It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103311 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Teaman

Abingdon, VA

#94668 Jan 8, 2013
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
What?
Many of the posted gun license owners are police, retired and active.
GoGoBar

Thailand

#94669 Jan 8, 2013
Punc wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL you people are idiots. Children should't be attending gun shows, they should be at school. Then again, you wouldnt know because apparently you have never gone to school.
Idiot, he killed himself! you think he wouldnt havd enough time to kill at least one child before an armed teacher pulled her trigger? He was not afraid to die you uneducated baboon. more guns would have at least killed one in your theory, I guess thats ok with you. Killer idiot.
You have to love the gun show argument.

.All guns must be unloaded, tied and the magazines removed.
THIS INCLUDES FIREARMS OF CONCEALED CARRY PERMIT HOLDERS.
2.All ammo must be in sealed containers.
3.No loaded magazines allowed in the show.
4.No cameras allowed in the show.
5.Carts, dollys and baby strollers used to carry trade items cannot be brought into the show except by dealers.
6.Police officers who are in uniform or who are displaying badges have free admission.
7.All Federal, State and Local laws must be obeyed.
downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#94670 Jan 8, 2013
Guppy wrote:
The inspiration of the Bible depends upon the ignorance of the gentleman who reads it.
RGI
"I have examined all religions, as well as my narrow sphere, my straightened means, and my busy life, would allow; and the result is that the Bible is the best Book in the world. It contains more philosophy than all the libraries I have seen."
John Adams

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#94671 Jan 8, 2013
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
No, Im not, but if someone is in trouble, or I can lend a hand, I do.
Does that count ?
In this case no, as the issue about government vs religion is one where you need to have a fanatical ideology where you believe if you are not doing the work of god you are sinning and therefore there world is governed or coloured by those perceptions.......
Dr Freud

Northwich, UK

#94672 Jan 8, 2013
Punc wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL you people are idiots. Children should't be attending gun shows, they should be at school.
They should be at school? Where they get a gosh darned good brainwashing, like yourself?
Punc wrote:
Then again, you wouldnt know because apparently you have never gone to school.
Speak for yourself!
Punc wrote:
Idiot, he killed himself! you think he wouldnt havd enough time to kill at least one child before an armed teacher pulled her trigger?
How do YOU know he committed suicide? Were YOU there? Were there ANY witnesses at all to that event?
There were THREE other shooters that day, two of which were captured in the woods behind the school, and one out in front of the school was slammed to the ground, and arrested.
Punc wrote:
He was not afraid to die you uneducated baboon.
YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT!
Punc wrote:
more guns would have at least killed one in your theory, I guess thats ok with you. Killer idiot.
So, let's see: If a teacher had had a gun, the shooting would likely have been ended quickly. Or, more likely if the shooters KNEW that teachers were armed, the shooting wouldn't have taken place at all.
There goes YOUR 'theory.'
MORE GUNS = LESS CRIME!

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#94673 Jan 8, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
"I have examined all religions, as well as my narrow sphere, my straightened means, and my busy life, would allow; and the result is that the Bible is the best Book in the world. It contains more philosophy than all the libraries I have seen."
John Adams
I take it that he had read the bible from cover to cover....did he read every philosophy book from cover to cover to be able to make such a statement?.....I am betting no!
GoGoBar

Thailand

#94674 Jan 8, 2013
Dr Freud wrote:
<quoted text>
They should be at school? Where they get a gosh darned good brainwashing, like yourself?
<quoted text>
Speak for yourself!
<quoted text>
How do YOU know he committed suicide? Were YOU there? Were there ANY witnesses at all to that event?
There were THREE other shooters that day, two of which were captured in the woods behind the school, and one out in front of the school was slammed to the ground, and arrested.
<quoted text>
YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT!
<quoted text>
So, let's see: If a teacher had had a gun, the shooting would likely have been ended quickly. Or, more likely if the shooters KNEW that teachers were armed, the shooting wouldn't have taken place at all.
There goes YOUR 'theory.'
MORE GUNS = LESS CRIME!
If the three man squad KNEW the teacher had a gun they might just shoot the teacher first.
Most likely they would just open up on the playground or sportsfield with Bushmasters from a safe distance.
More guns just changes tactics if the GUNNUTS have access to sophisticated firearms.
downhill246

Boca Raton, FL

#94675 Jan 8, 2013
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
I take it that he had read the bible from cover to cover....did he read every philosophy book from cover to cover to be able to make such a statement?.....I am betting no!
He was known as a prolific reader of the bible and I am quite sure he was merely trying to make a point. He once said that a republican form of government would not be successful in France, calling it “a republic of thirty million atheists.”
Tm Clmns

Victoria, Canada

#94676 Jan 8, 2013
Dr Freud wrote:
<quoted text>
They should be at school? Where they get a gosh darned good brainwashing, like yourself?
<quoted text>
Speak for yourself!
<quoted text>
How do YOU know he committed suicide? Were YOU there? Were there ANY witnesses at all to that event?
There were THREE other shooters that day, two of which were captured in the woods behind the school, and one out in front of the school was slammed to the ground, and arrested.
<quoted text>
YOU DO NOT KNOW THAT!
<quoted text>
So, let's see: If a teacher had had a gun, the shooting would likely have been ended quickly. Or, more likely if the shooters KNEW that teachers were armed, the shooting wouldn't have taken place at all.
There goes YOUR 'theory.'
MORE GUNS = LESS CRIME!
Idiot... these shooters know they are going to die.. T hat is part of their plan.
Guards with a gun will only attract more psychos.. They would rather not shoot themselves.
It's extra work...

School removes "brainwashing" from stupid "common sense" thinking.

Voting should be restricted to educated people..

Also...NRA membership should exclude you from the voter's list.....

More guns = more deaths. Hope you are one of them..

Thankfully, the stupid woman who bought all these guns at New Town got her
just reward.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#94677 Jan 8, 2013
All guns owned or possessed by a any person are required to be registered and accounted for and a stutory declaration officially signed and forwarded to the relevent officials....All those who fail to do this will issued with a summons and must appear in court....where a fine will be issued and compliance with the order required..
1) All guns owned or possessed to be registered within a one month of a witnessed and signed declaration or ALL unlicenced guns must be handed into a official and monitored secure self locking gun bin, along with prior notice of their arrival.
2) Any person with a criminal record caught with an unlicenced weapon, whether used in a crime or not will recieve an automatic non parole jail term of five years.
3) Any person caught with an unlicensed weapon after the time given to have them licensed will be fined $10,000 per item and will not be elligable to own a gun for 5 years,
3a) Repeat violators of article 3. the offender will recieve a non parole jail term of 2 years which with be applied at time of arrest and enacted immediately.

This could be the way to go!

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#94679 Jan 8, 2013
downhill246 wrote:
<quoted text>
He was known as a prolific reader of the bible and I am quite sure he was merely trying to make a point. He once said that a republican form of government would not be successful in France, calling it “a republic of thirty million atheists.”
Obvious a pious person.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#94680 Jan 8, 2013
jaes wrote:
None of my weapon are registered but then I do not serve the democrat republican government. Sorry that your country is forced into servitude.
Irrelevant.....it would work to serve as a good mode of controlling those who have failed to license their weapons by hitting them where it hurts...financially and with penaly....
GoGoBar

Thailand

#94681 Jan 8, 2013
By any measurable effect you can only conclude that the second ammendment is a failure.

Considering there is no "Well regulated Militia" it should be repealed under the "Archaic" clause in the constitution.

14955 Murders per year

8700 gunnut homides (Misuse by the people)

201 Justifiable Gun Homicides.(LOL)
JusttheFacts

Rochester, KY

#94682 Jan 8, 2013
Ahomana wrote:
All guns owned or possessed by a any person are required to be registered and accounted for and a stutory declaration officially signed and forwarded to the relevent officials....All those who fail to do this will issued with a summons and must appear in court....where a fine will be issued and compliance with the order required..
1) All guns owned or possessed to be registered within a one month of a witnessed and signed declaration or ALL unlicenced guns must be handed into a official and monitored secure self locking gun bin, along with prior notice of their arrival.
2) Any person with a criminal record caught with an unlicenced weapon, whether used in a crime or not will recieve an automatic non parole jail term of five years.
3) Any person caught with an unlicensed weapon after the time given to have them licensed will be fined $10,000 per item and will not be elligable to own a gun for 5 years,
3a) Repeat violators of article 3. the offender will recieve a non parole jail term of 2 years which with be applied at time of arrest and enacted immediately.
This could be the way to go!
Look stupid person. It is not and has not been a problem in the US with gun owners that have gotten them by legal means. I would need to do some more research but I'm almost positive ALL the guns that have been used in the school shootings, which is what this is all about, were stolen. No crime was committed by the owners.
ManWithNoBum

Perth, Australia

#94683 Jan 8, 2013
Why does anyone want the government to be the only people with guns.
Why do you want one group of people to have complete power over you ?
GoGoBar

Thailand

#94684 Jan 8, 2013
ManWithNoBum wrote:
Why does anyone want the government to be the only people with guns.
Why do you want one group of people to have complete power over you ?
In your country 97% of the people vote for the Govt.
So the Govt IS a subset of the people.
Because firearms are common in your country, it is only prudent that Enforcement Agencies be equally armed.
Your police are not a part of the Govt. They are a seperate entity and only enforce laws. The police in control of the police are commissioned officers and not elected.
None of your Judiciary are popularly elected.

You enjoy a very safe society.
ManWithNoBum

Perth, Australia

#94685 Jan 8, 2013
GoGoBar wrote:
<quoted text>
In your country 97% of the people vote for the Govt.
So the Govt IS a subset of the people.
Because firearms are common in your country, it is only prudent that Enforcement Agencies be equally armed.
Your police are not a part of the Govt. They are a seperate entity and only enforce laws. The police in control of the police are commissioned officers and not elected.
None of your Judiciary are popularly elected.
You enjoy a very safe society.
The police always act on the side of whatever government is in power, therefore they are a tool of the government.
They would do as they were told no matter what government was in power.
So if the police were to be the only ones with guns, that would effectively make the government the only ones with guns.
Its very suspicious that people want to take guns away... very suspicious.
ManWithNoBum

Perth, Australia

#94686 Jan 8, 2013
If John Howards gun laws were so effective, why did they police have to upgrade their weapons from 6 shot revolvers to semi automatic 15 shot Glocks. You would think they police would be cutting back if the new laws were so successful like the media keeps saying.
For a government that claims to dislike shootings, the police seem to shoot quite a few people that are not armed with guns.
Marauder

Palmer, AK

#94687 Jan 8, 2013
tinydropthestickgooddog wrote:
<quoted text>
what you got against pink
- MR PINK ?
Nothing for the things that should be pink...just won't be my guns.
GoGoBar

Thailand

#94688 Jan 8, 2013
ManWithNoBum wrote:
<quoted text>
The police always act on the side of whatever government is in power, therefore they are a tool of the government.
They would do as they were told no matter what government was in power.
So if the police were to be the only ones with guns, that would effectively make the government the only ones with guns.
Its very suspicious that people want to take guns away... very suspicious.
The police are seperate from the Govt. and can only act within the law.
The Govt. is elected after 97% of the people vote.
Unless you institute a one party form of politics it is impossible to get a more representative legislative subset of the people.

The effectiveness of your policies is well documented in your low murder rate and low prison population. There are less gunnuts to lock up or commit easy murder.

No High Income Democracy Govt.has more guns than the populace.

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