Some Minn. Lawmakers Face Gay Marriag...

Some Minn. Lawmakers Face Gay Marriage Conflict

There are 164 comments on the EDGE story from Nov 14, 2012, titled Some Minn. Lawmakers Face Gay Marriage Conflict. In it, EDGE reports that:

ST. PAUL, Minn. - More valuable than any poll, Minnesota lawmakers got a strong pulse of their constituents this week on gay marriage through district-by-district, town-by-town results of a vote that rejected a constitutional ban on same-sex marriage.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at EDGE.

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#125 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
So NO COMPROMISE, ALL OR NOTHING, and on and on we will go FOREVER...just like with abortion...
I already have my rights, so go right ahead...
We'll all wait...
As you note, you already have your rights, so what do you care if we choose to wait for our full equality?

We will compromise where necessary with civil unions- i.e. Illinois, Pennsylvania, Colorado, etc.- where marriage isn't yet an option. But the ultimate goal now will always be full marriage equality nationwide.

Maybe if your fellow anti-gays had pushed for nationwide civil unions 20+ years ago, then we wouldn't be having this conversation. But of course we ALL know this isn't about marriage- it's about denying ANY recognition to same-sex couples, which is why your side fought civil unions all those years before marriage was ever even a consideration.

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#126 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
yup, but by putting everyone in the SAME GROUP, all of what you said is not applicable!
And I disagree, the religious get their precious name "marriage" the non-believers get a clear divide between religious relationships and legally recognized ones...
But the fact is, that YOU guys are rejecting the idea and claiming its because THEY would reject it...
it makes me think the rights are collateral to what you really want...
So what's stopping you from passing your "civil unions for all"?

Straight people have overwhelming super-duper majorities in EVERY legislaive body, both state & federal.

You can pass whatever you want at any time.

Go for it!

We'll wait........
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#127 Nov 19, 2012
WeTheSheeple wrote:
<quoted text>
As you note, you already have your rights, so what do you care if we choose to wait for our full equality?
Hey man, you are the one claiming how much damage it does to your families....
this tends to make me think that was a bit of hyperbole...

and what part of all of us having the same institution would be unequal (or are you just in the habit of adding that in to everything?)
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#128 Nov 19, 2012
WeTheSheeple wrote:
<quoted text>
So what's stopping you from passing your "civil unions for all"?
..
psst, look at the response I got, I can confidently say the gays REJECT it...
BTW, it was "civil partnerships".....forget the old language.. too much baggage...
say weren't you going on and on about the importance of terminology?

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#129 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
how?
The answer lies in your motivation to change the legal name recognized around the world as the primary relationship between two non-related adults forming a family. It is to appease those who don't want gay people to have what they have. It indulges and accommodates prejudice, and in doing so, that perpetuates and promotes it as well.
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#130 Nov 19, 2012
Not Yet Equal wrote:
<quoted text>
The answer lies in your motivation to change the legal name recognized around the world as the primary relationship between two non-related adults forming a family. It is to appease those who don't want gay people to have what they have. It indulges and accommodates prejudice, and in doing so, that perpetuates and promotes it as well.
so even if NO ONE can have it...that's still bigotry according to you, huh?

so you really dig the NAME huh, the actual rights are kinda incidental?

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#131 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey man, you are the one claiming how much damage it does to your families....
this tends to make me think that was a bit of hyperbole...
Documentation of the harm caused by legal discrimination has been supplied. There is plenty more if you have any doubts. The evidence through history, science, and law clearly shows prejudice and discrimination result in needless suffering and death.

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#132 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
so even if NO ONE can have it...that's still bigotry according to you, huh?
so you really dig the NAME huh, the actual rights are kinda incidental?
Where did I use the word "bigotry"?

We have covered this already. You want to give it to religions, even though that includes religious groups that accept marriage equality.

What is your motivation for removing from the law, the word recognized around the world?

(answer: to accommodate prejudice)

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#133 Nov 19, 2012
"Prejudice, we are beginning to understand, rises not from malice or hostile animus alone. It may result as well from insensitivity caused by simple want of careful, rational reflection or from some instinctive mechanism to guard against people who appear to be different in some respects from ourselves." (Golinski v)
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#134 Nov 19, 2012
Not Yet Equal wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did I use the word "bigotry"?
We have covered this already. You want to give it to religions, even though that includes religious groups that accept marriage equality.
What is your motivation for removing from the law, the word recognized around the world?
(answer: to accommodate prejudice)
Not at all, it was merely an attempt to GET YOU rights...
a compromise involves a trade off, you get that right?
so if you acede anything you "accommodate prejudice"?
good luck with the all or nothing, but its going to take you FOREVER if not longer..
that's also what compromises do...shorten the time frame...but I guess getting the rights doesn't make that big a difference in your actual life does it?

So tell me again how having all legal relationships be partnerships is any kind of prejudice?
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#135 Nov 19, 2012
Not Yet Equal wrote:
<quoted text>
Documentation of the harm caused by legal discrimination has been supplied. There is plenty more if you have any doubts. The evidence through history, science, and law clearly shows prejudice and discrimination result in needless suffering and death.
death?

talk about hyperbole!
Jane Dough

Barre, VT

#136 Nov 19, 2012
Not Yet Equal wrote:
"Prejudice, we are beginning to understand, rises not from malice or hostile animus alone. It may result as well from insensitivity caused by simple want of careful, rational reflection or from some instinctive mechanism to guard against people who appear to be different in some respects from ourselves." (Golinski v)
do you mean like how you guys treat the religious?
no respect and full disdain....

Lililth_Satans_B ore

Since: May 12

Bellevue, WA

#137 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
How about a compromise where you get ALL the rights and in return cede the name Marriage to the religious?
so is it really about the rights, then?
totally wrong stupid... in every state that has tried to pass domestic partnership or civil unions you christardo bigots fought it just as hatefully... so stfu

so it is really about the bigotry, then!!!!!!!!!

its called marriage and you can keep your bigotry under your hateful cross .. thank you

Lililth_Satans_B ore

Since: May 12

Bellevue, WA

#138 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
do you mean like how you guys treat the religious?
no respect and full disdain....
your right... i treat religious like scum... because they are

Lililth_Satans_B ore

Since: May 12

Bellevue, WA

#139 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
do you mean like how you guys treat the religious?
no respect and full disdain....
but don't worry your churches make for nice bonfires to roast smores over

your own ignorance and hatetred continues to push further youth away.... yesssss a day in the future without that ignorant mythical superstition

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#140 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
psst, look at the response I got, I can confidently say the gays REJECT it...
BTW, it was "civil partnerships".....forget the old language.. too much baggage...
say weren't you going on and on about the importance of terminology?
Psssst, gays aren't the majority in this country.

If straight people want to pass "civil partnerships", what's stopping you? You have overwhelming super-duper majorities in EVERY legislative body, state & federal. All you have to do is vote it in. There is NOTHING gays & lesbians can do to stop you from passing your "civil partnership" law.

Go for it.

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#141 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
do you mean like how you guys treat the religious?
no respect and full disdain....
It is only those religious groups and individuals who promote prejudice and discrimination that are not respected.

We realize many religious leaders, groups, and individuals believe in treating others the way they themselves want to be treated:

“There is a significant and growing consensus among biblical scholars about the few biblical texts that are often referenced as the basis for condemning same-gender loving people of God. Contemporary biblical scholarship argues strongly against this condemnation and finds a much more significant Gospel message that supports the inclusion of LGBT persons into the full life and mission of the church.”( United Church of Christ.”)

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#142 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey man, you are the one claiming how much damage it does to your families....
this tends to make me think that was a bit of hyperbole...
and what part of all of us having the same institution would be unequal (or are you just in the habit of adding that in to everything?)
Again, if we're willing to wait, what's it to you?

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#143 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
Not at all, it was merely an attempt to GET YOU rights...
a compromise involves a trade off, you get that right?
so if you acede anything you "accommodate prejudice"?
good luck with the all or nothing, but its going to take you FOREVER if not longer..
that's also what compromises do...shorten the time frame...but I guess getting the rights doesn't make that big a difference in your actual life does it?
So tell me again how having all legal relationships be partnerships is any kind of prejudice?
Again, what is your motivation for removing the word recognized around the world from the law?

Since: Jun 11

AOL

#144 Nov 19, 2012
Jane Dough wrote:
<quoted text>
death?
talk about hyperbole!
Prejudice and discrimination not only gives permission to those who would use violence to torture and kill us, it also results in self destruction both fast and slow. Here is a tiny sample of the documentation showing prejudice and discrimination result in needless suffering and death. There is plenty more.


"Being lesbian, gay, bisexual and/or transgender is not a risk factor for suicide," Powers emphasized. "Actually, it is the social stigma and discrimination that LGBT youth experience that results in feelings and behaviors which are, in turn, associated with suicidal behavior." The American Association of Suicidology.

"The research, published in the January Pediatrics (Vol. 123, No. 1), found that LGB adults who reported high rates of parental rejection in their teens were 8.4 times more likely to report having attempted suicide, 5.9 times more likely to report high levels of depression, 3.4 times more likely to use illegal drugs, and 3.4 times more likely to have had unprotected sex than LGB peers who reported no or low levels of family rejection, reports the study team, headed by Caitlin Ryan, PhD, of San Francisco State University.
"Because families play such a critical role in child and adolescent development, it is not surprising that adverse, punitive and traumatic reactions from parents and caregivers would have such a negative influence on [young people's] risk behaviors and health status as young adults," the authors write.

Preliminary results are promising: "We've seen that families can grow and become more supportive once they've learned how their words, actions and behaviors affect their LGBT children," she says."

With a youth suicide rate 4 to 8 times that of their straight peers, it should be obvious prejudice kills. You may not have heard of Carl Joseph Walker-Hoover, an 11-year-old boy who committed suicide after being relentlessly bullied at school with homophobic taunts, or Jaheem Herrera, a fifth-grader in the Atlanta area, who hanged himself in his room after enduring extreme daily bullying that included anti gay taunts. Or 14 year old Brandon Bitner who walked 13 miles and then ran in front of a Semi. He left a note. Anti-gay bullying was the cause. Many others have killed themselves as a result of the anti-gay prejudice you and others here promote.

"To assert that homosexuality is not a mental disorder does not mean that all gay and lesbian people are free of emotional problems or mental illness. In fact, some studies suggest that while most gays and lesbians are well adjusted, some (especially those subjected to harassment and prejudice or living in cultures extremely intolerant of homosexuality) are at risk for higher levels of depression and anxiety (Meyer, 2003, Cochran & Mays, 2006). This is a logical and expected correlation. Depression and anxiety are common, understandable reactions to societal prejudice, religious condemnation, employment discrimination, and familial rejection." (APA)

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