Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

[confrinting with the word]

who="7th Day Catholics Rock" He most certainly hated Essau now didn't he.

**********

We have to study the language of the Bible to understand. English can't always express the exact meaning. When Jesus mentioned 'hating' one's family for His sake, the word 'hate' meant to 'love less'.

KayMarie

[Clay]

New Age Spiritual Leader wrote:

<quoted text>
I responded, but I wanted to tell you, that you are also off-topic.
Remember, this forum isn't about me.
Why do you think the RCC is the true church?

Well you're on this forum.. And you're making your case on 'new age' ism.

Nevermind the title of the this thread, its an open forum now.
But
Why do I think the "RCC is the true Church"?

I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God. God Himself made manifest. I believe He set up an actual Church. Not a body of various believers with no set doctrine...but an actual Church with one faith.
Therefore, whatever Church was there from the beginning, would have to be divinely guided. Because Jesus is divine. All other scenarios do not make since when considering who Christ was/is.

Now there are other reasons why I believe the Catholic Church to be who they say they are.
The Eucharist - which I have the privilege of partaking in is one.
The history of the Church and how its withstood circumstances that normally would have toppled any other institution is another.
If Christ, being who He is, started an actual Church, then I wanna be a part of it. No one can argue that theirs rightfully should be called 'His Church' except the Catholic Church.(Orthodox have a great argument too, but we are much the same and its another story) all others came along way too late in Christianity to claim to be valid.
He didn't establish a secret hidden church.

Why is New Age considered the correct deposit of faith.

[confrinting with the word]

TheBlackSheep wrote:

Let me try to help you with your ignorance.
<quoted text>
For the most part, Atheists to not deny that there is a god or gods. Atheists see no proof of a god or gods. Faith is a belief without proof and Atheists do not suffer from such nonsense.
<quoted text>
As do all believes. You know how many nasty, unjust laws your god came up with? A rape victim must marry her rapist! A father must kill his daughter, if she is not a virgin on her wedding night! None of you follow those laws, even though jesus himself demanded that you do!
<quoted text>
Do you remember the sabbath and keep it holy? No. You do not follow this very basic commandment. Most christians 'worship' on Sunday, the 1st day of the week. Many christians work on Saturday, whether it is cooking, cleaning, or going to a job.
You only follow what you like and damn others for not doing so. Which in its self is against your god.
Notice the log in your own eye before the spec in another's...

~~~

So you are on this forum to discuss the four corners of the round table

RIGHT...

To talk about something that you know nothing about

and claim you don't believe in.

I to you ..GOD DOES NOT EXIST...WHO ARE YOU SHADOW BOXING WITH???

[preston]

Robert F wrote:

<quoted text>
preston
Ignatius of Antioch
Born: c. 35 AD(maybe as late as 50)
Died: c. 110 AD(during the reign of Trajan)-117 AD
The RCC does not believe in the myth that Ignatius was one of the children touched by Jesus....Rather, that he rather late in his life had a conversion....
A rather fair and balanced approach to him is in this article
http://www.nndb.com/people/718/000094436/
I think the main point is the genuineness of the Vossian Epistles, which everyone thinks are true(the 7 Epistles), supported by Polycarp and Eusebius....It is in Section V
In the same article, the last paragraph is particularly important....(although the whole article is interesting....)

yes, I admit that teh article was vey intersting and i picked up on several itesm that were of great inteest to me, how about You?

first;The only shred of extra information which he gives us is the statement that Ignatius "was the second successor of Peter in the bishopric of Antioch."

when you google his name, it shows that he was teh third Bishop of Antioch, di you see that?

also something is strange with this from that article. and please comment or anyone else.

The Latin form, of which there are thirteen extant manuscripts, omits the letter of Mary of Cassobola, but adds to the list the Laus Heronis, two Epistles to the apostle John,{one to the Virgin Mary and one from Mary to Ignatius}.

now, and please correct me if I am wrong. it was believed that Mary dies in 54 AD, and I was under the impression that these Epistles wer written while he was imprisoned and on his way to rome, which would place that time around 50 years after Mary was deceased.

In 54 AD, Mary the mother of Jesus died and was buried, and so John fulfilled his duty of caring for her until the very end. It was said that when they opened the tomb her body was gone. Catholic tradition says she rose from the dead and ascended into Heaven with both body and soul intact in what is called the Assumption of Mary,[21] however others say her body was taken away lest it become an idol.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_the_Apostle

[TheBlackSheep]

ReginaM wrote:

<quoted text>
Hello, BS. I see Fun Facts answered your post to me. I meant to reply last night but was tired and went to bed early. Btw, I don't think he's a sock puppet. I would also link to the Catechism which does a nice job of explaining as well, but have a feeling your response would be the same.
As to the rest of your questions, from what I can remember of them...yes, the Mass used to be in Latin. There are still Masses celebrated entirely in Latin, and some parishes use a mix of the vernacular and Latin, especially during certain liturgical seasons, although the Kyrie is in Greek and "Amen" is actually Aramaic. Yes, I do understand it, although I'm a bit rusty on some parts these days.

First, I believe he/she is a sock.

Second, yes my answer would be the same. Every group takes a verse or two, or even a part of a verse and created their own little version of belief. And they all believe that god guided them to their beliefs.

Third, mass changes to appease the money. The younger generation does not like Latin, so the stop going to mass. They didn't agree with the invention purgatory, so the leadership got rid of it.

Just like Walmart, the church will do what it needs to keep the money coming in.

[preston]

LTM wrote:

This seems to be the theme for today, no matter what I read,
I believe God is trying to tell me something.

yeah, but are you gonna do it?

the first thing that God impresses on sinners like you is to Repent and sin no more.

no matter what you and your other fellers on this forum think,you aint right with God, and lying is still a sin

[confrinting with the word]

who="root66" When i read stories like this i thank god i am Atheist

*********
:):):) Did you get THAT ONE?:)

KM

[preston]

. Ignatius constantly contends for the recognition of the authority of the ministers of the church. "Do nothing", he writes to the Magnesians, "without the bishop and the presbyters." The "three orders" are essential to the church, without them no church is worthy of the name (cf. Trall. 3). "It is not lawful apart from the bishop either to baptize or to hold a love-feast" (Smyrn. 8). Respect is due to the bishop as to God, to the presbyters as the council of God and the college of apostles, to the deacons as to Jesus Christ (Trall. 3). These terms must not, of course, be taken in their developed modern sense. The "bishop" of Ignatius seems to represent the modern pastor of a church.

if number 3 is correct, then we can place no credence in any form that Peter himself ordained ignatius, since that office is one that the chruch itself is involved in, by calling themselves a Pastor.

friends it cant be both ways, if the office of a bishop needed to have an Apostle lay hands on him, then it is more than a Pastorate,

if it is less, then peter was never involved, for what ever reason

[confrinting with the word]

hojo wrote:

<quoted text>
The bible says "absolutely nothing" about the negativity, heresy or lies that you are spreading about Jesus Christs One True Catholic Church......ONLY WHAT YOU."MAKE UP" ON YOUR OWN!!... ANYONE can see that "everytime" you make a "derogatory comment" and list a bunch of (unrelated) bible verses that you continue to reach the depths "of new lows" in your "condemning and judgmental" heretical ministry. You also have become an "expert fraud" in inserting the word "Catholic" ---any place in the bible----wherever and whenever it supports and fits into your "vengence and hatred" for Jesus Christ and the Catholic Church..... You, Confrinting are the most condemning, judgmental and deceitful (half-truth) Christian that I have ever had the "displeasure" of meeting! Take a lesson "example" from your wife KayMarie! As I have told you before, "she is the only TRUE Christian in your family.

~~~

YOU DON'T KNOW ANY THING ABOUT THE SEVERITY AND VENGEANCE OF GOD..

and believe Him to be wishy washy such as your religious system is...

Rom_11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

~~~

Evidently you (because you deny and are ignorant of His word.) believe the the Blood of Jesus is cheep and of no consequence...

You devalue it .... have replaced his blood (which cleanses from all sin.) with cheap religious rituals works and rhetoric..rosary pomp pride and corruption...icons statues and idols...made of plaster plastic, and ceramics.

God even forbade an altar to be touched with a hammer in the old testament

Exo 20:23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.

Exo 20:24 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee.

Exo 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.

Exo 20:26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

Clay wrote:

<quoted text>
Well you're on this forum.. And you're making your case on 'new age' ism.
Nevermind the title of the this thread, its an open forum now.
But
Why do I think the "RCC is the true Church"?
I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God. God Himself made manifest. I believe He set up an actual Church. Not a body of various believers with no set doctrine...but an actual Church with one faith.
Therefore, whatever Church was there from the beginning, would have to be divinely guided. Because Jesus is divine. All other scenarios do not make since when considering who Christ was/is.
Now there are other reasons why I believe the Catholic Church to be who they say they are.
The Eucharist - which I have the privilege of partaking in is one.
The history of the Church and how its withstood circumstances that normally would have toppled any other institution is another.
If Christ, being who He is, started an actual Church, then I wanna be a part of it. No one can argue that theirs rightfully should be called 'His Church' except the Catholic Church.(Orthodox have a great argument too, but we are much the same and its another story) all others came along way too late in Christianity to claim to be valid.
He didn't establish a secret hidden church.
Why is New Age considered the correct deposit of faith.

Thanks for being honest in your belief.

First and foremost, "deposit of faith" is a action of one - through a mental change of sorts. If one is to put any action it is of our minds that this action is initiated, so we are actually saying that "we" (also I, you, us, me, he, she, etc, etc) "deposit faith" because we choose to.

So if I were "deposit" any "faith", it would be "faith" [belief/Self] in Jesus' words of "to know yourself is to know the kingdom of Good."
- very profound if one really dwells in "solving these mysterious words". It really takes a pondering of one's inner Self to determine how it is achieved.

Anyhow, now that is clarified in all respects of religion, the question was, "Why is New Age considered the correct deposit of faith?"
- good question.
- I don't believe that. Like others' have stated, "New Age" is undefined, whereas, my belief is defined, by my 'Self', its actions toward others, and how I live in this world.
- Remember, it's between "God" and I, huh? You really don't have any choice in this one Clay, huh?
- Maybe this type of question is more pertinent.....Do I think there is a "New Age" philosophy that exists, that should be a type of belief one should have and live by?
+ Sure I do. I think its a liberating experience to know that I have know specific bindings of a "religion" to get me through life.
+ I don't require any ritual of "self-gratification" to know that I am only human, I will make dumb mistakes, and learn from them, and I will do what I can when I know of another person who is down and out. I respect the deity, if there is an ultimate Creator, and if I have to answer to this being, I will be able to answer for my life.

Self.

[4GVN]

It goes way beyond illogical to believe that Jesus(the greatest teacher who ever lived) spent 3 and a half years with his disciples and taught them all about spiritual matters and about heaven and about hell. And taught them what a man must do to be saved and go to heaven that Jesus prepared for them. But somehow 'forgot' to mention a place as important as purgatory which is the only way that a sinful man can attain heaven. Scripture, nor any of the apostles tell us of this place. No one has ever been to this place and come back to tell us about it. But we are supposed to believe that it is real, and only the Catholics know about it.:{

[confrinting with the word]

confrinting with the word wrote:

<quoted text>
~~~
YOU DON'T KNOW ANY THING ABOUT THE SEVERITY AND VENGEANCE OF GOD..
and believe Him to be wishy washy such as your religious system is...
Rom_11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
~~~
Evidently you (because you deny and are ignorant of His word.) believe the the Blood of Jesus is cheep and of no consequence...
You devalue it .... have replaced his blood (which cleanses from all sin.) with cheap religious rituals works and rhetoric..rosary pomp pride and corruption...icons statues and idols...made of plaster plastic, and ceramics.
God even forbade an altar to be touched with a hammer in the old testament
Exo 20:23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.
Exo 20:24 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee.
Exo 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.
Exo 20:26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.

~~~

Moses even had to take off his shoes at the burning Bush..

Exo 3:2 And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.


Exo 3:3 And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.

Exo 3:4 And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.

Exo 3:5 And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.

Exo 3:6 Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.

And

Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.

You Roman Catholics evidently have no fear of God...

___

Solomon said...

Ecc_12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

Psa_36:1 A Psalm of David the servant of the LORD.

The transgression of the wicked saith within my heart, that there is no fear of God before his eyes.

Psa_55:19 God shall hear, and afflict them, even he that abideth of old. Selah. Because they have no changes, therefore they fear not God.

Eze_30:13 Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also destroy the idols, and I will cause their images to cease out of Noph; and there shall be no more a prince of the land of Egypt: and I will put a fear in the land of Egypt.

[ReginaM]

TheBlackSheep wrote:

<quoted text>
First, I believe he/she is a sock.
Second, yes my answer would be the same. Every group takes a verse or two, or even a part of a verse and created their own little version of belief. And they all believe that god guided them to their beliefs.
Third, mass changes to appease the money. The younger generation does not like Latin, so the stop going to mass. They didn't agree with the invention purgatory, so the leadership got rid of it.
Just like Walmart, the church will do what it needs to keep the money coming in.

There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.

What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid

Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.

[Hermeneutics Smutics]

TheBlackSheep wrote:

<quoted text>
Very simple! god wanted the world to believe without knowing or seeing!
If you are brave enough to throw off your logic, your intellect, and your knowledge, you too could be a believer!
You too can start your own denomination! Just pick a verse, or even a part of a verse, claim that god told you that it was the most important part of the bible! Soon, you will have idiots beating down your door to be part of the 'truth'!
If hal lindsey, joseph smith, and paul could start their own, highly successful religions, why can't you?
Playing with deadly snakes has already been taken.:(

====

Hi Black Sheep

Ok Let's talk philosophy and logic.

You said "If you are brave enough to throw off your logic, your intellect, and your knowledge, you too could be a believer!"

If our premise is:

If many people can form different opinions of a Truth then the Truth does not exist.

This means
There would be no science
There would be no philosophy
There would be no psychology.
etc etc etc

Therefore, just because there are different opinions of God and what is Truth does not mean these do not exist.

Of course we do have specific common sense criteria to help us know if a certain opinion is closer or farther from the truth.

Just my thoughts

[confrinting with the word]

ReginaM wrote:

<quoted text>
There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.
What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.

you wrote

Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".

Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...

THE SEQUENCE OF MANS FATE... IS CLEARLY DEFINED IN GOD'S WORD..

it says

Heb_9:27 And as

1.it is appointed unto men

2.once to die,

3. but after this

4. the judgment:

NOW

Prove me wrong

Take the Bible and prove me wrong...

IF YOU CAN?

[Hermeneutics Smutics]

ReginaM wrote:

<quoted text>
There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.
What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.

Hey there girl!! Hurricanes and srious medical crises have kept us apart. Still love ya.

[confrinting with the word]

confrinting with the word wrote:

<quoted text>
you wrote
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".
Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...
THE SEQUENCE OF MANS FATE... IS CLEARLY DEFINED IN GOD'S WORD..
it says
Heb_9:27 And as
1.it is appointed unto men
2.once to die,
3. but after this
4. the judgment:
NOW
Prove me wrong
Take the Bible and prove me wrong...
IF YOU CAN?

~~~
JESUS DID NOT TEACH PURGATORY..

HE SAID...

Mar_16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Joh_3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Joh_3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and

-->he that believeth not the Son

shall not see life;

but the wrath of God abideth on him. <--

[preston]

if we cant get some more interesting arguments going, I am going to pull out that "S" word again.

[preston]

confrinting with the word wrote:

<quoted text>
you wrote
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".
Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...

Reggie never said that it was.

you read about like LTM, what you think she says IS NOT WHAT SHE SAID.

[preston]

hey Reggie, you got your gloves on, I will take you and Hermi both on at the same times,

no holds barred.but hurry up, I am going to bed in 5 minutes or less, maybe, If I dont fall asleep before then or maybe later depends on what is on tv, if I am not recording it to watch when I wake up if I aint asleep when it comes on