Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.
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Since: Dec 11

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#408784
Dec 12, 2012
 

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Free Mind wrote:
<quoted text>
What do you consider evidence against the theory of evolution?
Genesis?
George W Bush

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#408785
Dec 12, 2012
 

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atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>this picture was taken at my sons farewell party at Golden corral.
and i noticed the crooked fingers after we put the picture up. they verify what I have said before that i have trouble typing because of those fingers.
A handsome couple. I enjoyed the picture. I would post a pic of Sera and myself but she is wanted by law enforcement authorities in 5 states.

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#408786
Dec 12, 2012
 

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atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>how about you chilling out. Hermi has just went thru a life threatening experience and we all are glad to have him back with us.
so for awhile keep your smart alec remarks to your self.
you wanna pick on someone try me.
Thanks.I want to be abkle to make it to my daughter's house as a surprise for hristmas. Ever see Heidi? LOL Remember when Heidi had the cripple girl walk as a Christmas present? LOL That's me.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#408787
Dec 12, 2012
 
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>Hey kid, grfeat to be dialoguing with youn again.I will admit that the Old Testament confounded me with its "vengeful petty God".It seemes, as Marcion said, that there were 2 different Gods- One of the Old Testament and one of the New Testament.This question caused me to question and look and ask more questions and look further.
I believe that one must have both Wisdom and the Holy Spirit to read the Bible. I am not a Fundamentalist.I try to read the Bible prayerfully also factoring context, history, culture, language, genre of literature being used etc.When quotes are ripped out of this amd presented torn from the wholistic view of these factors and the ible itself,we get all sorts of muitations.
As an Orthodox I also have tradition-including tremendous minds and souls who write intricately of sych issues.
With this said I still look to be more enlightened on this Old estament issue.
I understand what you are saying - there are many factors of Self that are 'required participants' in 'believing' the way one does.

And yet you still avoided saying that 'those passages' we are talking about - "the evil ones" - are not "of God".

Unless you really do believe them to be "of God".
- like a "bitch-slap" to humans maybe?:o)

Thanks for responding.

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Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#408788
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
No Apocryphal book was written by a true prophet or apostle of God. And no apocryphal book was confirmed by divine miracles--- something that happened often with the prophets in the Old Testament and apostles in the New Testament.
WOW 4GVN! You really seem to "know the mind of God".

How did this come about?

Did "God" tell you that certain books are not inspired and heresy?

I don't believe you. Please provide your citation.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

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#408789
Dec 12, 2012
 
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
That is very good, New Age Spiritual Leader!!
You are probably not surprised by how many people will not even address those points, because they are afraid of the honesty it brings up.

Self.

Since: Dec 06

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#408790
Dec 12, 2012
 
New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:
<quoted text>
Where does "God" say Gnosticism or any religion is heresy?
NASL

Acts 4:12

" Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

John 14:6 Jesus said to him,“I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

All religions seeks to try to reach God....
Christianity God seeks to reach people...
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#408791
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>Again you show the same lack of understanding because you do not understand what it is that the scripture says that we are saved from. You don't understand the New Birth, which is just as real as the physical birth. You don't understand what it means to be saved. There are only to possible conditions, one is either lost(never having been saved) on one is saved.
Today, just as in bible times, when the New Birth takes place there is a transformation that is evident in the life of the believer. When the Holy Spirit moves in ones is changed from the inside out. I am one of millions who testafy of this change. My life has been changed. I am very aware of it. People who know me have witnessed the change. I have witnessed the same life changing esperience in many others. But you hang on to your 'religion' and leave Jesus on the porch. Why don't you invite him in? Why don't you ask him to reveal this to you?
Nice. You've become a better person since you 'got' Jesus.

The issue remains; no one was ever told they were once saved, always saved in the bible.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

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#408792
Dec 12, 2012
 
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
No, that's not the question. We already know it's salvation through Jesus. Catholics and protestants acknowledge this. The question remains; what is it to 'receive' the gift? You say it's a simple mental acknowledgement and affirmation of His sacrifice and love for us. We say it's more. Both positions have biblical support, but your idea didn't come about until 1500 years later.
In answer to you question about the difference in what you teach and what we evangelicals believe..

I will give you a parable that came from an affleunt Lady that was a Professor of World History in a Roman Catholic College in Holland. That my wife lead to the Lord over the internet in early 2000.

"Jach" wrote..


The Foundation of the Gospel (Ephesians 2:20)[kjv]( Name (removed)9/17/05


From:(name removed... author now deceased)

Date: Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:52 am

Subject: Re: The Foundation of the Gospel (Ephesians 2:20)[kjv]

Dear Pastor;

It hadn't been my intention at all to react to this "discussion-item"
any longer, but this time I simply can't resist...
You are SO RIGHT!

Your example of the "fishing-club" really makes-my-day!:)

In first instance it reminds me of a comical-situation that
literally happened in my neighborhood.

A man in my street joined a official fishing-club for the first time
in his life, in order to go and fish for a price.
He prepared himself by taking theoretical-lessons, and afterwards
went to buy every tool-possible for a terrible-amount of money,
although his mates had warned him in advance that he wouldn't need
them at all, as only simple-stuff would be more than sufficient!

The morning of the "competition" arrived, and,-sitting on the river-
bank and looking around-, he got surprised that the other fishermen
had such simple tools with them.
This encouraged him very much; and obviously,- while putting out
his long-long telescopic-rod -, which nearly reached the other
bank, he must already have been dreaming of the price...

Well,- to make a long story short -, suddenly he felt somebody
knocking on his shoulder. It was the Chairman of the fishing-club,
who kindly told him : "Sir, you would have done better to stand with
a short and tiny-simple-little rod on the opposite bank of the
river".:)

So, dear Pastor, I can entirely "follow" what you are saying
here!

People can make things of the Bible SO DIFFICULT and COMPLICATED
with their sophisticated-tools, that I can't follow their reasoning
any longer...

I must say that I prefer to stand with a simple-, tiny little rod on
the river-side, in order to now-and-than catch a little fish...:)

I have my PhD in Classical-Ancient-History, and I'm lecturing at
University, but this has proven WORTHLESS for coming to believe in
God/Jesus Christ!

I have experienced that one needn't this fancy-equipment for living
one's life with Him; on the contrary, I've seen and learned in my
own life, that simply listening to His Word, without adding to it,
is more than enough.

Thanks again for your post!

Love;
"Jach."

summation.

You Roman Catholics have all your expensive fishing gear that one must for being fishers of men..

But "Jach" (who passed away in 2008) was an agnostic that found Jesus Christ (as Her Lord and Savior)

simply by the presentation of the word of God and faith in Jesus Christ

presented by my Wife (on a Yahoo group..) that simply used a bank pole
a sting and a hook...

That said...

Act_16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Since: Dec 06

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#408793
Dec 12, 2012
 

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Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>==========
I have examined the issue of whether esus and th Apostles quoted from the APOCRYPHA/DEUTEROCANONICAL BOOKS.My conclusion is that the argument used to prove they quoted from these books is not a solid one.While Certain quotes from Matthew, Mark, etc can paralell to ome extent those books:1. you are corrct nthat these are not direct quotes 2.references can be drawn fronm these quotes to other Canonical Old Testament books.
An argument can be made either way.However the argument that my Churc or the Catholic Church would make for the Deutercanonical books, if it was based strictly on these referencs would not be a strong argument.
Herme good friend

The N.T. quotes of O.T., is not a basis of accepting the Deuterocanonical books....

If it were, then we would need to throw out, "Ezra, Nehemiah, Esther, Ecclesiastes, and the Song of Solomon", since they are not quoted in the N.T....

Jesus, went to the Feast of the Dedication....what we now called Hannukah..., this was the defeat of Greco-Assyrian by the Maccabees....Fortunately, the Deuterocanonicals has I and II Maccabees. They of course have history and theology in them, and is the great final and solid statement by Jesus in the Temple, to the authorities that he is the Son of God.

It is a pity that Protestantism through out the Books of the Maccabees, they lost much of the linkage between Jesus and the latter part of Israel's history, and prophecy, that "the Gentiles will see the Savior of Israel...."(I Macc 4:11), and the continuation of the Hannukah....

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

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#408794
Dec 12, 2012
 

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atemcowboy wrote:
<quoted text>how about you chilling out. Hermi has just went thru a life threatening experience and we all are glad to have him back with us.
so for awhile keep your smart alec remarks to your self.
you wanna pick on someone try me.
Pick On? What are you, 12? So many keyboard tough guys Here!
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#408795
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>sHOW ME WHERE SCRIPTURE MAKES THAT DISTINCTION. And show me where in the scripture works are differentiated. Is salvation by works or by grace? What does the scripture say?
Rom. 3:20,28; Gal. 2:16,21; 3:2,5,10; Eph. 2:8-9 - many Protestants err in their understanding of what Paul means by "works of the law” in his teaching on justification. Paul’s teaching that we are not justified by “works of the law” refer to the law of Moses or to any legal system that makes God our debtor. They do not refer to good works done in grace with faith in Christ. This makes sense when we remember that Paul's mission was to teach that salvation was also for the Gentiles who were not subject to the "works of the law." Here is the proof:

James 2:24 – compare the verse “a man is justified by works and not by faith alone” to Gal. 2:16 –“a man is not justified by works of the law,” and Rom. 3:20,28 –“no human being will be justified in His sight by works of the law.” James 2:24 appears to be inconsistent with Gal. 2:16 and Rom. 3:20,28 until one realizes that the Word of God cannot contradict itself. This means that the “works” in James 2:24 are different from the “works of the law in Gal. 2:16 and Rom. 3:20,28. James is referring to “good works”(e.g.,clothing the naked; giving food to the poor) and Paul is referring to the “Mosaic law”(which included both the legal, moral and ceremonial law) or any works which oblige God to give us payment. Here is more proof:

Rom. 3:20,28; Gal. 2:16 - Paul's phrase for "works of the law" in the Greek is "ergon nomou" which means the Mosaic law or Torah and refers to the teachings (legal, moral) and works (ceremonial) that gave the Jews the knowledge of sin, but not an escape from sin. We have further proof of this from the Dead Sea Scrolls which provide the Hebrew equivalent ("hrvt ysm") meaning "deeds of the law," or Mosaic law. James in James 2 does not use "ergon nomou." He uses "ergois agathois." Therefore, Paul’s "works of the law" and James' "works" are entirely different types of works. Again, they could never contradict each other because the Scriptures are the inspired word of God.

Rom. 3:29 - Paul confirms that works of the law in this case refer to the Mosaic law by rhetorically asking "Or is God the God of the Jews only?" It does not mean "good works."

Rom. 4:9-17 - Paul provides further discussion that righteousness God seeks in us does not come from Mosaic law, but through faith. But notice that Paul also never says “faith alone.”

Rom. 9:31-32 - righteousness is pursued through faith, not works of the law. Again, "works of law" does not mean "good works."

Rom. 11:6,11 - justification is no longer based on "works" of the law, but on the grace of Christ. Why? Because salvation is also for the Gentiles.

Rom. 15:9-12 - Paul explains that Christ also saves the Gentiles. Therefore, "works of law" are no longer required.

More here; http://www.scripturecatholic.com/justificatio...
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

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#408796
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>Well Hello POLLY. lol
Yes--and the TRUTH needs to be "parroted" over and over again, to bible only heretics like you, 4GVN who (are forever) trying and feed your "molded crackers" of "distorted and false interpretation of the bible" to Catholics on this forum--(who "know the TRUTH" of the Word of God and TRUE Church History.
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#408797
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
<quoted text> The bible does say that by faith(that is the word used. The word is alone, or by itself.) That is what is meant by faith alone. Not that the word alone is used. Any one who half way seeks to understand the biblical position would be able to understand this point. And I hav pointed it out many times before. My salvation was BOUGHT by the FINISHED (WORD) of Jesus at Calvery. BUT, you go ahead and keep trying to WORK your way to heaven. Good luck. Let me know when you have done enough to attain salvation.
James tells us that faith is faith and works are works. They are two separate entities, and must be coupled together to achieve salvation. Faith (a mental process) and works (an action) are required for salvation.

When James asks “Can his faith save him?,” the answer is a resounding NO. James is talking about salvation. The answer to the question is NO because we must add works to our faith. Works just don't flow automatically out of true believers. The Bible never says anything about false faith or saving faith. Faith may truly exist, but it is not enough to save us. Even the demons believe in Jesus and tremble. Remember, James was talking to "saved Christians" in his epistle. Yet James continues to warn them to avoid sin and do good, or they will lose their salvation. That is because their faith was not enough to save them.

Abraham is a perfect example. Even though he was justified in Genesis 15, God still required him to sacrifice his son (a "work") which justified him in Genesis 22. If Abraham would not have added this work to his faith, he would have fallen out of favor with God. Thus, James says that Abraham was justified by his works.

Faith and works are required for salvation. God accepts them when done in a system of grace. This means we don't view God as a debtor who owes us, but as a loving Father who will reward us out of His goodness. Neither our faith nor our works can please God outside of grace. The key distinction is law versus grace. We are saved by God's grace through faith and works, and not faith alone.

http://www.scripturecatholic.com/justificatio...

Since: Dec 06

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#408798
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
The Roman Catholic Church decided that 'SOME' of the books of the Apocrypha belonged in the bible shortly after the beginning of the Protestant Reformation. In fact, the Catholic Council of Trent(A.D.1545-1563)canonized these books some 1500 years AFTER they were writen, largly as a reaction against the Protestant Reformation.
4GVN good friend

Protestant Bibles in English overall do not have the Deuterocanonicals. Though the KJV originally did have them.
Protestant Bibles in German today, do have Deuterocanonicals.

I remember as a child the KJV still had the Deuterocanonicals....

So when did the English decide to take them out, and when did they finally get them out?
Why do the Germans still keep them in?

By your logic, Protestants are even more messed up than the RCC about cannonization of the Bible to this day....
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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Dec 12, 2012
 

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confrinting with the word wrote:
News Item:
Despite 'war on Catholics,' faculty and staff at Catholic universities gave overwhelmingly to Obama
About ninety percent of faculty and administrators from America's top Catholic universities who contributed to presidential campaigns in 2012 gave to President Obama, a Campus Reform investigation has revealed.
KM
Stirring up trouble again Kay?

A leopard can never change her spots.
Anthony MN

Minneapolis, MN

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#408800
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
When Jesus comes to indwell us, He says that He will NEVER leave us nor forsake us. But you believe you can make Him a liar and make Him leave? I don't think so. I will believe the bible. You make up what ever you want to.
You don't believe the bible because the bible says we can leave Him.

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#408801
Dec 12, 2012
 

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4GVN wrote:
No Apocryphal book was written by a true prophet or apostle of God. And no apocryphal book was confirmed by divine miracles--- something that happened often with the prophets in the Old Testament and apostles in the New Testament.
4GVN good friend

You have been reading lies....
You are reading some very deceitful material.

An example....

The Feast of the Dedication, which Jesus went to and celebrated in His time, and is today known as Hannukah is about the cleansing of the Temple after the abomination by the Gentiles....One day of oil burned in the Temple for 8 days....That is why the Mennorah is 8 days long, with 9 lights in it....It is considered a miracle....Recorded in the Book of the Maccabees....
Pad

Rockford, IL

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#408802
Dec 12, 2012
 
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
All do respect Pad, you didn't answer any of my questions...at all.
How can I leave the Catholic Church when no one can provide one shred of evidence that the Church is not who they say they are?
If you say some of our beliefs are not 'explicitly found in scripture'. Then you MUST provide scripture, that says scripture is the only thing Christ established. You can't just give me a nice testimonial about how you view the Bible!
I'll answer your other post to me as well.WHO is asking you to leave the Catholic Church? Not me Clay,no matter what I say or do about the Catholic Church that has nothing to do with you.Stay,grow where you are planted,enjoy your church,and most of all be used of God.It is the LORD you will see face to face someday.

There is no doubt in my mind Clay that the Lord Jesus Christ in His Infinite,love,mercy and wisdom has each and every believer accounted for,and is using them for His glory.On a daily basis Clay I see people at work,and some are Catholics,there are two in particular I talk to almost every day.

Jim is very involved in his parish and we are basically friends,he is conservative,but yet is not too fond of the Catholics in his church who are ardant and strongly dedicated to the Lord,on the other hand Ginny is and when I talk to her I feel very connected with her spirit as she believes strongly in being born of the Spirit.Ginny loves her church but you can see such a love for Jesus and she is open to every believer.

Nevertheless Clay,I could care less what building of Christian endeavor they attend,for they both share with me what they believe and love about God and faith,and so on. I have my concerns about Catholicism,but basically it is too big for me to topple with some personal gripes.I have long ago learnded to love the brethren,and that is all inclusive to every affiliation.

Authority is Christ's alone,He is the ONE who has the authority in His People world-wide. That is a general statement,but think of this Clay.Since Jesus is ALL in all,and His Spirit is no respecter of persons,He gives liberally,and blesses with wonderful blessings and graces to all who come to Him by faith."COME unto me who labor and are heavy laden ,and I will give you rest........" Jesus calls us to Himself,there is enough of Him to go around,because of the Holy Spirit,that is why the Holy Spirit was sent to give Jesus to everyone who believes and repents.

The 40,000 expressions of church government and whatever you see it as,may seem at odds with each other over minor issues,but the truth is Christ is still worshiped and glorified,and He through the Holy Spirit directs and guides.When you take the time to realize that each and every sect,and affiliation in Christ all rely on the Spirit for direction and truth,it becomes apparent to you that Christ is ALL in all. Those 40,000 different sects of which I do not believe there is even close to that many,all believe in faith,preach the gospel,teach new believers,have part in taking care of the POOR and needy,and all rely on the Bible for confirmation in the BIG things:Prayer and supplication,Obedience to Him,rejecting sin,living Moral lives in righteousness.
hojo

Saint Paul, MN

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#408803
Dec 12, 2012
 
MICHAEL wrote:
<quoted text>
Bottom line! I don't care what you believe.
Yes--Michael---"YOU DO CARE" what I believe, just like you care what Clay, Anthony, or any other Catholic on this forum "believe"!! The fact is that you and your other agnostic, atheists or bible only Protestant "heretics" wouldn't be on this Catholic Forum, OTHERWISE--- condemning, judging and attacking our Catholic-Christian Faith, AND Jesus Christ HIMSELF ---as well as --the One True Catholic Church that he formed, established and authenticated!!
In other words,(if you didn't care what we believe) you would just go away and continue living in the "bondage of hate, hostility, vengeance and animosity that has "festered and infected" your heart, mind and soul--all these years!!! But we as Catholics ALL KNOW that you can't and won't do that because you would rather live your life in the "same old condemning" anti-catholic revenge in which your distorted "personal judgmental opinion" is the "final authority!! Until you come to "true Salvation" in Jesus Christ, in and through His One True Catholic Church, you, Michael will continue to remain "on the outside of the TRUTH" ---always looking in!!!!!

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