Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

Who says Mormons aren't Christians?

There are 32101 comments on the CNN story from Oct 12, 2011, titled Who says Mormons aren't Christians?. In it, CNN reports that:

Editor's note: Dean Obeidallah is an award-winning comedian who has appeared on TV shows such as Comedy Central's "Axis of Evil" special, ABC's "The View," CNN's "What the Week" and HLN's "The Joy Behar Show." He is executive producer of the annual New York Arab-American Comedy Festival and the Amman Stand Up Comedy Festival.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CNN.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25558 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
But when they wrote that, they wrote it in Hebrew
God formed Adam from the "Alma" (dirt/dust) of the "Adamah" (Ground).
Hebrew doesn't use "dirt" to identify with "soil". they use "dirt" to identify with something that is unclean.
They use "Adamah" to identify the soil from the ground.
as Josephus says, of red earth macerated, or mixed with water;
http://www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/g...
a dark red/brown color... you know like black people, and other dark complexioned humans.
Not white people.
So where did white people come from?
<quoted text>
Actually the word 'dirt' is NEVER used in the Torah or the Christian Bible. The words dust, ground and earth are used.
And in Genesis, it doesn't state God added water to the dust/ground to change it's colour to make adam. Nice racist slant on that verse though :)

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25559 May 11, 2013
But none of those are her...

Some of those names you mentioned are women who are virgins or who never had children.

you act as if women in mythology are interchangable nameless placeholders.
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Off topic? I answered in kind as you asked and you find offense with me? lol...Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer. In this case, I at least gave you an idea of what humans have called her for the last few thousand years.

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25560 May 11, 2013
Yet you use "outside sources" to identify where Adam and Eve may have lived...

Mormons do not use outside sources to establish adam or eve or their color.

name one source Mormons use to establish their color.
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
I criticize you for using 'outside' sources to establish Adam and Eve and all of humanity were black and no other colour in the same way you criticize Mormons and whoever else, for using outside sources to establish Adam and Eve and all of humanity are their colour and no other colour.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25561 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
So where did white people come from?
<quoted text>
You like science so chew on these opinions :)

Did the caucasian race begin in the Caucasus Mountains?
Is this the origin of the "Cave Man" story?
4 years ago

Best Answer - Chosen by Voters

Actually, National Geographic claims that the first successful mutation, which we today know as Caucasian, occurred in modern-day Kazahkstan, about 40,000 years ago, and as these populations migrated westward, through Caucasus Mountain area (the modern-day Republic of Georgia), and entered the perimeter of the Black Sea region (which was a freshwater lake until 7,000 years ago), they were first known as Cro-Magnon Man, and later designated as Caucasian...
4 years ago

A more detailed answer...
Yes! You've got it right-on! The Caucusus Mountains was the original homeland of the Aryans, who many historians believe were the very first Caucasian ethnic group, and therefore are the ancestors of all Caucasian people. Before I explain further, let me make one point clear:

RACE HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH SKIN COLOR.

Race is a sub-species classification used in anthropology and biology to categorize organisms that share similar genetic and physical traits within the same species. Racial classifications are based upon anthropology, most notably facial features and the shape of the skull - not skin color. People can be of very different skin color, and yet be categorized in the same racial group based on similar facial features.

"Caucasian" is a racial classification that means anyone of European, North African, Persian (modern-day Iran), and Indian ancestry. The term "Caucasian" is synonymous with the word "Japhetic". Caucasians are characterized by a vertical forehead; a slender, protruding nose; and soft cascading hair. This is in contrast to the Semitic Race (Jews, Arabs, Turkic peoples), which are characterized by a receding forehead; a prominent, hooked nose; and more rigid hair. The Hamitic Race (sub-Saharan Africans and native Australians) are characterized by a wide, flat nose; large jawbone; and very rigid hair.(One side note: In case you don't know, Turkic peoples live in countries such as Turkey, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Afghanistan, Kyrgyzstan, Azerbaijan, etc. A large group - the Tatars - live in Eastern parts of Russia)

The etymology of the word "Caucasian" is derived from the Caucusus Mountains, a mountain range stretching from the Black Sea to the Caspian Sea. This geographic location is where many scientists and historians believe that the first Caucasian people, the Aryans, have originated. The Aryans migrated into Europe and North Africa in the first wave of migration, and then later to modern-day Iran and India in a second wave of migration. In India, they displaced the original inhabitants (the Dravidians), much the same way that Europeans displaced Amerindian populations in North America. Many historians believe that the Hindu caste system evolved to its current rigid status because the Aryans wanted to retain political superiority over the native Dravidians, who were assigned to lower social castes. According to the World Factbook, approximately 70% of India's population today is Indo-Aryan, while 30% is Dravidian. However, these figures are not concrete because large-scale miscegenation occurred since the Aryan invasion, which took place between 1700-1300 B.C.E., despite the formation of the caste system.(As a side note, It is important to note that some people choose not to use the word "Aryans" because of its connotations with Nazism and Nazi ideology. Instead, people commonly use the more politically correct term "Indo-Europeans"; such as "Indo-European" language groups, etc.). In short, people from Europe, North Africa, Iran, Pakistan, and India all share a common ancestor - a group of people who lived in the Caucusus Mountains many years ago.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#25562 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
Yet you use "outside sources" to identify where Adam and Eve may have lived...
Mormons do not use outside sources to establish adam or eve or their color.
name one source Mormons use to establish their color.
<quoted text>
And despite all his babble he somehow forgot that the Garden of Eden is actually in Jackson County, Missouri.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#25563 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
But none of those are her...
Some of those names you mentioned are women who are virgins or who never had children.
you act as if women in mythology are interchangable nameless placeholders.
<quoted text>
Exactly...that's the point.

Since: Oct 08

Location hidden

#25564 May 11, 2013
"Blame it on Cain.
Don't blame it on me.
Oh, oh, it's nobody's fault,
but we need somebody to burn." it just seems to be his turn."
~Elvis Costello

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25565 May 11, 2013
I like "SCIENCE" so you offer me "OPINIONS"

so if I like "OPINIONS" will you offer me "SCIENCE" then?

This below is useless nonsense.

"Did the caucasian race begin in the Caucasus mountains?"
"the first successful mutation" (I suppose if it made white skin, they means it was successful... ghee whiz)...

Ok here we go...

They call you Caucasian, because some 19th century philosophers thought that was where Noah's ark landed. And in the typical arrogance they assumed whites were the first race and thus the white race was called "Caucasian". This was based on some assumption by some German named Christopher Meiner. He just really thought the Caucasians were the prettiest people, and because that's where Mount Ararat is believed to be (where Noah's ark landed).

that's all it's about.

So you are really conceding, because you offering people's opinions when I asked for facts... that's just wasting your time.
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
You like science so chew on these opinions :)
Did the caucasian race begin in the Caucasus Mountains?
Is this the origin of the "Cave Man" story?
4 years ago
Best Answer - Chosen by Voters
Actually, National Geographic claims that the first successful mutation, which we today know as Caucasian, occurred in modern-day Kazahkstan, about 40,000 years ago, and as these populations migrated westward, through Caucasus Mountain area (the modern-day Republic of Georgia), and entered the perimeter of the Black Sea region (which was a freshwater lake until 7,000 years ago), they were first known as Cro-Magnon Man, and later designated as Caucasian...
4 years ago
A more detailed answer...
Yes! You've got it right-on! The Caucusus Mountains was the original homeland of the Aryans, who many historians believe were the very first Caucasian ethnic group, and therefore are the ancestors of all Caucasian people. Before I explain further, let me make one point clear:
RACE HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH SKIN COLOR.

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25566 May 11, 2013
No it's not. The Caucasian race did not originate in the Caucaus mountains.

How's that.

So again, where did white people come from?
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
You like science so chew on these opinions :)
Did the caucasian race begin in the Caucasus Mountains?
Is this the origin of the "Cave Man" story?

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25567 May 11, 2013
Before the age of exploration, group differences were largely based on language, religion, and geography.... the European had always reacted a bit hysterically to the differences of skin color and facial structure between themselves and the populations encountered in Africa, Asia, and the Americas (see, for example, Shakespeare's dramatization of racial conflict in Othello and The Tempest). Beginning in the 1500s, Europeans began to develop what became known as "scientific racism," the attempt to construct a biological rather than cultural definition of race ... Whiteness, then, emerged as what we now call a "pan-ethnic" category, as a way of merging a variety of European ethnic populations into a single "race" ...
—Gregory Jay, "Who Invented White People?"

No Surprise,

I get it now. You've been reacting hysterically, and I tend to, because I am so angry at how whites that perpetuate racism seem to get away with it...

I've been pummelling your hysterical mind, not giving you a moment to find any peace, so that anytime you give an answer that goes against reality, I am there to pull you back out of your fairy land fantasy world.

It's my way of punishing you for defending racist lies about my people.

Part of me wants to let it go, but another part of me feels that you should keep being pummelled for as long as you try to push your racist agenda. Even if it is because you are panicking and desperate (Pangea, Caucaus Mts, no direct answers)...

“The Pleasure is all MINE”

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#25568 May 11, 2013
because some white people cannot live, breathe, or emotionally function without the following myths (andd my apologies to the other white people who are normal)

1. Blacks have to be inferior somehow
2. Jews must be the rival of the white race
3. white have to be the source of everything important in history
4. Blacks cannot be trendsetters in the Bible

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25569 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
Adamah is clearly related to adam
adamah is also used to describe fertile ground about 50 times in the Bible.
Fertile ground is black.
I rest my case.
Sorry, you're talking to a guy that lived on farms. Fertile ground isn't black. It actually comes in hues of browns, reds and a lot of reddish browns. That dark colour comes from moisture from rain and or irrigation. Take away rain and irrigation and all you'll soon have is pale coloured dirt.
The sun bleaches top soil when it's out. The sun evaporates the moisture. No moisture no colour, get it? All top soils no matter their colour is turn lighter colour in the sun.
Your dark soil = dark skin is just another racial stretch

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25570 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
Let us resolve the main issue:
Cain was marked with a skin of blackness.
I've clearly proven it is not possible.
You have shown by your opinion it's not possible to you, that is correct.
You're not considering this in light of the information the other sides gives up without explanation. Such as...
Even if it stated Cain was cursed and marked with dark/black skin, this could be a description of many, many races. Because the verse says nothing of facial features. There is also the unsaid portion of this story if Adam was tanned and all of his posterity with the same facial features, then Cain's skin was darkened, long before Noah was born Cain's posterity and Seth's posterity would have mixed for a thousand plus years. By the time the flood arrived there would have been an assortment of light to dark brownish skin colours from race mixing and skin colour darkening from environment.
Point being by the time Noah came along, with everyone having the same facial features and hair type and various skin shades of brown, genealogy would have been the only way to know who was from what lineage.
Now take two thousand more years of race mixing and facial feature changes and there would be next to no way to identify who was of Cain's lineage.
And all of the above can be said in the reverse for any colour you want to start Adam with and for whatever coloured mark you want to assign Cain with.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25571 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
The white skin color that God changed was a result of a skin disease.
The disease itself was the curse, the change of color was merely a reflection of the effect of the disease.
Cain's oath was to protect him and was not a result of the curse. It was a result of Cain's fear and pleading with God to protect him.
And still these two events are not related to one another. You're trying to explain that because God "can" do it in one instance (where you misrepresent the color and it's implication), he may have or must have done it in another (where you misrepresent the event in question).
And no, those writers never take a moment to explain it because... unlike YOU and unlike your mormon liars
THEY DIDNT CARE. IT DIDNT MATTER. ITS A QUESTION THEY ARE NOT INTERESTED IN ANSWERING.
<quoted text>
The disease of leprosy isn't a curse. It's a disease people get like any other disease.
But God through a prophet turned the disease into a curse. Leprosy doesn't come in colours. Leprosy affects patches of skin and to the bone so parts of the extremities are lost. Go and Google leprosy and click on images. The man being turned white as snow was an extra curse on top of the leprosy because lepers don't turn white. The man could only have turned white under some super natural condition that doesn't ever happen to other lepers.
So ignore that fact all you want. God took a man with probably some type of brown skin and turned him white as snow and all his descendants were to suffer the same cursings.
God took a disease and used it to curse a man to turn his skin a completely different colour. That's a Bible fact so adjust to it is my recommendation.
So you think the writers left out information because they didn't care? Interesting. You realize that means man has redid the scriptures as he saw fit to write them and, they aren't inspired at all IF the writers showed they didn't care and were indifferent to different pieces of information they judged whether to allow it in or not?

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25572 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
I made a comment that Cain was not marked with white skin.
You have not one time argued against this assumption.
You've argued against the assumption that Cain was not marked with black skin...
But you've been silent about Cain not being marked with white skin.
Why?
Because I find the colour of Adam unimportant. I find the curses on Cain and Ham's grandson and all the rest unimportant. It's interesting to discuss and debate the issues but that is all.
But I'm not so ignorant to not acknowledge that God can do anything he wishes, even if to change a person's skin colour.
I have no personal evidence from the Bible that tells me what the mark of Cain was. I have no evidence from the Bible that tells me how any of the human colours came to be. But I have evidence from the Bible that God will change a person's skin colour by a disease or without a disease if he so wishes to do so.
If a person wanted to establish where white people came from using just the Bible, they could use this 'white as snow' skin colouring curse as 'possible' evidence. It's a very weak theory as is the mark of Cain theory but it can be used that way to explain colours.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25573 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
Yes
Multiple places of water would have to exist in order for them to be gathered in one place.
So yes... you erred...
By the way, are you applying science to the biblical narrative? Are you doing the very thing you said I could not do?
Why yes... yes you are...
how DELIGHTFUL!
Please, continue... how does this relate to Cain and black skin?
<quoted text>
Nooo...you're ignoring the geographical description the writer used. There isn't any science to it. And what was said afterwards matters not. For the first sentence describes how it was before it was described as what it became afterwards with time.
9 And God said,“Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so.
The writer used a geographical description to describe how the earth looked before it had life.
The writer who wrote the story of Adam and his creation didn't do that. He just stated Adam was made from the dust of the earth. You on the other hand wish to claim Adam is the result of primates. You can't logically apply that reasoning because the Bible gives Adam's creation from the earth, dust, not a primate. By using a primate theory you change what the story actually states. That means you err and you will always err as long as you use primates for Adam's creation. Understand?

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#25574 May 11, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
You still don't get this. Let me explain it again to you.
People use 'outside' Bible sources to validate their belief that Adam was their skin colour. You have stated these people are racists for doing that to sustain their opinion that Adam wasn't black.
You have done the very, same, exact, thing to sustain Adam being black and you say your not a racist in doing that but they are.
Understand?
Don't limit what mormonism is actually teaching about black skin. They taught that people with black skin are Satan's representatives on Earth. That is racist.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#25575 May 11, 2013
osirica wrote:
But here's your problem. The white supremacy took it to another level. You see, Muslims didn't teach Christians how to make "Oath" with Cain become "marked with a skin of blackness". Because Muslims didn't really understand the thing right. They thought the skin of blackness WAS the curse... which was what they did pass to you guys.
Nor did Muslims teach you to combine the mark with cain myth with Ham... you know the whole "egyptus" thing...
No, that was pure Southern Baptist teaching, and Mormons took it to yet another level... by trying to put it IN the Bible.
So you see? An 18th century fraud should not have the kind of influence to have you on here typing away.
but he does...
<quoted text>
Why do you keep dragging the muslims into the mark of Cain story? The Koran has a story of Cain and Abel and Cain was marked with sorrow but that's all. Muslims and Arabs racially discriminated against Africans because they choose to.
The brown Christian Spaniards were the definite proved first to use the story of Cain to justify enslaving Africans.
And white supremacy didn't take it to another level that didn't already exist. I don't know where you came up with that one. The Arabs, Muslims and Spanish elevated their races way above the African and beat them and tortured them and killed them as Americans did in early America.
And that 18th century guy you talk about, he wanted to set the slaves free before Lincoln even wrote about it. That guy was letting Africans into his church as members when American Christian religions were excluding them. He was allowing natives and Asians in his church if they wanted in. He was actually viewed as an abolitionist by slave owners in the southern states. That guy you call a fraud had an early influence in the changing opinion of how white America viewed blacks. Many scholars think it's one of the primary reasons why he was killed, is because of his 'free the slaves' position.
What happened after his death is another story.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#25576 May 11, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
She never asked why a church lead by prophets, seers, and revelators can't give us the name of their Heavenly Mother? Christianity doesn't even know the personal name of the God called God the Father. So if his name isn't known, should we expect to know her name?
Again, you are wrong, as usual. God has had many names:
http://bible.org/article/names-god And we are talking about Mormonism here, not what the rest of Christianity teaches, which does not believe in a "heavenly mother" as Mormonism does. Another cheap attempt to get away from the topic.
I'll turn your question around and quite appropriately. I'm also throwing the question of why a God who gave birth to billions of spirit children is so unimportant to his children? It is a legit question. We hear all sorts of information about Jesus this and Jesus that. But we hear next to knowing of who the Father and God is that began it all and has superior power over all existing things including Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
Gave you the list, if you want to know, go read it.
And by the way, her actual question was "So what is her name than?" I believe. So I gave her a list of names that our human ancestors have called her even if we don't have her personal name or the personal name of God the Father. Get it?
She was clearly asking in the context of Mormonism, any one reading would understand that. Assclown games won't save you.

“Too much LDS in the 60's”

Since: Sep 10

Marysville, CA

#25577 May 11, 2013
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
You made no reference to 'just a film'. You said... "They are white in the temple endowment ceremony also." And you can't prove differently! LOL!!!! As usual you left out information to be considered in your need to claim white racism at work.
Assclown games won't make you right.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

US News Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Election 'Fox News Sunday' to Host Kentucky Senate Debate (Oct '10) 3 min Julia 274,498
News Trump claims witch hunt, says he's most hounded... 8 min bad bob 1,033
News At congressional picnic, Trump calls for post-s... 11 min fingers mcgurke 1
News Barack Obama, our next President (Nov '08) 11 min Cheech the Conser... 1,548,163
News Obama's secret struggle to punish Russia for Pu... 14 min fingers mcgurke 32
News Nebraska Democrat party official fired for wish... 16 min fingers mcgurke 5
News Plurality of Americans think Trump is failing 17 min bad bob 6,859
News POLL: Americans Trust James Comey Over Trump 2 hr ardith 497
More from around the web