BARACK OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE: Suit contesting Obama's citizen...

Full story: Chicago Tribune

The U.S. Supreme Court will consider Friday whether to take up a lawsuit challenging President-elect Barack Obama 's U.S. citizenship, a continuation of a New Jersey case embraced by some opponents of Obama's ...

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“Facts trump speculation”

Since: Dec 08

RationalState

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#130796
Nov 30, 2012
 
Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>Makes no difference, aliens have never had a say in our governmental process.
On the one hand, BirfoonBoy believes that aliens are not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States because they "have never had a say in our governmental process." However children have never had a say in our governmental process and millions of children in this country indeed are citizens and subject to/under the jurisdiction thereof.

BirfoonBoy has serious cognitive issues.
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Insipid. Minor children have no say in our government either.
When were you first diagnosed with mental illness?
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130797
Nov 30, 2012
 
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, citizenship by birth in the US is not a "recognition" of dual citizenship. It concerns US citizenship without regard to the political condition of the parents of a person born here.(Except for children of foreign ambassadors and foreign hostile occupying troops.)
Now put your play robe and gavel away in your toy box where they belong and grow up.
Sorry, all children born in this nation of aliens are citizens of their father's country of origin.
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130798
Nov 30, 2012
 
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Nobody cares about operation of Play Law interpretation of the 14th.
Grow up.
<quoted text>
Sorry, that is the way it works.

“zero nuclear weapons”

Since: Sep 08

Perryville

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#130799
Nov 30, 2012
 
American Lady wrote:
Alexander Hamilton opposed granting citizenship immediately to new immigrants: "To admit foreigners indiscriminately to the rights of citizens, the moment they foot in our country would be nothing less than to admit the Grecian horse into the citadel of our liberty and sovereignty." Instead, he recommended that we gradually draw newcomers into American life, "to
enable aliens to get rid of foreign and acquire American attachments; to learn the principles and imbibe the spirit of our government; and to admit of a philosophy, at least, of their feeling a real interest in our affairs."
Theodore Roosevelt wrote: "In the first place we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birth place, or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance here."
Have you heard of this?

The New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,

With conquering limbs astride from land to land;

Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand

A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame

Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name

Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand

Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command

The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

"Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she

With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,

Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,

The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.

Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,

I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Do you understand the meaning behind these words?

“Facts trump speculation”

Since: Dec 08

RationalState

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#130800
Nov 30, 2012
 
Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, all persons born in this country are citizens, but only if they are "subject to the jurisdiction, thereof".
Children of aliens are just that, they receive the citizenship of their father and his country of origin, at the moment of birth.
Aliens have never been subject to the US Constitution, this is only a right that a citizen enjoys.
Play Law doesn't count, Alice.

Unlike Alice in Wonderland, simply saying something is so doesn't make it so.
-Judge Clay D. Land

What part of "sovereign nation" does BirfoonBoy not comprehend?

Foreign citizenship law has no force or effect in the United States.

BirfoonBoy's fantasy violates the principle of sovereignty. His delusion crashed and burned.

BirfoonBoy needs to put his play robe and gavel away in his toy box where it belongs.
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, citizenship by birth in this country grants US citizenship to persons born here. It has no bearing on foreign citizenship. Similarly, foreign citizenship by birth of a child of US citizens born in a foreign country does not strip the child of US citizenship.
Dale needs to put his play justice robe and gavel back in his toy box.
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130801
Nov 30, 2012
 
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, Play Justice, birthright citizenship in the US neither "strips" nor affirms foreign citizenship.
Now put your play robe and gavel away in your toy box where they belong.
<quoted text>
it certainly does recognize foreign citizenship and law, if not we wouldn't have a Naturalization Act.

“Facts trump speculation”

Since: Dec 08

RationalState

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#130802
Nov 30, 2012
 
Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>Sorry, that is the way it works.
It is quite evident that the delusional twit believes that Play Law "works", but it only works in his play room and not in the real world which is inhabited by rational adults.
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Nobody cares about operation of Play Law interpretation of the 14th.
Grow up.
LRS

Shreveport, LA

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#130803
Nov 30, 2012
 
Jacques Ottawa wrote:
LRS wrote:
<quoted text>
The citizens did most of the early levee building. Try and grasp this point
<quoted text>
Johannes, Johannes, LRS and his birther ilk have not yet grasped that Romney lost and Obama is still president. And that is fairly recent, less than a month ago. How do you expect a crass vulgar fundamentalist birther tea partyer to grasp something that happened years ago? His prejudices, hate and envy prevent him from thinking on a rational level. C'mon, he talks about his beautiful nurse girl friend like it was real. LMAO (LRS tm reg'd).
Got plans to see her today! Great timing again jacqazz. Jealous? I know you are but that's just your nature. Jealous of everyone and everything! Again, jacqazz you're only repeating your worn out BS. You know, when I was curious about the levees, I researched the subject. Are you two nimrods too lazy to do your own? Guess you're waiting on the Gov. to pay someone to do it for you. pigeons (big time) LMAO!!!
Johannes

Yucaipa, CA

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#130804
Nov 30, 2012
 
Rogue Scholar 05 wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, Yohannes failed to provide a link to support his allegations. The Army Corps of Engineers was instructed by CONGRESS to rebuild the CITY OWNED levees to withstand a Cat-2 hurricane after the 1965 Hurricane Betsy. And they did. It was never designed or built to withstand anything greater than a Cat-2 hurricane and that is not the fault of the Army Corps of Engineers.
If you go up the the Mississippi River levees that were designed, built and maintained by the Corps of Engineers you will see the difference. They are like golf courses. NO trees are allowed to grow on them and no varmints are allowed to borough into them either. The levees own by the City of New Orleans are totally different and it was not the fault of the Corps of Engineers.
The PHI heliport at N.O. was located next to the Mississippi River levee and, like I said, it is like a humped golf course. The grass is maintained better than most states maintain the grass next to Interstate Highways.
When I worked for PHI there were some days when we could not fly and once we spent three days during a hurricane evacuation from the Gulf as the PHI heliport at Venice was not only out side the Corps' levee but also the State's levees. Yep, PHI had their own levee and it was destroyed during Hurricane Katrina and they built a totally new heliport about five miles north of there that had a Corps' levee on the east side and a State's levee on the west side.
Sorry, I've done that several times, including yesterday. You can continue to ignore the facts and the truth, but it will not change anything.
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130805
Nov 30, 2012
 
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
“They became such in virtue of national law, or rather natural law which recognizes persons born WITHIN THE JURISDICTION of every country as being subjects or citizens of that country. Such persons were, therefore, citizens of the United States as WERE BORN IN THE COUNTRY or were made by naturalization.” Senator Jacob Howard, Cong. Globe 39th Cong., 1st Sess, 2765 (1866).[emphasis added]
Grow up, loser.
<quoted text>
The national law Howard was speaking of was the Civil Rights Act of 1866, "all persons born in the US and not subject to any foreign power, are citizens of the US", this was the only national law pertaining to citizenship.

“Facts trump speculation”

Since: Dec 08

RationalState

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#130806
Nov 30, 2012
 
Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>it certainly does recognize foreign citizenship and law, if not we wouldn't have a Naturalization Act.
Sorry, Play Law only works in your play pen. Birthright citizenship concerns who is born a US citizen, not who is a foreign citizen. A stateless person is not a foreign citizen but is not a US citizen either. Such a person would have to be naturalized. The Naturalization Act does not depend upon recognition of foreign citizenship, but rather alienage of the person to be naturalized.

Now go put your play robe and gavel back in your toy box. Your momma wants to put you to bed for your nap.
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, Play Justice, birthright citizenship in the US neither "strips" nor affirms foreign citizenship.
Now put your play robe and gavel away in your toy box where they belong.
Johannes

Yucaipa, CA

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#130807
Nov 30, 2012
 
Thomas the Pimp wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, Yohannes failed to provide a link to support his allegations. The Army Corps of Engineers was instructed by CONGRESS to rebuild the CITY OWNED levees to withstand a Cat-2 hurricane after the 1965 Hurricane Betsy. And they did. It was never designed or built to withstand anything greater than a Cat-2 hurricane and that is not the fault of the Army Corps of Engineers.
If you go up the the Mississippi River levees that were designed, built and maintained by the Corps of Engineers you will see the difference. They are like golf courses. NO trees are allowed to grow on them and no varmints are allowed to borough into them either. The levees own by the City of New Orleans are totally different and it was not the fault of the Corps of Engineers.
The PHI heliport at N.O. was located next to the Mississippi River levee and, like I said, it is like a humped golf course. The grass is maintained better than most states maintain the grass next to Interstate Highways.
When I worked for PHI there were some days when we could not fly and once we spent three days during a hurricane evacuation from the Gulf as the PHI heliport at Venice was not only out side the Corps' levee but also the State's levees. Yep, PHI had their own levee and it was destroyed during Hurricane Katrina and they built a totally new heliport about five miles north of there that had a Corps' levee on the east side and a State's levee on the west side.
In 29 August 2005 there were over 50 failures of the levees and flood walls protecting New Orleans, Louisiana, and its suburbs following passage of Hurricane Katrina and landfall in Mississippi. The levee and flood wall failures caused flooding in 80% of New Orleans and all of St. Bernard Parish. Tens of billions of gallons of water spilled into vast areas of New Orleans, flooding over 100,000 homes and businesses. Responsibility for the design and construction of the levee system belongs to the United States Army Corps of Engineers; the responsibility of maintenance belongs to the local levee boards. The Corps hands components of the system over to the local levee boards upon completion. When Katrina struck in 2005, the project was between 60-90% complete.[1] Five investigations (three major and two minor) were conducted by civil engineers and other experts, in an attempt to identify the underlying reasons for the failure of the federal flood protection system. All concur that the primary cause of the flooding was inadequate design and construction by the Corps of Engineers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_levee_failu...
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130808
Nov 30, 2012
 

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LRS wrote:
<quoted text>
I think she wants your wood. LMAO!!!
hahaha!! She can buy a chainsaw and leave my wood alone!

“Facts trump speculation”

Since: Dec 08

RationalState

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#130809
Nov 30, 2012
 

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Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>The national law Howard was speaking of was the Civil Rights Act of 1866, "all persons born in the US and not subject to any foreign power, are citizens of the US", this was the only national law pertaining to citizenship.
What part of the following does BirfoonBoy fail to comprehend?“Such persons were, therefore, citizens of the United States as WERE BORN IN THE COUNTRY or were made by naturalization.”

Obviously the only way the two can be reconciled is by recognition that ordinary aliens in the US are not subject to any foreign power but are subject to the jurisdiction of the United States.

BTW, that happens to be the law -- real law, not Play Law.
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>
“They became such in virtue of national law, or rather natural law which recognizes persons born WITHIN THE JURISDICTION of every country as being subjects or citizens of that country. Such persons were, therefore, citizens of the United States as WERE BORN IN THE COUNTRY or were made by naturalization.” Senator Jacob Howard, Cong. Globe 39th Cong., 1st Sess, 2765 (1866).[emphasis added]
Grow up, loser.
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130810
Nov 30, 2012
 

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Jacques Ottawa wrote:
Ellen1 wrote:
<quoted text>
fu
<quoted text>
She used lower case only as you have very little to fu-rself with, LMAO.
LMAO!!!! The prim and proper Jock-itch has a potty- mouth, also!!!

“ad maiora nati sumus ”

Since: Sep 09

Justice Scalia is an Oxymoron

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#130811
Nov 30, 2012
 

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Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>Yes, the Constitution is the jurisdiction over the US, aliens have never been subject to it, if so they would be called citizens.
If aliens are not subject to the Constitution then that means that aliens are not protected by the civil rights contained in the Constitution. In other words, aliens have no right to trial by jury, no freedom of speech, not protected from unreasonable search and seizures, no protection against double jeopardy and no right to a speedy and public trial.

Moreover, these aliens do not come under the 14th Amendment's equal protection clause.

However, your faulty premise has no legal foundation since courts have established that citizens and aliens have the same constitution rights. "The Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution is not confined to the protection of citizens. It says: "Nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws." These provisions are universal in their application, to all persons within the territorial jurisdiction, without regard to any differences of race, of color, or of nationality; and the equal protection of the laws is a pledge of the protection of equal laws" Yick Wo v. Hopkins, 118 U.S. 356, 369 (1886)

Furthermore, "Alien inhabitants of a State, as well as all other persons within its jurisdiction, may invoke the protection of these clauses [14th Amendment]." Terrace v. Thompson, 263 U.S. 197, 216 (1923)

Justice Stevens wrote "There are literally millions of aliens within the jurisdiction of the United States. The Fifth Amendment, as well as the Fourteenth Amendment, protects every one of these persons from deprivation of life, liberty, or property without due process of law. Wong Yang Sung v. McGrath, 339 U. S. 33, 48-51; Wong Wing v. United States, 163 U. S. 228, 238; see Russian Fleet v. United States, 282 U. S. 481, 489. Even one whose presence in this country is unlawful, involuntary, or transitory is entitled to that constitutional protection. Wong Yang Sung, supra; Wong Wing, supra.

The fact that all persons, aliens and citizens alike, are protected by the Due Process Clause does not lead to the further conclusion that all aliens are entitled to enjoy all the advantages of citizenship or, indeed, to the conclusion that all aliens must be placed in a single homogeneous legal classification. For a host of constitutional and statutory provisions rest on the premise that a legitimate distinction between citizens and aliens may justify attributes and benefits for one class not accorded to the other; and the class of aliens is itself a heterogeneous multitude of persons with a wide-ranging variety of ties to this country. Mathews v. Diaz, 426 U.S. 67, 77-79 (1976)

As such, your folderol claim that aliens are not subject to the constitution doesn't hold water in lights of Supreme Court decisions that hold the contrary position.
Johannes

Yucaipa, CA

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#130812
Nov 30, 2012
 
Thomas the Pimp wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, Yohannes failed to provide a link to support his allegations. The Army Corps of Engineers was instructed by CONGRESS to rebuild the CITY OWNED levees to withstand a Cat-2 hurricane after the 1965 Hurricane Betsy. And they did. It was never designed or built to withstand anything greater than a Cat-2 hurricane and that is not the fault of the Army Corps of Engineers.
If you go up the the Mississippi River levees that were designed, built and maintained by the Corps of Engineers you will see the difference. They are like golf courses. NO trees are allowed to grow on them and no varmints are allowed to borough into them either. The levees own by the City of New Orleans are totally different and it was not the fault of the Corps of Engineers.
The PHI heliport at N.O. was located next to the Mississippi River levee and, like I said, it is like a humped golf course. The grass is maintained better than most states maintain the grass next to Interstate Highways.
When I worked for PHI there were some days when we could not fly and once we spent three days during a hurricane evacuation from the Gulf as the PHI heliport at Venice was not only out side the Corps' levee but also the State's levees. Yep, PHI had their own levee and it was destroyed during Hurricane Katrina and they built a totally new heliport about five miles north of there that had a Corps' levee on the east side and a State's levee on the west side.
On April 5, 2006, months after independent investigators had demonstrated that the levee failures were not due to natural forces beyond intended design strength, Lt. Gen. Carl Strock testified before the U.S. Senate Subcommittee on Energy and Water that, "We have now concluded we had problems with the design of the structure." He also testified that the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers did not know of this mechanism of failure prior to August 29, 2005. The claim of ignorance is refuted, however, by the National Science Foundation investigators hired by the Army Corps of Engineers, who point to a 1986 study by the corps itself that such separations were possible in the I-wall design.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_levee_failu...
Justice Dale

Wichita, KS

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#130813
Nov 30, 2012
 
wojar wrote:
<quoted text>Nonexistent distinction. Grow up. Put your play robe and gavel back in your toy box.
Puss, get smart!
Jacques Ottawa

Toronto, Canada

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#130814
Nov 30, 2012
 
Justice Dale wrote:
<quoted text>hahaha!! She can buy a chainsaw and leave my wood alone!
A dull toothless steak knive would be more than adequate.
Johannes

Yucaipa, CA

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#130815
Nov 30, 2012
 
Thomas the Pimp wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, Yohannes failed to provide a link to support his allegations. The Army Corps of Engineers was instructed by CONGRESS to rebuild the CITY OWNED levees to withstand a Cat-2 hurricane after the 1965 Hurricane Betsy. And they did. It was never designed or built to withstand anything greater than a Cat-2 hurricane and that is not the fault of the Army Corps of Engineers.
If you go up the the Mississippi River levees that were designed, built and maintained by the Corps of Engineers you will see the difference. They are like golf courses. NO trees are allowed to grow on them and no varmints are allowed to borough into them either. The levees own by the City of New Orleans are totally different and it was not the fault of the Corps of Engineers.
The PHI heliport at N.O. was located next to the Mississippi River levee and, like I said, it is like a humped golf course. The grass is maintained better than most states maintain the grass next to Interstate Highways.
When I worked for PHI there were some days when we could not fly and once we spent three days during a hurricane evacuation from the Gulf as the PHI heliport at Venice was not only out side the Corps' levee but also the State's levees. Yep, PHI had their own levee and it was destroyed during Hurricane Katrina and they built a totally new heliport about five miles north of there that had a Corps' levee on the east side and a State's levee on the west side.
In August 2007, the Corps released an analysis revealing that their floodwalls were so poorly designed that the maximum safe load is only 7 feet (2.1 m) of water, which is half the original 14-foot (4.3 m) design.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_levee_failu...

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