The Senate's gun control fail: dead c...

The Senate's gun control fail: dead children and monied politicians | David Simon

There are 605 comments on the The Guardian story from Apr 18, 2013, titled The Senate's gun control fail: dead children and monied politicians | David Simon. In it, The Guardian reports that:

The blocking of gun control legislation in the Senate exposes just how deeply corrupted America's bought democracy has become Mark Barden, whose son Daniel died at Sandy Hook elementary school, hugs Joe Biden after the Senate bill was killed.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Guardian.

downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#597 May 9, 2013
tha Professor wrote:
<quoted text>
Trouble is, "defensive firearms uses" are a minuscule number of the total of gun homicides and suicides.
A minuscule number?

Defensive gun usage studies

Field -California 1976 -3,052,717
Bordua-Illinois- 1977-1,414,514
Cambridge Reports 1978-U.S.-N.A.
DMIa-U.S. 1978-2,141,512
DMIb-U.S.-1978-1,098,409
Hart-U.S. 1981-1,797,461
Ohio-1982-771,043
Time/CNN-1989-N.A.
Mauser-U.S.-1990-1,487,342
Gallup-U.S.-1991-777,153
Gallup-U.S.-1993-1,621,377
L.A.Times-U.S.-1994-3,609,682
Tarranca -U.S.-1994-764,036
Kleck and Gertz-U.S.-1993-Approx 2,000,000 to,2,500,000
spocko

Oakland, CA

#598 May 9, 2013
xxxrayted wrote:
You are simply comparing two sets of number because they happen to support your gunloon assumption, fact is, there is zero evidence that supports the statistical argument. Don't take my word for it it's an the FBI's website!
spocko

Oakland, CA

#599 May 9, 2013
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, that is unfortunate. So I guess the solution is to take insurance policies away from all homeowners in the country instead of creating a law that says anybody leaving an insurance policy on the table is subject to 10 to 20 years in prison.
Nah. Just get rid of all homeowners insurance. That's the bright thing to do.
Huh? What the f*** are you talking about, someone drop yo on head?
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#600 May 9, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
Didn't the left predict Florida would become the wild wild west when they passed concealed carry back in the 1980s?
Now there are more guns than ever owned by private citizens and violent crime has gone down. Yeee -haaaa!
Same story here in Ohio. I debated the left when the CCW laws were in consideration. One leftist asked me the same thing? Do you want Ohio to become the wild-wild west? To that I replied: It already is the wild-wild west, except in our neo-wild-wild west, only the police and criminals have the guns.

Well..... we didn't become the wild-wild west. Our latest law allows us to carry weapons in places where alcohol is served and public arenas. Again, the left made all kinds of horror speculations that never came through.
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#601 May 9, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
You are simply comparing two sets of number because they happen to support your gunloon assumption, fact is, there is zero evidence that supports the statistical argument. Don't take my word for it it's an the FBI's website!
Not according to Wiki it isn't.

Lets see, how does one "prove" armed citizens deter criminals? Well, I guess we can go to prisons and ask inmates if they ever reconsidered committing a crime because of armed citizens? But what about potential criminals that didn't commit a crime, but were thinking about it? Maybe a survey would show I'm correct. Lets do a random survey of all citizens.

Of course you can't prove something didn't happen for whatever reason. That's ridiculous. All you can really do is look at the data and come to your own conclusion. We still have the same percentage of poor in this country. We still have the same prisons we've had in this country for the last 20 years. And thanks to DumBama, we have the most government dependent people in our country in decades. So what else changed during that time period that one can site as a possible explanation for declining violent crimes?

Then we look at states and cities that had or still have major gun restrictions. What else can we conclude? Sandy Hook was in a state that had an assault weapons ban. Illinois recently had their CCW ban overturned by the federal courts. Chicago is a zoo just like Washington DC.
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#602 May 9, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
Huh? What the f*** are you talking about, someone drop yo on head?
Can't follow your own scenario I see. You're the one who exchanged insurance policies for guns, and now you can't figure out my reply. Go figure........
spocko

Oakland, CA

#603 May 9, 2013
xxxrayted wrote:
<quoted text>
Can't follow your own scenario I see. You're the one who exchanged insurance policies for guns, and now you can't figure out my reply. Go figure........
It was a spoof you brainless moron :-) how can an insurance police on the table kill someone?
Cat74

United States

#604 May 9, 2013
All this talk about changing the 2nd amendment, grabbing the guns is just a passing fancy of liberals. There is nothing they can do as long as everytine they try that gun grab we take it to the Supreme Court, and they will rule for the citizens to have the protection of the 2nd amendment. They cannot rewrite the Constitution no matter how much they would like to.
Windy

Buffalo, NY

#605 May 10, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
I own a number of guns, I’m also the proud owner of SSG-3000 high precision rifle and use it ever Sunday morning at the local gun range where it is kept in gun vault. As far as I’m concerned, with the 2nd amendment we have a wonderful legacy and tradition – it's the gunloonery that is the problem. Why would anyone, in the right mind, resist implementing a system that protects legit gun owners while keeping guns out of the hands of the criminal element? How can one possible accomplish that with more guns and less restrictions or “more guns means less crime” it’s idiotic and retarded nonsense.
E X AC T L Y !
I'm done arguing with these thick-headed gunloons. Everything and everyone is a threat to them, and the only way to defend yourself is with a gun, without a national registry or restriction on ammo and power.
I will keep my votes where they count whenever I get the opportunity.

Try not to shoot yourselves!
~Peace~
xxxrayted

Brook Park, OH

#606 May 10, 2013
Cat74 wrote:
All this talk about changing the 2nd amendment, grabbing the guns is just a passing fancy of liberals. There is nothing they can do as long as everytine they try that gun grab we take it to the Supreme Court, and they will rule for the citizens to have the protection of the 2nd amendment. They cannot rewrite the Constitution no matter how much they would like to.
That all depends on who is President and who he or she appoints to the courts. This is something not many consider when they go to vote for a President. So yes, we could easily lose our right to bear arms.
Cat74

United States

#607 May 10, 2013
We are one justice from losing the 2nd amendment, but unless a Conservative dies while Obama is President we won't lose that voice on the court. The liberal justices are older, and sicker then the Conservatives. Still, you are right it is something to watch.
1 post removed
FormerParatroope r

Chicago, IL

#609 May 13, 2013
Windy wrote:
<quoted text>
But, it would have stopped me from being able to transfer ownership of my weapon to my mentally unstable uncle/neighbor/friend without subjecting him to a background check.
Would it really have done that?
The effort to cause private citizens to make such checks is not solving the issue either. And you are opening many unintended consequences. Do you think your neighbor gas something in thier past? Do a background check under the guise they are buying a firearm from you.
Maybe you would also support mandating that anyone buying, battering, trading or otherwise transferring any property, or service, to have a retailers identification, collect applicable taxes, and to report such as income? And hold the seller responsible for injury or action that the buyer causes?
Common sense is needed. And a new law is not the answer. If new laws were the answer, then at this point with all the laws we have we would have no crime.
FormerParatroope r

Chicago, IL

#610 May 13, 2013
tha Professor wrote:
<quoted text>
IU'm sorry, it IS a major part of the problem at least. While it's true that a century or more ago there were fewer nutballs just going off and shooting people at random, there are a LOT more gun accidents, gun suicides, and gun-related domestic shootings. A LOT more handguns are everywhere...and they're easy to use to "solve your problem" whether it's your life or your wife or girlfriend or your neighbor.
Gangs, drug dealers, etc. use guns because they're easily available. It's that availability that makes crime more easily committed.
Odd, there is a higher rate of firearm ownership than there has been for a few decades, yet violent crime is at its lowest point since the 1970's.

As far as nutballs. They will always find a way to inflict mayhem. Whether with a firearm, a bomb, a knife, a car or any other manner they can dream up, no law, social etiquette or reasoning will stop them. That has been a fact since our species has existed.
spocko

Oakland, CA

#611 May 13, 2013
FormerParatrooper wrote:
<quoted text>
Odd, there is a higher rate of firearm ownership than there has been for a few decades, yet violent crime is at its lowest point since the 1970's.
As far as nutballs. They will always find a way to inflict mayhem. Whether with a firearm, a bomb, a knife, a car or any other manner they can dream up, no law, social etiquette or reasoning will stop them. That has been a fact since our species has existed.
No one knows what’s going on. Gun sales to individuals seem like they've increased a fair amount over the past decade and so have background checks, but the number of households reporting gun ownership has decreased substantially. Does this mean that fewer households own guns, but the ones that do own guns have more and more of them? More data please!
FormerParatroope r

Chicago, IL

#612 May 13, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
No one knows what’s going on. Gun sales to individuals seem like they've increased a fair amount over the past decade and so have background checks, but the number of households reporting gun ownership has decreased substantially. Does this mean that fewer households own guns, but the ones that do own guns have more and more of them? More data please!
The data is incomplete to that. But look at the numbers of how many background checks are being conducted, and in Illinois more than 40,000 new firearm owners identification cards are being applied for.

I never trust polls that ask if someone owns things, probably because I don't participate in them. Some may say yes, even tho they don't, and the opposite is true.

“Voters elect Big Bird”

Since: Jan 07

Dump American Eagle

#613 May 13, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
No one knows what’s going on. Gun sales to individuals seem like they've increased a fair amount over the past decade and so have background checks, but the number of households reporting gun ownership has decreased substantially. Does this mean that fewer households own guns, but the ones that do own guns have more and more of them? More data please!
More households have guns. Since the 2008 and 2012 elections there have been people who had never been around firearms who have purchased one or more,as well as taking classes or sought private tutoring on them.
downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#614 May 13, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
No one knows what’s going on. Gun sales to individuals seem like they've increased a fair amount over the past decade and so have background checks, but the number of households reporting gun ownership has decreased substantially. Does this mean that fewer households own guns, but the ones that do own guns have more and more of them? More data please!
Maybe citizens don't want to report gun ownership since it is no one's business but their own.There have been 70,291,049 background checks for gun purchases since President Obama took office including the first three months of 2013, according to data released by the FBI. There have been over two million a month in 2013.

Permits for guns climb in Mass.
Crackdown fear, desire for safety spur 5-year rise
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusett...
-permits-the-rise-undercutting -state-anti-gun-reputation/2I6 042aXN7FbJkXt5ptArO/story.html ?rss_id=Most+Popular

The Rise in Popularity of the AR-15 Among Women
It's a clear, sunny day on the shooting range. Only the crack of gunshots breaks the silence.

What's unique on this range is that all the gun owners are members of A Girl and A Gun Women's Shooting League—and they're all firing AR-15 semiautomatic rifles.

"I think there is a small bit of status for a gal that says she owns an AR-15," said Juliana Crowder, president and co-founder of A Girl and a Gun. "Especially right now, since they're so hard to get a hold of."

Recent attempts to pass stricter gun laws are having an unintended effect: AR-15s are flying off store shelves. The rifles and their accessories account for roughly a billion dollars of the $4 billion U.S. gun industry.

"The AR-15 is becoming extremely popular among women," said Crowder. "Some women are very gadgety or want to be personalized, they're painting them, getting these different grips and colors, and stylizing it. It's very popular because they can build it to their own specifications-- use it for fun, and feel pride of ownership in it."

Crowder's own AR-15 is purple—the same color as her former dance studio. An ex-dance teacher, Crowder now focuses her time on her all-female shooting league. In just two years it's grown to 28 chapters in eleven states..........


http://www.cnbc.com/id/100650400... |headline|other|text|&par= yahoo
downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#615 May 13, 2013
spocko wrote:
<quoted text>
No one knows what’s going on. Gun sales to individuals seem like they've increased a fair amount over the past decade and so have background checks, but the number of households reporting gun ownership has decreased substantially. Does this mean that fewer households own guns, but the ones that do own guns have more and more of them? More data please!
October 26, 2011
Self-Reported Gun Ownership in U.S. Is Highest Since 1993
Majority of men, Republicans, and Southerners report having a gun in their households
by Lydia Saad

PRINCETON, NJ -- Forty-seven percent of American adults currently report that they have a gun in their home or elsewhere on their property. This is up from 41% a year ago and is the highest Gallup has recorded since 1993, albeit marginally above the 44% and 45% highs seen during that period.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/150353/Self-Report...
Old Gun Owner

Leesburg, VA

#616 May 21, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
October 26, 2011
Self-Reported Gun Ownership in U.S. Is Highest Since 1993
Majority of men, Republicans, and Southerners report having a gun in their households
by Lydia Saad
PRINCETON, NJ -- Forty-seven percent of American adults currently report that they have a gun in their home or elsewhere on their property. This is up from 41% a year ago and is the highest Gallup has recorded since 1993, albeit marginally above the 44% and 45% highs seen during that period.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/150353/Self-Report...
Dude....youre citing facts to a lib. They dont deal with facts. Thay make their sh*t up as they go along.
You're far better off praying that lunes like him are prohibited from gun ownership because of their mental instability.
Old Gun Owner

Leesburg, VA

#617 May 21, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
A minuscule number?
Defensive gun usage studies
Field -California 1976 -3,052,717
Bordua-Illinois- 1977-1,414,514
Cambridge Reports 1978-U.S.-N.A.
DMIa-U.S. 1978-2,141,512
DMIb-U.S.-1978-1,098,409
Hart-U.S. 1981-1,797,461
Ohio-1982-771,043
Time/CNN-1989-N.A.
Mauser-U.S.-1990-1,487,342
Gallup-U.S.-1991-777,153
Gallup-U.S.-1993-1,621,377
L.A.Times-U.S.-1994-3,609,682
Tarranca -U.S.-1994-764,036
Kleck and Gertz-U.S.-1993-Approx 2,000,000 to,2,500,000
More facts conveniently glossed over & ignored by phoney intellects.

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