It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103340 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Light Bearer

Perth, Australia

#90054 Dec 25, 2012
Aquarius-WY wrote:
<quoted text>
I now ask you sir,
what is the "free state"?
Which of the three entities are that "free state"?
Is it the government?
Is it the states themselves individually or severally?
Is it the people themsleves?
My argument would be

There are no States that are not free in the Union
And All states have a Well Regulated Miltia

The people have a right to bear arms but those rights are not unlimited and all laws must be obeyed.

Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal.

Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated.

“We don't have to take it”

Since: Jun 08

WhereTFamI?

#90055 Dec 25, 2012
Dr Freud wrote:
That's not nice. Behave!

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90056 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
My argument would be
There are no States that are not free in the Union
And All states have a Well Regulated Miltia
The people have a right to bear arms but those rights are not unlimited and all laws must be obeyed.
Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal.
Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated.
So, you have no intention of answering the simple question.
One is left to wonder if it is because you are simply incapable of objective thought.
It would appear so.

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90057 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
My argument would be
There are no States that are not free in the Union
And All states have a Well Regulated Miltia
The people have a right to bear arms but those rights are not unlimited and all laws must be obeyed.
Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal.
Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated.
"My argument would be" has no place here.
I did not present an argument that begged a counter, sir.
I asked you a simple question.
ONE simple question, and you respond with a counter argument to something that does not exist in my post.

<shakes head, and ponders what Miss Bunny is doing today>

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90058 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal.
...
Chances are that they all, by definitive catagory, and other descriptions/definitions, have been used thusly.

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90059 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated.
Interesting.

Your programmed drivel up ^there^ is precisely why firearms are the ONLY effective defense against any "state", deemed "free" or otherwise, which the people ultimately have sir.

"deemed to be a threat to any free state"

Precisely just who are those charged with making that determination?
The Wise Ones

Montréal, Canada

#90060 Dec 25, 2012
Aquarius-WY wrote:
<quoted text>
"I live in the present, not by outmoded thoughts, ideas and rules which might or might not have worked in the good ol' days."
Does one plus one equal two?
Has one plus one always equalled two?
Will one plus one always equal two?
The answer to all three questions is an obvious yes.
Why are they always yes?
They are always yes, because it is a constant, an axiom of mathematics, that one plus one ALWAYS equals two.
What you call "out moded thoughts" are just such axioms as well.
Do you have a right to your own life? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
Do you have a right to defend your own life? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
Do you have a right to decide for yourself what you wish to be? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
Do men and women in positions of power often abuse that power? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
Do men and women in positions of power often go "on the take" and accept monies from "contributors" that may have dark intentions? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
Are there evil people in the world? Yes.
Will that ever change? Nope.
NOW,
Consider the following;
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
Tell me, just what is "out moded" in ^that^ idea?
So owning guns is the pursuit of happiness to you and self-evident?

You're weird?
Spocko

Oakland, CA

#90061 Dec 25, 2012
Dr Freud wrote:
<quoted text>
It is my considered opinion that this man knows MORE about the matter than yourself:
"So shall we ban kitchen knives? Or cars? Actually, most mass attacks in China – which like almost all despotisms has very tight gun laws – are done with either knives or explosives. The important thing is that these attacks still happen even with gun laws.
What I am asking you to do here is to think. Don’t be herded into the standard liberal opinion, that the Sandy Hook School tragedy is the fault of America’s allegedly crazy gun laws.
Actually, Connecticut’s gun laws are a good deal tighter than Britain’s were before 1920. British gun law before then was so relaxed it made Texas look effeminate. Did the streets of Edwardian London echo to gunfire? Were school massacres common? No.
Were guns restricted here because of crime? No, they were restricted because the panicky British government thought there might be a revolution.
In Switzerland, to this day, most homes contain powerful military weapons and ammunition. But gun crime is extremely rare there (unless you count suicide). Yet these massacres are a feature of modern life. They happen in countries such as Britain and Germany that already have severe gun laws. "
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-225...
So, take your emotionalism and pack it!
Well, well everyone agrees with you in the wacky world of psycho gun-a-holics!
Marauder

Valdez, AK

#90063 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
A well regulated miltitia being no longer necessary to the Security of any free state.....
...is hogwash.
Frog

Chesterfield, MO

#90064 Dec 25, 2012
Is not denying anyone of a gun a violation of someone rights .No matter if someone has a felony or is mentally mess up and u denied them a right to a gun and they are a U.S citizen to me the govt already has made there own rules already so why are you against gun control they already doing it as it is !
Marauder

Valdez, AK

#90065 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
My argument would be
There are no States that are not free in the Union
And All states have a Well Regulated Miltia
The people have a right to bear arms but those rights are not unlimited and all laws must be obeyed.
Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal.
Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated.
And your argument fails;

"Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal."

That would apply only to those used illegally by an individual and confiscated as evidence...an entire class of arms would NOT be illegal.

"Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated."

Who would "deem" any arms "as a threat to any free state"...? Under what authority would arms "may be well regulated"...? There is no such authority within the 2nd Amendment. It is the militia that will be "well regulated", as in trained in military arms, equipment and tactics.
Marauder

Valdez, AK

#90066 Dec 25, 2012
Aquarius-WY wrote:
<quoted text>
"My argument would be" has no place here.
I did not present an argument that begged a counter, sir.
I asked you a simple question.
ONE simple question, and you respond with a counter argument to something that does not exist in my post.
<shakes head, and ponders what Miss Bunny is doing today>
"<shakes head, and ponders what Miss Bunny is doing today>"

Oh for shame!!

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90067 Dec 25, 2012
The Wise Ones wrote:
<quoted text>
So owning guns is the pursuit of happiness to you and self-evident?
You're weird?
Not at all.
It falls under the one you intentionally left out.

"Life".

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90068 Dec 25, 2012
The Wise Ones wrote:
<quoted text>
So owning guns is the pursuit of happiness to you and self-evident?
You're weird?
It falls under the other one you left out too.
"Liberty".

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90069 Dec 25, 2012
Frog wrote:
Is not denying anyone of a gun a violation of someone rights .No matter if someone has a felony or is mentally mess up and u denied them a right to a gun and they are a U.S citizen to me the govt already has made there own rules already so why are you against gun control they already doing it as it is !
Was that supposed to make sense?
Do you think it made sense?

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90070 Dec 25, 2012
Marauder wrote:
<quoted text>
"<shakes head, and ponders what Miss Bunny is doing today>"
Oh for shame!!
But, but, I miss being told I'm stupid at every turn, and those big rolling bunny eyes. Make ya melt man.
<sniff>
Light Bearer

Perth, Australia

#90071 Dec 25, 2012
Marauder wrote:
<quoted text>
And your argument fails;
"Any Arms that have been used by the people to break the laws of a state may be deemed to be illegal."
That would apply only to those used illegally by an individual and confiscated as evidence...an entire class of arms would NOT be illegal.
"Any Arms not having been used to break the laws of a state, deemed to be a threat to any free state may be well regulated."
Who would "deem" any arms "as a threat to any free state"...? Under what authority would arms "may be well regulated"...? There is no such authority within the 2nd Amendment. It is the militia that will be "well regulated", as in trained in military arms, equipment and tactics.
LOL. Arent you the same guy that sprouted endlessly that the Affordable Healthcare Act was impossible to implement because of your drivel?
Arguments can be made, and Judges will make decisions based on OPINIONS of the particular arguments offered.
Who knows when the next SCOTUS member wants to make his own history.

“Evolved hunter/gatherer”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#90072 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
Who knows when the next SCOTUS member wants to make his own history.
So now you're saying that it will be a Supreme Court judge that will become the next "nutter" and shooter.

Nice.
Marauder

Valdez, AK

#90073 Dec 25, 2012
Frog wrote:
Is not denying anyone of a gun a violation of someone rights .No matter if someone has a felony or is mentally mess up and u denied them a right to a gun and they are a U.S citizen to me the govt already has made there own rules already so why are you against gun control they already doing it as it is !
"Is not denying anyone of a gun a violation of someone rights."

Well, with the exception of that pesky 2nd Amendment that enumerates that very right "of the people" to "keep and bear arms".

"No matter if someone has a felony or is mentally mess up and u denied them a right to a gun and they are a U.S citizen to me the govt already has made there own rules already so why are you against gun control they already doing it as it is !"

Those you name have had their "due process of law" also required under the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
Marauder

Valdez, AK

#90074 Dec 25, 2012
Light Bearer wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL. Arent you the same guy that sprouted endlessly that the Affordable Healthcare Act was impossible to implement because of your drivel?
Arguments can be made, and Judges will make decisions based on OPINIONS of the particular arguments offered.
Who knows when the next SCOTUS member wants to make his own history.
"Arent you the same guy that sprouted endlessly that the Affordable Healthcare Act was impossible to implement because of your drivel?"

"Endlessly"...my "drivel"...?...No, not that I recall...however, I do believe I may have referenced it a couple times in various forums. By no means have I ever "sprouted endlessly" regarding it.

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