In America, atheists are still in the...

In America, atheists are still in the closet

There are 47812 comments on the Spiked story from Apr 11, 2012, titled In America, atheists are still in the closet. In it, Spiked reports that:

So do many other interest and identity groups. Complaint is our political lingua franca: it's what Occupiers, Tea Partiers, Wall Street titans, religious and irreligious people share.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Spiked.

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#12994 Jun 1, 2012
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
What WOULD you say to someone who said god spoke to them?
I'd ask who their god is.
AllAboardll

Jasper, TN

#12995 Jun 1, 2012
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>I do not deride your take on religion in your culture. I deride your take on religion in the world, without having seen the world.
True Truth speak nothing except..
True Truth...Much love & thanks to our savior Jesus Christ..& to the true truth & to the speaking in all our hearts in one accord, as You said we would know & to this divine plan that You have laid out for us all that choose to SEE, love, follow & watch. Much Love to you True Truth & to all. We are ready to walk with Christ forever & He is ready for us. God Bless
and the Truth

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#12996 Jun 1, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text>
1. Do you use the Bible as the source of your religious beliefs?
2. How is Christianity different where you live? Do they not believe in the Hebrew God/Jesus?
3. Have you proven that the God of your holy book exists?
When you answer these three questions honestly, we may have something left with which we can have a conversation.
1. Nope. I'm a muslim.
2. Most Christians in South Africa don't seek to put their Bible into politics. They believe in Jesus.
3. Nope. I have belief, and personal evidence that is good enough for me.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#12997 Jun 1, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text> Don't cry, but she turned us down.
Just as well. Hehehe.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

#12998 Jun 1, 2012
water_nymph wrote:
<quoted text>Off on another OCD trek. Does anyone have some chocolate?
Bowl of M&Ms...

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#12999 Jun 1, 2012
barefoot2626 wrote:
<quoted text>

Did you come up with the name of the USA state religion, btw?
It would seem to be stupidity.

The US has made a religion of it.

You appear to be its pope.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#13000 Jun 1, 2012
barefoot2626 wrote:
<quoted text>Let me know when you find it.

Unlike the UK, the USA is a secular country.

The church of the USA doesn't appoint members to Congress or require collective worship.

As happens in the UK.
And yet, the US is more religious than the UK.

Imagine that.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#13001 Jun 1, 2012
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>I'd ask who their god is.
So as long as their god is the same one that speaks to you, they're sane?

But if their god, who speaks to them, is not the same as yours, they're not sane?

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#13002 Jun 1, 2012
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>70-80% regulated capitalism? 20-30% socialism? What does that mean exactly? What is included in these figures? How do you even attempt to quantify policy? And 25% of what income? Earned income, sole proprietorship income? Corporate income? Capital gains income?

Secular humanism is just as open to interpretation as any religion. While you and perhaps other humanists you know may look at Guantanamo as horrific, others may very easily argue that Guantanamo is torturing a few humans to keep millions of humans safe, and is hence a humanistic decision.

My point is, who will decide?
Somebody who doesn't have imaginary friends.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#13003 Jun 1, 2012
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh please, you ramble on about Christianity, period. You don't talk exclusively about Christians in America. You go and on and on about the evil of Christianity, not the evil of American Christians.
There are a multitude of American televangelists that you can discuss and criticise. You can talk about that stupid creationist museum in Kentucky and how it is misleading the public. Talk about abortion and stem cell generation and their hinderance of it. Name the churches and the church groups you have encountered. You don't do that. You just ramble on about "Christianity", and claim to be a great authority on the matter. You assert that I don't know them, only you know them, and I have yet to learn.
I do not tell you how wonderful Christianity is. I tell you that it is not as bad as you assert it to be, or more accurately they are no different to any other group of people.
Let's generalize this even more then, shall we. There is an inherent flaw in having religion present at all, actually. Though I do not prescribe to being against all religion it's a valid argument that cannot be ignored or denied.

With religion someone stating "god told me that I should do this" and all religious people will simply consider them to be perfectly sane and "normal" because they cannot say otherwise without facing the fact that their own religious belief is false since almost all religions state that their god "speaks" to them. This means that no matter what they claim, the chances of a religious person, especially one of the same religion, seeing anything wrong with the statement, even when what they should do is immoral, is slim to none because it would require admitting what they perceive as impossible.

When everyone around has no religion and someone states "god told me to do this" we immediately wonder of the sanity of the person making this claim. Anything that is inherently detrimental we immediately assume that the person is delusional and should be watched closely or treated for their mental instability. There is no threat in admitting that the person is delusion as we would have no beliefs that doing so would betray.

There is a "save" for the religious people, that is to admit that they are unsure themselves and that they cannot account for such things as "god speaking" to them. However this is likely to not happen in areas of high zealotry and even moderate organized religious people tend not to question the claims of a god speaking to their fellows. Typically the most done is a wide berth approach to the ones making the claims unless they are preachers, in which case such claims are not questioned at all and are accepted without justification.

This is why evidence is so important to an atheist, without the justifications of belief, we can see that any claim requires evidence to support it's validity enough as to justify believing it.

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#13004 Jun 1, 2012
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
So as long as their god is the same one that speaks to you, they're sane?
But if their god, who speaks to them, is not the same as yours, they're not sane?
Nope. I'd check to see if their god is an actual speaking person, or anything that I can have a conversation with. If not, I'd assume the person is hallucinating.

“Listen to the sounds”

Since: Feb 09

of your own extinction......

#13005 Jun 1, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's generalize this even more then, shall we. There is an inherent flaw in having religion present at all, actually. Though I do not prescribe to being against all religion it's a valid argument that cannot be ignored or denied.
With religion someone stating "god told me that I should do this" and all religious people will simply consider them to be perfectly sane and "normal" because they cannot say otherwise without facing the fact that their own religious belief is false since almost all religions state that their god "speaks" to them. This means that no matter what they claim, the chances of a religious person, especially one of the same religion, seeing anything wrong with the statement, even when what they should do is immoral, is slim to none because it would require admitting what they perceive as impossible.
When everyone around has no religion and someone states "god told me to do this" we immediately wonder of the sanity of the person making this claim. Anything that is inherently detrimental we immediately assume that the person is delusional and should be watched closely or treated for their mental instability. There is no threat in admitting that the person is delusion as we would have no beliefs that doing so would betray.
There is a "save" for the religious people, that is to admit that they are unsure themselves and that they cannot account for such things as "god speaking" to them. However this is likely to not happen in areas of high zealotry and even moderate organized religious people tend not to question the claims of a god speaking to their fellows. Typically the most done is a wide berth approach to the ones making the claims unless they are preachers, in which case such claims are not questioned at all and are accepted without justification.
This is why evidence is so important to an atheist, without the justifications of belief, we can see that any claim requires evidence to support it's validity enough as to justify believing it.
Well with nearly all people I know, if someone tells them that God is speaking to them and telling them what to do, they usually assume it is some hallucination of psychotic condition. Perhaps scitzophrenia or multiple personality disorder. From the theists I know, there are very few that would fall for the claims of someone that God is talking to him and telling him to do whatever absurd actions.

And you overestimate the importance of evidence to an atheist. Some atheists are rational and require evidence. Others are emotional and simply believe whatever they originally wanted to believe.

You have perhaps read lots of claims and information about the universe. For how many claims did you really look at the technique of experimentation, the mathematical models, validity of results and competing results? Most people don't have the time and end up just accepting the claim because it was made by some phd at some research institution. Whether the claim is valid or not isn't the point. The point is, you would accept it with little or no question.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#13006 Jun 1, 2012
True Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Well with nearly all people I know, if someone tells them that God is speaking to them and telling them what to do, they usually assume it is some hallucination of psychotic condition. Perhaps scitzophrenia or multiple personality disorder. From the theists I know, there are very few that would fall for the claims of someone that God is talking to him and telling him to do whatever absurd actions.
And you overestimate the importance of evidence to an atheist. Some atheists are rational and require evidence. Others are emotional and simply believe whatever they originally wanted to believe.
You have perhaps read lots of claims and information about the universe. For how many claims did you really look at the technique of experimentation, the mathematical models, validity of results and competing results? Most people don't have the time and end up just accepting the claim because it was made by some phd at some research institution. Whether the claim is valid or not isn't the point. The point is, you would accept it with little or no question.
But they don't do that when a preacher claims to be "told by god." There is always an exception. The scriptures themselves are the biggest one, you accept, blindly, that it was "inspired" by your god without ever considering it was written by people who do exactly that "god told me this." This is gullibility in it's purest form. That is why I state that religion itself has this exception which is completely irrational and unjustifiable, you are believing that "god told me to kill" when you conclude that the bible is the "word of god."

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#13007 Jun 1, 2012
Nontheist wrote:
<quoted text>
So far, I think this poster is the most repetitive any I've seen in the forum. It reminds me of ...
Melt down continues?

You see what you want to see, darling.

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#13008 Jun 1, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah, so you ignored all the posts mocking you.
Pearls before swine, KrustyOdor.

You aren't in the position to mock anyone.

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#13009 Jun 1, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
Now that is funny – ok we’ll take him just on the off chance that the next monarch will reinstate this ancient and worth custom
You can count on the UK always having another monarch, another head of the state religion.

Perhaps five years before Liz drowns in a bowl of porridge, there will always be another one to follow.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#13010 Jun 1, 2012
barefoot2626 wrote:
<quoted text>
Pearls before swine, KrustyOdor.
You aren't in the position to mock anyone.
Positions matter not when matters of mockery are the concern. For it is you who lacks the footing on which to mock anyone as you continually do nothing but troll and humiliate your own personage.

Since: Feb 11

Location hidden

#13011 Jun 1, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
For it is you who lacks the footing on which to mock anyone as you continually do nothing but troll and humiliate your own personage.
You come up with a better excuse to explain your confusion re: agnostic and atheist yet? I.E.: you saying they are "technically" the same?

“There's a feeling I get...”

Since: Jun 11

...when I look to the West

#13012 Jun 1, 2012
Double Fine wants pie

“The eye has it...”

Since: Jan 12

Russell's teapot.

#13013 Jun 1, 2012
barefoot2626 wrote:
<quoted text>
You come up with a better excuse to explain your confusion re: agnostic and atheist yet? I.E.: you saying they are "technically" the same?
Both positions result in a lack of belief in deities, so, what do you think?

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