It's the Guns, Stupid

It's the Guns, Stupid

There are 103299 comments on the Truthdig story from Apr 20, 2007, titled It's the Guns, Stupid. In it, Truthdig reports that:

“And that's the end of the issue”

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing? Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent ... via Truthdig

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Truthdig.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84031 Dec 7, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
What you say has merit, and indeed Zimmerman may be a wannabe cop.
My question to you is, when do you give up the right to defend yourself from someone trying to kill you?
There are specifics in the law here in NC. I am interested in your opinion.
This actually isn't about giving up the right to defend yourself, this is about a guy who ignored advice of police not to follow a posible threat, so he could play at being a hero to his community with dire consequences that could have been avoided.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84032 Dec 7, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
The photo of the bloody head was available a couple of weeks after the incident. You just won't see it on the liberal news. I found it on a UK source. The liberal news had already plastered the low res photos that did not show wounds to prove their point.
The liberal news hates it when it gets caught in a lie.
I didn't spot those pics till just recently, thanks for the info, but the pics change nothing for me as I never believed and altercation didn't occur....I just have my idea of how it went down judging on the facts as they come....Zimmerman said that Martin grabbed for his gun in the altercation that took place....that appears to be a lie because they have proved there is no DNA on the gun from Martin which supports Zimmermans accounts...which keeps my theory of him being the one that instigated it all, against expert advice, and it got out of hand.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84033 Dec 7, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
Hmmm.
We speculate that the thug banging Z's head on the sidewalk will kill Z, and you call that pure speculation.
You specualte that Z somehow confronted the thug until he was provoked enough to attack Z, and you have no evidence, and you call our theory "pure speculation".
We base our guess on known facts, you base you guess on things you made up.
Hmmm.
I go with the facts.
You are assuming this kid to be a thug in this instance when most of the evidence is that it was Zimmerman with his record and behaviour that was thuggish....he got out of his car and an altercation took place...stands to reason the kid was miffed...look at it from both sides....if that was you that some guy in this case Zimmerman was following, what would you have done.... if you felt confident about being there and were being followed...you would have stopped turned and asked what the guy wanted and when asked what you were doing there and you explained and the guy didn't accept your explanation, you would have told him to piss off, because you had a legit right to be there. It is all speculation on the information given and everyone has an opinion, it is human nature to want to take a side of the person that fits your idea of the norm rather than seek justice.
That is why we have a jury of our peers...
X Obama Supporter

Coffeyville, KS

#84034 Dec 7, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
I didn't spot those pics till just recently, thanks for the info, but the pics change nothing for me as I never believed and altercation didn't occur....I just have my idea of how it went down judging on the facts as they come....Zimmerman said that Martin grabbed for his gun in the altercation that took place....that appears to be a lie because they have proved there is no DNA on the gun from Martin which supports Zimmermans accounts...which keeps my theory of him being the one that instigated it all, against expert advice, and it got out of hand.
Reach for the stars!!! Grabbing FOR something is not the same as grabbed it. You can reach for something and yet not reach it. You won't leave DNA just for the attempt.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84035 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
Excuses/Excuses
Can't take the blame, can you?
Own up to it.
Y'all screwed up royally.
Now you are blaming the USA.
Stop sucking up.
It's humiliating.
It took you YEARS to find out you were duped? Ah.....don't believe it.
Johnny, why did you hit that poor little boy? Mum! They told me to! Johnny! Think for yourself! Don't be pushed around! But, Mum! I was too stupid to know better! You just wanted to impress your friends! Admit it! You're right mum! I wanted to be one of the boys! Grow up Johnny and take the blame! OK mum.....Shaking head.
Actually I am blaming the US because it was to blame for it's lies and deciet....but if you note I am (unlike yanks) also blaming my government here at the time(Howard) for ignoring the advice of it's own intelligence who was giving advice contrary to the CIA which turned out to be accurate...but America or it's government or it's people would not listen to Australia in such matters, they had righteous on their side they were going after those to get at Bin Laden (manipulation at it's best) get it right fish!....You are being to overly simplistic....if your friend was bashed by another boy and your freind was angry and hurt and wanted to go and attack that person he said had committed the injury but he needed your support, you would give him your support because he is your friend and you trust that he has the right information because he was the one involved and he was the one injured, why would he lie and say it was someone else? How would your friendship stand up after the lie was discovered?

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84036 Dec 7, 2012
Teaman wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm naive!? I live here. You live on the other side of the earth reading left wing garbage. Some of the better neighborhoods here in my area are predominantly black. Retired government, cops, military, small business owners.
What does that mean that they are not racist that they are not trying to live up to white expectations? Are they living according to our rules or theirs.

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84037 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
It's about time they discovered something.
It was probably an American Pharmaceutical company. They discover everything. Gifted scientists/researchers.
Do they have anything else in the pipeline? ONE DRUG? Well, I guess it's better than nothing. Sigh.
And don't forget penicilin, spray on skin the coclear ear implant all of which has saved billions and allowed hundreds of thousands the hear and got burns victims the best chance of a fast recovery for their injuries that you can thank us for...and no it was not an America pharmaceutical company...but a good try to take the credit like most of Americans, you fit the mold well......there are many, many more inventions attributed to Australians....we try to concentrate on healing not killing....

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84038 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
Spew much?
I have heard from someone who moved to your wonderful country that you guys are super racist. The person who said that was appalled.
Let's call a spade ~ a spade.
Aborigine? That was outrageous. You actually stole these kids away from their families and abused them over and over again. Abso disgusting.
Oh, but you're not racist.
Keep the lies coming ~ If it makes you feel better about what YOU Did.
See I never said I wasn't a racist....you yanks never read what is written without bias....shame on you....
And are you telling me you yanks aren't super racist?
We also have the stolen "white generation" too...or are you so ignorant to know about that...what ever we do to one of us we have been guilty of doing to all....it's called being equal and we face it...mind there has never been an apology to the stolen white generation, but I am sure it will come in time as it has for the stolen aboriginal generation....

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84039 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
A. Ho,
You are lying when you say your Boys never killed an innocent person. If you were in Vietnam ~ you killed tons of innocent people. Beyond sad what you did to the Vietnamese. They had almost nothing, but you destroyed it.
Sympathy for Americans? You had a few Austrailians in the buildings. You only cared about them. You could care less about Americans. Sympathy? My foot.
A: of course innocents get killed accidently in wars no doubt even by our own troups...but NO we have not murdered en masse the way Americans did in the vietnam war...or in Japan the murders and rapes by American soldiers is legendary...

Military guys? The top military guys are brilliant. I don't need to defend them. It's obvious to everyone, but you.
A: I wonder if you would say that if they ran in and murdered 16 members of your family in an incident that could have been avoided if the military had done it's job properly...and military guy being brilliant....

There you go again about babies. One track mind. Yes, if one steak isn't enough, we will have two and three for dinner and wash it down with a cold beer or two or.........Protein ~ Yum!
Leave the babies out of it. That's sick.
Most of you don't like us. Prejudiced? Glad you admitted to it.
Just because we are the heaviest ~ doesn't mean we are fat. It's all relative. So what? It's our brains and our ability to work very hard ~ that's what counts.

A: I am not saying it is the weight that defines a person, not at all, I am just stating what is know about statistics and you are the fattest nation of people...thats a fact....
Oh, and our hearts. Americans are very generous with their money. When someone needs help ~ they are always there with their wallets open. Generous lot.

A: per head of population Australian is the most generous country on earth...

You are so defensive. Makes me wonder.
Hope you like living in no mans land.
Crocodile Dundee. Your claim to fame!
Put one on the barbie, mate

Don't forget Steve Irwin as well as Paul Hogan Hugh Jackman, Tony Collette as well as well as many excellent directors and the like, all Australians we are extremely proud of...and shrimp was for the American market....we call them prawns down here in Aus.....and I will do....

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84040 Dec 7, 2012
ZigmunnDroid wrote:
<quoted text>
Jane you ignorant slut, we bash racist bastards like you who just love to restrict rights they don't understand or fear.
If things were up to you, your aborigines would have been exterminated years ago.
As would your Indians and Negro's if you had of had no use for them....what's your point?
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84041 Dec 7, 2012
A four year old boy found his father's guns and killed his two year old brother in Michigan.

The little two year old would be alive today if it weren't for the gun.

Sad story.

Happens too much. Shouldn't have guns in the house with children.

I bet the parents will show up at the police station and drop off the weapons.

Shaking Head.
Guppy

Gadsden, AL

#84042 Dec 7, 2012
The nurse in London.

Auzzie's basically killed her.

They have blood on their hands.

Way to go Auzzie's!

“Topix is lowlife scum with no”

Since: Jun 12

respect for anyone...

#84043 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
The nurse in London.
Auzzie's basically killed her.
They have blood on their hands.
Way to go Auzzie's!
Sigh....here we go again, same retarded sh*t, different thread.
Ignorant fools like yourself might believe that is so but just stop & think for a second about what you've just said.
How can Australians be responsible when someone on the other side of the world decides to take their own life?
If that's what happened, I've seen no official confirmation of that so far.
There's only one person responsible for making that decision, the nurse herself.
Law

Papillion, NE

#84044 Dec 7, 2012
Guppy wrote:
The nurse in London.
Auzzie's basically killed her.
They have blood on their hands.
Way to go Auzzie's!
Yeah, right. She chose to kill herself. She made that choice. Not the Aussies.

Since: Feb 11

Sutton, UK

#84045 Dec 8, 2012
Guppy wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do you like to keep busy?
Something else, but it was kind of a very small riot.
I have no idea, other than it suits me.

Something else ? small riot ? did you consider buying a gun at the time ?

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84046 Dec 8, 2012
Guppy wrote:
The nurse in London.
Auzzie's basically killed her.
They have blood on their hands.
Way to go Auzzie's!
That was a terrible tragedy, made more terrible by those that ridiculed her for a simple honest mistake....

Since: Dec 10

Perth, Australia

#84047 Dec 8, 2012
X Obama Supporter wrote:
<quoted text>
Reach for the stars!!! Grabbing FOR something is not the same as grabbed it. You can reach for something and yet not reach it. You won't leave DNA just for the attempt.
I am stating the evidence as it came...Zimmerman obviously told police that Marting reached for his gun, the cops had to check if Martins print were on the gun because if they were it would prove that part of Zimmermans story, as it is there was none of Martins DNA on the gun so it is still a he said vs he said scenario.

Since: Feb 11

Sutton, UK

#84048 Dec 8, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't believe people think deeply enough or realise that to hate a guy because they are an Arab or Jewish or black or hispanic or Indian etc, they are being hateful to all.....they just never realise when they have a go at Obama because of his heritage or his colour that, that is being a racist...because it's ok he's their President or they call someone a black bastard or whatever that their excuse is they are not racist because they don't hate the black children or their whole race simply because they sling off at one....When people are threatened job being taken away from them by another group....they will always use the race card... in war they did it with the Germans the Japanese and the Jews, in your country it's the Indians and the Negro's and Muslims(not a race) arabs, ours it's everyone, because we like to be equal...racism is everywhere....
If YOU are racist, then that is something YOU have to deal with, or not. Have you considered thoughtfully the reason's for your racism ? do you approach other's or talk to them in a negative manner ? doing so will give of the wrong impression and they may well reciprocate if they are allso of a weak frame of mind.
During verbal confrontations people will often throw out attempts at insults such as :- You tall short fat skinny lanky dummpy stupid smartarse ugly overated idiot. those sort of remarks are not racism, but are said in an attempt to suggest that we are better than the person the remarks are directed at,,the same is true when colour is brought up and does not mean the person using such words is a racist, only some times not allways.
sid

Chermside, Australia

#84049 Dec 8, 2012
Interesting isn't it, guns don't kill people so if there were no guns in america the murder statistics would be exactly the same only there would be a lot more baseball bats in circulation.
Tray

New Albany, MS

#84050 Dec 8, 2012
Ahomana wrote:
<quoted text>
I am stating the evidence as it came...Zimmerman obviously told police that Marting reached for his gun, the cops had to check if Martins print were on the gun because if they were it would prove that part of Zimmermans story, as it is there was none of Martins DNA on the gun so it is still a he said vs he said scenario.
The fact Trayvon didn't get the gun is self evident. How would his DNA be on an object he didn't get? You also miss the fact DNA is not always detectable or deposited on an object. It was raining, the gun was in a holster, George handled the gun. There is also the chance DNA was on the gun but washed off by the rain or wiped off by George handling it. In this situation any lab person would tell you the likelihood of finding DNA on this object would be difficult to impossible at best.

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