Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

Full story: CBC News 558,638
The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ. Full Story
preston

Waverly, OH

#406732 Dec 3, 2012
. Ignatius constantly contends for the recognition of the authority of the ministers of the church. "Do nothing", he writes to the Magnesians, "without the bishop and the presbyters." The "three orders" are essential to the church, without them no church is worthy of the name (cf. Trall. 3). "It is not lawful apart from the bishop either to baptize or to hold a love-feast" (Smyrn. 8). Respect is due to the bishop as to God, to the presbyters as the council of God and the college of apostles, to the deacons as to Jesus Christ (Trall. 3). These terms must not, of course, be taken in their developed modern sense. The "bishop" of Ignatius seems to represent the modern pastor of a church.

if number 3 is correct, then we can place no credence in any form that Peter himself ordained ignatius, since that office is one that the chruch itself is involved in, by calling themselves a Pastor.

friends it cant be both ways, if the office of a bishop needed to have an Apostle lay hands on him, then it is more than a Pastorate,

if it is less, then peter was never involved, for what ever reason

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#406733 Dec 3, 2012
hojo wrote:
<quoted text>
The bible says "absolutely nothing" about the negativity, heresy or lies that you are spreading about Jesus Christs One True Catholic Church......ONLY WHAT YOU."MAKE UP" ON YOUR OWN!!... ANYONE can see that "everytime" you make a "derogatory comment" and list a bunch of (unrelated) bible verses that you continue to reach the depths "of new lows" in your "condemning and judgmental" heretical ministry. You also have become an "expert fraud" in inserting the word "Catholic" ---any place in the bible----wherever and whenever it supports and fits into your "vengence and hatred" for Jesus Christ and the Catholic Church..... You, Confrinting are the most condemning, judgmental and deceitful (half-truth) Christian that I have ever had the "displeasure" of meeting! Take a lesson "example" from your wife KayMarie! As I have told you before, "she is the only TRUE Christian in your family.
~~~

YOU DON'T KNOW ANY THING ABOUT THE SEVERITY AND VENGEANCE OF GOD..

and believe Him to be wishy washy such as your religious system is...

Rom_11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

~~~

Evidently you (because you deny and are ignorant of His word.) believe the the Blood of Jesus is cheep and of no consequence...

You devalue it .... have replaced his blood (which cleanses from all sin.) with cheap religious rituals works and rhetoric..rosary pomp pride and corruption...icons statues and idols...made of plaster plastic, and ceramics.

God even forbade an altar to be touched with a hammer in the old testament

Exo 20:23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.

Exo 20:24 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee.

Exo 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.

Exo 20:26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.

“What are you looking at?”

Since: Jan 08

Albuquerque, NM

#406734 Dec 3, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Well you're on this forum.. And you're making your case on 'new age' ism.
Nevermind the title of the this thread, its an open forum now.
But
Why do I think the "RCC is the true Church"?
I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God. God Himself made manifest. I believe He set up an actual Church. Not a body of various believers with no set doctrine...but an actual Church with one faith.
Therefore, whatever Church was there from the beginning, would have to be divinely guided. Because Jesus is divine. All other scenarios do not make since when considering who Christ was/is.
Now there are other reasons why I believe the Catholic Church to be who they say they are.
The Eucharist - which I have the privilege of partaking in is one.
The history of the Church and how its withstood circumstances that normally would have toppled any other institution is another.
If Christ, being who He is, started an actual Church, then I wanna be a part of it. No one can argue that theirs rightfully should be called 'His Church' except the Catholic Church.(Orthodox have a great argument too, but we are much the same and its another story) all others came along way too late in Christianity to claim to be valid.
He didn't establish a secret hidden church.
Why is New Age considered the correct deposit of faith.
Thanks for being honest in your belief.

First and foremost, "deposit of faith" is a action of one - through a mental change of sorts. If one is to put any action it is of our minds that this action is initiated, so we are actually saying that "we" (also I, you, us, me, he, she, etc, etc) "deposit faith" because we choose to.

So if I were "deposit" any "faith", it would be "faith" [belief/Self] in Jesus' words of "to know yourself is to know the kingdom of Good."
- very profound if one really dwells in "solving these mysterious words". It really takes a pondering of one's inner Self to determine how it is achieved.

Anyhow, now that is clarified in all respects of religion, the question was, "Why is New Age considered the correct deposit of faith?"
- good question.
- I don't believe that. Like others' have stated, "New Age" is undefined, whereas, my belief is defined, by my 'Self', its actions toward others, and how I live in this world.
- Remember, it's between "God" and I, huh? You really don't have any choice in this one Clay, huh?
- Maybe this type of question is more pertinent.....Do I think there is a "New Age" philosophy that exists, that should be a type of belief one should have and live by?
+ Sure I do. I think its a liberating experience to know that I have know specific bindings of a "religion" to get me through life.
+ I don't require any ritual of "self-gratification" to know that I am only human, I will make dumb mistakes, and learn from them, and I will do what I can when I know of another person who is down and out. I respect the deity, if there is an ultimate Creator, and if I have to answer to this being, I will be able to answer for my life.

Self.
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#406735 Dec 3, 2012
It goes way beyond illogical to believe that Jesus(the greatest teacher who ever lived) spent 3 and a half years with his disciples and taught them all about spiritual matters and about heaven and about hell. And taught them what a man must do to be saved and go to heaven that Jesus prepared for them. But somehow 'forgot' to mention a place as important as purgatory which is the only way that a sinful man can attain heaven. Scripture, nor any of the apostles tell us of this place. No one has ever been to this place and come back to tell us about it. But we are supposed to believe that it is real, and only the Catholics know about it.:{

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#406736 Dec 3, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
YOU DON'T KNOW ANY THING ABOUT THE SEVERITY AND VENGEANCE OF GOD..
and believe Him to be wishy washy such as your religious system is...
Rom_11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
~~~
Evidently you (because you deny and are ignorant of His word.) believe the the Blood of Jesus is cheep and of no consequence...
You devalue it .... have replaced his blood (which cleanses from all sin.) with cheap religious rituals works and rhetoric..rosary pomp pride and corruption...icons statues and idols...made of plaster plastic, and ceramics.
God even forbade an altar to be touched with a hammer in the old testament
Exo 20:23 Ye shall not make with me gods of silver, neither shall ye make unto you gods of gold.
Exo 20:24 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee.
Exo 20:25 And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.
Exo 20:26 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy nakedness be not discovered thereon.
~~~

Moses even had to take off his shoes at the burning Bush..

Exo 3:2 And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.


Exo 3:3 And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.

Exo 3:4 And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.

Exo 3:5 And he said, Draw not nigh hither: put off thy shoes from off thy feet, for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.

Exo 3:6 Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.

And

Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.

You Roman Catholics evidently have no fear of God...

___

Solomon said...

Ecc_12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

Psa_36:1 A Psalm of David the servant of the LORD.

The transgression of the wicked saith within my heart, that there is no fear of God before his eyes.

Psa_55:19 God shall hear, and afflict them, even he that abideth of old. Selah. Because they have no changes, therefore they fear not God.

Eze_30:13 Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also destroy the idols, and I will cause their images to cease out of Noph; and there shall be no more a prince of the land of Egypt: and I will put a fear in the land of Egypt.
ReginaM

Lakewood, NJ

#406737 Dec 3, 2012
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
First, I believe he/she is a sock.
Second, yes my answer would be the same. Every group takes a verse or two, or even a part of a verse and created their own little version of belief. And they all believe that god guided them to their beliefs.
Third, mass changes to appease the money. The younger generation does not like Latin, so the stop going to mass. They didn't agree with the invention purgatory, so the leadership got rid of it.
Just like Walmart, the church will do what it needs to keep the money coming in.
There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.

What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid

Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#406738 Dec 3, 2012
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
Very simple! god wanted the world to believe without knowing or seeing!
If you are brave enough to throw off your logic, your intellect, and your knowledge, you too could be a believer!
You too can start your own denomination! Just pick a verse, or even a part of a verse, claim that god told you that it was the most important part of the bible! Soon, you will have idiots beating down your door to be part of the 'truth'!
If hal lindsey, joseph smith, and paul could start their own, highly successful religions, why can't you?
Playing with deadly snakes has already been taken.:(
====

Hi Black Sheep

Ok Let's talk philosophy and logic.

You said "If you are brave enough to throw off your logic, your intellect, and your knowledge, you too could be a believer!"

If our premise is:

If many people can form different opinions of a Truth then the Truth does not exist.

This means
There would be no science
There would be no philosophy
There would be no psychology.
etc etc etc

Therefore, just because there are different opinions of God and what is Truth does not mean these do not exist.

Of course we do have specific common sense criteria to help us know if a certain opinion is closer or farther from the truth.

Just my thoughts

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#406739 Dec 3, 2012
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.
What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.
you wrote

Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".

Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...

THE SEQUENCE OF MANS FATE... IS CLEARLY DEFINED IN GOD'S WORD..

it says

Heb_9:27 And as

1.it is appointed unto men

2.once to die,

3. but after this

4. the judgment:

NOW

Prove me wrong

Take the Bible and prove me wrong...

IF YOU CAN?

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#406740 Dec 3, 2012
ReginaM wrote:
<quoted text>
There's more than just a verse or two, and also Sacred Tradition which describes the Mass from the earliest days of Christianity. Don't forget, we're not 'bible alone', however, it is biblical.
What makes you think the younger generation doesn't like Latin? I've always loved the Latin Mass, and there are many Catholics (young Catholics) who prefer it. Why do anti-Catholic Christians always throw down the money card whenever they don't know the real reason behind something? And what, may I ask, is wrong with money? The Church needs it just the way everybody else does. How do you think the electric bill gets paid
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of". You need to find out what Catholicism actually teaches and why. You're denouncing something that you know nothing about. Disagree with it, if you must. But it's pretty obvious you've gotten hold of some erroneous information. It's like my basing a dislike of apples on the orange I've just eaten.
Hey there girl!! Hurricanes and srious medical crises have kept us apart. Still love ya.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 55:11--"MATT 10:27"

#406741 Dec 3, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
you wrote
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".
Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...
THE SEQUENCE OF MANS FATE... IS CLEARLY DEFINED IN GOD'S WORD..
it says
Heb_9:27 And as
1.it is appointed unto men
2.once to die,
3. but after this
4. the judgment:
NOW
Prove me wrong
Take the Bible and prove me wrong...
IF YOU CAN?
~~~
JESUS DID NOT TEACH PURGATORY..

HE SAID...

Mar_16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Joh_3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Joh_3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and

-->he that believeth not the Son

shall not see life;

but the wrath of God abideth on him. <--
preston

Waverly, OH

#406742 Dec 3, 2012
if we cant get some more interesting arguments going, I am going to pull out that "S" word again.
preston

Waverly, OH

#406743 Dec 3, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
you wrote
Purgatory is still a doctrine of the Church. It's not an "invention" and hasn't been "gotten rid of".
Purgatory IS NOT..NEVER WAS a doctrine of the BIBLE...
Reggie never said that it was.

you read about like LTM, what you think she says IS NOT WHAT SHE SAID.
preston

Waverly, OH

#406744 Dec 3, 2012
hey Reggie, you got your gloves on, I will take you and Hermi both on at the same times,

no holds barred.but hurry up, I am going to bed in 5 minutes or less, maybe, If I dont fall asleep before then or maybe later depends on what is on tv, if I am not recording it to watch when I wake up if I aint asleep when it comes on

Since: Dec 11

Location hidden

#406745 Dec 3, 2012
preston wrote:
hey Reggie, you got your gloves on, I will take you and Hermi both on at the same times,
no holds barred.but hurry up, I am going to bed in 5 minutes or less, maybe, If I dont fall asleep before then or maybe later depends on what is on tv, if I am not recording it to watch when I wake up if I aint asleep when it comes on
HIDES BEHIND SERAPHIMA
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#406746 Dec 3, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
It is biblical.
http://www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory.ht...
In fact the Jews believe in a form of purification.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory#sect...
I. A State After Death of Suffering and Forgiveness
Matt. 5:26,18:34; Luke 12:58-59 – Jesus teaches us,“Come to terms with your opponent or you will be handed over to the judge and thrown into prison. You will not get out until you have paid the last penny.” The word “opponent”(antidiko) is likely a reference to the devil (see the same word for devil in 1 Pet. 5:8) who is an accuser against man (c.f. Job 1.6-12; Zech. 3.1; Rev. 12.10), and God is the judge. If we have not adequately dealt with satan and sin in this life, we will be held in a temporary state called a prison, and we won’t get out until we have satisfied our entire debt to God. This “prison” is purgatory where we will not get out until the last penny is paid.

RESPONSE: A 'state of forgiveness'? What is a 'state of forgiveness' and why must one be in a 'state of suffering' to be forgiven? This is just ridicules. NOTICE that this whole post is based on speculation. Example."is LIKELY in reference to the devil".
This does not stand in light of the context of the passage. Jesus is teaching about how to deal with those who have aught against us. NOT in how to deal with the devil.
" This prison is PURGATORY" they say. Based on what? This would be laughable if it were not so serious.
Can you imagine if YOUR child came to you for your forgiveness and you told them you may have it, BUT , I am going to make you go to a place to be tortured first. What a loving parent you would be. But in your warped view of a loving compassionate saviour it is somehow O.K.???? It literally sickens me to even read this garbage.
ReginaM

Lakewood, NJ

#406747 Dec 3, 2012
preston wrote:
hey Reggie, you got your gloves on, I will take you and Hermi both on at the same times,
no holds barred.but hurry up, I am going to bed in 5 minutes or less, maybe, If I dont fall asleep before then or maybe later depends on what is on tv, if I am not recording it to watch when I wake up if I aint asleep when it comes on
Are you going to punch me??!! Bed and a book sound like a whole lot more fun right about now.
ReginaM

Lakewood, NJ

#406748 Dec 3, 2012
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>Hey there girl!! Hurricanes and srious medical crises have kept us apart. Still love ya.
I love you, too! I'm thrilled that you're home and doing better, even if progress is slow. I hear you were making goo-goo eyes at the nurses! And now you're into midgets. What next??!!

"I Survived Hurricane Sandy", yeah, it was a little breezy out one day.
ReginaM

Lakewood, NJ

#406749 Dec 3, 2012
Hermeneutics Smutics wrote:
<quoted text>Hey there girl!! Hurricanes and srious medical crises have kept us apart. Still love ya.
I'd give you a 'heart', but apparently the icons upset 4BDN. I don't normally use them since they're so childish, but now that I know they get under his skin, I could learn to like them...a lot!
hojo

Minneapolis, MN

#406750 Dec 3, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
YOU DON'T KNOW ANY THING ABOUT THE SEVERITY AND VENGEANCE OF GOD..
and believe Him to be wishy washy such as your religious system is...
Rom_11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
~~~
Evidently you (because you deny and are ignorant of His word.)
The only thing that I deny are false-judgmental-heretical-con demning anti-catholic Protestant preachers like you, who conveniently, insert the word Catholic (anywhere in the bible, wherever it "fits" into your hositlity and hate towards Jesus Christs One True Catholic Church
If YOU knew ANYTHING about the vengeance of God, you would "get down on your knees" and repent of the condemning and judgmental hypocricy against (any and all) other Christians (especially Catholics)........ You have "proven" to everyone of this forum that (condemning the faith of other Christians) is the "entire basis of your ministry!! You seem to think that "quoting a bunch of bible verses" makes you a Christian. You--Confrinting --are in for a "rude awakening" on judgment day---(a day of reconing- for those who "purposely" divide, separate, disunite and fracture the body of Christ and the body of Believers.(I Cor 1:10-13). Furthermore YOU CONFRINTING are NOT the finalojudge nor the blueprint for my Salvation in Christ (OR ANYONE ELSES)--I know the TRUE INTERPRETATION of the word of God------I listen to it, believe it, adhere to it, absorb it, and follow it, every day at Daily Mass, at home and at the Adoration Chapel--before the blessed Sacrament......... Furthermore, I not only know Gods "true interpretation" of His word----I KNOW JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF(every single day) as personal Lord and Savior!!----It is HE who helps me to "stomach, endure and put up with" heretical bible only Protestant preachers like you---through acts of confession and repentance, in attempting to "deal with" your blatant lies regarding my own personal faith, my Catholic doctrinal faith and listening to your "on-going" distorted anti-catholic hate and animosity that has "CORRUPTED your mind, heart and soul...... God help this bondage of hate that you display toward us Catholics (as brothers and sisters in Christ) and toward His One True Catholic Church. Thank God for your wife KAYMARIE--again---she is the "breath of fresh air" ----the ONLY true Christian in your family!!
4GVN

Wentzville, MO

#406751 Dec 3, 2012
Anthony MN wrote:
<quoted text>
It is biblical.
http://www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory.ht...
In fact the Jews believe in a form of purification.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory#sect...
If we have not adequately dealt with satan and sin in this life, we will be held in a temporary state called a prison, and we won’t get out until we have satisfied our entire debt to God. This “prison” is purgatory where we will not get out until the last penny is paid.
This of course goes against the teachings of scripture in that the the (debt to God) is the debt for our sin. And the scriptures clearly tell us the price(debt) of sin is the 'second death' which is an eternity in hell seperated from God forever. "And death and hell were cast into the Lake of Fire."

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