If Health Law Is Overturned, What Wil...

If Health Law Is Overturned, What Will Liberals Do?

There are 4935 comments on the thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com story from Mar 28, 2012, titled If Health Law Is Overturned, What Will Liberals Do?. In it, thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com reports that:

If the Supreme Court strikes down all or part of President Obama 's health care law , it will have unraveled a legislative compromise that many liberals had viewed with suspicion from the beginning.

In one of the ironies of recent politics, Mr. Obama was a late convert to the merits of the individual mandate that now appears to be in danger of being declared unconstitutional.

But the president’s embrace of the mandate — and his willingness to abandon a so-called public option to get a health care deal — was a hard pill to swallow for many of his Democratic supporters.

The Affordable Care Act promises to provide health insurance to millions who lacked it. But it also stops far short of the idea that health care is a basic right for everyone living in the country. And it embraces the market-based system of private health care delivery that has long existed in America.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com.

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curmudgeon

Mountain Home, AR

#5378 Mar 19, 2013

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#5379 Mar 19, 2013
Churmudgeon wrote:
<quoted text> I dont believe folks who build in low lying flood prone areas should be able to buy insurance anyway. They should build on high ground or build a house boat on a barge.
^^ This. When we lived in Houston there was a poor white area near where the San Jacinto River crosses I-10 called Banana Bend that flooded just about every storm. Those people there got all kinds of help from FEMA - they'd get flooded out, get low interest loans, and rebuild, lather, rince, repeat. They abused the system and we subsidized their lifestyle. It's like Sam Kinison's advice tos tarving Ethiopians: "You live in a desert; move!"
TheUglyTruth

Manhattan, KS

#5380 Mar 19, 2013
This whole thread should've been erased at least a year ago. It's not even about health care anymore. It's about conservative extremists jerking off in each other's faces.
curmudgeon

Bexar, AR

#5382 Mar 22, 2013

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#5383 Mar 23, 2013
curmudgeon wrote:
http://theeconomiccollapseblog .com/archives/after-the-bankst ers-steal-money-from-bank-acco unts-in-cyprus-they-will-start -doing-it-everywhere
All they did is copy the wall st model, lent to the greeks who could not pay and sent the country bankrupt. All this would never have happened if Reagan had not cut all the "red tape" as he called it on financial transactions. You can't blame other countries for following the Wall St model, after all in the financial world there are no borders. So if some cowboy bank is offering 2-3% higher returns on so called AAA products then it's obvious others will follow suite. Fact was that in some cases 40% of those AAA products were not worth a dime. So why should some poor bastard who saved a lifetime have to pay for a greedy banker's mistake.
curmudgeon

Bexar, AR

#5384 Mar 23, 2013
OzRitz wrote:
<quoted text>
All they did is copy the wall st model, lent to the greeks who could not pay and sent the country bankrupt. All this would never have happened if Reagan had not cut all the "red tape" as he called it on financial transactions. You can't blame other countries for following the Wall St model, after all in the financial world there are no borders. So if some cowboy bank is offering 2-3% higher returns on so called AAA products then it's obvious others will follow suite. Fact was that in some cases 40% of those AAA products were not worth a dime. So why should some poor bastard who saved a lifetime have to pay for a greedy banker's mistake.
Yes your correct/. The derivates market hasnt helped. If the Obama folks hadnt been funnelling money into the banks & stock market it would not be so high. This whole stagnant economy is a ponzi scheme that will eventually collapse. Now the question is Do the Cyprus parlament dare try and steal money from the Russaian Mafia? Those former KGB will extract revenge if you steal from them.
Curmudgeon

Ash Flat, AR

#5386 Jun 18, 2013
well the health cre plan snt madatory until 2014 and its allready having a negative imact. many buisnesses are reducing their workforce so they wont have to pay. There isnt any reward great enough or any punishment harsh enough to cause the USA gun owners to registar or give up their arms. That stubborn additude will carry on when it comes to the illegal & uncounstitional health care. The second admendment gives the means to disobey uncounstitional laws.
garrfem

Donora, PA

#5389 Jun 18, 2013
youtube.com/watch... Get Lucky the Liberals might deport more Illegal Aliens?

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#5391 Jun 18, 2013
Curmudgeon wrote:
well the health cre plan snt madatory until 2014 and its allready having a negative imact. many buisnesses are reducing their workforce so they wont have to pay. There isnt any reward great enough or any punishment harsh enough to cause the USA gun owners to registar or give up their arms. That stubborn additude will carry on when it comes to the illegal & uncounstitional health care. The second admendment gives the means to disobey uncounstitional laws.
Some employers here in Indiana have already dropped their employee sponsored health insurance because it was cheaper to pay the fine than keep the employees employer sponsored health Insurance and there is more to come.
Curmudgeon

Ash Flat, AR

#5392 Jun 19, 2013
The picture frame factory in pocahontas ar terminated all of its full time employees. they replaced the forklift operator who had been there for 38 years with two 19 hour per week workers from AID Temporary. And I dont blame them. They are doing the correct thing. All of the right,s named in the Counstition & Bill of Rights where not given to the citizens by the founders. Those are inalienable Rights. They are god Given rights. A citizen has a moral obligation to disobey and not comply with uncounstitional laws. the Tax and spend economy is doomed . too many parasite takers and too few producing makers.
disgusting

Junction City, KS

#5393 Jun 19, 2013
Curmudgeon wrote:
The picture frame factory in pocahontas ar terminated all of its full time employees. they replaced the forklift operator who had been there for 38 years with two 19 hour per week workers from AID Temporary. And I dont blame them. They are doing the correct thing. All of the right,s named in the Counstition & Bill of Rights where not given to the citizens by the founders. Those are inalienable Rights. They are god Given rights. A citizen has a moral obligation to disobey and not comply with uncounstitional laws. the Tax and spend economy is doomed . too many parasite takers and too few producing makers.
I think the owner sound like a disgusting pos. If you're telling the truth. If that is the way they're going to treat a loyal employee just to save a few bucks, wow - totally disgusting. But, according to their web site "Pinnacle Frames and Accents is an equal opportunity employer who offers competitive salaries and benefit packages." So, which is it?

Fortunately, it seems across the country most small businesses are not following through with the "sky is falling" doom and gloom prophecies. Kinda like when businesses went up in arms about having to pay a minimum wage all the boo hooing about how that was going to destroy business. It is unfortunate that we need government to step in when people refuse to do the right thing, but you're picture frame company is a perfect example.

BTW - What is in our constitution and bill of rights are man-given rights. It was a bunch of men who wrote it - not God. I have yet to see anywhere in the Bible that God said we have any freedom at all, but of course I am sure in due time there will be another rewrite of the book that will include that somewhere!
Curmudgeon

Ash Flat, AR

#5395 Jun 19, 2013
Jody Smith 60 years old was given a pink slip last christmas. He lives at Ravenden Spring,s Ar. His pink slip simply stated that his position was eliminated. He recieved nothing . Zero no severance no early retirement nothing. He was allowed to draw unemployment. Jody loved his job. 38 years and never missed a day. He planned on working there until he was 65. Len Anderson also of Ravenden Springs is another lomgtime employee who was let go. The local Wal Mart has reduced it,s employees hours. they now have very few full time employees. Buisness does what it hs to do in order to survive. Most of our factories here Up and left. they went to some other country. TRW, Skill,Brown Shoe, Waterloo, and several more just closed down.Myself Im in buisness and know the hardships that are placed upon the owner by the goverment. And Everyones counstitional rights even yours are indeed god given
Curmudgeon

Ash Flat, AR

#5397 Jun 19, 2013
Ok that factory started out in a local mans garage. Mr Maggee made picture frames from wood bought from local sawmillers. He expanded and grew his buisness. then he sold to the tandy corporation. Tandy sold to pinnacle. They dont even make wood picture frames anymore. Its a assembly plant where foriegn made plastic componets are assembled and repackaged. The managers are local guys who are scared shitless that they will meet the same fate as jody smith. Im ok with the companys refusing to comply with the uncounstitional health care law. The more who dont comply the better. If everyone refused to comply what are the goverment enforcers gonna do? The goverment cant force or bribe anyone to willingly do something as unpopular and costly as the Health care.The Health care has already caused many jobs to be gone. It will cause many more jobs & buisness to dissappear.What it does is force citizens to engage in commerce. Your told buy health insurance or else? You become a criminial if you dont do something.

Since: Jul 11

Location hidden

#5398 Jun 19, 2013
Curmudgeon wrote:
Ok that factory started out in a local mans garage. Mr Maggee made picture frames from wood bought from local sawmillers. He expanded and grew his buisness. then he sold to the tandy corporation. Tandy sold to pinnacle. They dont even make wood picture frames anymore. Its a assembly plant where foriegn made plastic componets are assembled and repackaged. The managers are local guys who are scared shitless that they will meet the same fate as jody smith. Im ok with the companys refusing to comply with the uncounstitional health care law. The more who dont comply the better. If everyone refused to comply what are the goverment enforcers gonna do? The goverment cant force or bribe anyone to willingly do something as unpopular and costly as the Health care.The Health care has already caused many jobs to be gone. It will cause many more jobs & buisness to dissappear.What it does is force citizens to engage in commerce. Your told buy health insurance or else? You become a criminial if you dont do something.
It's one thing to set up a business that only makes a profit by by-passing the government rules and another thing altogether a business model who factors in all the gov rules & reg to still profit.
Doing what it takes to survive is fine even the biggest companies go through that from Apple who may make a phone no one wants to the local picture frame guy. But never use the excuse its because of the health insurance or taxes or some other fee that sends them broke. That is BS, the G8 meeting that never agree on anything, agreed on closing all the tax havens that has become a national pastime for leading companies around the world including major US companies. That is business behaving at its worst.
Curmudgeon

Ash Flat, AR

#5399 Jun 19, 2013
OzRitz wrote:
<quoted text>
It's one thing to set up a business that only makes a profit by by-passing the government rules and another thing altogether a business model who factors in all the gov rules & reg to still profit.
Doing what it takes to survive is fine even the biggest companies go through that from Apple who may make a phone no one wants to the local picture frame guy. But never use the excuse its because of the health insurance or taxes or some other fee that sends them broke. That is BS, the G8 meeting that never agree on anything, agreed on closing all the tax havens that has become a national pastime for leading companies around the world including major US companies. That is business behaving at its worst.
Do really believe that the companies that left US soil are paying the same cost of production where they escaped too . same as those who stayed are paying? Maytag went broke. Mattell the toymaker went broke. Westing house went broke. bethelem steel and Us steel went broke. The car companies are a shell of what they once where. International harvester went broke. And the health care has cost jobs. If you cant pass any increase in cost of production on to your customers you will fail. for example the simple fact is if a company relocates from the us to mexico and moves its corporate headquarters to mexico, that company is no longer a us company and doesnt owe any taxes or have any moral obligation to the usa. they shure as heck domt have to pay for health care. those companies can under sell the us made product and still make more money.the fact is moral behavior cannott be legislated.

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