't understand things like the Eucharist and the Passover; the sacrificial Lamb pertaining to the Lamb of God.
The Jews understood the importance of partaking in the sacrificial Lamb. They consumed it.
Christ is the Lamb of God.
Now do you see the importance of The Mass and partaking in the Eucharist? You see why The Old Testament and New, flow together?
FIRST of all thank you for responding,and giving a list,all things that have been haggled over and over,and you were specific,I commend you for that.

I read your other post.Again Clay thank you.I hope you have a good New Year,it is really something we made it to 2013.I noticed hojo has not been here for awhile,it seems he probably needs to take a rest from it all,as I am sure he was quite exhausted from continuing his never ending proclamation of the ONE TRUE APOSTOLIC CHURCH ,that Jesus Christ started,the Holy Roman Catholic Church.

All Evangelicals with the exception of those who are Roman Catholic and some in the Orthodox adhere to this list:

1. The Bible is the inerrant Word of God,the Confirmation of Faith,Hope and Love.
2. The Bible is the Book that written today stops grave heresies in their track.
3. To worship God is to worship Him in Spirit and in Truth,that is we are to be born of His Spirit,and the Truth is Jesus Christ(The Way,The Truth,and the Life).
4. We trust in the Cross of our Lord Jesus who defeated sin and death through His terrible crucifixion,death and Resurrection.We can apply what Jesus DID to our own struggle with the rudiments and power of Sin in the individual and corporate membership of His Body.
5. In discovering the Word as being Spiritually discerned Evangelicals know that walking with Christ unravels the power of Satan in our lives,and awakens us to the Risen and Victorious Savior who is our EXAMPLE.The Apocrypha by the way does not add to the Christ,as the New Testament is sufficient in expounding on Christ. Sirach and Wisdom are noble writings,and we can enrich our own souls with such.Sirach has lengthy segments on useless statues of deities and the like.The Old Testament is of course the greatest source in comparing the Hebrews to our believers today,and their journey t o the Kingdom of the Father.

6.We have Communion,and it is not just some quick fast food mindset,but a time of deep comtemplation into the DEATH
of our Lord Jesus Christ.
7.Baptism has not changed one iota from the first century Church, we baptize new converts to Christ,following the Biblical pattern,Infant baptism is not biblical,baptizing men and women who repent of their sin and enter the community of Christ are baptized,Biblical to the CORE.
8. Our clergy is mentioned in the New Testament,ministers,pastors,de acons or elders,our services are the simple form you see in Corinthians as organized by the Apostle Paul himself.We have teachers,and those who trust the Lord for healing and miracles,as the Scripture by the way states in the list of clergy and the practices of.All in the Epistles.Some Evangelicals have apostles, and some have bishops.I agree with you that it does not follow the Biblical pattern not to have bishops,of course many evangelcals use the word Superintendant rather than Bishop.No doubt a move to not identify with the Catholic office of Bishop.
9. Although we have beautiful artwork,and there are pictures of Christ in many churches,we generally and unanomously abhor the use of statues.
10. We abhor the formation of a celibate clergy,because the Lord never instituted such.

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