It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103296 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Tray

Pontotoc, MS

#84383 Dec 11, 2012
X Obama Supporter wrote:
<quoted text>
Well aren't you just itching for an argument from someone over something? I have never seen an actual bank robber, in person, so I haven't seen one armed with a calculater or anything else for that matter but if someone tried to rob a bank with a calculater I would say they didn't have much chance of getting away with anything. I never said anything about Martin being armed with his fists so that gave George the right to use deadly force in defense. Everyone is armed with fists, doesn't give someone the right to shoot us for it. I suppose the difference would be in what I did with my fists and of course the level of strength and experience I had with using them to harm someone. Yes if I were taking a math test I would go in for the test armed with a calculater, if I went to a gun fight only armed with a calculater I would lose, but that would be because I was "out armed".
That is the most pointless ranting I've seen on here to date.
Palixco Burrrs

United States

#84385 Dec 11, 2012
Its not the guns, its NFL players with guns

“Now thats a tin hat!”

Since: Oct 07

Blue Ridge Mountains

#84386 Dec 11, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't spot those pics till just recently, thanks for the info, but the pics change nothing for me as I never believed and altercation didn't occur....I just have my idea of how it went down judging on the facts as they come....Zimmerman said that Martin grabbed for his gun in the altercation that took place....that appears to be a lie because they have proved there is no DNA on the gun from Martin which supports Zimmermans accounts...which keeps my theory of him being the one that instigated it all, against expert advice, and it got out of hand.
And that is one of the cruxes of the matter. You believe.
I have certain beliefs about the idiot Zimmerman, and the young dope head, but I base my conclusions on the available evidence.

And everything I seen on the news smacked of liberal news bias and fear of a black uprising.

Not whether or not Z committed voluntary manslaughter.
Which I "believe" he did. The question to me is, was it justifed. And the evidence points that way.
Unless the DA has something they are hiding from the defense, I cannot imagine any verdict but not guilty (to 2nd degree murder).

“Now thats a tin hat!”

Since: Oct 07

Blue Ridge Mountains

#84387 Dec 11, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
You are assuming this kid to be a thug in this instance when most of the evidence is that it was Zimmerman with his record and behaviour that was thuggish....he got out of his car and an altercation took place...stands to reason the kid was miffed...look at it from both sides....if that was you that some guy in this case Zimmerman was following, what would you have done.... if you felt confident about being there and were being followed...you would have stopped turned and asked what the guy wanted and when asked what you were doing there and you explained and the guy didn't accept your explanation, you would have told him to piss off, because you had a legit right to be there. It is all speculation on the information given and everyone has an opinion, it is human nature to want to take a side of the person that fits your idea of the norm rather than seek justice.
That is why we have a jury of our peers...
You and I think very differently.
I think like people have for thousands of years, you think like people that have been trained by liberal public schools, IE to rely on some great gov authority to protect you.

The village is what is important. A family makes uo that village. Strangers are a danger, until proven otherwise.

trayvon was a stranger in the neighborhood. This neighborhood had been experiencing "danger". IE , break ins.

One of the villagers saw a "suspicious character". Checking out suspuiscious characters is something villagers have been doing for thousands of years, and is a very important evolutionary tool.

Everything Z did is something I would like to think anyone in my neighborhood would do.
Unfortunately, most of my neighbors are liberals who would not even call the law if they heard screaming in their back yard.

Since Trayvon was a "visitor", he had no right to expect to wonder freely thru the village without being confronted. Even the "gangs" understand that concept.
Since Z was a villager, he had an obligation to check out the stranger.

Since that is not part of your thinking process, Z will always be the villian to you, and T will be the hero.

Which is a counter evolutionary way of thinking.

At least according to me and history.

When human being quit acting like human beings , then maybe I will embrace your notions.

“Now thats a tin hat!”

Since: Oct 07

Blue Ridge Mountains

#84388 Dec 11, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
As would your Indians and Negro's if you had of had no use for them....what's your point?
Um, we did try to exterminate the indians. Now we love their Casinos.

And we bought slaves. Only the Dems tried to exterminate them after the Civil War.

My point is you want to restrict rights, and we tell you to stick it.

And you think YOU have the high ground??????
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84389 Dec 11, 2012
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
She's going to have to Google Lord Mountbatten.:-)
No, Did not google Lord Mountbatten. He was Prince Charles mentor, so to speak.
He was killed in the boat along with his grandson???
I have a DVD called ~ Mountbatten ~ or something like that.

So There!
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84390 Dec 11, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
Um, we did try to exterminate the indians. Now we love their Casinos.
And we bought slaves. Only the Dems tried to exterminate them after the Civil War.
My point is you want to restrict rights, and we tell you to stick it.
And you think YOU have the high ground??????
We love their casino's? I have a theory about that.

You Gamble!?

They were Given all that beautiful land in Connecticut. Shaking head.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84391 Dec 11, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
And that is one of the cruxes of the matter. You believe.
I have certain beliefs about the idiot Zimmerman, and the young dope head, but I base my conclusions on the available evidence.
And everything I seen on the news smacked of liberal news bias and fear of a black uprising.
Not whether or not Z committed voluntary manslaughter.
Which I "believe" he did. The question to me is, was it justifed. And the evidence points that way.
Unless the DA has something they are hiding from the defense, I cannot imagine any verdict but not guilty (to 2nd degree murder).
It will be guilty because Zimmerman was carrying a gun/he started a fight with the boy/couldn't take the beating/shot the boy.
Shaking Head.
No gun/no death.
Too bad all the way around.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84392 Dec 11, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah well. Rudd picked Gillard as his running mate. Will he concede that he was wrong in picking her? No, he's too PC. I get the creeps when I think of him. Nasty man.
A: Wrong Labor picked Gillard as Rudds second in command, he complied as would be expected of a party faithful.
WW2? We Americans would blame the Japanese. Yes, they did the evil deed that got us into that war and they paid a very high price in the end.
A: So I thought you said you shouldn't blame others!...mmmmmm!
What is a faulty breast implant? I just heard from someone in the know that breast implants have come a very long way and..........let's just say they have improved greatly. Thinking about a pair?
A: Nothing about me is false fish...and you must have heard about the damage and deaths caused by faulty breast implants...unless you live in a cave....methinks you might.
Holocaust? Who would you blame?
I would blame the inventor of hate mongering that led to the murder of so many innocent victims.....
Thelodomite? What is that?
A: Oh....Thalidomide, my bad......http://en.wikipedia.o rg/wiki/Thalidomide
You get to pick and choose. It's a fair way of doing that to prevent jealousy.
A: No you don't there is either someone to blame or there isn't...
Read a local magazine today and it said Philadelphia has some of the fattest people in the country. Yay! We are almost #1! hip/hip. I am proud to live in the suburbs of Philly, mate. Think I'll have another cheesesteak. Just finished two of them. Growing girl.
A: Pound it down porky...
Why do you like Rudd?
A: Because he defeated Howard....and in this country after Howard signed us up for a war, lied about children overboard affair, and used scaremongering tactics to sell his lies.....who woudn't.
Anything else?
Nope that about covers it.
I said you shouldn't blame others?

I blame the Japanese 100%/

Yes, I live in a cave. It's not so bad.

You like Rudd because he defeated Howard? That's it? Besides the apology ~ did he actually do anything constructive? Did the Rudd's become richer? It's fine to make money, but not when you have connections and insider information, that's wrong. I realize they have been rich for a while, but being PM sure did help the old portfolio.

I think Julia G. is way smarter than him. But that wouldn't be so hard to do.

The Rudd's were a LITTLE TO EAGER to live in your white house, so to speak. That was obvious. Kind of desperate for recognition. Shrug ~ to each his own. Not very sophisticated.

Thalidomide? Didn't read the link. Was that for morning sickness? Poor babies.

Thinking of having a foot long hoagie for lunch. Had a pound of scrabble for breakfast with 4 eggs. Yummy. Trying to keep my weight up. Don't want to lose the title of one of the fattest cities in the country.

Anything you would like to say?

“Si vis pacem, para bellum !!”

Since: Dec 07

Southeast Virginia

#84393 Dec 11, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
It will be guilty because Zimmerman was carrying a gun
So. He was licensed to do so. Not a crime.
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
/he started a fight with the boy
What evidence is there that he "started" anything??
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
/couldn't take the beating
Why should he have to take a beating???
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
/shot the boy.
AFTER having his head pounded into the sidewalk. A life-threatening attack.
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
Shaking Head.
No gun/no death.
Too bad all the way around.
Well....no death for Martin. Zimmerman may very well have been killed by having his head repeatedly slammed into the concrete. Good thing he was able to defend himself, huh?
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84394 Dec 11, 2012
Tray wrote:
<quoted text> Let's see you throw that tomahawk 100 yards or better, or an arrow for that fact. FACT The American Indian was not armed in the since of fighting against an ARMED opponent. They lost because they basically could not defend themselves against an advanced race.
The military had rifles that could only shoot Once. Then they had to reload. Whilst reloading, they would get an arrow or two (looked like a porcupine) shot at them. Indians were great shots.
They did a pretty good job of killing people. IT Was after the buffalo hunters came on the scene, that they basically gave up. The buffalo hunters were tough dudes. The indians killed/scalped more than a few, though.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84395 Dec 11, 2012
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
So. He was licensed to do so. Not a crime.
<quoted text>
What evidence is there that he "started" anything??
<quoted text>
Why should he have to take a beating???
<quoted text>
AFTER having his head pounded into the sidewalk. A life-threatening attack.
<quoted text>
Well....no death for Martin. Zimmerman may very well have been killed by having his head repeatedly slammed into the concrete. Good thing he was able to defend himself, huh?
I haven't read about this case since last spring, but I will try to answer. My pleasure.

How do you know Zim had his head repeatedly slammed into the concrete? One good slam could have broken the skin.

I'll try to simplify this.

Martin was walking through the "gated" neighborhood. Was he on his way to his father's house? If so, he was a guest. He was allowed to be there.

Zim was cruising around looking for interlopers. Had his gun ready to roll.

Zim sees Martin and wants to confront him.

He does.

Fight insues.

Zim is getting worried because he is taking the brunt of it.

Pulls out gun and shoots Martin.

Zim should have waited for cops, but he was hell bent on confronting this guy, that had every reason to be there IF HIS FATHER LIVED THERE. Don't remember if this is true.

Martin is dead for walking through neighborhood and Zim is in enormous trouble.

He'll be found guilty.

Because he is.

It's The Guns, Stupid.

If I see someone I don't recognize on my street, I say hello to them and keep walking. NO ONE but a security guard has the right to ask someone why they are there. NO ONE does that.

If you live in the woods in a secluded area and I was walking down your lane one day.
I would be expected to be asked by the owner of the house what I was doing there.

Guppy
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84396 Dec 11, 2012
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
I think they both had a loser attached. When a gun sits in a box it just sits in a box. It can't do anything.
But when a guy gets his hands on one. All hell breaks loose.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84397 Dec 11, 2012
spider1954 wrote:
<quoted text>
WHAT KILLED ABE LINCOLN ?
WHAT KILLED JFK ?
Just a theory here but I would suggest it was a difference in poitical views with another group of people.
What killed Lord Mountbatten ?, Yes thats it, a difference in political views, NOT that he was personally involved in polotics, but the people that BLEW his boat to pieces with a BOMB were just interested at hitting out at the establishment.
I think JFK was killed by the mob. He and his brother betrayed them and being the ultra sensitive people they are, wanted revenge. They got it, big time.
I think you are right about Abe Lincoln.
10:33 Most Cloudy. Where is the sun?!

Since: Jan 11

Abingdon, VA

#84398 Dec 11, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
But when a guy gets his hands on one. All hell breaks loose.
That's right, "a guy".

Since: Jan 11

Abingdon, VA

#84399 Dec 11, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
I think JFK was killed by the mob. He and his brother betrayed them and being the ultra sensitive people they are, wanted revenge. They got it, big time.
I think you are right about Abe Lincoln.
10:33 Most Cloudy. Where is the sun?!
So, Oswald's pro-communist views were the same as Kennedy's anti-communist views?

Since: Jan 11

Abingdon, VA

#84400 Dec 11, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
No, Did not google Lord Mountbatten. He was Prince Charles mentor, so to speak.
He was killed in the boat along with his grandson???
I have a DVD called ~ Mountbatten ~ or something like that.
So There!
Blockbuster wants it back.

Those Indians killed Mountbatten too?
Dan C

Sacramento, CA

#84401 Dec 11, 2012
Armed Veteran wrote:
<quoted text>
So. He was licensed to do so. Not a crime.
<quoted text>
What evidence is there that he "started" anything??
<quoted text>
Why should he have to take a beating???
<quoted text>
AFTER having his head pounded into the sidewalk. A life-threatening attack.
<quoted text>
Well....no death for Martin. Zimmerman may very well have been killed by having his head repeatedly slammed into the concrete. Good thing he was able to defend himself, huh?
Your biggest problem is not seeing Zimmerman's involvement.

Zimmerman played the punk that night. You nor anyone else has the right to play creep towards an unarmed youth at night in the fashion Zimmerman did. If you think Zimmerman was in the right in his actions that night then in turn you might just support a pedophile following little girls. It's the same reasoning in that they did nothing illegal unless they cross the bounds.

Zimmerman asked for that event to happen that night. He begged for it.

Just because your IQ isn't high enough to figure out which end of a can of soda to open the first try doesn't mean anyone else, especially the jury that is chosen for this trial, will see this case the same way.

FYI.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84402 Dec 11, 2012
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
So, Oswald's pro-communist views were the same as Kennedy's anti-communist views?
That had nothing to do with the killing of JFK.

How did Oswald orchestrate the whole thing by himself?

Remember he said he was a Patsy before they killed him so he wouldn't talk.

NO lawyer, no nuttin.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84403 Dec 11, 2012
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
Blockbuster wants it back.
Those Indians killed Mountbatten too?
The indians couldn't put a bomb together to save their lives.

Blockbuster wants it back? No one told me.

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