House passes 20-week abortion ban

House passes 20-week abortion ban

There are 426 comments on the Feministing story from Jun 19, 2013, titled House passes 20-week abortion ban. In it, Feministing reports that:

Yesterday evening the House of Representatives passed the "Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act," a ban on legal abortions 20 weeks or more after fertilization based on dubious evidence that fetuses can feel pain during the second trimester.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Feministing.

Dan

Omaha, NE

#164 Jul 11, 2013
Broseph wrote:
<quoted text>
IVF is sex to you?
You equated it with sex as procreation, not me.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#165 Jul 11, 2013
Broseph wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did my DNA for all of my cells come from? From a man and a woman. Where does the zygote's DNA come from? From a man and a woman. Also, all of my cells are distinct from one another from point mutation and INDEL mutation. Also, that zygote isn't an individual. It's development and survival depends entirely on the woman.
Its "individual" as in separate and distinct.

If your cheek gets swabbed, it won't be your mom or dad's DNA. It'll be yours.

When that zygote develops, is born and it's cheek gets swabbed at 3 months, it' be its DNA, not it's mom or dads. It's entirely dependent upon someone else for survival, but it has it's own DNA.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#166 Jul 11, 2013
Broseph wrote:
<quoted text>
"In 2006, HIV activist and prevention advocates in Uganda expressed concern that the new emphasis on abstinence-only programmes and RESTRICTIONS IN CONDOM SUPPLY were reversing two decades of successful HIV prevention work, after a survey found that HIV prevalence was starting to increase again.2 The national serostatus survey for 2004-05 showed that average national prevalence was 6.4%, slightly up from 6.2% just over a year previously. Infection was shifting from the young people to adults aged between 30 and 40 years. Prevalence rates have traditionally been higher among younger people, so the new trend baffled health workers. There are at least 1.4 million Ugandans living with HIV."
That's 7 years ago. You're going backwards, not forwards.

It's 2013 now.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#167 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
Again, given how many people are pro-choice, or pro-life with acknowledgement that they don't get to make that decision, you obviously thought wrong.
I didn't think "wrong".

It's not wrong to state the fact that pregnant women make decisions based upon their acknowledgement that there is s separate life involved.

They do whether they carry to term or abort. Either way, they act upon their acknowledgement of it.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#168 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
They're going to abort the pregnancy. You don't have the authority to say what they think about the embryo/fetus.
And no, I'm not defining it by location. We've been through this already. I'm comparing the functioning of organ systems to illustrate the FACT that there is a difference between caretaking, and being dependent on the organ systems of another for life support.
I don't need "authority" to state what's known. If women didn't think there was a separate life involved, they wouldn't abort. If they don't abort, they'll get a baby at the end of 9 months or so. They know that, so they abort.

Why do you work so hard to deny this? All I'm asserting is basic cognizance on part of the woman as to what's going on with her own body, and you're fighting even that.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#169 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you seriously suggesting that there will never be another available source to give those things to an infant?
A fetus is dependent for MORE than those things, and only ONE available source for them, as we've already established.
I'm seriously suggesting that a 10 month old will die if left without a source of food, warmth and shelter. It's in the same boat as the fetus who's mother dies.

Morgana 9

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#170 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
No one but you denies that a fetus is an separate life from the mother.
If you were correct, the woman's life would be terminated at the abortion. It's not. The life of the fetus is terminated, thus proving that they are separate human lives.
So you contend that the fetus is not in anyway connected to the mother, or lives off her resources?

If the mother dies the fetus dies.

When the life of the fetus is terminated, the woman/girls body returns to normal and she has no further medical issues.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#171 Jul 11, 2013
Broseph wrote:
Temporary shortage, they reordered.

Thanks
Dan

Omaha, NE

#172 Jul 11, 2013
Broseph wrote:
<quoted text>
Nice how you ignored the whole thing about complex growth factors.
Why pay any mind to it?

You assert that your fingertip is equal to a zygote RE: DNA, and it isn't and never will be nor can it be.

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#173 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't think "wrong".
It's not wrong to state the fact that pregnant women make decisions based upon their acknowledgement that there is s separate life involved.
They do whether they carry to term or abort. Either way, they act upon their acknowledgement of it.
Ah, there is it, the dishonesty. That is not what I said, and it's not what YOU'D said earlier. You said a woman HAS TO take that into consideration. I asked "says who?", and YOU said "society, I thought". You thought wrong.

Morgana 9

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#174 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't need "authority" to state what's known. If women didn't think there was a separate life involved, they wouldn't abort. If they don't abort, they'll get a baby at the end of 9 months or so. They know that, so they abort.
Why do you work so hard to deny this? All I'm asserting is basic cognizance on part of the woman as to what's going on with her own body, and you're fighting even that.
There is a medical issue involved for the woman. Aborting returns the woman/girls body to normal. If they don't abort then they continue with the medical aspects of the pregnancy and child birth. What is going on with a woman/girls body related to a pregnancy is individual, not two are the same.

You are the one fighting what is going on with a womans body. You do not consider it any any terms of medical .

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#175 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm seriously suggesting that a 10 month old will die if left without a source of food, warmth and shelter. It's in the same boat as the fetus who's mother dies.
10 month olds aren't guaranteed to be left without a source just because their mother dies.

A fetus IS guaranteed to be left with non-functioning organ systems if the woman who is providing them with life support through her own dies.

An honest person would acknowledge that.

Just one of the differences between a fetus and a neonate from our previous conversation on the subject.

Morgana 9

“And the Horse You Rode in On”

Since: Sep 08

Minneapolis

#176 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm seriously suggesting that a 10 month old will die if left without a source of food, warmth and shelter. It's in the same boat as the fetus who's mother dies.
Seriously? What happened to daddy? Where is he??

There are more than one to care for a born child. Not to mention extended family.

You are reaching and struggling Dan.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#177 Jul 11, 2013
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
So you contend that the fetus is not in anyway connected to the mother, or lives off her resources?
If the mother dies the fetus dies.
When the life of the fetus is terminated, the woman/girls body returns to normal and she has no further medical issues.
I don't think I contended that, no. Don't even think I implied it.

"When the life of the fetus is terminated, the woman/girls body returns to normal and she has no further medical issues."

No further medical issues EVER? Holy cow! So they'll like, live forever or something?

“Blessed Be”

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#178 Jul 11, 2013
Dan wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't need "authority" to state what's known. If women didn't think there was a separate life involved, they wouldn't abort. If they don't abort, they'll get a baby at the end of 9 months or so. They know that, so they abort.
Why do you work so hard to deny this? All I'm asserting is basic cognizance on part of the woman as to what's going on with her own body, and you're fighting even that.
It is NOT "known" what every woman who has an abortion thinks of the embryo/fetus in her uterus.

What's aborted is the pregnancy. That's what abortion MEANS in terms of a pregnancy.

And no, there is also no guarantee they WOULD get a baby at the end. 35% of all pregnancies are spontaneously aborted.

I deny it because what you're saying is untrue. Of course a woman knows that if she has an abortion the pregnancy will be over and the embryo/fetus will die. But YOU pretending you know what every woman who gets an abortion thinks ABOUT that embryo/fetus, is dishonest.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#179 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah, there is it, the dishonesty. That is not what I said, and it's not what YOU'D said earlier. You said a woman HAS TO take that into consideration. I asked "says who?", and YOU said "society, I thought". You thought wrong.
You've lost track here.

Your post:

"The pregnant woman is host to a separate human life created due to an action taken of her own volition. She has to take that into consideration during her decision making process"

Says who?"

My Response:

"Well, everyone does, I thought. The woman knows it. She gestates to term and gives birth or she takes specific action to terminate the pregnancy-either way, she's acknowledging the fact that there's a separate entity involved that requires action on her part either way she goes."

I should have said "everyone KNOWS that they have to".

I've said maybe thrice now that women have to take the separate life thing into consideration and that they do in fact do this, whether they keep it for abort it.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#180 Jul 11, 2013
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a medical issue involved for the woman. Aborting returns the woman/girls body to normal. If they don't abort then they continue with the medical aspects of the pregnancy and child birth. What is going on with a woman/girls body related to a pregnancy is individual, not two are the same.
You are the one fighting what is going on with a womans body. You do not consider it any any terms of medical .
I'm calling BS on this one, Morgana.

9 months returns the woman's body to normal. They abort the fetus as to not have a child they don't want. If people do abort so they can fit back into their skinny jeans, they don't admit to it.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#181 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
10 month olds aren't guaranteed to be left without a source just because their mother dies.
A fetus IS guaranteed to be left with non-functioning organ systems if the woman who is providing them with life support through her own dies.
An honest person would acknowledge that.
Just one of the differences between a fetus and a neonate from our previous conversation on the subject.
A 10 month-old isn't guaranteed TO have a source.

An infant is no more practically viable than a fetus.

Neither can live independently.

Honest people acknowledge that.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#182 Jul 11, 2013
Morgana 9 wrote:
<quoted text>
Seriously? What happened to daddy? Where is he??
There are more than one to care for a born child. Not to mention extended family.
You are reaching and struggling Dan.
LOL.

It's not a reach, unless you can tell me that a 10 month old isn't wholly dependent upon another for survival.
Dan

Omaha, NE

#183 Jul 11, 2013
Bitner wrote:
<quoted text>
It is NOT "known" what every woman who has an abortion thinks of the embryo/fetus in her uterus.
What's aborted is the pregnancy. That's what abortion MEANS in terms of a pregnancy.
And no, there is also no guarantee they WOULD get a baby at the end. 35% of all pregnancies are spontaneously aborted.
I deny it because what you're saying is untrue. Of course a woman knows that if she has an abortion the pregnancy will be over and the embryo/fetus will die. But YOU pretending you know what every woman who gets an abortion thinks ABOUT that embryo/fetus, is dishonest.
I didn't say a damn thing about what the woman THINKS about the embryo/fetus. No one thing.

I said women know it's living and that an abortion causes its death, and they make decisions. You agree with me here. That was my point. Really-that was my point.

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