Should Billy Graham's legacy be rescued?

[Givemeliberty]

I figured you would try to worm out of responsibility for your church's crimes. Oh yes it's always other people and not your church eh?

Your statement clearly shows you did not bother to read the links on the page and just assume it's all about Baptist hating.

barry wrote:

<quoted text>i did look again. i must say that either someone hates the southern baptists or there is a lot of evil people in the southern baptist church. i went down the list and it was a good thirty churches before i found one that was unidentified as having an affiliation and perhaps is an independent baptist church. about ten more listings and i found another one that definitely was an independent baptist church and they happened to self report and turned the violator in.
you look long and hard before you find any one let alone a pattern of this type of sin in the independent baptist churches. we clean our own house.

[emperorjohn]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
So?
"Christian", "Catholic"--
-- they are all the same evil hate-cult as seen from the outside.
And christianity >>sprang<< from catholicism, you ignorant baboon.
So it is BEYOND stupid to even claim what you said-- they were ALREADY catholic, in the eyes of catholicism, silly!
There is no >>functional<< difference: they all worship the same false beliefs.

I Have not laughed like this in a while.

[emperorjohn]

barry wrote:

<quoted text>no, they didn't ignore those "parts of the bible which condoned slavery". they recognized that what was happening here in our great country had no resemblance to what was condoned in the Bible.
in the end God sorted it out when we as a nation could not accept and do what was right. it was very costly to us.

Explain to me and Bob how slavery in Biblical times was different than 19th century slave, save the element of race.

[emperorjohn]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
We will never know how many non-christians supported or were against slavery, will we?
Because in the 1850's, if you were an unbeliever, you'd be hung from he nearest tree as often as not.
Even in the cities, a non-believer had to walk very carefully-- or be murdered out of hand by some True Believer™ or other.
In any case?
There were an equal number of Genuine Christians™ using YOUR bible to justify slavery as there were trying to undermine slavery up in the north.
In fact?
There were more-- as there were strong sympathizers in the north who were pro slave.
Check the historical records of the number of times escaped slaves, who did NOT make it to Canada, were sent back by pro-slave northerners to their incarceration in the south.
All of them would've been Genuine Christians™ of course--what else? Those people were everywhere-- and actively murdered anyone who wasn't.
So, in retrospect, there were far MORE of you Genuine Christians™ supporting slavery, than there were against it.
Far, far more.
In fact, even Lincoln himself was mildly sympathetic to the idea, and considered compromise allowing the south to keep their slaves, if they would only not succeed.
His efforts weren't enough, though-- and since he won by war? He got to dictate the terms of the south's surrender.
And abolished slavery-- but it took until the late 1950's before the last of the pro-slave laws were stricken.
So strong is the love for slavery among you Genuine Christians™.
All justified in your Genuine Bible™ naturally.

Mississippi just banned slavery this year

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

barry wrote:

<quoted text>really, i suppose you have a link for that.

All of Xianist history is available to you--- yet you cling to the tiny few who comfort you with lies.

Why?

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

barry wrote:

<quoted text>you know all i was doing was using a site that could explain what i was saying. would i use a catholic site?
i did notice that you didn't point out any errors.

I did not bother to read your Lying For Jewsus "quotes".

No need, really-- we know they lie, and we know they lie in the way that makes YOU comfortable.

Lying is what you do, after all.

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

emperorjohn wrote:

<quoted text>
Mississippi just banned slavery this year

Uggg.

I'll have to revise my already pessimistic outlook yet again...

[emperorjohn]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
Uggg.
I'll have to revise my already pessimistic outlook yet again...

Here is the article
http://io9.com/5985959/mississippi-officially...
Isn't it marvelous that one of the most religious states in the US just ratified a ban on slavery just this year?

[Reason Personified]

emperorjohn wrote:

<quoted text>
Here is the article
http://io9.com/5985959/mississippi-officially...
Isn't it marvelous that one of the most religious states in the US just ratified a ban on slavery just this year?

It sounds as if they really do, believe in the bible. I do hope that all the other states have beat them to it. I'd hate that there may be more, who haven't got around to it yet. Though, I'm sure it was a case of "just in case".

[jiggis]

youtube.com/watch... ……… Wheres the Beef?

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

emperorjohn wrote:

<quoted text>
Here is the article
http://io9.com/5985959/mississippi-officially...
Isn't it marvelous that one of the most religious states in the US just ratified a ban on slavery just this year?

How on earth did this one slip by?

It just goes to show, that up until pretty recently, the only people allowed to be in government were...

... rich, old, WHITE guys.

I cannot imagine that a person of color who was aware of that oversight, permitting it to stay on the books.

At the very least, it'd have made a pretty good "hook" to get elected.

The Old, Rich, White guy club: Republicans, of course.

Who wear their religion like a thin jacket-- put on over what they were going to do regardless, to pacify the STUPID people into voting for their sorry *sses back into positions of power & privilege.

Disgusting.

[Amused]

His "legacy" should be based on the truth and the historical record. All of it. Including the anti-Semetic remarks he shared with Nixon, who certainly was no slouch in the anti-Semetism department himself. Including the remarks about mormonism being a cult. Including his campaigning against gay marriage. Omitting these things from his "legacy" in the name of "rescuing" that legacy is simply a form of lying. It is just distortion of the whole picture in order to perpetuate a perception which is false.

We can disagree about where these negative bits fit in, or how much weight to give them in assessing the man and his career. But, the discussion of his "legacy" should be an honest discussion of his real legacy, not a whitewashed, fabricated version.

[Amused]

barry wrote:

<quoted text>and many Christians chose to die rather than convert to catholicism.

Perhaps you should look up "Martin Luther". Before Martin Luther, all christians were either catholic or eastern orthodox. Protestantism did not exist before 1517, when Luther wrote his 95 theses. Even after the splitting off, most of protestant belief is the same as catholic belief.

You are no doubt a great follower of Martin Luther. You seem to share his disdain for reason when it is in opposition to faith:

Reason is the enemy of faith.- Martin Luther

Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God - Martin Luther

Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.- Martin Luther

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

Amused wrote:

<quoted text>
Perhaps you should look up "Martin Luther". Before Martin Luther, all christians were either catholic or eastern orthodox. Protestantism did not exist before 1517, when Luther wrote his 95 theses. Even after the splitting off, most of protestant belief is the same as catholic belief.
You are no doubt a great follower of Martin Luther. You seem to share his disdain for reason when it is in opposition to faith:
Reason is the enemy of faith.- Martin Luther
Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has; it never comes to the aid of spiritual things, but - more frequently than not - struggles against the divine Word, treating with contempt all that emanates from God - Martin Luther
Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has.- Martin Luther

Yeah. That Luther-- he was also quite the racist.

[Lincoln]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
Yeah. That Luther-- he was also quite the racist.

don't be modest about your own abilities in this area

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

Lincoln wrote:

<quoted text>
don't be modest about your own abilities in this area

I'm not a racist-- I don't believe in white OR black gods, you silly hatetheist.

It's you BuyBull worshipers who try to justify your love of slavery using your evil BuyBull.

Silly.

[emperorjohn]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
Yeah. That Luther-- he was also quite the racist.

Don't forget that he sold out the German peasants during the Peasants Rebellion of 1525. He pushed the princes to exterminate the peasant rebels who wanted things like a decent lifestyle and for the lord not to force himself on their wives.

[Charlie MD]

emperorjohn wrote:

<quoted text>
Don't forget that he sold out the German peasants during the Peasants Rebellion of 1525. He pushed the princes to exterminate the peasant rebels who wanted things like a decent lifestyle and for the lord not to force himself on their wives.

;) emperorJohn or papajohn?!! U delivery pizza in Rome, Eataly?!!;-00

[Lincoln]

Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:

<quoted text>
I'm not a racist-- I don't believe in white OR black gods, you silly hatetheist.
It's you BuyBull worshipers who try to justify your love of slavery using your evil BuyBull.
Silly.

This actually makes no sense what so ever :-)

A "BuyBull worshipers" is an interesting term
for which I have no knowledge.

[Bob of Quantum-Faith]

Lincoln wrote:

<quoted text>
A "BuyBull worshipers" is an interesting term
for which I have no knowledge.

Yes it is-- look in the mirror-- you worship the evil bible, or a more descriptive name, the "buybull" as in you have to buy into the bullsh7t to believe it.

Which you obviously do.

Since you DO worship the evil bible/buybull?

That makes you just another common terrorist.

A hate-monger if you will-- you, spreading your lies and your hate everywhere you go.

Do you understand it now?

Or do I need to dumb it down even more?