Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

Oct 12, 2011 Full story: CNN 32,004

Editor's note: Dean Obeidallah is an award-winning comedian who has appeared on TV shows such as Comedy Central's "Axis of Evil" special, ABC's "The View," CNN's "What the Week" and HLN's "The Joy Behar Show." He is executive producer of the annual New York Arab-American Comedy Festival and the Amman Stand Up Comedy Festival.

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Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#19136 Nov 29, 2012
not ashamed wrote:
<quoted text>you gonna provide a little more insight as to why it's our fault ?
Are u going to ostrich yourself as usual? Denial from the get go..how pathetically typical...hence the problem. Ur part of the problem, Molly

“I will not keep calm”

Since: Mar 08

Raise hell...change the world

#19137 Nov 29, 2012
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Are u going to ostrich yourself as usual? Denial from the get go..how pathetically typical...hence the problem. Ur part of the problem, Molly
I asked a simple question. One you can't answer.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#19138 Nov 29, 2012
not ashamed wrote:
<quoted text>I asked a simple question. One you can't answer.
Can't answer?..
Deny, then diversion. Do u even realize how despicable that is?
A kid, described by his friends as gay and bullied, had his mom pick him up from school today at 1:00..he returned to the pedestrian bridge by his school at three..saw/confronted some classmates, pulled a gun and blew his brains out.
Now..write novels about how this isn't because of religious bigots..go ahead. U justify this shit every time u make exceptions.

“I will not keep calm”

Since: Mar 08

Raise hell...change the world

#19139 Nov 29, 2012
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Can't answer?..
Deny, then diversion. Do u even realize how despicable that is?
A kid, described by his friends as gay and bullied, had his mom pick him up from school today at 1:00..he returned to the pedestrian bridge by his school at three..saw/confronted some classmates, pulled a gun and blew his brains out.
Now..write novels about how this isn't because of religious bigots..go ahead. U justify this shit every time u make exceptions.
I simply.asked for specifics. It's heartbreaking that a child took his life, but you assume to know what was going on in his mind. You blame religion. Maybe that is why, but you don't know that.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19140 Nov 29, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
Incorrect.
The LDS Church's official canon consists of the King James Version of the Holy Bible, the Book of Mormon, and the Doctrine and Covenants.
There is nothing in LDS doctrine that denies the grace of Jesus Christ.
That is simply not true. by Biblical definition, if you are trying to earn your salvation, you are by definition, not saved by works. I've broken this topic down clearly, many times. You can see it explained again at: http://www.bibtruth.com/grace.html
As members of the church, we also benefit from continuing revelation through Profits of the Lord.
I guessing your use of "Profits" was a brain fart. But it was the so called words of the Prophets that have made Mormons outcast among society since the beginning. It's what cause the persecutions. It's why you had to move to the middle of nowhere to ever get some peace.
It was a Baptist friend of mine from high school who stated that she believed the King James translators were divinely inspired, as taught by her church. Thus, it would appear that many evangelicals would disagree with you on the source of the King James Version of the Holy Bible.
Good for her. Her opinion, is her opinion. It's isn't fact. It was a good translation for the people of it's day, that's all. There are far more accurate translations in a language that is easier to understand today. Here is a good article on the subject: http://www.tentmaker.org/Biblematters/King-Ja...

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#19141 Nov 29, 2012
not ashamed wrote:
<quoted text>I simply.asked for specifics. It's heartbreaking that a child took his life, but you assume to know what was going on in his mind. You blame religion. Maybe that is why, but you don't know that.
Deflect....wow, which one is next again?
It's really sad that u sheep immediately get defensive at the mention of suicide. Why?..because ur cults bs is to blame. Attack me, attack the kid, this poor child died a brutal death because of ignorant, religious based bigotry. Wake the hell up.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19142 Nov 30, 2012
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Deflect....wow, which one is next again?
It's really sad that u sheep immediately get defensive at the mention of suicide. Why?..because ur cults bs is to blame. Attack me, attack the kid, this poor child died a brutal death because of ignorant, religious based bigotry. Wake the hell up.
No, YOU intolerant, bigoted, anti-religious zealots accuse everyone but yourselves for the the failures in YOUR own community. You said the kid lived in your community..where were you when he blew his brains out? Why were you posting your inane anti-religious drivel on some inconsequential internet message base rather than manning the suicide prevention hotline, or working with suicidal teens?

Why? Because you are the typical hypocritical jackass who would rather point fingers than actually take steps to do something right there where you live.

Any suicide is tragic, and teen suicide is particularly so, however, rather than wildly casting about blame after the kid is dead, maybe it would do you well to educate yourself on the subject, so that perhaps you could someday actually make a difference, rather than watch the kids around you die:

http://www.teendepression.org/related/teen-su...

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19143 Nov 30, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
That is simply not true. by Biblical definition, if you are trying to earn your salvation, you are by definition, not saved by works. I've broken this topic down clearly, many times. You can see it explained again at: http://www.bibtruth.com/grace.html
<quoted text>
I guessing your use of "Profits" was a brain fart. But it was the so called words of the Prophets that have made Mormons outcast among society since the beginning. It's what cause the persecutions. It's why you had to move to the middle of nowhere to ever get some peace.
<quoted text>
Good for her. Her opinion, is her opinion. It's isn't fact. It was a good translation for the people of it's day, that's all. There are far more accurate translations in a language that is easier to understand today. Here is a good article on the subject: http://www.tentmaker.org/Biblematters/King-Ja...
Yup. I knew the word "profits" didn't look right when I typed it, but I was in a hurry and had to get cooking supper. I'd actually began that post hours before, and had been outside doing some maintenance on the stables, feeding the livestock, getting my old rototiller running, etc. before I got back to it. My error.

As for reading what you've "broken down clearly, many times", you assume that I'm interested in the opinions of an apostate with no ecclesiastic authority. Other than perhaps as occasional amusement, I am not. I know my church is true, and am fully satisfied by that fact.

As for being "outcasts"? I've been LDS for 30 years now, and never have I felt outcast. Seems all my LDS friends are quite happy and well adjusted also. So it would appear the "outcast" thing is merely another phony label placed upon us by anti-LDS zealots who wish to push their agenda among each other, and among non-Mormons who have no understanding of the church.

On the contrary, being a member of the Lord's church is actually quite a feeling of "belonging" that a lot of folks miss out on.

My baptist friend carried a Holy Bible with her among her textbooks back in high school..and many unflattering comments were made about that among the secular crowd, not to mention her being the butt of outright jokes. Her response? As I remember it, she was "in the world", not "of the world"..and it is better to be an outcast from modern "humanity", than to be an outcast from the presence of the Lord.

I would have to agree. You speak of being an "outcast" as if it's a bad thing. Personally, I find so much detestable in modern society that for one to be outcast from that, one is far better off.

And as for whether or not the King James Version of the Holy Bible is inspired..well, you'll have a lot of argument against you on that one too..and it will come from folks more closely aligned with your opinion on the subject of the LDS Church..LOL!

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/KJB/insp...

http://www.scionofzion.com/kjvinsp.htm

http://www.1611kingjamesbible.com/

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19144 Nov 30, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
Yup. I knew the word "profits" didn't look right when I typed it, but I was in a hurry and had to get cooking supper. I'd actually began that post hours before, and had been outside doing some maintenance on the stables, feeding the livestock, getting my old rototiller running, etc. before I got back to it. My error.
As for reading what you've "broken down clearly, many times", you assume that I'm interested in the opinions of an apostate with no ecclesiastic authority. Other than perhaps as occasional amusement, I am not. I know my church is true, and am fully satisfied by that fact.
God's word has plenty of "ecclesiastic authority". I do assume you care, in some part at least, about your own salvation. That you care what Jesus taught, what his apostles had to say. You will have to answer for the decisions you make. By what you have told us about your life, Mormonism gives you nothing but a place to go sit on Sundays. It can't be giving any comfort about your salvation because you don't or can't keep even the most basic standards. You may love the church. But how does the church love you? It doesn't, I don't care what you claim.
As for being "outcasts"? I've been LDS for 30 years now, and never have I felt outcast. Seems all my LDS friends are quite happy and well adjusted also. So it would appear the "outcast" thing is merely another phony label placed upon us by anti-LDS zealots who wish to push their agenda among each other, and among non-Mormons who have no understanding of the church.
You can say that, but I just saw a lot of Mormons trying real hard to prove they're normal this year, hoping to get Romney elected. I know first hand what freaks people think Mormons are having been one. Being the only Mormon in my school growing up, heck just about being the only teen even in seminary. Maybe you're lucky, but I have a hard time believing it.
On the contrary, being a member of the Lord's church is actually quite a feeling of "belonging" that a lot of folks miss out on.
Really? Even though you have total disregard for the Word of Wisdom? Or are the other members just being polite to you? Answer that one to yourself.

Why do you believe in the church? That would be really interesting to know.
My baptist friend carried a Holy Bible with her among her textbooks back in high school..and many unflattering comments were made about that among the secular crowd, not to mention her being the butt of outright jokes. Her response? As I remember it, she was "in the world", not "of the world"..and it is better to be an outcast from modern "humanity", than to be an outcast from the presence of the Lord.
I would have to agree. You speak of being an "outcast" as if it's a bad thing. Personally, I find so much detestable in modern society that for one to be outcast from that, one is far better off.
And as for whether or not the King James Version of the Holy Bible is inspired..well, you'll have a lot of argument against you on that one too..and it will come from folks more closely aligned with your opinion on the subject of the LDS Church..LOL!
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/KJB/insp...
http://www.scionofzion.com/kjvinsp.htm
http://www.1611kingjamesbible.com/
Let them argue, it's only a translation. People can get silly about some of the stupidest things.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19145 Nov 30, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
God's word has plenty of "ecclesiastic authority". I do assume you care, in some part at least, about your own salvation. That you care what Jesus taught, what his apostles had to say. You will have to answer for the decisions you make. By what you have told us about your life, Mormonism gives you nothing but a place to go sit on Sundays. It can't be giving any comfort about your salvation because you don't or can't keep even the most basic standards. You may love the church. But how does the church love you? It doesn't, I don't care what you claim.
<quoted text>
You can say that, but I just saw a lot of Mormons trying real hard to prove they're normal this year, hoping to get Romney elected. I know first hand what freaks people think Mormons are having been one. Being the only Mormon in my school growing up, heck just about being the only teen even in seminary. Maybe you're lucky, but I have a hard time believing it.
<quoted text>
Really? Even though you have total disregard for the Word of Wisdom? Or are the other members just being polite to you? Answer that one to yourself.
Why do you believe in the church? That would be really interesting to know.
<quoted text>
Let them argue, it's only a translation. People can get silly about some of the stupidest things.
If I didn't care about my salvation, I wouldn't be a member of the Lord's church. Whether an earthly organization called a "church" loves it's members or not is not the issue. The issue is whether one loves the Lord, and whether the Lord loves humanity. In my case, yes on both counts. How do you know the Salvation Army loves you?

I'm sorry that during your high school years you felt so out of place, and were more concerned with how you appeared outwardly to others than with your own salvation, but to each their own. But you made it through and only left the church years later. Perhaps one day you will have a change of heart and return to the fold. You can rest assured that just because you've turned your back on the Lord, the Lord has not turned his back on you.

Why do I believe in the Lord's Church? Why, because I know it to be true, of course. I would have thought your would have understood that already, based upon the fact that I've repeatedly stated it right here in this forum.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19146 Nov 30, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
If I didn't care about my salvation, I wouldn't be a member of the Lord's church. Whether an earthly organization called a "church" loves it's members or not is not the issue. The issue is whether one loves the Lord, and whether the Lord loves humanity. In my case, yes on both counts. How do you know the Salvation Army loves you?
It' doesn't matter if the Salvation Army loves me. Like the Mormon church, the Army doesn't save anyone. That is where Mormonism has screwed you up. It has fooled you into thinking that your salvation is tied in to belonging to the right church. Churches are man made creations. At best they can lead you into the right direction. At worst, they lead you away. But your salvation is with your relationship with Jesus Christ, not a membership in a church. Men, whether they are calling themselves prophets or not, can not give you salvation, and they can't take it away. Only God can do that. church can't change that one way or another. Mormonism teaches that it can. That is one of it's great lies.
I'm sorry that during your high school years you felt so out of place, and were more concerned with how you appeared outwardly to others than with your own salvation, but to each their own. But you made it through and only left the church years later. Perhaps one day you will have a change of heart and return to the fold. You can rest assured that just because you've turned your back on the Lord, the Lord has not turned his back on you.
I left the LDS church to turn to the Lord. To do it the way he said to do it, and reject a religion that is made from the "flesh of the arm." I have something now I never had as a member of the LDS church, an assurance of my salvation. I not longer have a doubt about my salvation. I no longer have to worry about losing it. It's absolutely wonderful. It is something no member of the Mormon church has, I don't care how long they have had their temple recommend or not. You talk about me turning my back on the Lord, what about you? If you are not living the principles of the LDS church, that constitutes you turning your back on him also. Any member will tell you that. "All those saying Lord, Lord," you know what that means.
Why do I believe in the Lord's Church? Why, because I know it to be true, of course. I would have thought your would have understood that already, based upon the fact that I've repeatedly stated it right here in this forum.
What you are saying, and what you are doing, are two different things. You may stay Mormon because that is what someone has convinced you is true, but that isn't saying why you believe the Mormon church is true.
dr fill

Mount Prospect, IL

#19147 Nov 30, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
It' doesn't matter if the Salvation Army loves me. Like the Mormon church, the Army doesn't save anyone. That is where Mormonism has screwed you up. It has fooled you into thinking that your salvation is tied in to belonging to the right church. Churches are man made creations. At best they can lead you into the right direction. At worst, they lead you away. But your salvation is with your relationship with Jesus Christ, not a membership in a church. Men, whether they are calling themselves prophets or not, can not give you salvation, and they can't take it away. Only God can do that. church can't change that one way or another. Mormonism teaches that it can. That is one of it's great lies.
<quoted text>
I left the LDS church to turn to the Lord. To do it the way he said to do it, and reject a religion that is made from the "flesh of the arm." I have something now I never had as a member of the LDS church, an assurance of my salvation. I not longer have a doubt about my salvation. I no longer have to worry about losing it. It's absolutely wonderful. It is something no member of the Mormon church has, I don't care how long they have had their temple recommend or not. You talk about me turning my back on the Lord, what about you? If you are not living the principles of the LDS church, that constitutes you turning your back on him also. Any member will tell you that. "All those saying Lord, Lord," you know what that means.
<quoted text>
What you are saying, and what you are doing, are two different things. You may stay Mormon because that is what someone has convinced you is true, but that isn't saying why you believe the Mormon church is true.
Is your daddy that nut case pat robertson?

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19148 Nov 30, 2012
dr fill wrote:
<quoted text> Is your daddy that nut case pat robertson?
Nope, no relation. Sorry.

“I will not keep calm”

Since: Mar 08

Raise hell...change the world

#19149 Nov 30, 2012
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Deflect....wow, which one is next again?
It's really sad that u sheep immediately get defensive at the mention of suicide. Why?..because ur cults bs is to blame. Attack me, attack the kid, this poor child died a brutal death because of ignorant, religious based bigotry. Wake the hell up.
It has nothing to do with deflecting. It has to do with the fact that mere hours after this tragedy you are on a forum playing the blame game. You don't know why this kid commited suicide or if he was even gay. Because kids called him that, it means he was? Only religious people bully others? If you really care about this child get all tge facts, then state your case. Don't use his suicide to further your agenda.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19150 Nov 30, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
It' doesn't matter if the Salvation Army loves me. Like the Mormon church, the Army doesn't save anyone. That is where Mormonism has screwed you up. It has fooled you into thinking that your salvation is tied in to belonging to the right church. Churches are man made creations. At best they can lead you into the right direction. At worst, they lead you away. But your salvation is with your relationship with Jesus Christ, not a membership in a church. Men, whether they are calling themselves prophets or not, can not give you salvation, and they can't take it away. Only God can do that. church can't change that one way or another. Mormonism teaches that it can. That is one of it's great lies.
<quoted text>
I left the LDS church to turn to the Lord. To do it the way he said to do it, and reject a religion that is made from the "flesh of the arm." I have something now I never had as a member of the LDS church, an assurance of my salvation. I not longer have a doubt about my salvation. I no longer have to worry about losing it. It's absolutely wonderful. It is something no member of the Mormon church has, I don't care how long they have had their temple recommend or not. You talk about me turning my back on the Lord, what about you? If you are not living the principles of the LDS church, that constitutes you turning your back on him also. Any member will tell you that. "All those saying Lord, Lord," you know what that means.
<quoted text>
What you are saying, and what you are doing, are two different things. You may stay Mormon because that is what someone has convinced you is true, but that isn't saying why you believe the Mormon church is true.
No, the LDS Church is the Lord's true church here on earth. As such, it does not "screw anybody up". Quite the opposite in fact. The Gospel of Jesus Christ saves people. The Church of Jesus Christs of latter-day Saints is ordained of God. I know that for fact. I've stated that repeatedly, but you choose to ignore my words. Your choice to do so has absolutely no bearing on me.

Having a personal testimony is a wonderful thing. My personal testimony is why I believe the church is true. I'm sure you once had one as well, maybe you still do, you've merely chosen to ignore it.

You left the LDS Church because you have been deceived, and chose to follow the path of darkness. I pray someday you will return to the fold. It is never too late. As members, we have been told that only in rare instances does the average member have enough knowledge to commit unpardonable sin.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19151 Nov 30, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
No, the LDS Church is the Lord's true church here on earth.
There's no debate you believe that. But that isn't how a person knows they have truth. Everybody in every group, believes their group is "truth." Nazi's believed it. Communists, believed it. Muslim believe it. We don't join groups we don't believe in.
As such, it does not "screw anybody up". Quite the opposite in fact. The Gospel of Jesus Christ saves people.
Well, that is just a myth, one you wish was true. I can show you a web site where thousands of Ex-Mormons have gathered because the LDS church has screwed up their lives in one form or another. As for saving people, how can you claim that when it hasn't saved you? What you do tells far more about the subject, than what you say. My whole family is screwed up because of the teachings of Mormonism. I know that for a fact. I can name only one person out of a thirty or more it has actually worked for. One. That is not a record of success. That is a record of failure. Show me someone you think Mormonism has saved, besides the leaders. I admit they are making a good living off the members gullibility.
The Church of Jesus Christs of latter-day Saints is ordained of God. I know that for fact. I've stated that repeatedly, but you choose to ignore my words. Your choice to do so has absolutely no bearing on me.
I ignorant them because my life is a testimony that it isn't. The truth is that your life is also a testimony it isn't. Your actions are speaking louder than your words. I live my faith today. Live it without any effort on my part. I know I have that blessed assurance no Mormon has, nor ever will. That is success, that is a testimony that it works.
Having a personal testimony is a wonderful thing. My personal testimony is why I believe the church is true. I'm sure you once had one as well, maybe you still do, you've merely chosen to ignore it.
I agree. I also have a personal testimony now. A personal testimony back up by scripture, the Holy Bible. That is something no Mormon has. You claim the KJV of the Bible divine, yet deny it's teachings. You deny the saving grace of Jesus Christ and put your hopes in temple ceremonies and teachings of which you don't even practice. And in some cases can't because of your church's standards, you are not worthy. That is by your own admission.
You left the LDS Church because you have been deceived, and chose to follow the path of darkness. I pray someday you will return to the fold. It is never too late. As members, we have been told that only in rare instances does the average member have enough knowledge to commit unpardonable sin.
If I'm deceived, then God is the deceiver, because I'm doing it exactly the way he teaches to do so in the Bible. You have already committed sin worthy of damnation. Denying the Grace of Jesus Christ and putting your faith in the arm of the flesh. There is a reason Jesus warned us of false prophets and false Christ. He knew churches like the LDS church would be coming. Joseph Smith is just one of many false prophets that have appeared through the ages. He wasn't the first, and he won't be the last.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19152 Nov 30, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
There's no debate you believe that. But that isn't how a person knows they have truth. Everybody in every group, believes their group is "truth." Nazi's believed it. Communists, believed it. Muslim believe it. We don't join groups we don't believe in.
<quoted text>
Well, that is just a myth, one you wish was true. I can show you a web site where thousands of Ex-Mormons have gathered because the LDS church has screwed up their lives in one form or another. As for saving people, how can you claim that when it hasn't saved you? What you do tells far more about the subject, than what you say. My whole family is screwed up because of the teachings of Mormonism. I know that for a fact. I can name only one person out of a thirty or more it has actually worked for. One. That is not a record of success. That is a record of failure. Show me someone you think Mormonism has saved, besides the leaders. I admit they are making a good living off the members gullibility.
<quoted text>
I ignorant them because my life is a testimony that it isn't. The truth is that your life is also a testimony it isn't. Your actions are speaking louder than your words. I live my faith today. Live it without any effort on my part. I know I have that blessed assurance no Mormon has, nor ever will. That is success, that is a testimony that it works.
<quoted text>
I agree. I also have a personal testimony now. A personal testimony back up by scripture, the Holy Bible. That is something no Mormon has. You claim the KJV of the Bible divine, yet deny it's teachings. You deny the saving grace of Jesus Christ and put your hopes in temple ceremonies and teachings of which you don't even practice. And in some cases can't because of your church's standards, you are not worthy. That is by your own admission.
<quoted text>
If I'm deceived, then God is the deceiver, because I'm doing it exactly the way he teaches to do so in the Bible. You have already committed sin worthy of damnation. Denying the Grace of Jesus Christ and putting your faith in the arm of the flesh. There is a reason Jesus warned us of false prophets and false Christ. He knew churches like the LDS church would be coming. Joseph Smith is just one of many false prophets that have appeared through the ages. He wasn't the first, and he won't be the last.
Your comparison of the LDS church with Nazism and Communism is telling of your negative attitude towards the Lord's church. It really is a shame that you've allowed yourself to be deceived in such a way.

I have no interest in what "ex-Mormons" have to say. They are the folks who have been deceived by the world, just as you have. I'm sure most of them are fully capable of fully returning to the fold, but the choice is up to them.

The truth about my testimony is that it's direct inspiration from the Lord that the church is true. One cannot get better than that. Your supposed "testimony", which denies truth, is merely a falsehood created entirely within your own mind.

As I stated earlier, there is nothing in Lord's church that denies the grace of God. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is true, I know that in my heart, and it fully encompasses the grace of God.

The church of the Lord does not change for humanity. Humanity is required to change for the Lord. Unfortunately, sad as it is, no everyone will make the cut. But everyone does have the opportunity.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19154 Dec 1, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
Your comparison of the LDS church with Nazism and Communism is telling of your negative attitude towards the Lord's church. It really is a shame that you've allowed yourself to be deceived in such a way.
I used Nazism, Communism, and Islam as points of references that we can both agree on is not true. You want to view me as the one deceived, yet I only show that you are like the Muslim, Nazi, or Communist, who as certain their views are as correct as you think yours is of the LDS church.
I have no interest in what "ex-Mormons" have to say. They are the folks who have been deceived by the world, just as you have. I'm sure most of them are fully capable of fully returning to the fold, but the choice is up to them.
If that were true, you wouldn't be here. So you do have some interest in what we have to say.
The truth about my testimony is that it's direct inspiration from the Lord that the church is true. One cannot get better than that. Your supposed "testimony", which denies truth, is merely a falsehood created entirely within your own mind.
You only deceive yourself if you don't think my testimony of the falsehood of Mormonism isn't as strong as yours is for it's truth. My testimony isn't based on some feeling alone either. It is backed up by holy scripture, and an honest look at the fruit the Mormon church has bore from it's beginning. It is based on what the Bible told us to base things on, that is "Spirit and Truth."
As I stated earlier, there is nothing in Lord's church that denies the grace of God. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is true, I know that in my heart, and it fully encompasses the grace of God.
Sure there is. There are many things about the teachings of the Mormon church that denies the grace of Jesus Christ. The temple endowment ceremony being one of the biggest. At least the temple work for the dead aspect of it. When members do temple work for the dead they are openly denying the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross for all mankind. Scripture clearly taught he paid the price for "all sin" on the cross. By members trying to do the temple work on behalf of others they are saying the cross is a lie, and that Jesus didn't finish the work. That is pure blasphemy to any true Christian, or anybody claiming to love our Lord Jesus Christ.
The church of the Lord does not change for humanity. Humanity is required to change for the Lord. Unfortunately, sad as it is, no everyone will make the cut. But everyone does have the opportunity.
You should study LDS history more. Whenever the LDS church has had it's back against the wall, it has always, and I do mean always, acquiesced.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#19155 Dec 1, 2012
Dana Robertson wrote:
<quoted text>
I used Nazism, Communism, and Islam as points of references that we can both agree on is not true. You want to view me as the one deceived, yet I only show that you are like the Muslim, Nazi, or Communist, who as certain their views are as correct as you think yours is of the LDS church.
If that were true, you wouldn't be here. So you do have some interest in what we have to say.
You only deceive yourself if you don't think my testimony of the falsehood of Mormonism isn't as strong as yours is for it's truth. My testimony isn't based on some feeling alone either. It is backed up by holy scripture, and an honest look at the fruit the Mormon church has bore from it's beginning. It is based on what the Bible told us to base things on, that is "Spirit and Truth."
Sure there is. There are many things about the teachings of the Mormon church that denies the grace of Jesus Christ. The temple endowment ceremony being one of the biggest. At least the temple work for the dead aspect of it. When members do temple work for the dead they are openly denying the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross for all mankind. Scripture clearly taught he paid the price for "all sin" on the cross. By members trying to do the temple work on behalf of others they are saying the cross is a lie, and that Jesus didn't finish the work. That is pure blasphemy to any true Christian, or anybody claiming to love our Lord Jesus Christ.
You should study LDS history more. Whenever the LDS church has had it's back against the wall, it has always, and I do mean always, acquiesced.
My interest in what you is said here is entirely in the realm of entertainment value. I don't play video games anymore, so while I'm checking Ebay, Craigslist, the news, etc. I jump into discussion here as well.

I love debate. Just as I love to discuss politics, when I saw this topic, I had to join in the fun. Frankly, I'm rather surprised after 150 plus years some still hold such rancor towards an established religion. I guess from NoMo's and Haw Haw's militant gay standpoint, I can understand, because there are those who foam at the mouth at the mention of Catholicism, The Salvation Army, or any number of other "protestant" religions, as well. It's a shame some go through life with such anger and bitterness, but so be it. It's the militant supporters of the homosexual agenda who keep setting so-called "gay rights" back by decades with their vitriol. A nation divided against itself cannot stand. And while folks like NoMo and Haw Haw like to angrily stick their belief system in other's faces, they only firm up their opposition, who feel forced into reacting to them. They may win battles in the secular world, but they continue to lose the war because folks become hardened against them.

And I find the dynamic of those who "Leave the LDS Church, but cannot leave it alone", interesting as well. I guess it's humanity's lot to have an "axe to grind" against something. Some folks need a cause.

I found that person who joined in here merely to slam Mitt Romney interesting as well. Can't remember the name he use, but seems he/she's disappeared now. However, thanks to him, or her, studying the wild and nutty accusations, I did some research, and become a stronger supporter of Mitt Romney than ever. Romney is likely the most honorable man to run for President in quite a while. The savaging he took at the hands of the left will never be forgiven by me, and my belief that the modern left is the most dangerous and destructive force America has ever faced is more rock-solid than ever.

However, all this discussion here on Topix is really no more than the proverbial "fart in a whirlwind". The entertainment value is there, but life went on before Topix existed, and life will continue if Topix someday goes by the wayside.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#19156 Dec 1, 2012
Cary L Nickel wrote:
<quoted text>
My interest in what you is said here is entirely in the realm of entertainment value. I don't play video games anymore, so while I'm checking Ebay, Craigslist, the news, etc. I jump into discussion here as well.
I love debate. Just as I love to discuss politics, when I saw this topic, I had to join in the fun. Frankly, I'm rather surprised after 150 plus years some still hold such rancor towards an established religion.
You wouldn't be surprised if you actually listen to the reasons why. You don't want to hear it. You say you love debate, but fear the discussion of the issues. Quoting platitudes isn't debating. You can't express why you think the LDS church is true besides saying you feel like it is. That isn't debating. It also isn't fact. Add to it the way you live your life is a testimony that the church isn't true creates a credibility problem for you. You are a only a armchair cheerleader for a church that in fact isn't making a bit difference in your life.
I guess from NoMo's and Haw Haw's militant gay standpoint, I can understand, because there are those who foam at the mouth at the mention of Catholicism, The Salvation Army, or any number of other "protestant" religions, as well. It's a shame some go through life with such anger and bitterness, but so be it. It's the militant supporters of the homosexual agenda who keep setting so-called "gay rights" back by decades with their vitriol. A nation divided against itself cannot stand. And while folks like NoMo and Haw Haw like to angrily stick their belief system in other's faces, they only firm up their opposition, who feel forced into reacting to them. They may win battles in the secular world, but they continue to lose the war because folks become hardened against them.
Or, like the civil rights movement of the 50's and 60's, it will force the bigots to go into hiding more and more just like the racists do today. There are still many racist people in the U.S., but for the most part they have to bite their tongues and hide their true feelings because the majority of people won't tolerant it anymore. If you are openly racist today, you will never have a good paying job or friends of any real value. Kids are more and more growing up accepting homosexuals. In the last election for the first time, the people voted in by the majority the right for gays to be able to get married. The tides are turning against you and your views. And while you may never change your views, like the dinosaurs, your kind will become extincted, or at best, in the minority. The change is in the wind, and even your church will change to go with it, like it has on every social issue that has come up. There were members who thought that black people would have never held the priesthood in the LDS church also, my dad certainly was one of them.

To be continued...

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