DOMA Gives Gay Politicians 'Free Pass' On Ethics, Says Watchdog

Feb 13, 2013 | Posted by: Rick in Kansas | Full story: www.huffingtonpost.com

Most arguments against the Defense of Marriage Act focus on the multitude of rights and benefits denied to same-sex couples whose marriages are not recognized by the federal government.

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“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

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#1
Feb 14, 2013
 

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At least we get some benefit for being gay.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

St. Louis, MO

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#2
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Wow, all those straight people in government are going to really be jealous. Our team gets to cheat and steal, legally, while they have to go through all that trouble to hide their nefarious dealings.
Tangar

Turkey

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#3
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Nothing new here. Queers get everything handed to them on a silver platter these days.
Tangar

Turkey

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Feb 14, 2013
 

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RalphB wrote:
Wow, all those straight people in government are going to really be jealous. Our team gets to cheat and steal, legally.
Thanks for your honesty.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

St. Louis, MO

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#6
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Tangar wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for your honesty.
You're welcome. I happen to believe in equality, and that means I have to also accept that there are crooks among gays as well as straights.

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

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#7
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Tangar wrote:
<quoted text>
Enjoy your government handouts.
We will.

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

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#8
Feb 14, 2013
 

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I've always said that will eventually bring down DOMA legislation and usher in equal rights for GLBT couples is people realizing that inequality harms BOTH sides, not just the side being attacked and disadvantaged.

Honestly, the fact that neither the State of Michigan nor the Federal government recognizes our marriage has meant that my husband and I have been able to *legally* shuffle our taxable income and, more importantly, our tax deductions back and forth to whichever return will benefit most from them for YEARS now--all perfectly within the tax laws. Married couples can't do that because they are forced to combine everything, no matter what.

When he got a small but taxable inheritance a few years back, we paid just a tiny portion of the tax on it that we would have had to pay had we been forced to combine our incomes before the inheritance was taxed.

And, year after year, one of us takes all our itemized deductions, and the other one takes all the standard deductions, thereby essentially doubling up on our tax write-offs. Married couples can't do that, either.

We also know gay couples where one (legal stranger) spouse stays home and raises their kids while the other one supports the family. Because the stay-at-home (legal stranger) parent has no income and is barred from participating in the company healthcare plan the (legal stranger) spouse gets at work, guess who pays for the second parent and the childrens' healthcare??? Yep!!! You, the taxpayer does, because they qualify for government assistance due to not having any income, despite living in a nice house in the suburbs and sending the kids to private schools. Nice, huh? All perfectly legal because the State and the Feds are legally BARRED from recognizing their marriage. Married couples have to PAY for their kids' healthcare and schooling.

So, yeah. The door swings both ways, doesn't it?? Pass laws that screw over people for no reason and there's always some benefit to be had somewhere from the unequal treatment.

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark, Ohio

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#9
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Read this part of the article and then try to recall the old cartoon that shows how different Christian Denominations would build a horse and cart!

In an amicus brief filed with the Supreme Court ahead of a March hearing on the constitutionality of DOMA, Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington pointed out that same-sex couples are excused from aspects of the Ethics in Government Act, which applies only to opposite-sex couples since DOMA forbids the federal government from recognizing same-sex marriages.

“DOMA was not driven by rational considerations, but rather a desire to strike out at same-sex married couples regardless of the repercussions,” Professor Alan Morrison, who co-authored the brief, said in a statement.“In its zeal to discriminate against same-sex couples, Congress inadvertently gave them a free pass to violate the very same ethics laws with which opposite-sex married couples must comply.”

Seems to me this exlanation does a better job of illustrating that DOMA doesn't attack or harm heteros in any way but does attack and harm same sex couples.

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark, Ohio

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#10
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Tangar wrote:
<quoted text>
Enjoy your government handouts.
Like you do in Miami with my gay Tax dollars?

Giimme a break. I lived in Miami Dade and know how much support they give hetero families and how hard it is for the families of Same Sex couples to get the same treatment by politicians and the courts there.

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark, Ohio

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#11
Feb 14, 2013
 

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Tangar wrote:
<quoted text>
Enjoy your government handouts.
Wow> You flew from Turkey to Miami in less than a few minutes.

Your wings must be killing you.

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark, Ohio

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#12
Feb 14, 2013
 

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eJohn wrote:
I've always said that will eventually bring down DOMA legislation and usher in equal rights for GLBT couples is people realizing that inequality harms BOTH sides, not just the side being attacked and disadvantaged.
Honestly, the fact that neither the State of Michigan nor the Federal government recognizes our marriage has meant that my husband and I have been able to *legally* shuffle our taxable income and, more importantly, our tax deductions back and forth to whichever return will benefit most from them for YEARS now--all perfectly within the tax laws. Married couples can't do that because they are forced to combine everything, no matter what.
When he got a small but taxable inheritance a few years back, we paid just a tiny portion of the tax on it that we would have had to pay had we been forced to combine our incomes before the inheritance was taxed.
And, year after year, one of us takes all our itemized deductions, and the other one takes all the standard deductions, thereby essentially doubling up on our tax write-offs. Married couples can't do that, either.
We also know gay couples where one (legal stranger) spouse stays home and raises their kids while the other one supports the family. Because the stay-at-home (legal stranger) parent has no income and is barred from participating in the company healthcare plan the (legal stranger) spouse gets at work, guess who pays for the second parent and the childrens' healthcare??? Yep!!! You, the taxpayer does, because they qualify for government assistance due to not having any income, despite living in a nice house in the suburbs and sending the kids to private schools. Nice, huh? All perfectly legal because the State and the Feds are legally BARRED from recognizing their marriage. Married couples have to PAY for their kids' healthcare and schooling.
So, yeah. The door swings both ways, doesn't it?? Pass laws that screw over people for no reason and there's always some benefit to be had somewhere from the unequal treatment.
Yellow light Bulb, Life Preserver and Big Red Heart!

DNF

“Liberty AND Justice”

Since: Apr 07

Born in Newark, Ohio

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#13
Feb 14, 2013
 
WeTheSheeple wrote:
<quoted text>
We will.
YUP. But hopefully most in the LGBT community will only ask for what is given our heterosexual counterparts. IMO most do that already.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

St. Louis, MO

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#14
Feb 15, 2013
 

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eJohn wrote:
I've always said that will eventually bring down DOMA legislation and usher in equal rights for GLBT couples is people realizing that inequality harms BOTH sides, not just the side being attacked and disadvantaged.
Honestly, the fact that neither the State of Michigan nor the Federal government recognizes our marriage has meant that my husband and I have been able to *legally* shuffle our taxable income and, more importantly, our tax deductions back and forth to whichever return will benefit most from them for YEARS now--all perfectly within the tax laws. Married couples can't do that because they are forced to combine everything, no matter what.
When he got a small but taxable inheritance a few years back, we paid just a tiny portion of the tax on it that we would have had to pay had we been forced to combine our incomes before the inheritance was taxed.
And, year after year, one of us takes all our itemized deductions, and the other one takes all the standard deductions, thereby essentially doubling up on our tax write-offs. Married couples can't do that, either.
We also know gay couples where one (legal stranger) spouse stays home and raises their kids while the other one supports the family. Because the stay-at-home (legal stranger) parent has no income and is barred from participating in the company healthcare plan the (legal stranger) spouse gets at work, guess who pays for the second parent and the childrens' healthcare??? Yep!!! You, the taxpayer does, because they qualify for government assistance due to not having any income, despite living in a nice house in the suburbs and sending the kids to private schools. Nice, huh? All perfectly legal because the State and the Feds are legally BARRED from recognizing their marriage. Married couples have to PAY for their kids' healthcare and schooling.
So, yeah. The door swings both ways, doesn't it?? Pass laws that screw over people for no reason and there's always some benefit to be had somewhere from the unequal treatment.
My spouse and I have been doing the same with taxes ever since we got together 40 years ago. And all those tax returns go straight into tax-sheltered investments. And yet, we are willing to give up the tax benefits in exchange for human dignity.

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

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Feb 15, 2013
 

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RalphB wrote:
<quoted text>
My spouse and I have been doing the same with taxes ever since we got together 40 years ago. And all those tax returns go straight into tax-sheltered investments. And yet, we are willing to give up the tax benefits in exchange for human dignity.
My husband and I feel the same, of course. We'd gladly give up the tax breaks for legal recognition. Despite the tax savings we've had over the last 19 years (next Tuesday), they pale in comparison to the Social Security survivor benefits we won't get, and the taxes that the surviving spouse will have to pay on our estate when one of us passes away. It would still be better to have our marriage recognized, for sure.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

St. Louis, MO

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#16
Feb 15, 2013
 

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eJohn wrote:
<quoted text>
My husband and I feel the same, of course. We'd gladly give up the tax breaks for legal recognition. Despite the tax savings we've had over the last 19 years (next Tuesday), they pale in comparison to the Social Security survivor benefits we won't get, and the taxes that the surviving spouse will have to pay on our estate when one of us passes away. It would still be better to have our marriage recognized, for sure.
Happy Anniversary (a little early). I hope you have many more happy years together. Ain't it amazing how fast those years slip by when you are content? Seems like only yesterday I met Frank, and we set up a date to go out to dinner.

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

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#17
Feb 18, 2013
 
RalphB wrote:
<quoted text>
Happy Anniversary (a little early). I hope you have many more happy years together. Ain't it amazing how fast those years slip by when you are content? Seems like only yesterday I met Frank, and we set up a date to go out to dinner.
Very much so. It amazes us every year. We celebrated our 10th anniversary together about six months after finally moving in together and even THAT was amazing. Now that we're looking toward our 20th. Wow.

My husband's older brother and his husband are celebrating their 45th anniversary in the fall--the longest-lasting couple out of 40-some cousins in their family. Not bad, huh?

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

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#18
Feb 18, 2013
 

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eJohn wrote:
<quoted text>
Very much so. It amazes us every year. We celebrated our 10th anniversary together about six months after finally moving in together and even THAT was amazing. Now that we're looking toward our 20th. Wow.
My husband's older brother and his husband are celebrating their 45th anniversary in the fall--the longest-lasting couple out of 40-some cousins in their family. Not bad, huh?
What's kinda sad is our 26 years already is longer than any of my relatives with the exception of my parents. I even have nieces on their 2nd marriages, and they're only in their early 20's; of course they learned from their parents.

Since: Mar 07

The entire US of A

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#19
Feb 18, 2013
 

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RalphB wrote:
<quoted text>
Happy Anniversary (a little early). I hope you have many more happy years together. Ain't it amazing how fast those years slip by when you are content? Seems like only yesterday I met Frank, and we set up a date to go out to dinner.
It always works that way when things are right.

“Equality First”

Since: Jan 09

St. Louis, MO

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#20
Feb 19, 2013
 

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eJohn wrote:
<quoted text>
Very much so. It amazes us every year. We celebrated our 10th anniversary together about six months after finally moving in together and even THAT was amazing. Now that we're looking toward our 20th. Wow.
My husband's older brother and his husband are celebrating their 45th anniversary in the fall--the longest-lasting couple out of 40-some cousins in their family. Not bad, huh?
Very good record. I know many couples who have been together longer than my husband and I. One couple who befriended me when I first came out was together over 60 years. I really miss them. They were even more inspiring than my own parents, who were together, sadly only 38 years when my father died. It took a lot of courage for my friends to have gotten together back in the 40's, and stick it out through all those years. But they never complained. They just lived happily together, ignoring the taunts and abuse.

“Marriage Equality”

Since: Dec 07

Lakeland, MI

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#21
Feb 19, 2013
 
WeTheSheeple wrote:
<quoted text>
What's kinda sad is our 26 years already is longer than any of my relatives with the exception of my parents. I even have nieces on their 2nd marriages, and they're only in their early 20's; of course they learned from their parents.
Well, I'm noticed over the years that the people that buy into the, "gotta git married!! gotta git married!! gotta git married!!" panic and get married to the first idiot that's stupid enough to propose when they're both still children are pretty much destined to divorce young, too.

My white trash next-door neighbor boys were ALL THREE married by the time they were 19 (because the kid was either on the way or already here), but then two were divorced by 20 and the third lasted all the way to 22 before his wife dumped him with the kid and disappeared.

The most successful marriages I know were couples that had already been together for quite a few years before getting married, making them 30-somethings when they finally did it. That makes a lot of sense. I didn't even meet my husband until I was 29 and he was 41. And we STILL waited 9 years before moving in together. We would have got married at that time had it been legal, but it wasn't yet. So we waited for 18-1/2 years to finally go to New York and get married.

I honestly think that it's the fear that gay couples will enjoy a lower divorce rate than straight couples do that drives a lot of the anti-marriage bigotry. Of course we will in the short-term because so many of us have already been together for decades, but long-term, I can't imagine it would be much different.

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