LDS Church, other religious groups respond to Prop 8 ruling

Feb 8, 2012 Full story: Deseret News 63

Shortly after the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals issued its ruling that CaliforniaA's Proposition 8 banning same-sex marriage is unconstitutional , The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints issued a response.

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“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#21 Feb 28, 2013
Grandpasmurf952 wrote:
Here is some encouraging news for those who respect the protection the constitution gives minorities against the tyranny of the majority:
http://www.sfgate.com/lgbt/article/White-Hous...
The US constitution has never, ever, given rights to many recent minority issues. That is why these issues have had to find law makers to side with their case to influence other law makers to help pass laws to help out that minority issue receive "legal rights and protections" neither the law or constitution afforded them before hand.
Recently passed laws by individual states and their legislators have afforded the base for minorities to find equality where no equality was found before.
SCOTUS has nothing to reflect on in the US constitution to show same sex marriage is to be equal to opposite sex marriage. If something was there, same sex marriage would have been established through the constitution decades ago.
SCOTUS will use recently passed laws for same sex marriage from individual states to decide on same sex marriage, not the constitution.
So your "...some encouraging news for those who respect the protection the constitution.." statement is totally inaccurately being used. Just saying.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#22 Feb 28, 2013
NoMo wrote:
When will they regret being bigots?
An answer to this question really has little to do with Mormons.
70% of black Californian voters and probably caring little of what Mormons think voted for prop 8. Half of California's latino voters voted for prop 8 and like black Americans, have little care for what Mormons think.
With the exclusion of Utah since it's a Mormon state, all other non-Mormon states have consistently proved to be your consistent bigots.
So as to your question, if the majority of the states were given time to accept same sex marriage, you would than find out an answer to your question.
But if SCOTUS makes same sex marriage constitutional, you may never get an answer.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#23 Mar 1, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
An answer to this question really has little to do with Mormons.
70% of black Californian voters and probably caring little of what Mormons think voted for prop 8. Half of California's latino voters voted for prop 8 and like black Americans, have little care for what Mormons think.
With the exclusion of Utah since it's a Mormon state, all other non-Mormon states have consistently proved to be your consistent bigots.
So as to your question, if the majority of the states were given time to accept same sex marriage, you would than find out an answer to your question.
But if SCOTUS makes same sex marriage constitutional, you may never get an answer.
Oh, it has everything to do with Mormons...since their multi-million dollar campaign is over, 60+% of Californians are now FOR equality. I guess even those black people u assume aren't LDS realized all the lies they were told by the Utah Klan and decided to stop listening to their crap.†
"All men are created equal". ALL..not some

...if it had so little to do with the Mormons, why did the Mormons join Fred phelps in filing that brief? Why is evergreen still open and thriving? Why is Boyd PaKKKer's little masturbation pamphlet still being printed and widely used? Why are they still being as hateful as they've always been, while making sappy sad web pages to try(and fail) to appeal to gay people? Why are they using people like Josh Weed to prove their lies are true? Why are they sticking their nose in the BSA's business? Why is it ok for Utah to have pockets of bigots discriminating(firing, evicting, etc) instead of passing state wide anti discrimination? Funny how the church SAYS it supports such a law and every year, it doesn't pass....the Mormons are a very big part of the problem.

“Mystical Atheism for everyone!”

Since: Nov 08

El Cerrito California

#24 Mar 1, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
It will be federal one day...and the bigots can go hide in their closets with the Klan.
I agree. And I think the public is becoming more and more aware of the agenda of the Mormons and the religious right. It's just a matter of time before this form of bigotry is recognized for what it is by the majority of decent LOVING people.

Here is an interesting article on the Misinformation Campaign orchestrated by the Later Day Saints:

http://www.publiceye.org/magazine/v23n4/propo...

have a good evening!

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#25 Mar 1, 2013
Grandpasmurf952 wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree. And I think the public is becoming more and more aware of the agenda of the Mormons and the religious right. It's just a matter of time before this form of bigotry is recognized for what it is by the majority of decent LOVING people.
Here is an interesting article on the Misinformation Campaign orchestrated by the Later Day Saints:
http://www.publiceye.org/magazine/v23n4/propo...
have a good evening!
Very good article...I think it's really funny they forgot about google and social media..they used it but "somehow"(lol) didn't realize it would come back to bite them. And in such a big way!†

Their strategy of-

"The memo notes that in order to win the battle against gay marriage,ďthere may have to be certain legal rights recognized for unmarried people such as hospital visitation so that opponents in the legislature come away with something.Ē The Right was willing to concede some rights for gays in an effort to defeat same sex marriage."

..they are still using today...unfortunately for them, most people do see it as total bs. The quorum is doomed to their deceit, they can't see past it. They get what they deserve..
U have a good evening too! I'm hoping for some major snowmelt this weekend:)†

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#26 Mar 2, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, it has everything to do with Mormons...since their multi-million dollar campaign is over, 60+% of Californians are now FOR equality. I guess even those black people u assume aren't LDS realized all the lies they were told by the Utah Klan and decided to stop listening to their crap.†
"All men are created equal". ALL..not some
...if it had so little to do with the Mormons, why did the Mormons join Fred phelps in filing that brief? Why is evergreen still open and thriving? Why is Boyd PaKKKer's little masturbation pamphlet still being printed and widely used? Why are they still being as hateful as they've always been, while making sappy sad web pages to try(and fail) to appeal to gay people? Why are they using people like Josh Weed to prove their lies are true? Why are they sticking their nose in the BSA's business? Why is it ok for Utah to have pockets of bigots discriminating(firing, evicting, etc) instead of passing state wide anti discrimination? Funny how the church SAYS it supports such a law and every year, it doesn't pass....the Mormons are a very big part of the problem.
Californians voted against same sex marriage long before prop 8 came to be. Yes LDS $ backing ads helped. But the voting percentages would have remained about the same even if LDS hadn't been involved.
So my point still stands. Non-Mormons have been voting against same sex marriage without the help of LDS $ to many times to count. Prop 8 is the exception for ad influence.
Next, as for why, it's because Mormons believe as many Christians still believe that God is pro-opposite sex marriage. They're all giving on more civil legal rights for homosexuals. But the Southern Baptist Convention, heavily black in the south still has heavy opposition to same sex marriage.
Understanding something goes a long way to having knowledge.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#27 Mar 2, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Californians voted against same sex marriage long before prop 8 came to be. Yes LDS $ backing ads helped. But the voting percentages would have remained about the same even if LDS hadn't been involved.
So my point still stands. Non-Mormons have been voting against same sex marriage without the help of LDS $ to many times to count. Prop 8 is the exception for ad influence.
Next, as for why, it's because Mormons believe as many Christians still believe that God is pro-opposite sex marriage. They're all giving on more civil legal rights for homosexuals. But the Southern Baptist Convention, heavily black in the south still has heavy opposition to same sex marriage.
Understanding something goes a long way to having knowledge.
Prop h8 is not the exception....who do u think funds NOM? They are NOT all about giving more civil legal rights and what's more, it's none of their business. If that were true, Utah would have passed non-discrimination laws long ago and stopped meddling here in the US and internationally. Using their "religion to justify their bigotry doesn't flyer well anymore. The world sees thru their lies and it's coming back to haunt them..whatdid the lizard quorum say again...they were " shocked" at the backlash after prop8? Shocked.....it shows how out of touch those old bigots really are. The more hate and lies they put out there, the more it comes back around to bite them.

The double standard lies they use to try to control LGBTs within their own congregation..people who are born Mormon and gay, have had devastating affects. Suicides, closeted people living lies and destroying families, the barbaric damages of evergreen, the enormous numbers of gay youth kicked out to live on the streets of Utah. For what? A pyramid scheme claiming to be a " Christian religion that holds every members access to Mormon high heaven for ransom. U gotta pay to play if u want to be a god. If Mormons allow gay people in heaven, it makes the whole doctrine false. Shaming and shunning are the only tools they have left....pretty sad for a cult that "loves everyone" isn't it?

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#28 Mar 3, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Prop h8 is not the exception....who do u think funds NOM? They are NOT all about giving more civil legal rights and what's more, it's none of their business. If that were true, Utah would have passed non-discrimination laws long ago and stopped meddling here in the US and internationally. Using their "religion to justify their bigotry doesn't flyer well anymore. The world sees thru their lies and it's coming back to haunt them..whatdid the lizard quorum say again...they were " shocked" at the backlash after prop8? Shocked.....it shows how out of touch those old bigots really are. The more hate and lies they put out there, the more it comes back around to bite them.
The double standard lies they use to try to control LGBTs within their own congregation..people who are born Mormon and gay, have had devastating affects. Suicides, closeted people living lies and destroying families, the barbaric damages of evergreen, the enormous numbers of gay youth kicked out to live on the streets of Utah. For what? A pyramid scheme claiming to be a " Christian religion that holds every members access to Mormon high heaven for ransom. U gotta pay to play if u want to be a god. If Mormons allow gay people in heaven, it makes the whole doctrine false. Shaming and shunning are the only tools they have left....pretty sad for a cult that "loves everyone" isn't it?
Well since you have a habit for blaming Mormons whether your correct or incorrect, I went to the web and found the following.

http://washingtonindependent.com/116452/nom%E...

Perhaps the man who trusts NOM the least is Fred Karger Ė least known for his long-shot GOP presidential campaign as the first openly gay candidate, but best known for exposing the Mormon Churchís extensive financial involvement in Californiaís Proposition 8 campaign that overturned the legalization of same-sex marriage in 2008.

After obtaining classified Mormon documents from an anonymous source, Karger has maintained his belief that the National Organization for Marriage was set up by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS) as a front group to funnel money for political campaigns against the legalization of same-sex marriage. Ever since, Karger has been tailing NOMís every move Ė ready to file a complaint each time it funds a political campaign and fails to register or disclose its donors.

This year Karger started hounding NOM for its 990s a month before they were due. He told TAI that in late October he sent one of his campaign staffers to NOMís D.C. headquarters on K Street, who came back empty-handed. He then mailed an accusatory letter to recently named NOM chairman John Eastman, which soured the stafferís ability to collect the forms on a subsequent visit to NOMís office on Nov. 16.

(TAI first visited NOMís D.C. office looking for its 2010 990s in early November and was told by executive assistant Paul Bothwell that the forms were due to the IRS on Nov. 15 and would be published on NOMís website. On Dec. 2, TAI returned to NOMís office, and Bothwell promptly printed out the records. The forms indicate that NOM will not be making the records available online.)

Karger, who launched an ethics investigation against NOM in California and in Maine and closely tracks the groupís legal cases, told TAI that based on NOMís legal activities alone, he suspects the organizationís budget is higher than what they are reporting.

Though Karger still believes that the Mormon Church is in league with NOM, Jacobs said he thinks itís unlikely, due to all the attention and scrutiny the Mormon church faced after Proposition 8.

ďI would be very surprised if the Mormon Church gives anymore,Ē Jacobs told TAI.ďI think theyíre done.Ē

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#29 Mar 3, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Prop h8 is not the exception....who do u think funds NOM? They are NOT all about giving more civil legal rights and what's more, it's none of their business. If that were true, Utah would have passed non-discrimination laws long ago and stopped meddling here in the US and internationally. Using their "religion to justify their bigotry doesn't flyer well anymore. The world sees thru their lies and it's coming back to haunt them..whatdid the lizard quorum say again...they were " shocked" at the backlash after prop8? Shocked.....it shows how out of touch those old bigots really are. The more hate and lies they put out there, the more it comes back around to bite them.
The double standard lies they use to try to control LGBTs within their own congregation..people who are born Mormon and gay, have had devastating affects. Suicides, closeted people living lies and destroying families, the barbaric damages of evergreen, the enormous numbers of gay youth kicked out to live on the streets of Utah. For what? A pyramid scheme claiming to be a " Christian religion that holds every members access to Mormon high heaven for ransom. U gotta pay to play if u want to be a god. If Mormons allow gay people in heaven, it makes the whole doctrine false. Shaming and shunning are the only tools they have left....pretty sad for a cult that "loves everyone" isn't it?
I find nothing sad from any theistic group that's against same sex marriage. On the contrary it shouldn't be a surprise that they oppose homosexuality and or same sex marriage. With the exception of theistic religions that have went the way of popular opinion which I have no respect for, I find what the LDS and RCC and SBC do by their beliefs quite 'normal' of what they preach and won't support. Theistic religions that change with popular opinion, they're like certain towns and villages in Europe during WW2 that one week would be for the Allies that were there and the next week they would be for the Germans that would be there. I understand doing one's best to survive, but I have more respect for a theistic group that sticks to it's moral teachings than one that flip flops with popular opinion.
I think civil rights are civil rights and we all should have a right to them. But to find fault against a religion that teaches against specific things like homosexuality and or same sex marriage, I think it's a waste of time to find fault with the act of a religious group that is expected to take place. Just saying.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#30 Mar 3, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Well since you have a habit for blaming Mormons whether your correct or incorrect, I went to the web and found the following.
http://washingtonindependent.com/116452/nom%E...
Perhaps the man who trusts NOM the least is Fred Karger Ė least known for his long-shot GOP presidential campaign as the first openly gay candidate, but best known for exposing the Mormon Churchís extensive financial involvement in Californiaís Proposition 8 campaign that overturned the legalization of same-sex marriage in 2008.
After obtaining classified Mormon documents from an anonymous source, Karger has maintained his belief that the National Organization for Marriage was set up by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS) as a front group to funnel money for political campaigns against the legalization of same-sex marriage. Ever since, Karger has been tailing NOMís every move Ė ready to file a complaint each time it funds a political campaign and fails to register or disclose its donors.
This year Karger started hounding NOM for its 990s a month before they were due. He told TAI that in late October he sent one of his campaign staffers to NOMís D.C. headquarters on K Street, who came back empty-handed. He then mailed an accusatory letter to recently named NOM chairman John Eastman, which soured the stafferís ability to collect the forms on a subsequent visit to NOMís office on Nov. 16.
(TAI first visited NOMís D.C. office looking for its 2010 990s in early November and was told by executive assistant Paul Bothwell that the forms were due to the IRS on Nov. 15 and would be published on NOMís website. On Dec. 2, TAI returned to NOMís office, and Bothwell promptly printed out the records. The forms indicate that NOM will not be making the records available online.)
Karger, who launched an ethics investigation against NOM in California and in Maine and closely tracks the groupís legal cases, told TAI that based on NOMís legal activities alone, he suspects the organizationís budget is higher than what they are reporting.
Though Karger still believes that the Mormon Church is in league with NOM, Jacobs said he thinks itís unlikely, due to all the attention and scrutiny the Mormon church faced after Proposition 8.
ďI would be very surprised if the Mormon Church gives anymore,Ē Jacobs told TAI.ďI think theyíre done.Ē
" Most of NOMís funding for lobbying and ballot initiatives comes through its 501(c)4, which allows it to keep hidden much of its donor information"
...does NOM have prominent Mormons on its board of directors, now and in the past? If you are gullible enough to believe the quorum isn't still connected to NOM, you are willingly being hoodwinked. Why? Idk and I don't care either. The church needs to grow a pair and accept responsibility for prop h8 and every other legislation they have tried to quietly go after...you apologists trying to blame everyone else but the elephant in the room is frankly silly at this point.. Wave your hate flag proudly! if Fred phelps can do it, so can the lizards. Why do Mormons always play the victim after they get caught being despicable?

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#31 Mar 3, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
I find nothing sad from any theistic group that's against same sex marriage. On the contrary it shouldn't be a surprise that they oppose homosexuality and or same sex marriage. With the exception of theistic religions that have went the way of popular opinion which I have no respect for, I find what the LDS and RCC and SBC do by their beliefs quite 'normal' of what they preach and won't support. Theistic religions that change with popular opinion, they're like certain towns and villages in Europe during WW2 that one week would be for the Allies that were there and the next week they would be for the Germans that would be there. I understand doing one's best to survive, but I have more respect for a theistic group that sticks to it's moral teachings than one that flip flops with popular opinion.
I think civil rights are civil rights and we all should have a right to them. But to find fault against a religion that teaches against specific things like homosexuality and or same sex marriage, I think it's a waste of time to find fault with the act of a religious group that is expected to take place. Just saying.
Talking out of both sides of your mouth again. I really could care less what someone believes, it's what they DO that brings those beliefs into focus. Discrimination is ugly, against everything Jesus taught and completely un-American. If the cult wants to be on the wrong side of history AGAIN, so be it. They can enjoy their continued exodus of members and exposure.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#32 Mar 3, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
" Most of NOMís funding for lobbying and ballot initiatives comes through its 501(c)4, which allows it to keep hidden much of its donor information"
...does NOM have prominent Mormons on its board of directors, now and in the past? If you are gullible enough to believe the quorum isn't still connected to NOM, you are willingly being hoodwinked. Why? Idk and I don't care either. The church needs to grow a pair and accept responsibility for prop h8 and every other legislation they have tried to quietly go after...you apologists trying to blame everyone else but the elephant in the room is frankly silly at this point.. Wave your hate flag proudly! if Fred phelps can do it, so can the lizards. Why do Mormons always play the victim after they get caught being despicable?
Hoodwinked? About NOM? I know little of NOM. I have no connection to them. It would actually make sense that the LDS leaders would in fact have some connection to some anti-marriage organization that is supported by other Christian and non-Christian organizations. I would see nothing abnormal or wrong if one or more leaders were connected to that group or other groups like it. I would expect it of them wouldn't you?
And there are homosexual politicians claiming to be part of a Christian organization that are politically connected. Why is it so abhorrent to think Mormons have been doing the same thing for decades which they have done directly and indirectly. Each leader in any religion can be involved in politics. That's a right in this country. And it's a yes and no answer that a person represents their religious group.
I don't see where the LDS leaders claimed not to have an influence in prop 8 as their members were part of the fight. So how do you feel they need to accept responsibility for a fight they were obviously involved in directly and indirectly? I don't understand that statement unless you have read some where that I didn't read, that the LDS leaders claimed to have not had any involvement in prop 8?
lol...and wave a hate flag? A hate flag for what? That I support a US citizens right to vote their conscious? Is that a hate flag? A constitutional right to vote one's conscious? That I support religious freedom even if I disagree or agree? Is that constitutional right a hate flag to you also?

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#33 Mar 3, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Talking out of both sides of your mouth again. I really could care less what someone believes, it's what they DO that brings those beliefs into focus. Discrimination is ugly, against everything Jesus taught and completely un-American. If the cult wants to be on the wrong side of history AGAIN, so be it. They can enjoy their continued exodus of members and exposure.
No, understanding both sides to an issue goes a long way to understanding the issue at hand. And what someone believes usually leads them to act in kind.
Of Jesus, he began his ministry with discrimination. He came for the Jews and the Jews only. He stated that. He referred to all other peoples existing as dogs not worthy of his message. But Jesus was impressed by faith, especially the faith of non-Jews. And later in his ministry he rescinded his first statement.
Discrimination is discrimination, plain and simple. But if you're going to swear a war against one act of discrimination, you better be ready to fight all forms of discrimination or stand fast a hypocrite. Shacking up shouldn't be discriminated by religions. Neither should premarital sex or abortion or murder by self defence or adultery or swearing or using the Lords name in vain. Those all fall under acts of discrimination against those that do those things.
If you want to fight against discrimination, you better be open to fighting against all ways and manners of discrimination. Because if you're selective in what you'll be against and what you won't be against concerning discrimination, you stand as a bigot.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#34 Mar 3, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Talking out of both sides of your mouth again. I really could care less what someone believes, it's what they DO that brings those beliefs into focus. Discrimination is ugly, against everything Jesus taught and completely un-American. If the cult wants to be on the wrong side of history AGAIN, so be it. They can enjoy their continued exodus of members and exposure.
And you wish to speak about talking out both sides of one's mouth, let's discuss how homosexuals in general feel about polygamy. You have stated negative comments about polygamy. That by your definition defines you a discriminating bigot because you support one form of marriage and object to another, as is the case with certain people supporting opposite sex marriage and or same sex marriage.
People, not just religious people that support opposite sex marriage and or same sex marriage are discriminating hypocritical bigots by your definition.
The fact that most opposite sex supporters and same sex supporters discriminate against polygamy, by your definition defines them all as discriminating hypocritical bigots.
When it comes to civil matters, I believe a person should have a right to marry what or whom they wish to marry. We have a growing segment of people that are more happy in their personal relationships with an animal than humans. If they want to marry their animal and not for the purpose of sex why shouldn't they be allowed to? We have wealthy individuals leaving all or some of their estate to their animal(s) and not a relation at death! Some leave their wealth to their pet(s) and non-profit organizations.
Defining discrimination without including oneself as having done it or are doing it is tough not to do.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#35 Mar 3, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Hoodwinked? About NOM? I know little of NOM. I have no connection to them. It would actually make sense that the LDS leaders would in fact have some connection to some anti-marriage organization that is supported by other Christian and non-Christian organizations. I would see nothing abnormal or wrong if one or more leaders were connected to that group or other groups like it. I would expect it of them wouldn't you?
And there are homosexual politicians claiming to be part of a Christian organization that are politically connected. Why is it so abhorrent to think Mormons have been doing the same thing for decades which they have done directly and indirectly. Each leader in any religion can be involved in politics. That's a right in this country. And it's a yes and no answer that a person represents their religious group.
I don't see where the LDS leaders claimed not to have an influence in prop 8 as their members were part of the fight. So how do you feel they need to accept responsibility for a fight they were obviously involved in directly and indirectly? I don't understand that statement unless you have read some where that I didn't read, that the LDS leaders claimed to have not had any involvement in prop 8?
lol...and wave a hate flag? A hate flag for what? That I support a US citizens right to vote their conscious? Is that a hate flag? A constitutional right to vote one's conscious? That I support religious freedom even if I disagree or agree? Is that constitutional right a hate flag to you also?
If the cult is so proud of what they accomplished, why did they withhold their involvement to Cali election officials? Why were they so offended when the donor lists were made public? This is old news, if u(even tho u were on topix at the time, ripping posters for having a problem with what the mos were doing) need a refresher, go watch 8 TMP. Google LDS, Prop 8 and key words like "involvement" "secret" etc.(duh)
even u, in this thread tried to blame prop 8 on racial minorities in ca and totally minimize the cults involvement. Thing is, in the long run, Equality will win and the LDS will lose.. They chose hate nstead of love. They chose to hurt people instead of uplift, they chose to scheme about this years ago with attnys in Hawaii..thought they were smarter than the rest of the world and could secretly and quietly keep getting away with it. Karma.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#36 Mar 3, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
No, understanding both sides to an issue goes a long way to understanding the issue at hand. And what someone believes usually leads them to act in kind.
Of Jesus, he began his ministry with discrimination. He came for the Jews and the Jews only. He stated that. He referred to all other peoples existing as dogs not worthy of his message. But Jesus was impressed by faith, especially the faith of non-Jews. And later in his ministry he rescinded his first statement.
Discrimination is discrimination, plain and simple. But if you're going to swear a war against one act of discrimination, you better be ready to fight all forms of discrimination or stand fast a hypocrite. Shacking up shouldn't be discriminated by religions. Neither should premarital sex or abortion or murder by self defence or adultery or swearing or using the Lords name in vain. Those all fall under acts of discrimination against those that do those things.
If you want to fight against discrimination, you better be open to fighting against all ways and manners of discrimination. Because if you're selective in what you'll be against and what you won't be against concerning discrimination, you stand as a bigot.
Do you stick up for the KLAN too, because u understand "both sides of the issue"?

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#37 Mar 4, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
If the cult is so proud of what they accomplished, why did they withhold their involvement to Cali election officials? Why were they so offended when the donor lists were made public? This is old news, if u(even tho u were on topix at the time, ripping posters for having a problem with what the mos were doing) need a refresher, go watch 8 TMP. Google LDS, Prop 8 and key words like "involvement" "secret" etc.(duh)
even u, in this thread tried to blame prop 8 on racial minorities in ca and totally minimize the cults involvement. Thing is, in the long run, Equality will win and the LDS will lose.. They chose hate nstead of love. They chose to hurt people instead of uplift, they chose to scheme about this years ago with attnys in Hawaii..thought they were smarter than the rest of the world and could secretly and quietly keep getting away with it. Karma.
I will always have an issue with any one that tells another person they can't or shouldn't vote their conscious.
Next, I didn't 'blame' prop 8 on any body. I stated prop 8 passed because the majority of voters were non-Mormon. That's a fact. Non-Mormons in California prior to prop 8 voted against same sex marriage every time it was put to a vote by the people. Mormon $ weren't an influence in ads in prior voting instances proving people didn't need ads or Mormons to be influenced to vote against same sex marriage. So it's easy to claim Mormon $ helped voters decide to vote for prop 8 but past voting history in California shows that theory isn't as true as it's said to be.
Next, you need to realize something and that is LDS people will never lose anything. They have stood against homosexual activity and same sex marriage the same way they have stood against adultery, abortion, pre-marital sex, drinking, drugs, smoking, etc, etc. Their an established religion that most hate to love or loves to hate.
Your statement of how they hurt/hate people because their anti-same sex marriage, you could also say they choose hurt/hate over supporting a right to drink, smoke, do drugs, have non-emergency abortions, etc. Same application.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#38 Mar 4, 2013
NoMo wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you stick up for the KLAN too, because u understand "both sides of the issue"?
The KLAN has a history of out right purposeful discrimination fuelled by hate and physical and verbal violence. Jesus had no such comparable history.
And to understand how a person/group thinks doesn't mean one is sticking up for their beliefs. Sorry for your confusion not knowing the difference.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#39 Mar 4, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
I will always have an issue with any one that tells another person they can't or shouldn't vote their conscious.
Next, I didn't 'blame' prop 8 on any body. I stated prop 8 passed because the majority of voters were non-Mormon. That's a fact. Non-Mormons in California prior to prop 8 voted against same sex marriage every time it was put to a vote by the people. Mormon $ weren't an influence in ads in prior voting instances proving people didn't need ads or Mormons to be influenced to vote against same sex marriage. So it's easy to claim Mormon $ helped voters decide to vote for prop 8 but past voting history in California shows that theory isn't as true as it's said to be.
Next, you need to realize something and that is LDS people will never lose anything. They have stood against homosexual activity and same sex marriage the same way they have stood against adultery, abortion, pre-marital sex, drinking, drugs, smoking, etc, etc. Their an established religion that most hate to love or loves to hate.
Your statement of how they hurt/hate people because their anti-same sex marriage, you could also say they choose hurt/hate over supporting a right to drink, smoke, do drugs, have non-emergency abortions, etc. Same application.
God, you're exhausting. And once again, denying success(!) for one of the cults accomplishments. Short lived accomplishment, chasing bigotry globally does come back to haunt them, doesn't it?
Comparing being gay to bad habits and abortions? Pathetic...

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#40 Mar 4, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
The KLAN has a history of out right purposeful discrimination fuelled by hate and physical and verbal violence. Jesus had no such comparable history.
And to understand how a person/group thinks doesn't mean one is sticking up for their beliefs. Sorry for your confusion not knowing the difference.
So does your cult..one day they will have the official global designation of "hate group. Just like the KLAN.

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