Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 558,741
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#410714 Dec 21, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
He held the bread and said it's His body and the cup His blood. Was He referring to something other than the bread and cup?
No, He was referring to the 'bread' and the 'cup'. His physical body and blood were there before them. The bread and wine were obviously symbols.
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#410715 Dec 21, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
He held the bread and said it's His body and the cup His blood. Was He referring to something other than the bread and cup?
When Jesus walked this earth as a man, he had a physical body just as all other men. That body was not ever present. It was a physical body. Jesus' body could not be here and miles away and many places. That concept is clearly unbiblical.
Michael

Hamilton, Canada

#410716 Dec 21, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
The expectations of the Jews (concerning the coming messiah) were right but their timing was wrong...(that was their problem..)
BECAUSE THEY LOOKED FOR A CONQUERING MESSIAH.
They did not comprehend (THE WORKS OF THE SUFFERING SAVIOR/MESSIAH.).
THEY WERE OBLIVIOUS TO THE FACT ...
THAT
MESSIAH MUST COME FIRST To destroy the works of the devil
that had hijacked/seized dominion of the earth in Eden.
AND restore humanity BACK unto the good graces of God the Father.
Messiah will more than meet their expectations when he sets up His
kingdom and rules and reigns IN THE millennium upon the earth in a
thousand years of peace.
Confrinting says.....MESSIAH MUST COME FIRST To destroy the works of the devil.

You believe when Jesus walked the earth, those he preached to did not believe him. The devil as you claim, is still here 2,000 years later, and today the vast majority of the world do not accept Jesus as the third person of God.

...Was there a man who Jesus was a great moral teacher? Quite possibly. However, he was far from perfect in his moral outlook.

....... The idea and belief, that eternal punishment would follow from rejecting Jesus seems downright evil. The idea that someone could live a noble life and not be saved, when another could live a depraved and cruel, and immoral life and through a true conversion of his heart at the end of life still be saved, is hard to tally up on the moral balance sheet.

..... There are that many Christian groups reject this doctrine today, but for centuries it was normative church doctrine.

The Jesus who said (in Matthew 10:34-37), "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came NOT to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother" is not a Jesus whom I can accept as a moral model.

.... The statement is consistent, however, with the Jesus of Luke 14:26, who says, "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple."

.......Also, the Jesus who withers a fig tree because it did not provide him with fruit when he was hungry seems childish rather than exemplary (Matthew 21:17-19).

.......There are many remarkable and wonderful teachings of Jesus in the New Testament. However, they are the teachings of a human being, not a God, and many of them--including the most morally enlightened--are paralleled in rabbinic literature. The teachings of Jesus to his followers were the teachings of a human man, as they did not see him as God.

Christians accept the OT and NT as the formations of the bible, yet christians do not believe everything written or expressed in the OT. The Jews wrote the OT and the Jews never accepted anything more than 1 God and no trinity.

Can't have it both ways. You are either all in or all out.



.....
Pad

Rockford, IL

#410717 Dec 21, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
Pad says...Yes we all face heartache and trouble in this life,even the more reason to realize our frail beings,and the need to connect with our Creator who wondrously put us together.He promised.
Michael says. That is just your theory and you say this without any knowledge or evidence of what you speak. Because atrocities happen today to eveyone you have no other argument but to agree.
The idea that one can be saved only through Jesus is contrary to simple compassion and justice.
.....Judaism teaches that "the righteous of all nations have an equal share in the world to come." Maimonides writes in a letter that there are non-Jews who "bring their souls to perfection." That is the simple truth that all faiths should acknowledge and celebrate. Otherwise, there can be no kinship, and we see that today.
.... Abraham Joshua Heschel once wrote about attempts to convert the Jews: "How can we take seriously a friendship that is conditioned ultimately on the hope and expectation that the Jew will disappear?
.....How would a Christian feel if Jews were engaged in an effort to bring about the liquidation of Christianity?"
....We are all in this together, not one group righteous and another not.
So basically Michael you reject the Person of J e s u s Himself!And for the fact that so many do not understand Who and What He is in relation to human kind.The Jews do not accept Him,so does that mean Michael we should just dump that whole message of Christ into a pit and rather for unity sake endear ourselves to the Jewish cause for self preservation?

Well Messianic Jews who believe in Yeshua and love Him with a wonderful devotion and love consider themselves fulfilled J E W S.Their traditional relatives and friends who are Jews reject them,so what does that make those Jews who are Messianic and converted to Christ? ARE they not Jews anymore?
Who determines that? Some Rabbi who hates the name of Jesus?Well guess what no human being determines the outcome of what is done eternally to a soul for Christ.Christ is the Eternal Son of God Michael,and no matter what happens to the traditions of MEN over a decision to follow Christ is irrelavant.We who follow Him owe our allegiance to Him,our traditions and religious trappings mean little.

Christ calls men to Himself not to a particular religious organization.AND yes we organized many Christian groups and affiliations,but in the end,if a person is not connected with Jesus Christ Himself,their affiliation of being:Catholic,Protestant or Orthodox means ZILCH.Now if 1,000,000 plus Messianic Jews have embraced Yeshua as their Messiah today,or within this century,do not align themselves with Christian organizations,and YET still live and DIE for Him who was crucified,died and Rose from the grave,than affiliations hold no weight in light of H I M who give life to whoever will believe.

There are even Muslims who are being converted to Jesus,and have to form groups to encourage each other,not calling themselves Catholics,Protestants or Orthodox,but followers of JESUS.Your using Jews who naturelly reject the Messiah to convince me I am narrow-minded to Christ and Christianity is really a waste of time,I understand more than you realize in this matter.Com e up with why you reject H I M yourself?

Since: Dec 06

Location hidden

#410718 Dec 21, 2012
marge wrote:
<quoted text>
11My brothers, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. 12What I mean is this: One of you says,“I follow Paul”; another,“I follow Apollos”; another,“I follow Cephasa”; still another,“I follow Christ.”
13Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?
marge

Jesus was born in Bethlehem(House of Bread) Matt 2:1

Jesus is the bread of life John 6:35

Jesus broke the bread, and gave it to his disciples. Matt 26:26
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410719 Dec 21, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
I have no confidence in hearsay ...mixed with traditions,rituals, fables and conjecture, that is being forced upon the Christians of the world by the unloving murderous perverted,domination of an ungodly religious society.
Hearsay deluded and edited by multiple popes of the centuries who by you own admission are sinful men.
We have been given the inspired word of God the Bible and that is all I need...
The word I trust is..
Heb_4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
Your conjecture is no match to it...Not even the same species..
because it promises/guarantees no eternal life hereafter with Christ
if you adhere to it.
I WILL JUST TAKE GOD'S WORD FOR IT. THANK YOU.
Ok, well, I think you're dodging my questions. You have no confidence in what the disciples of the apostles said.

What evidence do you have that they are edited?

Since you too are a sinful man, why do you believe you can better interpret scripture than others?
Clay

United States

#410720 Dec 21, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>No, He was referring to the 'bread' and the 'cup'. His physical body and blood were there before them. The bread and wine were obviously symbols.
then why didn't he make it clear they were symbols? Why did he let John teach Ignatius the wrong thing? Didn't Christ promise to be with John and the other Apostles? How did their Disciples write something totally opposite?
You have to understand something very important. I have partook in the bread and wine, as have every Catholic on here. So you can't pull that bible verse manipulation with us, concerning the Eucharist. Isn't that exactly why Christ established it? To protect us from folks like you who He foresaw??
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410721 Dec 21, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>And many ;of these mentions are about his failures and short comings. He is the ONLY apostle referred to as Satan by Jesus.
Are these some of the passages you are referring to that point to Peter's higher position?
Obviously that is not the case, and your point is moot.
The point is certainly not moot.

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/primacy_of_p...
Clay

United States

#410722 Dec 21, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>When Jesus walked this earth as a man, he had a physical body just as all other men. That body was not ever present. It was a physical body. Jesus' body could not be here and miles away and many places. That concept is clearly unbiblical.
You're saying Jesus Christ - who is God - couldn't be in multiple places at once??
wow. I'm speechless.
Michael

Hamilton, Canada

#410723 Dec 21, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
Many of the Church fathers were taught directly by the apostles. What would their agenda be? And why do you think 2000 years later you have a better idea of what aligns with God's Word than they did?


...According to your scriptures this man of God Jesus preached Judiasm to his brethern of his day, performed dozens of miracles for thousands, witnessed by thousands more (christians only say) and they STILL! didn't believe in him, and 2,000 years later, the VAST MAJORITY of our world is still out on his authenticity.

A small select group of disgruntled jews with an agenda created the story of christianity, using customs/traditions of man/gods that came 1,000 years before, using the exact same elements (heaven/hell, prophecies, baptism, holy sacrificial meal, eternal salvation, all practiced previously, used a deadman as their leader so they could say and write whatever they wanted without any recourse. Joined up with powerman constantine who they knew would strong arm all the other christian groups into submission, found that family indoctrination was the way to go, and the rest is history.

BUSTED!



Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410724 Dec 21, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>No, He was referring to the 'bread' and the 'cup'. His physical body and blood were there before them. The bread and wine were obviously symbols.
Jesus did not say "this is a symbol of My body and blood". If He did, that would be obvious.

He is God. Do you think it's impossible for Him to be there AND in the appearance of bread and wine?
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410725 Dec 21, 2012
marge wrote:
<quoted text>
11My brothers, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you. 12What I mean is this: One of you says,“I follow Paul”; another,“I follow Apollos”; another,“I follow Cephasa”; still another,“I follow Christ.”
13Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized into the name of Paul?
?

And why do you think 2000 years later you have a better idea of what aligns with God's Word than they did?
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410726 Dec 21, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>When Jesus walked this earth as a man, he had a physical body just as all other men. That body was not ever present. It was a physical body. Jesus' body could not be here and miles away and many places. That concept is clearly unbiblical.
So miracles are not biblical?
marge

Ames, IA

#410727 Dec 21, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
Jesus did not say "this is a symbol of My body and blood". If He did, that would be obvious.
He is God. Do you think it's impossible for Him to be there AND in the appearance of bread and wine?
But the time is coming--indeed it's here now--when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way.
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410728 Dec 21, 2012
Michael wrote:
<quoted text>
...According to your scriptures this man of God Jesus preached Judiasm to his brethern of his day, performed dozens of miracles for thousands, witnessed by thousands more (christians only say) and they STILL! didn't believe in him, and 2,000 years later, the VAST MAJORITY of our world is still out on his authenticity.
A small select group of disgruntled jews with an agenda created the story of christianity, using customs/traditions of man/gods that came 1,000 years before, using the exact same elements (heaven/hell, prophecies, baptism, holy sacrificial meal, eternal salvation, all practiced previously, used a deadman as their leader so they could say and write whatever they wanted without any recourse. Joined up with powerman constantine who they knew would strong arm all the other christian groups into submission, found that family indoctrination was the way to go, and the rest is history.
BUSTED!
You're quite the historian Mike. lol.

Give me your theory as to what civilization would be like today had there been no Christianity.
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#410729 Dec 21, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
You're saying Jesus Christ - who is God - couldn't be in multiple places at once??
wow. I'm speechless.
If only that were true.LOL
Michael

Hamilton, Canada

#410730 Dec 21, 2012
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>So basically Michael you reject the Person of J e s u s Himself!And for the fact up with why you reject H I M yourself?
Pad says.....that whole message of Christ into a pit and rather for unity sake endear ourselves to the Jewish cause for self preservation?
Well Messianic Jews who believe in Yeshua and love Him with a wonderful devotion and love consider themselves fulfilled J E W S.Their traditional relatives and friends who are Jews reject them,so what does that make those Jews who are Messianic and converted to Christ? ARE they not Jews anymore?

Michael says.....I give my opinion, just as you give yours. You have no personal evidence that clarifies the bible to be true in all respects. You believe what you were taught. I am sure Jews believe in all their hearts as they were taught and instructed that Jesus was just a mortal man, nothing more.
Jews see it crystal clear that Jesus was just a mere mortal man. Christians see crystal clear, Jesus as the son of God.
Messianic Jews have given up the right to be a Jew, and NO different than a christian giving up his christian belief, who would claim he loves Allah.
A man named Jesus that you know little or nothing about personally. You don't know when he was born, don't know what he did to support himself, don't know what he looked like, don't know his date of death, and catholic father Irenaeous had no knowledge of the age of Jesus but believed between age 30 and 50 and to this day this current pope can't even claim who killed him but believed he died a violent death. That is DEVASTATING at the least!
St Paul never mentions the miraculous virgin birth, no mention of angels, no mention of miracles by Jesus, no mention of John Baptist, no mention of the crucifixion. Its obvious Paul didn't know a Jesus, and even said so that he saw him as a vision only.
Why would Paul one of the very first writers not know these important elements of Jesus? Could it be that none of these stories had not been invented, until the gospels were written?
Christianity is called a belief for a reason, just as all religions are expressed as beliefs. If any religion was declared FACTUAL it wouldn't be called a belief anymore, and all other religions wouldn't exist anymore. The beliefs carry on.....
If there is a loving God, who watches over the world, he is watching over for everyone, not just a select group who just happened to be born by CHANCE into that select belief.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#410731 Dec 21, 2012
Pad wrote:
<quoted text>So basically Michael you reject the Person of J e s u s Himself!And for the fact that so many do not understand Who and What He is in relation to human kind.The Jews do not accept Him,so does that mean Michael we should just dump that whole message of Christ into a pit and rather for unity sake endear ourselves to the Jewish cause for self preservation?
Well Messianic Jews who believe in Yeshua and love Him with a wonderful devotion and love consider themselves fulfilled J E W S.Their traditional relatives and friends who are Jews reject them,so what does that make those Jews who are Messianic and converted to Christ? ARE they not Jews anymore?
Who determines that? Some Rabbi who hates the name of Jesus?Well guess what no human being determines the outcome of what is done eternally to a soul for Christ.Christ is the Eternal Son of God Michael,and no matter what happens to the traditions of MEN over a decision to follow Christ is irrelavant.We who follow Him owe our allegiance to Him,our traditions and religious trappings mean little.
Christ calls men to Himself not to a particular religious organization.AND yes we organized many Christian groups and affiliations,but in the end,if a person is not connected with Jesus Christ Himself,their affiliation of being:Catholic,Protestant or Orthodox means ZILCH.Now if 1,000,000 plus Messianic Jews have embraced Yeshua as their Messiah today,or within this century,do not align themselves with Christian organizations,and YET still live and DIE for Him who was crucified,died and Rose from the grave,than affiliations hold no weight in light of H I M who give life to whoever will believe.
There are even Muslims who are being converted to Jesus,and have to form groups to encourage each other,not calling themselves Catholics,Protestants or Orthodox,but followers of JESUS.Your using Jews who naturelly reject the Messiah to convince me I am narrow-minded to Christ and Christianity is really a waste of time,I understand more than you realize in this matter.Com e up with why you reject H I M yourself?
Hi Pad just in case I don't get a chance Merry Christmas, to you an you family, and many blessings for the New Year.
Wow the weather said it was going to snow and did it ever,
We have 25 cm since yesterday about 1pm and it is still snowing.
It is like that every where.
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

#410732 Dec 21, 2012
marge wrote:
<quoted text>
But the time is coming--indeed it's here now--when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way.
The truth is you don't think Jesus was speaking the truth when He said the bread and wine are His body and blood. So you may worship a spirit, but it's not the truth.
LTM

Sudbury, Canada

#410733 Dec 21, 2012
Oswald Chambers
Experience or God’s Revealed Truth?
Dec212012December 21, 2012
We have received ... the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God —1 Corinthians 2:12

My experience is not what makes redemption real— redemption is reality. Redemption has no real meaning for me until it is worked out through my conscious life. When I am born again, the Spirit of God takes me beyond myself and my experiences, and identifies me with Jesus Christ. If I am left only with my personal experiences, I am left with something not produced by redemption. But experiences produced by redemption prove themselves by leading me beyond myself, to the point of no longer paying any attention to experiences as the basis of reality. Instead, I see that only the reality itself produced the experiences. My experiences are not worth anything unless they keep me at the Source of truth— Jesus Christ.

If you try to hold back the Holy Spirit within you, with the desire of producing more inner spiritual experiences, you will find that He will break the hold and take you again to the historic Christ. Never support an experience which does not have God as its Source and faith in God as its result. If you do, your experience is anti-Christian, no matter what visions or insights you may have had. Is Jesus Christ Lord of your experiences, or do you place your experiences above Him? Is any experience dearer to you than your Lord? You must allow Him to be Lord over you, and pay no attention to any experience over which He is not Lord. Then there will come a time when God will make you impatient with your own experience, and you can truthfully say,“I do not care what I experience— I am sure of Him!”

Be relentless and hard on yourself if you are in the habit of talking about the experiences you have had. Faith based on experience is not faith; faith based on God’s revealed truth is the only faith there is.

Bible in One Year: Micah 4-5; Revelation 12

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